First Official 4BR Smash for Wii U Tier List

It is common for fighting game communities to create a tier list for their game as a source of reference and debate regarding the tournament viability of the cast. The Smash scene is no exception to this, and all games in the series have had a tier list posted to SmashBoards. More often than not, the website itself was instrumental to the creation of these lists, mainly through projects organized by the so-called Smash Back Room for each respective game.

Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS finds itself in the unique position of receiving patches, DLC characters and stages for more than a year after release, with two more characters still forthcoming. As a result of this, it made sense to hold off on tier list discussion until a period of relative stability came along. The current patch (1.1.3) left the majority of the cast relatively untouched and had Genesis 3 as a major showcase, so we chose this build as a foundation. With the recent launch of the 4BR, we were in a good position for the official tier list project to finally get underway.

The 4BR acknowledges that tier lists are often controversial and won't be perfect at the first iteration, if ever. We do, however, strive to study the game to the best of our ability and give a sincere opinion on the current state of affairs. As such, a tier list can be an important benchmark to look back on as the game progresses.

To illustrate this, compare the first and last tier lists for Brawl. Over the nearly 5 years separating the two, we saw the fall of top tier threats like King Dedede, R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch, the rise of supposed mid tiers like Captain Olimar and Zero Suit Samus and the blatant early misjudgment of Zelda's potential. Despite these major shifts, the majority of the cast did not end up that far from where they initially started.

Our community has pushed Smash 4 hard from day one, and we have more resources at our disposal than ever before, be it complete frame data, tutorials, or tournament footage. It will be interesting to see how this affects our accuracy in rating the cast, something only time will tell. All that being said, we are proud to present you the first official tier list for Smash Bros. for Wii U!

Procedure

In late December 2015, 4BR members were asked to distribute all 56 released characters across 20 tiers, with no differentiation within the same tier. Voters could place gaps wherever they wanted and there were no restrictions on the amount of characters in the same group. They had to assume play under the 1.1.3 patch with no custom moves allowed, while Miis had to be considered with their 1111 moveset only, in accordance with tournament reality at the biggest events. The 4BR at this moment has no official stance or recommendation on ruleset matters.

We agreed to let voting run until after Genesis 3, which would hopefully provide us with insights into especially the more recent additions to the cast, most notably Cloud. During the voting process, there was a separate topic for reasoning and discussion. We also asked a small group of non-members to submit a vote, in order to involve more people at the forefront of the metagame. We ended up with 53 votes, of which 34 were American and 19 were international.

These are the people who submitted a vote:

Spoiler: List of Voters

@AeroLink_the_SoulMaster (AeroLink)
@Alphicans
@Amazing Ampharos
@Ambrose (My Smash Corner)
@ASC | Red Ryu
@Camalange
@CHOMPY
@CYVE
@Dabuz
@DtJ XeroXen
@D1
@earth_tyt (Earth)
@False
@Fox Is Openly Deceptive
@gsmVoiD (VoiD)
@istudying
@John123456
@Katakiri
@k9.
@Liberation
Marc
@Meru.
@Mister Eric
@Mr-R
@Myran
@NAKAT
@NickRiddle
@nietono
@qb9b
@Ranai
@Raziek
@Rayquaza07
@Remzi (VABengal)
@rintarosu10 (RIN)
@san.
@Seagull Joe
@Shaya
@Slice~ (Beefy Smash Doods)
@Spinosaurus
@SS_and_TH (Komorikiri)
@TA~Mav
@The calm tyrant... (Tyrant)
@TheReflexWonder
@Thinkaman
@Trela
@UltimateRazer (GrimTurtle)
@vyQ (Beefy Smash Doods)
@Xiivi
@Xzax Kasrani
@Zan-
@Zigsta
@---
@-6WX-

Spoiler: Breakdown by region

USA
Atlantic North: 12
Midwest: 8
Pacific West: 7
Southwest: 4
Atlantic South: 3

International
Europe: 8
Japan: 6
Canada: 3
Australia: 2

Note that we will not release individual votes, but any voter is free to share his own vote with the public. The most notable abstainee was @TSM ZeRo, who felt it was still too early for a tier list.

Results

@Shaya processed the votes and found these average placements, standard deviations and gaps between average placements for the cast:

Spoiler: Raw voting data

Character | Average Placement | Standard Deviation | Gap
Sheik | 20.0 | 0.0 | 0.0
Zero Suit Samus | 19.46 | 0.708 | 0.538
Rosalina | 18.77 | 0.87 | 0.687
Ryu | 17.95 | 1.103 | 0.82
Pikachu | 17.86 | 1.065 | 0.099
Sonic | 17.83 | 1.269 | 0.021
Fox | 17.52 | 1.146 | 0.313
Mario | 17.51 | 1.108 | 0.014
Diddy Kong | 17.43 | 0.998 | 0.082
Meta Knight | 17.12 | 1.489 | 0.307
Villager | 16.52 | 1.614 | 0.597
Cloud | 16.5 | 1.657 | 0.023
Ness | 16.39 | 1.502 | 0.11
Captain Falcon | 15.16 | 1.767 | 1.228
Yoshi | 15.15 | 1.893 | 0.013
Luigi | 14.27 | 1.996 | 0.881
Dark Pit | 13.89 | 2.138 | 0.381
Pit | 13.88 | 2.308 | 0.006
Peach | 13.75 | 2.115 | 0.133
R.O.B. | 13.63 | 2.221 | 0.12
Wario | 13.56 | 1.898 | 0.067
Toon Link | 13.2 | 2.416 | 0.357
Lucario | 12.92 | 2.224 | 0.285
Olimar | 12.47 | 2.452 | 0.454
Greninja | 12.25 | 2.633 | 0.215
Ike | 12.12 | 2.425 | 0.126
Donkey Kong | 11.8 | 2.252 | 0.325
Mega Man | 11.41 | 2.159 | 0.386
Pac-Man | 11.29 | 2.278 | 0.124
Bowser | 10.81 | 2.66 | 0.477
Robin | 10.17 | 2.722 | 0.642
Roy | 9.29 | 3.209 | 0.883
Kirby | 9.1 | 3.388 | 0.183
Bowser Jr. | 8.93 | 2.671 | 0.176
Mr. Game & Watch | 8.72 | 2.47 | 0.21
Lucas | 8.65 | 2.993 | 0.071
Mewtwo | 8.35 | 2.666 | 0.297
Falco | 8.12 | 3.026 | 0.232
Wii Fit Trainer | 8.08 | 2.674 | 0.037
Shulk | 7.75 | 2.926 | 0.325
Marth | 7.72 | 2.237 | 0.038
Link | 7.47 | 2.474 | 0.249
Duck Hunt Dog | 7.18 | 3.11 | 0.283
Little Mac | 7.18 | 2.633 | 0.009
Dr. Mario | 7.14 | 2.437 | 0.033
King Dedede | 6.04 | 2.721 | 1.107
Lucina | 5.59 | 2.547 | 0.447
Mii Brawler | 5.01 | 2.952 | 0.584
Charizard | 4.79 | 2.255 | 0.218
Palutena | 4.78 | 2.199 | 0.008
Samus | 4.12 | 1.942 | 0.656
Mii Gunner | 3.6 | 2.153 | 0.525
Mii Swordsman | 3.32 | 2.054 | 0.282
Ganondorf | 3.23 | 1.675 | 0.082
Jigglypuff | 2.79 | 2.035 | 0.448
Zelda | 1.96 | 1.259 | 0.828

A standard deviation of (close to) 0 means that voters generally placed the character close to the mean, while a higher standard deviation means that the character had a larger range of placements. Most standard deviations are over 1, indicating that we are far from a consensus.

We considered all gaps over .50 as tier separation points and those above .75 for a change in label (Top, High, etc.). However, we decided against single character tiers and the C tier occupying a "High Mid" label with just two characters. Finally, we split F tier into two based on the largest difference within that group of 14 characters.

Official 4BR Smash for Wii U Tier List v1.0 (1.1.3 patch)

Top
S:

High
A:
B:

Middle
C:
D:
E:

Low
F:
G:

Bottom
H:
I:
J:

Text version:

S: Sheik, Zero Suit Samus, Rosalina & Luma
A: Ryu, Pikachu, Sonic, Fox, Mario, Diddy Kong, Meta Knight
B: Villager, Cloud, Ness
C: Captain Falcon, Yoshi
D: Luigi, Dark Pit, Pit, Peach, R.O.B., Wario, Toon Link, Lucario
E: Captain Olimar, Greninja, Ike, Donkey Kong, Mega Man, Pac-Man, Bowser, Robin
F: Roy, Kirby, Bowser Jr., Mr. Game & Watch, Lucas, Mewtwo, Falco, Wii Fit Trainer
G: Shulk, Marth, Link, Duck Hunt, Little Mac, Dr. Mario
H: King Dedede, Lucina
I: Mii Brawler, Charizard, Palutena
J: Samus, Mii Gunner, Mii Swordfighter, Ganondorf, Jigglypuff, Zelda

Graphic version:

Conclusion

The first year of Smash 4 has been an absolute rollercoaster, with players flocking from Bowser to Diddy Kong to Sheik to Luigi to Donkey Kong to Sheik again. With the completion of the cast on the horizon and the nerfs and buffs slowing to a halt, the game can be expected to come to full fruition in 2016. We can't wait to see the Smash 4 tier list evolve over the years as Smashers all over the world rise to the challenge -- and with them, their respective characters.

What do you think of the tier list? Would you have placed any characters differently? Let us know what your thoughts and questions are and we will try to address the most common ones in a followup article, which will also include a more in-depth analysis of the results with statements by 4BR members.

Major thanks go out to @Shaya for processing the votes, @Zigsta and @Liberation for helping with the release and @Xiivi, @Shaya, and @Camalange for collecting outside votes and various odds and ends. Finally, a shoutout to all the voters for their time and input. I was proud to spearhead this project and receive help from so many dedicated people.

 

I have this hunch that this patch is going to change EVERY character. I don't know why, but I just feel it.

 

This has been the most entertaining read of the year by far. Keep the NaCl flowing, everybody.

 

Actually, there's something very wrong with the list: Luma isn't in top and Rosa isn't in the lower mid.

 

This has been the most entertaining read of the year by far. Keep the NaCl flowing, everybody.

I am not really salty. I expected the first tier list to not fit the majority of people just like Melees. The only huge gripe involves my two mains:I feel like sonic is top 5 and rosa is not the highest tier. Everyone else though, is salty

 

Try this again with Mii Specials considered maybe. Not that their placings would change much.

1. Rules don't use any specials, why make a tier list with it.
2. Mii Brawler?

 

Seems legit. Going all the way to J seems a tad extreme though.

 

A bit of a trivial correction, but...

You tagged @John12346 wrong.

A few tweaks would be good here and there but overall a good list IMO.

 

I need an explanation as to why Gunner is at the very bottom.
I'm always seeing it, but nobody ever explains it.

 

Fair into rest.

Is not a true combo

 

I need an explanation as to why Gunner is at the very bottom.
I'm always seeing it, but nobody ever explains it.

It might no longer be the case, it might, nobody knows because they have never seen anyone play it since tournament organizing has been so harsh on the people that actually want to play them

 

I have this hunch that this patch is going to change EVERY character. I don't know why, but I just feel it.

lf you're talking about some massive frame data improvements for Palutena and Ganondorf, l'd like to disagree. These slower, clunkier characters who're god-awful in 1v1s are a blessing in Free-for-Alls with items on high on Gaur Plain or Cave Offensive. Giving true combos on characters like these eliminates the obviously intentional flaws of these characters. They force you to think in 1v1 situations and l like that.

 

Y'know what?
I'm not mad anymore.
I can accept this list. I guess I'll just have to wait for the next one, but can I just ask for the next one to be at least seven to nine months later? That way a new baby can be born?

 

Great intel Marc.

 

Y'know what?
I'm not mad anymore.
I can accept this list. I guess I'll just have to wait for the next one, but can I just ask for the next one to be at least seven to nine months later? That way a new baby can be born?

Bro, we get it. You don't like the tier list that was released. Stop going on about it.

 

lf you're talking about some massive frame data improvements for Palutena and Ganondorf, l'd like to disagree. These slower, clunkier characters who're god-awful in 1v1s are a blessing in Free-for-Alls with items on high on Gaur Plain or Cave Offensive. Giving true combos on characters like these eliminates the obviously intentional flaws of these characters. They force you to think in 1v1 situations and l like that.

Wait, what???? Did I just read items?

 

I have this hunch that this patch is going to change EVERY character. I don't know why, but I just feel it.

That would make the patch discussion so interesting. Im sitting here grinning, getting more hype for the testing and discussion of the patch than actually playing it!

 

My 2 cents.

Move C into B, and combine Low tiers into a SINGLE line.
There you go, better

 

Anyone else think that Roy is a little to low?

No. He is too high as a matter of fact. Every character below him has accomplished more than him.

 

Wait, what???? Did I just read items?

YES YOU DID. This isn't PM, competitive tryhards aren't the only people that play this game. Filthy casuals make up a ton of the fanbase. That's why this game can be pretty hard to balance.

And mentioning true combos was just a shot in the dark guessing at what buffs you would've wanted to see.

 

• Pika at 5th despite only having one good player who can barely finish top 8 anymore.
• MK barely in the top 10 despite dominating multiple continents.
• Characters like Diddy/Sonic ranked below other A-tiers despite having a proven record vs. Sheik.
• No +/- subgroupings (thus implying large gaps in viability between each of A-J.)

I am highly disappointed that such an intelligent group of people managed to compile a list as mediocre as this one.

Same.


Also guys guys...
Remember when I said since the beginning of Smash 4 that Yoshi is a top 15/20 character?

Neither do I :^)

 

YES YOU DID. This isn't PM, competitive tryhards aren't the only people that play this game. Filthy casuals make up a ton of the fanbase. That's why this game can be pretty hard to balance.

The casual players barely even know about balancing unless someone tells them form my knowledge. For all we know, sheik is the worst character in FFA's and doubles, yet they would buff her? Sakurai is focusing more on competetive given the recent tournament.

 

I don't understand people saying "Why posting the tier list 2 days before the next patch ?" Well, this is how tier list works. You make it, and update it at the same time the game does. Why would they realese it after the next patch, knowing that there will be another patch after ??

And we are in 2016, seriously. There will be patchs until the game dies. A game (such as SSB) can't ever EVER be balanced.

 

Why is so low?
He is perfection.

 

The casual players barely even know about balancing unless someone tells them form my knowledge. For all we know, sheik is the worst character in FFA's and doubles, yet they would buff her? Sakurai is focusing more on competetive given the recent tournament.

"Another problem we have to consider is that battles can take on many formats in Smash. There are moves that are completely useless in a 1v1 battle, but in a four-player free-for-all those moves might prove quite useful. Therefore, if I played only one kind of battle, the game would feel very slanted towards a particular style of play.
Furthermore, if I went with what is fair according to advanced players, the beginners wouldn’t be able to keep up. " - Sakurai's Famitsu Column

 

The casual players barely even know about balancing unless someone tells them form my knowledge. For all we know, sheik is the worst character in FFA's and doubles, yet they would buff her? Sakurai is focusing more on competetive given the recent tournament.

Oh, she is. Trust me. Why don't we buff her so she'll do better in that format?

 

"Another problem we have to consider is that battles can take on many formats in Smash. There are moves that are completely useless in a 1v1 battle, but in a four-player free-for-all those moves might prove quite useful. Therefore, if I played only one kind of battle, the game would feel very slanted towards a particular style of play.
Furthermore, if I went with what is fair according to advanced players, the beginners wouldn’t be able to keep up. " - Sakurai's Famitsu Column

True, but I feel like all the buffs have been more of an affect towards 1v1 then like FFAs

Oh, she is. Trust me. Why don't we buff her so she'll do better in that format?

So she is not brawl meta knight.

 

Is this list not BS?
Is Ganondorf not generally agreed to be low tier?
Is Link not generally agreed to be mid-tier?
Is Kirby not generally agreed to be bottom tier?
And WHY THE HELL IS ROBIN IN HIGH TIER!?

Kirby is generally just underplayed because he's kinda a basic character but he's pretty solid. Robin is so high because while he/she has a problem with ground and air speed, has a lot of good tools and even the ability to heal off of ALL the cast unlike some who need a specific kind of projectile, not to mention one of the best projectiles in the game that is generally easy to get your hands on unlike a bomb-omb or Mr. Saturn, or a stitch-face. Also the recent frame buffs and hitbox adjustments s/he got help as well.

 

So she is not brawl meta knight.

Exactly, this could be applied for a lot of the characters who're strong in their respective formats. Giving Brawl Ike (idk, example) an easy combo would make him needlessly stronger in the eyes of casuals of that game. Class dismissed!

 

Palutena's like, 6 places too high.

 

lf you're talking about some massive frame data improvements for Palutena and Ganondorf, l'd like to disagree. These slower, clunkier characters who're god-awful in 1v1s are a blessing in Free-for-Alls with items on high on Gaur Plain or Cave Offensive. Giving true combos on characters like these eliminates the obviously intentional flaws of these characters. They force you to think in 1v1 situations and l like that.

I think the deal with Palutena is that she was built around using her customs. Technically without them, she does have a combo of sorts (down throw -> fair), but with them on, she gains a ton of vicious and guaranteed followups with Superspeed and Lightweight on. Her and the Mii Fighters are the true losers of the customs ban post EVO 2015.

Palutena's like, 6 places too high.

She is bad without customs, but not the worst in the game.

 

That moment when Shulk is mid-low tier even with his recent frame buffs(feelsbadman). It's crazy how in concept and in a casual/semi-competitive environment he seems like a crazy good character, but everybody and their mothers who are serious about smash have played him at some point and enjoyed playing him, but could not get results with him. I honestly don't think he belongs that low on the tier-list.

 

Gotta love how Diddy Kong, Pikachu, Meta Knight and Fox are in the same tier.
Smash 64 top tier: Pikachu
Melee top tier: Fox
Brawl top tier: Meta Knight
Former Smash 4 top tier: Diddy Kong

 

Why do people consider Lucas top tier? (In the comments)

He's literally gotten no results, and all the dedicated Lucas mains refuse to just stick with him in tourney, NAKAT tried, hasn't pulled him out for a while, Pink Fresh is going Dark Pit because he's better, MEKOS plays Ness/Mario now because he thinks Lucas is bottom 10, FAE completely quit, Crimchild quit Lucas for Ness because he thinks he feels awful in this game...

Most people I've talked to ask me if he feels clunky in this game, and I agree. The main reason I even play him is because he's my favorite character, as much as I want to solo main him I can't because he doesn't have the tools to compete when it comes to playing to win in an optimal situation.

No, I do not hate Lucas, no I do not think he is trash, I think mediocre better describes him. No character in Smash 4 is truly bad, and when people learn to SDI his nair the footstools will become less consistent than they are currently. Without any auto cancels, and bad aerial frame data, he does not have a place in top tier or high tier. His main think he has going for him is his dthrow, which relies on grab... and he has a tether grab.

His Down Smash also only hits once, so if you shield the first hit the next 2 don't count, and nair has SDI multipliers intentionally added so you can get out of nair. His up smash also does not function as it's supposed to, with misleading tool tips that aren't correct, the move is literally broken (Think Samus U Smash in terms of functionality, but still kills if you're right on him)

This is one of the best tier lists I've seen, and I consider Lucas and Roy to be in the correct spots.

 

Let's not let the SSBWiki take this with viability.

First off, Ganondorf is not in the bottom three characters; he's a low tier, if not a lower middle tier character.

Then they have the audacity to put bottom tier Robin into high tier!?

Ooh, and Link in Low Tier when he's been agreed to be middle tier or upper middle?

Ryu...in top...five...WHAT?!

Game and Watch, Kirby and Little Mac in low tier? Where are their accurate bottom tier placements?

King Dedede's meant to be in the bottom five, you know.

Like seriously, 4BR, you need to really disband and remake yourself.
A tier list like this is actually unacceptable.

Dude calm the **** down

 

Top and high are ok. Everything else is lol.

 

Why do people consider Lucas top tier?

He's literally gotten no results, and all the dedicated Lucas mains refuse to just stick with him in tourney, NAKAT tried, hasn't pulled him out for a while, Pink Fresh is going Dark Pit because he's better, MEKOS plays Ness/Mario now because he thinks Lucas is bottom 10, FAE completely quit, Crimchild quit Lucas for Ness because he thinks he feels awful in this game...

Most people I've talked to ask me if he feels clunky in this game, and I agree. The main reason I even play him is because he's my favorite character, as much as I want to solo main him I can't because he doesn't have the tools to compete when it comes to playing to win in an optimal situation.

No, I do not hate Lucas, no I do not think he is trash, I think mediocre better describes him. No character in Smash 4 is truly bad, and when people learn to SDI his nair the footstools will become less consistent than they are currently. Without any auto cancels, and bad aerial frame data, he does not have a place in top tier or high tier. His main think he has going for him is his dthrow, which relies on grab... and he has a tether grab.

His Down Smash also only hits once, so if you shield the first hit the next 2 don't count, and nair has SDI multipliers intentionally added so you can get out of nair. His up smash also does not function as it's supposed to, with misleading tool tips that aren't correct, the move is literally broken (Think Samus U Smash in terms of functionality, but still kills if you're right on him)

This is one of the best tier lists I've seen, and I consider Lucas and Roy to be in the correct spots.

The list has Lucas Low tier, unless you're referring to Ness, which I don't think you are.

 

The list has Lucas Low tier, unless you're referring to Ness, which I don't think you are.

I'm talking about a lot of people saying Lucas should be high/top tier, not sure if they're all trolls, or if they're being serious. It's on the previous pages, I'll clarify. Sorry

 

Let's not let the SSBWiki take this with viability.

First off, Ganondorf is not in the bottom three characters; he's a low tier, if not a lower middle tier character.

Then they have the audacity to put bottom tier Robin into high tier!?

Ooh, and Link in Low Tier when he's been agreed to be middle tier or upper middle?

Ryu...in top...five...WHAT?!

Game and Watch, Kirby and Little Mac in low tier? Where are their accurate bottom tier placements?

King Dedede's meant to be in the bottom five, you know.

Like seriously, 4BR, you need to really disband and remake yourself.
A tier list like this is actually unacceptable.

calm down. Nobody put Robin in High tier. That being said, Robin is definitely not bottom tier. Game and Watch/Kirby are arguably not bottom tier [mac is], Putting link in upper mid and above toon link is such a gross overration that I'm not even going to bother, Ganon I'll give you [though only because I think Palutena and Charizard are about 6 spaces too high] Ryu I can see in Top 5, and Dedede could go either way.

All things considered, the list is pretty solid.

The only thing they'd have to do to please me is move Bowser Jr, Charizard and Palutena 6 spaces down. Then I'd be fine.

 

This list will likely become useless, or needs a major overhaul after the next update is released. Also, Rosalina is in the S-tier? Frankly, she's better placed at the top of the A-tier, simply because of the fact that without the Luma, her offensive game is heavily hindered; a weakness that's easily exploited by most fighters.

 

I personal think Roy and Lucas should be allot higher