Gears of War 3

[MuraRengan]

I think it's fine, finally a shotgun that behaves like a shotgun, and it's not that hard to stop someone getting within ball touching distance of you.

Though many believe the shotgun is a great firearm for inexperienced shooters, the truth is, at close range, the spread of shot is not very large at all, and competency in aiming is still required.

Uh huh, sure it does.

 

[Pluvia]

You'll be surprised to learn that Anya wouldn't be able to lift the Locust above her head with such ease after a Plancer charge.

Also you can't take 20 bullets from a Lancer, survive, and just stand up a few seconds later.

Also one shot in the torso from a Longshot would probably be enough to kill you.

Weird thing is, because it's a game, there's this thing called gameplay balance. In games these weapons called shotguns are close range weapons, you'll be surprised to find that almost every game makes shotguns close range, because of this thing called gameplay balance.

If you let someone get within ball touching range of you, then you deserve to get blown to pieces because by that stage aiming would be moot anyway, seeing as though you'd probably fill the entire screen and not being able to hit you with bullets would be an achievement.

 

[WindMajor]

I think they should decrease the range of the Sawed-Off.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I think they should decrease the range of the Sawed-Off.

They don't need to decrease the range just the huge size of the reticule. It's too horizontally large.

 

[MuraRengan]

You'll be surprised to learn that Anya wouldn't be able to lift the Locust above her head with such ease after a Plancer charge.

Also you can't take 20 bullets from a Lancer, survive, and just stand up a few seconds later.

Also one shot in the torso from a Longshot would probably be enough to kill you.

Weird thing is, because it's a game, there's this thing called gameplay balance. In games these weapons called shotguns are close range weapons, you'll be surprised to find that almost every game makes shotguns close range, because of this thing called gameplay balance.

If you let someone get within ball touching range of you, then you deserve to get blown to pieces because by that stage aiming would be moot anyway, seeing as though you'd probably fill the entire screen and not being able to hit you with bullets would be an achievement.

Oh yes, I definitely agree with you here, which is why I don't understand why you posted that nonsense earlier. If you want to talk about how a shotgun "should" work, you've gotta put it in the right context. IRL, the shotgun is most effective at close range, but requires some aiming skill to use because the spread is small. In this context, the sawed-off has the spread horrendously wrong. Now lets look at the context, you presented -appealing to other games. How many games have a shotgun with as ridiculous a spread as the sawed-off? I think I can fairly say "not many." So where is your standard for a the sawed-off working as a shotgun should? Oh, that's right, you have none.

 

[Pluvia]

Insanely close range and balance. People moan and ***** about the sawn off, even though it's more a shotgun than the Gnasher sniper rifle. The horizontal spread is huge, but at the expense of it having no range whatsoever, an insanely long reload time, 4 bullets, and 1 bullet per clip.

 

[MuraRengan]

Insanely close range and balance. People moan and ***** about the sawn off, even though it's more a shotgun than the Gnasher sniper rifle. The horizontal spread is huge, but at the expense of it having no range whatsoever, an insanely long reload time, 4 bullets, and 1 bullet per clip.

Perhaps you interpret the Sawed-off's kill range as "insane" because you spend so little time in range of other people. The Gnasher's range is fine, if it were decreased, then a player would have to waste time switching weapons just to catch a retreating opponent, whom, in the time it would take to switch weapons, would've already gotten away. Not to mention the fact that if you lessen the range on the gnasher, sawed-off users will pretty much ALWAYS be able to escape if they miss a shot. The gnasher's range is fine because it creates that magical word you used earlier - weapon balance. Balance between the gnasher, the sawed-off, and the retro, which are your typical close-to-mid range weapons. It certainly does NOT beat a HB or lancer in any circumstances other than close range.

Don't get me wrong, I feel that the Sawed-off is pretty accurately balanced (ability to down people should be removed), I just don't like it because it ruins the Gears experience that I (and the majority of gears players) have come to enjoy.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Pluvia you're ignoring the fact that getting close enough to someone to kill them isn't nearly as hard as you're trying to make it. A lot of the smarter Sawn Off users just sit back behind cover with their Lancers and then pull it out if anyone tries to get into a Shotgun battle with them (which I do a lot). The Gnasher can't beat a Sawn Off 1 v 1 against a good player which is a shame.

The game would be soooo much better without the Sawn Off... it's one of my few complaints about the game.

Honestly though Pluvia I think you're the only one that defends the Sawn Off in this thread.

 

[Fuelbi]

I agree the Sawn Off should stay the same wtf

 

[WindMajor]

The Sawn-Off IS too easy to get kills with. I don't even try when I have the weapon, all I do is walk towards my enemy and get the kill. That's quite literally it. I don't run, don't roll, don't wallbounce. All I do is walk. It's so effective that it's actually humorous.

My friends call this Murder Crew.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I agree the Sawn Off should stay the same wtf

Cause like 80% of your kills come from Sawn Off rushing lol. Seriously learn to use the Gnasher dude. It's better and less noob friendly.

 

[MuraRengan]

The sawed-off, by its nature, will ALWAYS be easy to get kills with, though it is balanced. The real problem is whether or not kills should be easy to get, which is pure preference. I prefer the GoW 1/GoW 2 legacy of effort being put forth to get kills. But if you ever visit Epic's forums, there are a LOT of people who want getting kills to be easier (which is why some folks like the retro and sawed-off as it is, and is the reason why most anti-gnasher folks feel the way they do.)

 

[Pluvia]

Which is a good thing, if you're letting a player with a close range one shot kill weapon get close to you then it's stupid to complain about them beating you if you have a Gnasher. The Gnasher fills a lot of roles and once the Plancer is depowered it'll shine again.

I don't mind that I'm the only one defending it.

Edit: Woah I was replying to TRG up there. I need to refresh more.

 

[MuraRengan]

Which is a good thing, if you're letting a player with a close range one shot kill weapon get close to you then it's stupid to complain about them beating you if you have a Gnasher.

The Gnasher is a PRIMARILY up close weapon. The only way to get a kill with the Gnasher is to be close. But the Sawed-off is so strong up-close that it beats the gnasher in every up-close encounter, thus making the gnasher only useful if the sawed-off person misses. There are several opportunities when a person can force a sawed-off to miss, but there are just as many opportunities when a player will be unable to avoid getting sawed-off. But the crucial matter is that a smart sawed-off user will KNOW when the other person is in a position to make him miss, and just maneuver himself until the kill is guaranteed, which really isn't very hard considering that it's IMPOSSIBLE to approach a sawed-off in cover unless you have some space and a retro.

 

[Wretched]

Pluvia, stop acting like every situation is so clear cut.
Good players get killed by the sawnoff for ****ing bad reasons.
It has too much spread. It is too easy to get downs and kills with.
It is a crutch. People can camp behind corners with it and not even aim.
Get the **** over it.

 

[Fuelbi]

Cause like 80% of your kills come from Sawn Off rushing lol. Seriously learn to use the Gnasher dude. It's better and less noob friendly.

As opposed to just corner camping like any other scrub dammit

 

[Pluvia]

You can camp around corners with the Gnasher too. I don't see the difference seeing as though they can both score one shot gibs, and the Gnasher has more range.

 

[Wretched]

The Gnasher doesn't score gibs until sawed off range unless you hard aim for a few seconds and line it up correctly.
The difference between the sawn off and the Gnasher when camping corners is that the Gnasher has to be aimed and lined up. The sawn off can kill anyone at any angle as long as you can see them on your screen and they are in range.
I never get killed by corner camped gnashers because I:
1. Roll out of the way (which doesn't work against the sawn off.)
2. Don't take enough damage to be Gibbed
3. Kill them first
4. Bounce to a wall in time to avoid a Gib.

The Sawnoff makes all of those options obsolete. The only thing you can do is pack a sawn off, or hope that you can aim fast enough to get a kill (which you won't)

 

[The Real Gamer]

Heres the difference between the Gnasher and Sawed Off:

You actually have to AIM with the Gnasher

/argument

EDIT: Nice ninja by Wretched

 

[MuraRengan]

The gnasher requires aim.

 

[Pluvia]

So what's the problem? Does your LT button not work on corners?

 

[WindMajor]

The Sawed-Off should be a really bright orange and should glow, that way I can tell the difference.

 

[The Real Gamer]

So what's the problem? Does your LT button not work on corners?

No it's called we're sick of losing/tying close ranged encounters to scrubs just because they don't know how to aim.

The Sawed-Off should be a really bright orange and should glow.

I agree with this lol.

 

[MuraRengan]

So what's the problem? Does your LT button not work on corners?

It takes longer to get a target by aiming that it does to fire blindly in someone's direction. As long as sawed-offs don't have to aim, it's going to beat shotguns up close because it doesn't take as long for users to assure that their shots will kill.

 

[Pluvia]

That's why you don't get close to sawn offers. Most sawn offers just walk around blindly, you just need to shoot them from a distance.

If you're continously getting outplayed by people then it's not the weapon that's at fault, it's you.

 

[The Real Gamer]

outplayed

I legit lol'ed

My goodness you're ignorant...

 

[Pluvia]

Nice comeback.

 

[MuraRengan]

That's why you don't get close to sawn offers. Most sawn offers just walk around blindly, you just need to shoot them from a distance.

If you're continously getting outplayed by people then it's not the weapon that's at fault, it's you.

The option of "not getting close" makes the gnasher a useless weapon. Again, the gnasher is an up-close weapon, if it's going to have any use, it has to be able to be used UP-CLOSE. Furthermore, being up-close is a fundamental aspect of playing this game. It's going to happen at some point, and judging by the way most people play, it's goign to happen way more than distance battles. So since up-close battles are commonplace in gears, if the ideal is varied gameplay, then players shouldn't have to be forced to use just one weapon. But, in the event of the game centralizing around one weapon, it's much more fitting that effort be put forth and skill used to get those kills, rather than randomly running in and blasting someone with a wall of bullets.

The only time when I get out-played by a sawed-off user is when they flank me or if there are multiple opponents, but in any 1-on-1 encounter, I can keep a distance and, if he approaches me, back up to bait him into taking a bad shot. The problem is that this shouldn't be the only way to kill a sawed-off, because it puts the results solely in the sawed-off user's hands. Whether or not he misses a shot is ultimately up to HIS actions, and smart sawed-off players will learn when they're being baited just not shoot as early. The point is, that sawed-off users control the situation too much, and as a player with a gnasher, a close range weapon, I should have at least some offensive capability to combat it. But the way the sawed-off works now, people facing it have no options for approaching and have to stay at range, which makes the gnasher useless against it.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Nice comeback.

There's no point in arguing with someone that refuses to see the other side of an argument. I wouldn't even call this an argument it's just you being ignorant and ignoring legitimate points from players that are obviously more knowledgeable AND skilled than you at Gears.

 

[Wretched]

I can't deny that he somehow maintains a 3.0+ though.

 

[MuraRengan]

People who avoid combat tend to have high K/Ds.

 

[Pluvia]

Maybe, but that wouldn't explain my W/L ratio.

People do play campy with the Sawn off but I still think it's fine. It's annoying to be killed by it, but it's easy to avoid if you know where they are. And if you don't know where they are then any weapon can kill you.

 

[F8AL]

I feel horrible whenever a locust rips off my arm and beats me to death with it for like 15 seconds...

 

[WindMajor]

Ma'am, I regret to inform you but.... your son has been killed in the war.

You see..... a locust.... he was shot down by a clutch no scope, and well.... you see............ when the locust walked up to him........ t-they............ t-they ripped your son's arm off, then beat him to death with it.

The other locust sexually violated him and shot bullets into his dead body as it happened. I'm sorry for your loss.

 

[smash brawl player 99021]

Good games Wretched and Pluvia...those stupid lagswitchers'...
Gyah. We had some good matches though. Gettin' better with that Gnasher!

 

[Master Xanthan]

People who avoid combat tend to have high K/Ds.

I doubt you've ever played a match with Pluvia so I doubt you could really make that assumption.

 

[Pluvia]

Good games Wretched and Pluvia...those stupid lagswitchers'...
Gyah. We had some good matches though. Gettin' better with that Gnasher!

At least we bet them. We won all our matches except 1 I think.

Poor Wretched seemed to be a magnet to all sawn offers. I got killed by more gnashers as you probably noticed by me pointing it out everytime they killed me. It was fun though.

 

[MuraRengan]

I doubt you've ever played a match with Pluvia so I doubt you could really make that assumption.

I've got a lot of experience with this game; I know a lot of different players, and I know a lot of different playstyles. Just based on the way Pluvia talks about the game I made the same assumption about how he plays a couple pages back, and he didn't go out of his way to deny it (much like how he's not denying it now.)

 

[Wretched]

I won every shotgun battle without outside interference last night.
The only time I lost was Vs. Sawnoff, vs. a retro, or when someone shot me from afar while I was shooting someone up close.
Gnasher has really been crafted to ensure and require accuracy.
With 15 sensitivity, and my experience with other games, I kinda feel like I'm violating the other players with it.

 

[Pluvia]

I've got a lot of experience with this game; I know a lot of different players, and I know a lot of different playstyles. Just based on the way Pluvia talks about the game I made the same assumption about how he plays a couple pages back, and he didn't go out of his way to deny it (much like how he's not denying it now.)

I actually don't avoid combat, I just don't headlong rush into every situation with a Gnasher.