Ganon's Book of Sinister Secrets (Discoveries, Trix & ATs)

[free33]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn_dzWtH8yk so this could have some potential. I was thinking. If we B reverse the second down B, could we land on the stage and survive?

 

[Litany]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn_dzWtH8yk so this could have some potential. I was thinking. If we B reverse the second down B, could we land on the stage and survive?

You can't B-reverse Wizkick unfortunately. Also, there's time for a punish even if the Wizkick is ledge-cancelled (for example, another Ganondorf can OoS F-tilt).

 

[free33]

You can't B-reverse Wizkick unfortunately. Also, there's time for a punish even if the Wizkick is ledge-cancelled (for example, another Ganondorf can OoS F-tilt).

i know it's punishable, but if they don't react fast enough... oh nevermind. lol thanks for setting me straight.

 

[Theosmeo]

i know it's punishable, but if they don't react fast enough... oh nevermind. lol thanks for setting me straight.

A bair might break the shield though, and that comes out a bit earlier aswell

 

[Z1GMA]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn_dzWtH8yk so this could have some potential. I was thinking. If we B reverse the second down B, could we land on the stage and survive?

I've never seen that Shield Break before.
Would be hilarious to do this Vs Pacman and be saved by his trampoline afterwards.

 

[TM 023]

I was testing some stuff in the lab with ledge cancel down b and I've found some sweet strings to do with it. When Ganon's down b hits the opponent and ledge cancels at the same time (and if they don't tech), you can get some nasty followups.

 

[mgleed]

Discussed it a while back with @Swoops and Z1GMA , but I finally labbed out people we can trump -> dair on a near-frame-perfect trump. I've rated how difficult I thought the character was to land it on, so it's pretty subjective. There may be more, but I'd be surprised.

Yoshi: very difficult
Lucario: difficult
Shulk: difficult
Cloud: difficult
Corrin: difficult
Peach: difficult
Captain Falcon: difficult
Villager: difficult
Lucas: difficult
Palutena: difficult
Ryu: moderate
Wii Fit Trainer: moderate
Ganondorf: moderate
Diddy Kong: moderate
Jigglypuff: moderate
Little Mac: moderate
Robin: moderate
Dark Pit: moderate
Pit: moderate
Ness: moderate
Rosalina & Luma: easy
Ike: easy
Mr Game & Watch: easy
Mewtwo: easy
Zelda: easy
Samus: easy
Donkey Kong: very easy

Demo vid:

 

[Z1GMA]

nice, mgleed . Love it when Ganon looks cheap.

Jag Lock Attributes of Jab:
Appearently, sweetspot Jab (10%) works better for Jab Locking than the sourspots - unlike how it was in Brawl.
However, it generally only works at around 5% which is pretty much never gonna happen for Ganon.

 

[TM 023]

I forgot to post this here, but here it is. If you footstool an opponent during his ledge jump, you can wizkick spike them to death. Unfortunately this only works if the opponent DIs away from the stage. If they DI in or not DI at all, they land onstage.

 

[Z1GMA]

Discussed it a while back with @Swoops and Z1GMA , but I finally labbed out people we can trump -> dair on a near-frame-perfect trump. I've rated how difficult I thought the character was to land it on, so it's pretty subjective. There may be more, but I'd be surprised.

Yoshi: very difficult
Lucario: difficult
Shulk: difficult
Cloud: difficult
Corrin: difficult
Peach: difficult
Captain Falcon: difficult
Villager: difficult
Lucas: difficult
Palutena: difficult
Ryu: moderate
Wii Fit Trainer: moderate
Ganondorf: moderate
Diddy Kong: moderate
Jigglypuff: moderate
Little Mac: moderate
Robin: moderate
Dark Pit: moderate
Pit: moderate
Ness: moderate
Rosalina & Luma: easy
Ike: easy
Mr Game & Watch: easy
Mewtwo: easy
Zelda: easy
Samus: easy
Donkey Kong: very easy

Demo vid:

What Input do you find to be the most optimal when doing this frame perfect?

edit: As awesome as it is getting a garantueed Stomp at ppl, I also think it's worth going for a Stomp sometimes at around 15% even if it isn't frameperfect.
A lot of ppl buffer jump, attack, or up+b/side+b after getting trumped, which can result in a stomp or trade.
For some characters, only a buffered airdodge is safe enough.

 

[mgleed]

What Input do you find to be the most optimal when doing this frame perfect?

edit: As awesome as it is getting a garantueed Stomp at ppl, I also think it's worth going for a Stomp sometimes at around 15% even if it isn't frameperfect.
A lot of ppl buffer jump, attack, or up+b/side+b after getting trumped, which can result in a stomp or trade.
For some characters, only a buffered airdodge is safe enough.

Some of the characters featured in the vid can be D-air'ed out of buffered jump if not-quite frame perfect. You can tell by the trajectory they get trumped at who gets hit easiest. A lot also get hit by the "shoulder" hitbox of D-air if the D-air is late or if they buffer jump or drop. I trump D-aired Gungnir out of his buffered jump in our dittos a couple weeks ago.

It's hard to describe the inputs exactly, and since I claw it may be a bit easier for me to do. But basically rotate the control stick 180 degrees toward the ledge and then toward the stage to trump, then nearly instantly after tap down to drop from the ledge then immediately jump and C-stick down. If you tap down too soon you will ledge jump. The timing is pretty strict, but it's doable with practice.

 

[free33]

Hey Guys I want to talk about some mostly useless tech that you will probably never hit in tournament, but could be really flashy if you hit it at some point. basically, from 0-4% for fair, and 0-2 or 3% for sourspot Dair, these moves slide the opponent off of Battlefield platforms from everywhere on the platform except all the way across when the opponent is partway off the other side. This allows incredibly easy jablock combos and other followups. I'll make a video showing my ideas later, but I just wanted to get this out to the other ganons and see what people could come up with. Note that these are more valuable than tipman at the extremely tight percents they work because you can pressure under the platform with them. Some notable things you can pull off are Fair-Uair lock-Dair-footstool-Uair lock-Fsmash, Fair Wizkick ledgecancel-Side B suicde, Nair, Fair, or Uair, Fair-reverse hit of Dash attack- Uair lock on platform-Fsmash or Usmash or Dair, Fair-Uair lock-reverse Uair tipman-footstool-Down B, (this would probably work on light characters): Fair-Uair lock-RAR Nair-Bair. Note that all of these things work by starting with sourspot dair as well (pressuring with your torso instead of legs) but it has some more ending lag and has a smaller hitbox, so I find fair to be more useful unless the extra 5% puts some characters just out of range for certain combos. So anyway, test it out f you want. You will probably never actually hit it in a tourney match, but it's fun tech to mess around with since it has 0-death potential.

EDIT: Some more testing confirms that 2nd hit of nair has the same platform sliding affect from 0-5%. This one is safer and has less landing lag, allowing for looser windows on combos. Again, most of this is pretty useless, since the situation for actually hitting this will come up extremely infrequently, but it's nice to know.

 

[free33]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkLfwPpOibQ so apparently this works. Lab here I come.

 

[free33]

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B8t9dT8LDGegbzRUYmpNNndSbnM
okay so here is what I could do with ganon's pratfall combos. I doubt anyone would ever actually hit this in an actual game since you have to hit the opponent at 0-4% depending on the move, but if you ever do hit this, you will be a god.