G3S Mafia | Day 4 starts | Deadline: 1st Feb [11:59pm CET]

[Omni]

oh bardull's slot was archer's?

**** 1000 replacements

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

No, that was Sworddancer.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Axel is scum from his behavior shortly before and all of it after I replaced into the game.

His claim is scummy as **** and he was pushing it through to the hilt.
The way he has, and continues to ignore everyone until confronted in a way he can't avoid.
The way he tries to force the one motive down everyone's throat without any reason for me to believe him.
That DISGUSTING strawman to my recent post.
The way he's trying to hammer home a lynch. That unvote offer with Acrostic was almost certainly so he could turn around and hammer.

 

[BarDulL]

im not scum

somebody save me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap7m1CYzS6A&feature=related

I'M HERE FOR YOU BROMNI!

Sorry everyone, I've been busy with school and I'm much more invested in AT Mafia atm. I'll try to get to this later toNight...if possible.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Both of you piss me off, and yes, I'm regarding Axel and Omni.

Omni, you're doing a whole lot of grasping at straws, with nearly everything.

I don't understand the need, I don't understand why you need to bring up incessant points such as "everyone voting me is a sheep" or "you don't want bronar/felipe/axel" leading the game do you becair lylo Ill tell you I told you so" or some **** like that.

If you're actually town omni, cut the drama and be more productive, I don't want to see this thread clogged with your AtE and Axel's sudden bullheaded approach to everything.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Honest opinions, honest opinions.

Soup wanna stay with me for a bit? I wanna bounce off some idea with someone.

 

[th3kuzinator]

And in case everyone's wondering I do plan on giving my piece before deadline to no-one prematurely hammer.

I'm combing through this thread as fast as I can.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I don't think I've ever actually been mad about a game, its like I'm channeling EE's spirit.

This day needs to move forward and my trigger finger itches, I'm literally, once again, just waiting for kuz.

 

[th3kuzinator]

And Bardull and Acro.

Acro can I get your read on Xonar and Bardull?

 

[th3kuzinator]

And Soup, how confident are you on Inferno being town?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Honest opinions, honest opinions.

Soup wanna stay with me for a bit? I wanna bounce off some idea with someone.

Man dat ninja.

Sure, I've got time, if I'm lagging behind its because my phone service is unreliable.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

And Soup, how confident are you on Inferno being town?

Not very. A lot of it is from early play but the play lately has been weak and I've been mulling it all day.

I didn't like his push onto bronar earlier, it felt like a cheap callout and was merely goading; I don't think I've ever seen inferno do that.

His lack of taking a stance is bothering too, even though he's not being forceful, he's playing cautious.

 

[BarDulL]

Sup. I'm really not the best person to bounce ideas off of since I'm not fully read, but anything regarding D1/first half of D2 works for me. Trying to focus on AT though.

 

[Omni]

Both of you piss me off, and yes, I'm regarding Axel and Omni.

Omni, you're doing a whole lot of grasping at straws, with nearly everything.

I don't understand the need, I don't understand why you need to bring up incessant points such as "everyone voting me is a sheep" or "you don't want bronar/felipe/axel" leading the game do you becair lylo Ill tell you I told you so" or some **** like that.

If you're actually town omni, cut the drama and be more productive, I don't want to see this thread clogged with your AtE and Axel's sudden bullheaded approach to everything.

its hard dude. i feel like the majority of my **** has been ignored, overlooked, or just Scumm'd up by Xonar/Axel infestation. and then people like RR have been like, "aight i can see that i guess sure maybe" and then people like Felipe are like "derp derp my vote goes wherever u two want me to put it dont really got nuthin to say" etc. etc.

im grasping because well, i don't have much else. i pounded away dozens of posts for the past 2 days just for literally 95% of it to be requoted and have the same two players tell me its scummy. its ********. and we dont have enough strong players to cut the entire Axel/Brosuke nonsense because half of them have been inactive, half are passive (Inferno, RR, you), and thats about it.

forgive me if im tired of saying the same **** 10x over and that im literally tired of fighting against a brick wall. at this point in the game there is literally not much i can say except what i've been saying over and over

1.) scum is in axel/xonar 100%
2.) im not da scum
3.) willing to ride the ryker/kuz magic carpet ride with soupa as doc protected and felipe can be iago

thats about it. the rest is on you guys

 

[th3kuzinator]

Omni what if one of Axel or Xonar wasn't scum. Who would be your third pick?

Bardull try and get as much done before deadline as you can.

Can someone who thinks he's town tell me why Inferno is town?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

I understand frustration, omni.

This day has been uneventful, and ruined by gambits and mechanic talk, along with back and forth between axel/ryker/brosuke.

You can't really says that there was much room to do anything else, but I did try making my thoughts clear.

I don't think an axel lynch is going through, just try to calm down and talk to us at a more manageable level, give me a huge list of your thoughts; go indepth.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Well that 502 sapped up a large majority of my reading time. Onward I go.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Xonar did you speak to your partner about your plan to CC Ryker before actually doing so>

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Vote: Axel

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'll explain in a sec.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Well that was unexpected and interesting.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Whiling going to a bar tonight by myself after an exam I thought about this game some more an where my head was at.

I haven't made any real pushed or done anything in this game outside of using my gambit to find WL and get some reads off his flip as well as interactions. About those I interpreted them, Brosuke still I find to be unlikely to be aligned with WL, Inferno I'm absolutely sure isn't I doubt Laundry would try a lynch on his scummates on D1 when they're were better alternatives than those two.

Now onto Omni, yeah I didn't like what he did with not being open, but that kinda normal from past games I've played with him when I looked back at Fire and Ice/Shaq mafia. So why WL budded him, my first guess was that Laundry was trying to stay on how scummates good side to not die and help with numbers in lylo. The other is that he knew Omni was looking town and wanted to get cred by being all buddy buddy with him.

The unltimate problem is that this interaction is WIFOM, however looking back onto the beginning of the ay when Omni didn't know he was aligned with scum. That looks like a town slip.

I doubt he wouldn't have talked to his partner about it if he was scum. He would have discussed the connections and best kill for the night so at some point WL's flip would have come up into the discussion. He wouldn't have been confused like he was before even with the color thing he had problems with.

~

Now Axel, he dies.

The gambit is bad from a town perspective. Tried to push their own personal pick and claim that they would have pushed to a lynch if they could. Off lying about being the cop, figure this. Town wouldn't do this.

He would have known an investigative would have most likely CC' him if he pushed it that far and Ryker wasn't inactive enough.

From his bad gambit he moved to ignore, and continues to do so, and only answer questions and comments when he chooses to with a pick and choose kind of style.

I think that is worse from an intent standpoint.

More or less where my head is at with these two.

I'm not totally cool with Omni atm, but I dislike Axel way more.

 

[th3kuzinator]

I know you, Ryker. You play to survive, at the extent of others. You're detrimental. Killing you is the best way for me to survive, and/or to keep Axel alive. And that's assuming you're town.
Which I don't. You're scum. And if you're scum, you're going to be a pain in the *** for the entire town. Especially me/Axel, if you survive today by some miracle and get that fake guilty on me/Axel. Not letting you.

wtfamireading.jpg

I may be interpreting this wrong but right now it reads all sorts of wrong.

 

[Axel]

Now Axel, he dies.

The gambit is bad from a town perspective. Tried to push their own personal pick and claim that they would have pushed to a lynch if they could. Off lying about being the cop, figure this. Town wouldn't do this.

Town wouldn't do what? Push my lynch choice? Yes I would and yes I did. Doesn't matter if you disagree with me. I told you in the very post that I claimed it was a gambit not to look into that fact. I predicted you and Inferno would be the ones to mention it. I showed you earlier how you were wrong, and you accepted it. So tell me what has changed.

He would have known an investigative would have most likely CC' him if he pushed it that far and Ryker wasn't inactive enough.

Why the heck do people keep assuming Ryker is town. He isn't town my friend. People may dislike my ability to read into this, but it's not my fault you guys are so slow. The end of this day is irking me because scum is flailing so hard, and while I've shown my points with logic and reason, people are still being so slow. As I said I believe this is the climax and scum have no choice but to fight for keeping Omni alive at this point. The fact that you're making this 180 all the sudden says something. Now then the "knowing and investigative would have most likely CC'd him" was addressed in #1374. Instead of ignoring my previous responses in order to fit your case, you need to address them and show how they were wrong. Furthermore, to say that I knew an investigative Role would likely CC is wrong. I explained why I didn't this was likely at all. You know there's something here that I just realized. How would I know an investigative would have investigated GORDITO? Ryker even claimed that his investigation was random, so there is no way I would know there would be a likely CC.

From his bad gambit he moved to ignore, and continues to do so, and only answer questions and comments when he chooses to with a pick and choose kind of style.

You keep saying this but have yet to show what I have ignored. Show me everything I have ignored and selectively answered. You even dropped this case after I disproved it (#1283). This leads me to believe that you're bringing it up again simply to add substance to your case.

 

[Axel]

Axel is scum from his behavior shortly before and all of it after I replaced into the game.

His claim is scummy as **** and he was pushing it through to the hilt.
The way he has, and continues to ignore everyone until confronted in a way he can't avoid.
The way he tries to force the one motive down everyone's throat without any reason for me to believe him.
That DISGUSTING strawman to my recent post.
The way he's trying to hammer home a lynch. That unvote offer with Acrostic was almost certainly so he could turn around and hammer.

-If I wanted to push it through to the hilt, I would have. The fact that I retracted after a shift in reads shows that was not my intention. As I said before, during my initial push on Gord I very much did believe him to be scum. I would have lynched him. Of course I would have loved for him to actually respond and I'm certain no one would have just blindly lynched him without getting his response. For my gambit to be legit I had to make it believable.

Explain to me the scum intentions behind claiming a false guilty on someone you know is town. It would give them a ml but they would certainly be dead the next day, if not the night.

-As I said with Ryu, show me what I have ignored. You, Omni, and ryu have all said this, but none of you have shown me a single thing that I have ignored.


-"The way he tries to force the one motive down everyone's throat without any reason for me to believe him." Soupa (or anyone else) explain this to me. Why I ask is because I know very well it makes no sense and I would like to prove so with an outside perspective. I'll do my best to answer though:

Spoiler

wut?

-I responded to your post, but you didn't respond. I seriously don't know what you mean. And wasn't that post the same regard as your first point? You're bringing up the same thing in a different way.

-I explained why I wanted the hammer. You can say that I would have turned around and hammered, but that's simply not true. I would have waited until Acro's questions were answered, and probably waited until about the last hour. This point is a he said/she said with no basis.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'm gonna murder this guy.

He's saying he was completely willing to go all the way with that claimed guilty. He already had Gorf at L-2 and was pushing for more votes. Literally, the first thing I got from anyone was "feel free to put Gorf at L-1."

He also insinuates that people are scummy for not joining the wagon while conveniently ignoring the fact that if he really were town, scum would be licking their chops at a shot at a mislynch followed by another mislynch.

Xonar, seriously, from where does the town read stem?

lol Ryker that doesn't matter. I'm telling you guys that I would have because that's just how I am. As scum I could have easily just not have told you that I wouldn't have stopped the lynch.

Anywho. If Kooz is serious about where he stands now, I'm pretty sure this is the climax of things. After Omni's flip, Bronar and I will probably be getting townie points. Ryker will have no choice but to kill one of us. From there, the other will be able to take them out without the support of Omni.

The bolded is quite literally all you responded to.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Xonar did you speak to your partner about your plan to CC Ryker before actually doing so>

No, but that has reasons.

Haven't read the big posts yet, but a quick reply here;

wtfamireading.jpg

I may be interpreting this wrong but right now it reads all sorts of wrong.

Spoiler

First I was scared of Ryker. (1). I was really sure that he was going to get me killed just to survive, because I felt I was in direct opposition to him (which I later discovered I'm not (see below))

Looking at these odds, I know it is better to lynch Gorf. The problem is, that you, Ryker, are an unbelievable survivalist who will sacrifice multiple towns-folks to survive.

As town vanilla: conjure guilty, survive as Rykertown, sacrifice Axel/Brosuke.
As town cop: get guilty, push it, survive as Rykertown (unlikely, I am town, I feel Axel is town too)
As town cop: get innocent, conjure guilty, survive as Rykertown, sacrifice Axel/Brosuke.
As scum: conjure guilty, survive as Rykerscum, win game.

I don't trust you regardless of your town/scum-being with the position you're in now.

But Ryker is far from wrong when saying something doesn't add up. It being late, I left Axel's claim out of the equation. That and fear of Ryker made the whole thing a mess. Here are some quotes;
Xonar's revelation
While looking I also found this quote of interest;
Ryker

gonna read them larger posts and check Ryker's list, try to get my list up and do Kuz's thing. Limited time though.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

His claim is scummy as **** and he was pushing it through to the hilt

Except he didn't. Didn't he call it off before a lynch happened? Yes, I do agree that it went on too long, but through to the hilt is a hyperbole. Honestly, the only way this could've really been used to bait a CC is if he assumed I was cop and felt confident on Omni or something? Nobody in the game would've copped Gorf tbh.

The way he has, and continues to ignore everyone until confronted in a way he can't avoid.

I haven't seen this happen, and I've dug a bit. Links?

The way he tries to force the one motive down everyone's throat without any reason for me to believe him.

You mean the motive behind his claim? If so, isn't that the logical thing to do? Convince other people that your motive is pure?

That DISGUSTING strawman to my recent post.

Point.

The way he's trying to hammer home a lynch. That unvote offer with Acrostic was almost certainly so he could turn around and hammer.

Speculation is a point now?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Deadline is in 12 hours.

Voted |

Voter(s)​

|

Votes to lynch​

Omni |

Axel, felipe, Brosuke, Archer's Bane​

|

4 / 6​

Axel |

Ryker, Omni, th3kuzinator, Red Ryu​

|

4 / 6​

---​

Not voting: Inferno, Bardull, Soupamario;

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Alright I'll be in this game thread til deadline, but Ryker just decided to claim all my time. Will do this after school. (2-3 hours?)

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Except he didn't. Didn't he call it off before a lynch happened? Yes, I do agree that it went on too long, but through to the hilt is a hyperbole. Honestly, the only way this could've really been used to bait a CC is if he assumed I was cop and felt confident on Omni or something? Nobody in the game would've copped Gorf tbh.

He was going to lynch a townie off of his claim and then walk for it because only now is he receiving any sort of attention in no small part due to two replacements. There is SO MUCH that could go wrong from a townie's perspective. There's still things that could go wrong from a scum's perspective, but the fact that he isn't dead yet and was CCed is a credit to how safe the claim was.

I haven't seen this happen, and I've dug a bit. Links?

Look at the call-outs. All of them. First on his claim and then Omni wanting information from him. IIRC, I also tried getting him to answer things while we were going back and forth, but he's selective in what he responds to.

You mean the motive behind his claim? If so, isn't that the logical thing to do? Convince other people that your motive is pure?

And instead of addressing the reasoning of my more plausible solution, he just insists that I'm wrong and he's right.

Speculation is a point now?

Alone no. With the information present, it's a reasonable assumption. Look at how he's behaving with this lynch. He's tried HARD to hammer it through before the backlash got out. Do you seriously think my speculation is unfounded. I CERTAINLY don't trust the number two in line for a lynch with the hammer and I think it's pretty ridiculous to think he should be allowed to hold it on good faith given his recent history.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Alright I'll be in this game thread til deadline, but Ryker just decided to claim all my time. Will do this after school. (2-3 hours?)

Yoooooooomiiiiiii

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

He was going to lynch a townie off of his claim and then walk for it because only now is he receiving any sort of attention in no small part due to two replacements. There is SO MUCH that could go wrong from a townie's perspective. There's still things that could go wrong from a scum's perspective, but the fact that he isn't dead yet and was CCed is a credit to how safe the claim was.

- His claim was very safe, and even withstood a 'counterclaim'
I see the safety in his claim and how you feel it is scummy, however, this is in direct contradiction with what you said earlier, on how he outed a PR. You realize that if he really made his role look like a true Cop then he would've gotten hard CCd and two townies would've died, right? He had to make this safe in the way of not exactly claiming cop as both alignments. Null.

- He was going to lynch a town based on a fake claim
Though he didn't.

As I said before, during my initial push on Gord I very much did believe him to be scum. I would have lynched him. Of course I would have loved for him to actually respond and I'm certain no one would have just blindly lynched him without getting his response. For my gambit to be legit I had to make it believable.

If he would've been satisfied he would've dropped it, like he did. If the gambit showed that Gorf is scum, then he would've pushed it through.

He did not really commit to a lynch at all.

Look at the call-outs. All of them. First on his claim and then Omni wanting information from him. IIRC, I also tried getting him to answer things while we were going back and forth, but he's selective in what he responds to.

Denying information about his claim once again had to be done to prevent counterclaiming. It was necessary for the gambit. If you've got specific examples that he left unanswered forever then go ahead and find em.

And instead of addressing the reasoning of my more plausible solution, he just insists that I'm wrong and he's right.

Your reasoning:
- He set himself up on D1
- He fakeclaimed to push a lynch on a threatening player
- He wanted to get a lynch out of it
- He intended to get away with it because of the non-committal nature of the fakeclaim
- He only admitted it because Ryker claimed

His reasoning:
- He thought Gorf was suspicious D1
- He fakeclaimed to push a lynch on a scummy player
- He wanted to get reads on the entire cast on it and Gorf
- He intended to revoke his claim should Gorf turn out to be town, or push it through should he not be
- He only admitted it because Ryker claimed

Am I correct? In that case, I will look at his overall play to determine his general intentions, which points me towards town. From this point of view of his intentions overall being town, I find it more likely that his reasoning is true.

Alone no. With the information present, it's a reasonable assumption. Look at how he's behaving with this lynch. He's tried HARD to hammer it through before the backlash got out. Do you seriously think my speculation is unfounded. I CERTAINLY don't trust the number two in line for a lynch with the hammer and I think it's pretty ridiculous to think he should be allowed to hold it on good faith given his recent history.

Alright. You don't trust him, I do. Agree to disagree here.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Town wouldn't do what? Push my lynch choice? Yes I would and yes I did. Doesn't matter if you disagree with me. I told you in the very post that I claimed it was a gambit not to look into that fact. I predicted you and Inferno would be the ones to mention it. I showed you earlier how you were wrong, and you accepted it. So tell me what has changed.

It' the fact you tried to lie your way into your personal lynch. Even knowing you could out the cop.

No, the only thing you proved me wrong about if I recall is voting Gorf. Nothing else has change.

Why the heck do people keep assuming Ryker is town. He isn't town my friend. People may dislike my ability to read into this, but it's not my fault you guys are so slow. The end of this day is irking me because scum is flailing so hard, and while I've shown my points with logic and reason, people are still being so slow. As I said I believe this is the climax and scum have no choice but to fight for keeping Omni alive at this point. The fact that you're making this 180 all the sudden says something. Now then the "knowing and investigative would have most likely CC'd him" was addressed in #1374. Instead of ignoring my previous responses in order to fit your case, you need to address them and show how they were wrong. Furthermore, to say that I knew an investigative Role would likely CC is wrong. I explained why I didn't this was likely at all. You know there's something here that I just realized. How would I know an investigative would have investigated GORDITO? Ryker even claimed that his investigation was random, so there is no way I would know there would be a likely CC.
You keep saying this but have yet to show what I have ignored. Show me everything I have ignored and selectively answered. You even dropped this case after I disproved it (#1283). This leads me to believe that you're bringing it up again simply to add substance to your case.[/QUOTE]

L2cop plz.

You cop people likely to make it into lylo and top scum picks. Inactive Gorf was likely to do so. And if you lecture me about what a real cop should do, I'm going to ignore you an say, I know this more than you off experience.

Oh I won't eat out of Ryker's hand either, if he tries to blow me off tomarrow, I'll push his lynch.

Still, please die. Die really really hard.

 

[Omni]

all this axel hate is turning me on

really tho, axel? we're up ahead no town deaths; 1 mafia dead. what incentive does town have to divert from regular mafia scumhunting and playing to an awkward gambit that proclaims a guilty on GORF of all people in which you were OK with having him lynched literally a day in a half into D2? meanwhile this very same gambit could (and did) out CC's from other investigation roles regardless if they found inno/guilty on Gorf himself. and then what? gorf is lynched, he flips town possibly, and you say what D3 after a possible town lynch and town death at Night?

literally nothing about your play was pro-town and everything focused town into a meta discussion between 3 people.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Though he didn't.

Doesn't disprove intent that he was whiling to despite the fact Gorf didn't get lynched.

 

[Omni]

also every time u say ur gonna look over Axel @ Xonar i just imagine ur avatar scoping Axel up and down with flashing anime eyes thinking he can do no wrong

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Omni

- Non committal ("not going to make stances before everyone posts")
-> all consequences. i.e. being able to feel out everything before making hard stances

a verdict consist of labeling someone as scum or town. at the time, did not do so. saying J is "legit" does not mean he is town.

Good example.

- Focusing hard on removing anti-town players from the game. To the point of wanting to use our daily lynch on an anti-town player.

- Often contradicts himself, then gets away with it due to being non committal. (1)

then what do you consider significant at that point in the game, Brosuke? i made stances.

- His scumpicks are easy. Day 1 he started on Red Ryu who just gambitted. Then he went on me who opened with a contradictorily post. Then he went on WL who was main flavor.


- Did nothing for the majority of D1.

- By extent, he has shown a lack of scumhunting intent.

- Played the town by suspecting everyone who disagreed.

- Started off D2 just on Felipe and Chaco, the two easiest picks. Had me as back-up.

- Once he felt the game out, he moved to this convenient list.

Don't trust Axel's slot at the moment. Don't trust Chaco. Don't trust you.

Going on in D2 this was his list. I got on his mistrust on Chaco before (1) (note his bad reasoning on why not to trust chaco as to defend the dumbest point ever)

- big red text

- Cherry picked responding to things on several occasions. Note how he did not answer everything.


tl;dr havent been scumhunting, had easy picks, was noncomittal, contradictory, was bad at responding (seriously just try to pressure this guy it's stress), did nothing yet masked it, wanted to use towns only weapon to get scum on anti-town, hunts antitown instead of scum to mask doing nothing.

Main points for as far as I know. People are free to add.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Doesn't disprove intent that he was whiling to despite the fact Gorf didn't get lynched.

His reasoning:
- He thought Gorf was suspicious D1
- He fakeclaimed to push a lynch on a scummy player
- He wanted to get reads on the entire cast on it and Gorf
- He intended to revoke his claim should Gorf turn out to be town, or push it through should he not be
- He only admitted it because Ryker claimed

get it 10char?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Coo' agree with most of this.

Mhm can we leave it at that then? I know in which direction I'm going to look but speculating on a flip that hasn't been given is wasting time. If you want me to talk about specific flip/people combos, go ahead and ask, but going over every single one is a draaaag.