Final Zelda Discussion - What's In, what's out?

[Creo]

Sure go ahead Creo.

Thank you.

Use question marks correctly. =P

I don't see why I even have to explain this, but okay:
Smash is ALL about personality. Completely and utterly. Fully and... wholly. And so on.
Would you play the game if the characters were like other fighting game characters? People who are just designed to look badass and have personalities that can be summed up in one word? For THEM, personality is nothing, it's all about being powerful.
The reason why everyone is discussing characters is because everyone wants characters they are attached to. Why do you like the Happy Mask Salesman? Seriously, why do you bother to defend him? Could it be because, I dunno, because you like him? And why would you like a fictional character that has no personality? You can argue all you want, it's the one and only reason, and you know that.
The counterarguments you brought up make no sense. Link never speaks. So what? He acts. He has facial expressions. He cares, he loves, he defends, he has friends, enemies, a home-town, a father-figure, a voice, and like most Nintendo characters just has inherent personality.
Why does nobody except for some really weird people want generic enemies and folks like Zoras? Because they're ~-GENERIC-~


EDIT: Could someone of the other guys please agree with me? This is getting me really agitated for some reason.

I used my ? mark correctly. Yes I noticed =P.

Zoras are not weird, you are and you voted I am.

You should be agitated because your wrong.

 

[Numa Dude]

Use question marks correctly. =P

I don't see why I even have to explain this, but okay:
Smash is ALL about personality. Completely and utterly. Fully and... wholly. And so on.
Would you play the game if the characters were like other fighting game characters? People who are just designed to look badass and have personalities that can be summed up in one word? For THEM, personality is nothing, it's all about being powerful.
The reason why everyone is discussing characters is because everyone wants characters they are attached to. Why do you like the Happy Mask Salesman? Seriously, why do you bother to defend him? Could it be because, I dunno, because you like him? And why would you like a fictional character that has no personality? You can argue all you want, it's the one and only reason, and you know that.
The counterarguments you brought up make no sense. Link never speaks. So what? He acts. He has facial expressions. He cares, he loves, he defends, he has friends, enemies, a home-town, a father-figure, a voice, and like most Nintendo characters just has inherent personality.
Why does nobody except for some really weird people want generic enemies and folks like Zoras? Because they're ~-GENERIC-~


EDIT: Could someone of the other guys please agree with me? This is getting me really agitated for some reason.

Personality= NOTHING!

Sure personality attracts you too a character and makes you like them but in a fighting game like smash Personality means nothing. The characters are being chosen for their roles in the games not because of their personality. I mean seriously G&W has no personality. Hell he doesn't even have a back story, so personality means nothing for choosing brawl participants, it's all about importance. On a side note I like HMS for his uniqueness and the mystery surrounding him.

 

[Stryks]

1) I just asked for reasons you didn't need to post all this.

2) A major role in one recent game means nothing to smash. They are going to choose characters that rep the series as a whole best, not just recent important characters.

3) The fairy in MM was a ***** too should we add her? Hell no. Oh and personality is nothing.

4) Exactly like the fairy in MM did.

5) Why does this matter?

6) Actually the king of red lions had a role just as important as Midna's plus she is still just a stupid helper character that ain't coming back. Oh and her talking alot is a ****ty reason.

7) Midna is a passing fad. As soon as the next Zelda comes out we will all forget about Midna.

8) Shiek and Zelda are the same person and therefore had the same role, your logic fails.

9) If she returns later and continues to be important then in a future smash maybe but now no.

10) Practically all the Zelda characters would have an easy to make moveset.

11) You paraphrased all the reasons up to this point for this one.

12) I see no reason we need TP exclusive characters. It is one game in a huge series, even if it is recent that wouldn't be fair to the series as a whole.

13) You forgot the Old man and Kafei.

14) You actually helped me by saying he was in the most recent Zelda game before Melee. How so you ask? Well if he wasn't added in melee and it was the most recent Zelda why does Midna have such a good chance of appearing if she is in the same situation? The awnser is he wasn't important enough yet. Nintendo didn't know if they wanted to continue to use him and now with his role in TP it shows they still remember Skull Kid and will most likely continue to use him. Oh and his popularity being diminished is not fact. While I'm at it the mask didn't control him, it unleashed his pent up negative feelings turning him into a heartless monster which eventually made him so demented he wanted nothing more than the death of everything so he tried to pull the moon down and when he was released from the masks power it used the opportunity to take a new host, the moon.

15) Vaati is cell shaded Link's rival and number one villain and with Y.Link most likely getting cell shaded I would be surprised if he isn't in brawl.

16) Tingle has WAY more chance than Midna because he has his own spin off games and has been in a hell of alot more games so Tingle owns Midna.

17) It's Y.Link with a different art style. You can't count him as a newcomer.

18) Both him and Midna have absolutely no chance in hell but HMS would be a better overall character because of his originality and crazy *** style. I'm better than you because I didn't respond to this statement with a smart *** comment.

19) I like owning Midna supporters.

1) Im givin facts about her in case some dont know her well, thus to better show off her uniqueness...

2) Yeah so thats why sheik and ganonDORF were added in melee? Both of them only appeared once b4 melee, Sheik was just the alter ego of zelda to hide her identity, she was just there to show u some history on what happen 7 years of links abscence and to teach u some songs, and ganondorf (tough ganon was always the villain, this was the 1st time ganonDORF appeared [in OoT]) and yet he was in melee...

U also fail on one thing: smahs is a game of all stars, how are unimportant character all stars? rite now midna is important in the zelda game, if she wil lstill keep that large role in the zelda series is sunknown, yes she did break the twilight mirror and thus never return, but we still dont know yet, and since I doubt theyll show trailers of the next zelda game b4 brawl, midna is important rite now in the present, thus having a good shot...

3) The fairy had pretyt much the same rol as navy, maybe a tad more important, u cant compare any guide character with midna, which is without a doub the one with the biggest role in zelda history...

4) Midnas personality is way more cooler that tatls, many will agree...

5) Shows how important she was in TP, believe me skull kid had a smaller role in MM: Hes sad cause giants left him, attacks HMS, takes the mask, mask unleashes anger within him, and wants to crash the moon on termina, thats pretty much all he does...

6) The king of red lions had a good role in the game, but u cant compare to midna, he was only there as the usual guide, tellin u what and where to do/go, and tellin u the history of hyrule and what happen in the past and such...

Midna actualyl helps u in battles, tells u the bond with the light and shadow worlds, and is great help when in wolf form, not to mention shes the twilight princess, u know the game is called LoZ TWILIGHT PRINCESS rite?

7) Its still too early to know, who knows she MAY return, but since we dont know yet, obviously sakurai wil lchoose from the characters of the games THAT HAVE BEEN MADE b4 the release of brawl, thus he will obviously see, with her big role, popularity and uniqueness, he will obviously consider midna, and will probably add her...

8) UR logic fails, sheik tough IS zelda, shes consider a diferent character, there are sheik trophies and zelda trophies, but wait there the same person wtf?! there are shiek players that dont use zelda, and zelda users that dont use sheik, but OMG theire da smae preson1!!1! Ur logic fails, u say that sheik apepared in the other retro zelda games, the nes, snes, and game boy titles? that stupid, SHEIK appeared for the 1st time in OoT, but ZELDA appeared in every other zelda game...

9) So why should skull kid be added then? he didnt continue the big role status, and actually missed one console zelda game, haha u burn urself with dat one (u cant possibly consider the role in TP as BIG)

10) Yeah skull kids moveset would be over easy to use, since he never fought in the game, it was the mask, yeah tingle would be easy, and dont forget kafei, the old man and hms...

Some are easier thant others, its fact...

11) Just so u can keep up

12) So why addin skull kid with majoras mask, its one game why would it need representation on such a huge series? brun urself again

13) How the hell is old man an all star, hes a retro character that told u dodongos dislike bomb, and kafei, wtf? why the hell should he be even mentioned?

14) Oi u surely dont know that melee was running low on time, thus sakurai couldnt finish the game like he would have liked, the deadline was near and they needed to fill the roster, thus clones were born, hell skul kid might have been added, i mean there was a termina stage rite? but with lack of time they couldnt finish it properly

Thats melee history 101

Sakurai has had over 2 years now and all 07 to finish it, thats like 3 years he has more than enough time to add unique characters, and avoid the clones, thus midna chances in entering are still high even by ur "logic"

15) Vaatis links main enemy in the handheld games, but since were addin WW link, whose main enemy is WW ganondorf, I dotn c how ur logic fits, and I doubt handheld zelda games will get rep in brawl...

16) Yes but tingle was always there for just map releated roles, thus his role in every zelda games have been very low, yes he has his own game, but ts just a balloon fighter game with him as the character, that doesnt qualify him to be in brawl, his chances are high, but not THAT high...

17) Yeah thats what I meant, hes the replacement, wstill since he has a totally diferent look they may consider him as a newcomer, or as a returning character, I still dont know...

18) How is a guy that sells mask original? and what style? hes always smiling cries for losing a mask, and has never actually fought, thats makes him a good character to be in brawl? and what an impish character that can hide in shadows, teleport, materialize and desmaterialize at will, use magic, and being the princess of twilight realm aint original? wtf? Midna is unique, awesome and has a kick *** personality...

19) Wait ur were owning, I couldnt tell since I pretty much PWN (thats how u type it by the way) everything u said...

Fawriel I agree with u, even tough for some characters, we dont know about their personality cause it wasnt implemented in their own game (ICs, GaW were retros, hardly any retro character has a distinguished personality) but for some characters like mewtwo, roy, mario, marth, peach, and all the other who have a distingueshed personality, is what makes them unique, their not sopuless and personality-less characters who just wanna fight, they fight in smash yet still keepin their personalities attached...

 

[Vali]

Why does nobody except for some really weird people want generic enemies and folks like Zoras? Because they're ~-GENERIC-~

Meh, generic characters/enemies/races can have unique personalities that you can get attached too, hence why there is sometimes a particular subject of that generic race that arises and is categorised as THE particular one of it's race (i.e Skull kid and Yoshi). I think it's the fact that you can fall in love with a well designed enemy as much as a well constructed character. For me, while the race of "dry bones" has never had anything to say or do it was an awesome moment for me in Paper Mario 2 in Hooktail's castle with the hundreds of dry bones which you got to smack with a hammer which just oozed with style that made me love the enemy design more than anything.

More to the point of the actual discussion, i do stand by you that personality matters a lot when it comes to choosing suitable smash contenders. Contrary to beliefs held by some, i think that a character's popularity (which is obviously derived from looks, style and first and foremost personality) will heavily influence a character's chance of appearance. Of course i'm not saying it's the most important factor, nor will it garuntee a spot, but a character with personality will almost indefinitely get a spot over a similar choice with no personality.

 

[Creo]

You summed up Skull Kids history. There is way more behind it.
Tatl is better than Midna.
HMS is original. He was an ORIGINAL person in OoT and a main in MM. He was crying over MM because he knew terrible things would happen.
I didn't feel like reading the rest so the stuff I typed, I PWN.
If any Zora, it would be Maiku.

 

[Deleted member]

Stryks really makes me hate Midna by comparing her to Skull Kid, Tatl, Navi, The King... She isn't the best companion ever. She sucks, to be quite honest. For the first half of the game she's annoying and doesn't help much, when I first met her I was hoping she'd bugger off and I'd have a normal fairy. Even when she changed a little, she was still annoying. Her voice sounds are some of the worst gibberish I've ever heard. And the sacrificing? Oh please. Zelda sacrificed herself. Midna sacrificed herself. It doesn't mean anything.

What's worse is that you're comparing her to Skull kid, who is a fantastic character and possibly the most intricate in the Zelda plot if you bothered to read up on him. If you wish to be schooled, I'll be happy to say everything, but I'm content that I've thrown your Midna loving a little off tonight.

 

[Stryks]

How the hell is HMS a main? He was just there at the beginning and at the end of a game, he had little influence in the game and had a small role, hell kafei was more important in the game cuase to get all the masks u needed him...

How is the world it tatl better than midna? did I miss a game name oZ: The fairy named tatl or what?

Zoras are generic, if we add any zora, lets say ruto, why dont we add the princes from TP, the king from TP, zora link from MM, the queen ghost from TP and so on, same with gorons...

Skull kids story aint as complex as midnas...

Now either u actually give reasons I hardly see the PWNing...


@ smash daddy: I passed MM 100% and am a big fan of skull kid, hell I have even a sig of him, but im idk REALISTIC, and know if skull kid or midna are gonna get added, its Midna... if u dont like her, to bad, lot of people like the characters and has a good shot...

 

[Creo]

Ok. There was a LoZ called Navi Trackers.

Happy Mask Salesman was a main because do you forget it is his mask(game is based on it), he taught you a song, and is one of the people you always remember.(usually mains)

Skull Kid still has an extensive backround. Not as much but has more than you put it.
Midna is a sorry excuse for help and Navi and Tatl pwn her.

Maiku is the MM Zora playable character.

It is not required to get all the masks or any for that matter. Kafei was not a main. Tingle had a more extensive role then him.

 

[Deleted member]

@ smash daddy: I passed MM 100% and am a big fan of skull kid, hell I have even a sig of him,

Cool!

but im idk REALISTIC,

Realistic?

and know if skull kid or midna are gonna get added, its Midna... if u dont like her, to bad, lot of people like the characters and has a good shot...

Ah. Realistic. -Nods head.-

You see, I didn't know you have such evidence as this:

its Midna

I mean, is there any way I can argue with the facts?

 

[Stryks]

I ahrdly see thw pwning in:

Fairys are better than midna!
I didnt like midna I wanted a fairy!
X character is better than midna...

I hardly c it really, without giving reasons on why these characters are better and why midna sucks, i gave a lot of info on midna, wh shes important, the role she plays, and why shes pretty much the #1 best choise for a new LoZ character in brawl, what have u guys posted? nothin, cmon give me info on character, their status reasons, or is it that u guys just cant think of anything good?

Lol smash daddy did u what ignore my last posts? I already said why midna is more realistic? so ur saying a character whose role is smaller that midnas in his game, which takes place kinda like a side story in the zelda universe, and the fact that the character (skull kid w/ majoras mask) and the game are about a decade old has more chance than a character from the latest game that had the bigegst role in that game and among guide characters, and that actually FIGHTS? lol god i dont believe it lol...

 

[Creo]

Uumm tough guy, did you read my last post.
And Skull Kid has an extensive backround because he is the main Boss.

 

[Deleted member]

Let's see... She's annoying in the game, I don't know who you're talking about but most people I talk to about her also think she was annoying. Then there's the fact that she is only the companion. She plays a big part in the story but you never play as her or do anything that's a first for the series. She plays the generic role with a few differences. Thirdly she's sized disproportionally. She has a massive head, tiny body, but also floats... Unless she was on Wolf Link, which would cause problems such as the fact that that is a very unpopular (in the thread by De Lupe, for example) choice.

Majora's Mask is no "side game". Skull kid is not a one-off. Majora's Mask may use recycled characters, but it's just so the player feels attached to the OoT characters, and it may be shorter but it makes up for it with side-quests and a unique day system. Midna is a one-off, Twilight Princess may be an important game right now but so was 'Majora's Mask when it came out. If they have the extra space, they won't choose a character as faulty as Midna could be. I see Skull kid with a good chance still. He appears in Twilight Princess, as you have repeatedly said ten years after his last appearance. Why would they do that if they didn't want to use him again?

 

[Creo]

I will agree with you all the way. Skull Kid is just better than Midna. So are the fairys.

 

[Stryks]

Ok well midna is ur guide character, is always with u, helps u in wolf form, helps with teleportation, helps u get in the twilight realm, tell u the bond between worlds, what happen with the twili, whose zant, turns into twili spider to break the barrier of the castle, should I continue?

How exaclt navi and tatl pwn her, unless the annoying HEY! LISTEN!! WATCH OUT!! is so loud that makes midnas head pop, I doubt theres anythin that makes navy and tatl more important...

SO what about maiku? (u dont exactly play him, u play link who trasnfroms into a zora) so that means we should add goron link, deku link, fierce deity link, the bird girl from WW, the little plat guy from MM, wolf link, ur logic fails...

And I keep saying, tingle has a shot, but his role in every game is not close as important as midnas, there no way u can say tinlge pwns her...

now instead of just saying: this guy pwns midna!!, why not give reasons and facts? or is it that u cant? nd It was hard to read ur last post cause u edit it after I posted mine duh...

 

[LukeFonFabre]

What's worse is that you're comparing her to Skull kid, who is a fantastic character and possibly the most intricate in the Zelda plot if you bothered to read up on him.

The heck? Skull kid isn't that intricate at all. He has a glorified role in MM by being a pathetic puppet of an ancient evil, which is his notable appearance of any worth (both his OoT and TP appearances are incredibly minor). Melee was the best time for his entrance, but now his chances have been hurt greatly. He just simply has too much working against him.

From what I can tell, Midna has a lot of popularity and it seems the people who dislike her are in the minority. She has a good shot of getting into brawl, not a certainty by any means, simply because outside the big 3 Zelda reps it's anyones game, but she's amongst the more likely candidates IMO.

 

[Numa Dude]

I expected an immature stupid response but this is a new record for you Stryks.

1) Im givin facts about her in case some dont know her well, thus to better show off her uniqueness...

Very Well then.

2) Yeah so thats why sheik and ganonDORF were added in melee? Both of them only appeared once b4 melee, Sheik was just the alter ego of zelda to hide her identity, she was just there to show u some history on what happen 7 years of links abscence and to teach u some songs, and ganondorf (tough ganon was always the villain, this was the 1st time ganonDORF appeared [in OoT]) and yet he was in melee...

Ganondorf is the same entity as Ganon and the same gos for Zelda and Shiek.

U also fail on one thing: smahs is a game of all stars, how are unimportant character all stars? rite now midna is important in the zelda game, if she wil lstill keep that large role in the zelda series is sunknown, yes she did break the twilight mirror and thus never return, but we still dont know yet, and since I doubt theyll show trailers of the next zelda game b4 brawl, midna is important rite now in the present, thus having a good shot...

You burn yourself with that post but you're arrogant to realise it. Midna is NOT an all star yet. IF she appears in more games then maybe but as of now she isn't.

3) The fairy had pretyt much the same rol as navy, maybe a tad more important, u cant compare any guide character with midna, which is without a doub the one with the biggest role in zelda history...

I wasn't talking about roles you twit I was comparing the twos personality and by saying Midna has one of the biggest roles in Zelda history is an over exaggerated lie.

4) Midnas personality is way more cooler that tatls, many will agree...

Midna is basically a more extreme version of Tatl.

5) Shows how important she was in TP,

Everyone already knows her importance. I haven't played the game and I know how important she is.

believe me skull kid had a smaller role in MM: Hes sad cause giants left him, attacks HMS, takes the mask, mask unleashes anger within him, and wants to crash the moon on termina, thats pretty much all he does...

Stop paraphrasing characters roles.

6) The king of red lions had a good role in the game, but u cant compare to midna, he was only there as the usual guide, tellin u what and where to do/go, and tellin u the history of hyrule and what happen in the past and such...

Once again you paraphrase the characters role there by making it sound smaller than it really is.

Midna actualyl helps u in battles,

Every guide does this in some way except the King of red lions.

tells u the bond with the light and shadow worlds, and is great help when in wolf form, not to mention shes the twilight princess, u know the game is called LoZ TWILIGHT PRINCESS rite?

We get it already she's important to the story so what.

7) Its still too early to know, who knows she MAY return, but since we dont know yet, obviously sakurai wil lchoose from the characters of the games THAT HAVE BEEN MADE b4 the release of brawl, thus he will obviously see, with her big role, popularity and uniqueness, he will obviously consider midna, and will probably add her...

You aren't even listening to me. She isn't important enough to the series as a whole yet. IF she appears in more games in the future then she very well could get in to a future smash game but for now she isn't important enough yet.

8) UR logic fails, sheik tough IS zelda, shes consider a diferent character, there are sheik trophies and zelda trophies, but wait there the same person wtf?! there are shiek players that dont use zelda, and zelda users that dont use sheik, but OMG theire da smae preson1!!1! Ur logic fails,

You idiot. Transformations don't take up rep spots. Yes they are separate characters overall but when you're talking about overall reps for that series then they don't count because they are the same person.

u say that sheik apepared in the other retro zelda games, the nes, snes, and game boy titles? that stupid, SHEIK appeared for the 1st time in OoT, but ZELDA appeared in every other zelda game...

When the hell did I say that?

9) So why should skull kid be added then? he didnt continue the big role status, and actually missed one console zelda game, haha u burn urself with dat one (u cant possibly consider the role in TP as BIG)

He should be added over Midna because he is more important to the series as a whole. I never said his role in TP is big.

10) Yeah skull kids moveset would be over easy to use, since he never fought in the game, it was the mask, yeah tingle would be easy, and dont forget kafei, the old man and hms...

Some are easier thant others, its fact...

Every one of those characters excluding Kafei (it was a freaking joke.) Could have an original and fun moveset. You just aren't thinking out side the box like I do.

11) Just so u can keep up

Your immature and stupid attempt at insulting me fails like you.

12) So why addin skull kid with majoras mask, its one game why would it need representation on such a huge series? brun urself again

He wouldn't rep MM with the mask, he would rep the 64 era and the reason he would have the mask in the first place is because that is his most famous incarnation.

13) How the hell is old man an all star, hes a retro character that told u dodongos dislike bomb, and kafei, wtf? why the hell should he be even mentioned?

It was a joke.

14) Oi u surely dont know that melee was running low on time, thus sakurai couldnt finish the game like he would have liked, the deadline was near and they needed to fill the roster, thus clones were born, hell skul kid might have been added, i mean there was a termina stage rite? but with lack of time they couldnt finish it properly

Maybe Skull Kid would have been added with more time but I doubt it and we have no reason to think he was supposed to be in other than the stage which could have been for Y.Link since he was both OoT and MM oriented.

Thats melee history 101

I didn't need a review.

Sakurai has had over 2 years now and all 07 to finish it, thats like 3 years he has more than enough time to add unique characters, and avoid the clones, thus midna chances in entering are still high even by ur "logic"

What do clones have to do with Midna? I think Midna's chances are low because of her low importance to the series as a whole not because of anything to do with clones. You make no sense.

15) Vaatis links main enemy in the handheld games, but since were addin WW link, whose main enemy is WW ganondorf, I dotn c how ur logic fits, and I doubt handheld zelda games will get rep in brawl...

We are adding cell shaded Link not just WW Link. He will take after all of the cell shaded Links not just WW even if it is the first game with cell shaded graphics. You saying the handheld don't need rep is just another by product of your biased love for TP and Midna.

16) Yes but tingle was always there for just map releated roles, thus his role in every zelda games have been very low, yes he has his own game, but ts just a balloon fighter game with him as the character, that doesnt qualify him to be in brawl, his chances are high, but not THAT high...

If his own games (there are two one is an RPG) are considered Zelda then you are wrong but if his own games are considered another franchise then he would most likely get in to rep them similar to Yoshi and his series. Either way it's still Tingle>Midna.

17) Yeah thats what I meant, hes the replacement, wstill since he has a totally diferent look they may consider him as a newcomer, or as a returning character, I still dont know...

It's Link at a young age, common sense says he will be just the new art style.

18) How is a guy that sells mask original?

Have you seen a video game character like him ever before? I didn't think so.

and what style?

Masks and Moods.

hes always smiling cries for losing a mask, and has never actually fought, thats makes him a good character to be in brawl?

Just because someone has never been seen fighting doesn't mean they can't. He is a good choice for brawl IMO for his originality.

and what an impish character that can hide in shadows, teleport, materialize and desmaterialize at will, use magic, and being the princess of twilight realm aint original? wtf? Midna is unique, awesome and has a kick *** personality...

I never said she isn't I just said HMS was more original than she is.

19) Wait ur were owning, I couldnt tell since I pretty much PWN (thats how u type it by the way) everything u said...

You make me seem mature and thats saying something.

 

[Stryks]

Sorry for double posting but the button aint workin for me:

Ok so umm im guessin HEY! LISTEN!! WATCH OUT!! every minute is less annoying than a little laugh from Midna? U never play as tatl, navi, the king, skull kid, tingle, HMS or any other character, whats ur point? Yeah generic role, I bet miyamoto went: "Ok lets named the title of the game after a totally generic character! I was thinking the bomb salesman, or maybe the running postman, oh I know, the fat sumo wrestling chief of the village!!... rite midna has a generic role, being the twilight princess and all [/sarcasm]

What her body size and shape is too weird?! god that means kirby, jiggly, mario (has a big head for his body), wario, metaknight and all of those are out of the picture, and guys like tingle (super small for his age), sonic (a blue hedge hog with sonic speed? BLASPHEMY!) and all of those are out of the pictue!! [/again sarcasm]

All ur logic fails, by the way, the skull kid in TP cant be the one from MM, I mean he doesnt have the look, size or posture, and if we add him, we cant give him MM since u know HMS took it back....

 

[Deleted member]

****, one second...

 

[Wiseguy]

I've skimmed over some of the arguments brought forward by Numa Dude and others, and I think the main argument people have against Midna is that she was only in one game, wheras someone like Skull Kid has been in three. There are two problems with this.

1) The inclusion of Sheik in Melee proved that a character from a recent Zelda game can be put in over older Zelda characters, even if that character has only been in one game. True Sheik wasn't a"pure character addition" in the sense that she was technically just an alter ego for Zelda. However, if Zelda's "disguise" can be deemed worthy of a unique moveset in Melee, surely Midna is just as likely to appear in Brawl.

2) Midna is far more central to the plot than any villian or side kick in any previous game, so its a false comparison to equate her with someone like Skull Kid or the King of the Red Lions.
As the main protagonist in the story of Twilight Princess, Midna will definitly be put in Brawl before the Skull Kid is even considered.

Don't shoot the messanger Skull Kid fans. I'm with you: Skull Kid is a far more interesting character and he would make a more interesting fighter for Brawl - in my view. I'm just stating the facts: Midna is far more likely.

I went into both characters in greater detail in my original post. Feel free to comment if you missed it.

Wow. Great thread Mendez. I can’t believe no one thought to make a single thread for all the Zelda characters before now.

Warning: Beware of Twilight Princess Spoilers! I’m not going to blot them out because the game has been out for almost five months now. If you own a Gamecube or Wii, and you still haven’t played it yet, you have no one to blame but yourself if you spoil the game for yourself.


Anyway, I thought I’d weigh in on which characters from Nintendo’s most respected series have a shot at appearing in Brawl.




Confirmed:

Twilight Princess Link- I think we can all agree it was a good call to include the Twilight Princess version of Link. Not only is it a great way to pay tribute to the Wii’s first must-own game, but it also makes sense given that this version of Link is about 500% more awesome looking than any his predecessors.




Very Likely:

Twilight Princess Ganondorf-
He’s unquestionably the main villain in the franchise, so you can bet that Ganondorf will be returning. My guess is that he will appear in his Twilight Princesss form, just like Link. He’ll likely get a new moveset based on his sword in TP and perhaps the odd physical attack, so that fans of his Melee moveset won’t be totally alienated.


Twilight Princess Zelda-
Rounding out the legendary (SEE WHAT I DID THERE?!?!) trio is Zelda. I see her ditching Sheik (thank goodness) in favor of a new moveset based on her role in TP. Perhaps they could give her access to her rapier, or give her some new magic attacks, or both.


Midna-
If you’ve played Twilight Princess, you know that Midna is more than the least annoying sidekick in Zelda history (O.K, she’s still pretty annoying at times…) she’s also the real hero of Twilight Princess. That’s right, she’s even more central to the plot that Link. Sure, fairy boy is the one you control from beginning to end – but for the game’s protagonist, you could stand in a puddle of his character without getting wet (ie: he’s an incredibly shallow character). Conversely, Midna proves to be the focus of most of the character events in the game (particularily in the later half of the game) so she ultimately gets more character development than anyone else in TP. In short, she will almost certainly make it into Brawl, given her importance in TP.

Which brings us to the question: which version of Midna will get in? Most people I’ve talked to seem to expect the Imp version of Midna as that is the form she appears in for the entire game, up until the game’s finale. Personally, I’m partial to Midna’s humanoid Twili form as that is the character’s “true” form (the Imp form she is more known for was just the result of Zant’s curse). Sadly, this will probably only happen if the Smash team gets pressed for time and decides to include her as a Zelda clone (perhaps could Zelda having based entirely on light magic and give Midna dark magic).


Wind Waker Link (aka: Young Link)-
I don’t care what anyone says. Windwaker’s cell shaped graphics made it the most visually stunning Zelda game of all time. Don’t get me wrong, I think the decision to go with a more realistic graphical style in Twilight Princess was a good one, but its hard not to notice the slightly wooden appearance in some of its characters compared to Wind Waker. What better way to pay tribute to this Gamecube masterpiece (and its highly anticipated DS sequel: Phantom Hourglass) than to include the most expressive and entertaining version of everyone’s favorite Green tunic-wearing hero: Wind Waker Link. This version of Young Link is far more worthy of being in Brawl than Melee’s Young Link for 2 reasons:

1)This version of the character many more recent games (Windwaker, Four Swords, Four Swords Adventures, Minish Cap and Phantom Hourglass) than the OoT/MM Young Link .

and

2) He wears pants. A definite plus.



Possible, Not Likely:

Zant-
And the award for most hilarious boss fight goes to…

Contrary to what some people may think, Zant is not the main villain in Twilight Princess. He may get more face time than Ganondorf, but he all his evil deeds were really committed by Ganondorf, who was using him as a puppet until he could take physical form. He’s a cool villain, to be sure, but with so many Twilight Princess characters worthy of a spot on the Brawl roster, I seriously doubt that Zant stands a chance.


Wolf Link-
This character just screams “Link’s Super Move”, but it looks like that won’t be the case. Unless they go the Zero-Samus route and allow Link to transform under certain conditions, I don’t think Wolfy has much of a chance.


Vatti-
I respect the character, really I do, but is he really Brawl potential? Unless he appears as the villain in Phantom Hourglass (highly, highly unlikely) I seriously doubt that the Smash development team chose to include him.


Skull Kid-
Objectively speaking, Twilight Princess is greatest Zelda game to date (it has the epic feel equal to OoT and ALttP, it has the most memorable dungeons, the most massive overworld, more memorable characters and fun items than ever before, and the Wii’s motion sensitive controls make the experience far more immersive) but my favorite Zelda story is still Majora’s Mask. In series more often than not content to recycle the same tired storyline revolving around Zelda, Ganon and the Triforce, MM took the series in a bold new direction with a storyline more akin to a bizarre hybrid of the movie Groundhog’s Day and an episode of the Twilight Zone. What elevated Majora’s story above all other Zelda games, in my opinion, is its highly memorable side quests (Aliens abducting cows. ‘Nuff said.) as well as creepy characters like the Happy Mask Salesman and, of course, the Shull Kid.

As the most unique villain in the series, and my personal favorite Zelda character, I would gladly give an arm and a leg to see him in Brawl. Unfortunately, if he was included my sense is that the Smash team would have to include the most recent version of the Skull Kid, and that would mean the character’s appearance in the Sacred Grove sidequest (one of my favorite parts of Twilight Princess) which, sadly, has far less potential for a unique moveset than the highly underrated Majora’s Mask wearing villain. My hope is that he will appear as a stage hazard in a Sacred Grove temple, at the very least.


Tetra-
She’s the most interesting Zelda in the series, but with Twilight Princess getting all the press these days, that’s probably the version that will ultimately get in the game.


Tingle-
As one of the most hated videogame characters of all time, I think having Tingle in Brawl would be great. There are few characters I would have more fun kicking the crap out of than he. However, given that his game was never released to North America, I think that Nintendo is aware of that Tingle’s appeal is somewhat limited outside Japan (to say the least…) so he will probably be cut for this very reason. I’m guessing he will return as a stage hazard, probably in a Wind Waker themed stage.


Zero Chance:

Sheik-
Despite being the cheapest and most overused character in Super Smash Bros. Melee, Sheik is one of the least important characters in the Zelda series (having appeared in only one game).Here’s hoping that this abomination never appears in any game ever again, let alone Brawl.

 

[Creo]

Ok well midna is ur guide character, is always with u, helps u in wolf form, helps with teleportation, helps u get in the twilight realm, tell u the bond between worlds, what happen with the twili, whose zant, turns into twili spider to break the barrier of the castle, should I continue?

How exaclt navi and tatl pwn her, unless the annoying HEY! LISTEN!! WATCH OUT!! is so loud that makes midnas head pop, I doubt theres anythin that makes navy and tatl more important...

SO what about maiku? (u dont exactly play him, u play link who trasnfroms into a zora) so that means we should add goron link, deku link, fierce deity link, the bird girl from WW, the little plat guy from MM, wolf link, ur logic fails...

And I keep saying, tingle has a shot, but his role in every game is not close as important as midnas, there no way u can say tinlge pwns her...

now instead of just saying: this guy pwns midna!!, why not give reasons and facts? or is it that u cant? nd It was hard to read ur last post cause u edit it after I posted mine duh...

First off, remember this is later thoughts of things so fairys didn't need to transport or anything. Also because the worlds are way smaller. And in MM, you have an Ocarina to transport you.

My logic doesn't fail because earlier, someone else said something on Zoras and I said most likely. That has nothing to do with all those other characters.

By the way, Tatl tells history of Skull Kid. Navi tells history just about for everything.

Tingle has more important role than Kafei smart one. Stop making up stuff.
If you want reasons, Tingle sells you world maps which are more helpful than the masks for teleporting.
And I know I edited so stop getting smart with me.

 

[Deleted member]

Ok so umm im guessin HEY! LISTEN!! WATCH OUT!! every minute is less annoying than a little laugh from Midna? U never play as tatl, navi, the king, skull kid, tingle, HMS or any other character, whats ur point? Yeah generic role, I bet miyamoto went: "Ok lets named the title of the game after a totally generic character! I was thinking the bomb salesman, or maybe the running postman, oh I know, the fat sumo wrestling chief of the village!!... rite midna has a generic role, being the twilight princess and all [/sarcasm]

They're as important with the combat and basically everything but the cutscenes. If there was some way to explain it I'm sure Navi would have teleported me from A to B, the technology just wasn't there and the world wouldn't have allowed it. And Midna also repeats the same thing over and over except it's gibberish, making it even more annoying. I prefer Navi's helpful "Watch out!" to Midna's "OHSHIZZLEZ MY NIZZLEZ" in gibberish, which she might as well be saying.

What her body size and shape is too weird?! god that means kirby, jiggly, mario (has a big head for his body), wario, metaknight and all of those are out of the picture, and guys like tingle (super small for his age), sonic (a blue hedge hog with sonic speed? BLASPHEMY!) and all of those are out of the pictue!! [/again sarcasm]

Except Kirby is perfectly rounded, as is basically Metaknight and 'Puff. Mario and Wario appear in different shapes and sizes with each game... Midna is in one game, in one size, and it's a freakish one. A purposely freakish one. There's no one to compare her to except those legendary Pokemanz of the lake from D/P.

All ur logic fails,

'Couldn't possibly be that you're hanging by a thread on nearly all this...

by the way, the skull kid in TP cant be the one from MM, I mean he doesnt have the look, size or posture, and if we add him, we cant give him MM since u know HMS took it back....

Uh... You are a moron. Saying it "can't be Skull kid" is like saying that Mario is not the same Mario every game. We don't have much proof, but the proof we do have is positive. Yet you choose to ignore it and post your opinion instead.

And he doesn't need the mask in the latest game to have it in 'Brawl, fool.

 

[Creo]

Okay I want to hear why my facts are supposedly wrong Stryks.
Plus, some people are small even at 35.(noticed sarcasm)

 

[Creo]

Sorry for DP'ing.
Tingle is not the most hated character in that quote smash daddy. He has two of his own games and stars in Zelda. Highly doubt he is the most hated. He is also Eji A's favorite character...and mine.

 

[Stryks]

1)I expected an immature stupid response but this is a new record for you Stryks.

2) Ganondorf is the same entity as Ganon and the same gos for Zelda and Shiek.

3) You burn yourself with that post but you're arrogant to realise it. Midna is NOT an all star yet. IF she appears in more games then maybe but as of now she isn't.

4) I wasn't talking about roles you twit I was comparing the twos personality and by saying Midna has one of the biggest roles in Zelda history is an over exaggerated lie.

5) Midna is basically a more extreme version of Tatl.

6) Everyone already knows her importance. I haven't played the game and I know how important she is.

7) Stop paraphrasing characters roles.

8) Once again you paraphrase the characters role there by making it sound smaller than it really is.

9) Every guide does this in some way except the King of red lions.

10) We get it already she's important to the story so what.

11) You aren't even listening to me. She isn't important enough to the series as a whole yet. IF she appears in more games in the future then she very well could get in to a future smash game but for now she isn't important enough yet.

12) You idiot. Transformations don't take up rep spots. Yes they are separate characters overall but when you're talking about overall reps for that series then they don't count because they are the same person.

13) When the hell did I say that?

14) He should be added over Midna because he is more important to the series as a whole. I never said his role in TP is big.

15) Every one of those characters excluding Kafei (it was a freaking joke.) Could have an original and fun moveset. You just aren't thinking out side the box like I do.

16) Your immature and stupid attempt at insulting me fails like you.

17) He wouldn't rep MM with the mask, he would rep the 64 era and the reason he would have the mask in the first place is because that is his most famous incarnation.

18) It was a joke.

19) Maybe Skull Kid would have been added with more time but I doubt it and we have no reason to think he was supposed to be in other than the stage which could have been for Y.Link since he was both OoT and MM oriented.

20) I didn't need a review.

21) What do clones have to do with Midna? I think Midna's chances are low because of her low importance to the series as a whole not because of anything to do with clones. You make no sense.

22) We are adding cell shaded Link not just WW Link. He will take after all of the cell shaded Links not just WW even if it is the first game with cell shaded graphics. You saying the handheld don't need rep is just another by product of your biased love for TP and Midna.

23) If his own games (there are two one is an RPG) are considered Zelda then you are wrong but if his own games are considered another franchise then he would most likely get in to rep them similar to Yoshi and his series. Either way it's still Tingle>Midna.

24) It's Link at a young age, common sense says he will be just the new art style.

25)Have you seen a video game character like him ever before? I didn't think so.

26) Masks and Moods.

27) Just because someone has never been seen fighting doesn't mean they can't. He is a good choice for brawl IMO for his originality.

28) I never said she isn't I just said HMS was more original than she is.

29) You make me seem mature and thats saying something.

1) U break ur record every day

2) Ok look at ur melee trophies list, check the ganondorf trophy (im guessin u have it) and check when he 1st appeared *wait for u to check* c OoT, same as sheiks, thus just because zelda has appeared in all the other games, and ganon as well, means ganndorf and sheik have more than one apeparance, thus a character can have one appearance and can be added tro smash...

3) True she may not be an all star, yet she has an important role rite now in zelda, if she continues that role then she becomes an all star, if not, then she will become just like sheik (who was in melee)

4) Tatl and midna have similair personalities yet midnas is more defined, she may not have the biggest role in the zelda series, but she did had the biggest role in TP, and if u compare the roles of the sages, zelda in 64, and others, she still has a bigger role than them in comparison...

5) YEp, but has a bigger role than tatl, thus no way tatls pwns midna...

6) and yet u say skull kid has more of a shot...

7) Thats pretty much all the king did really, tell u the story of hyrule, tellin u stuff of the hero, and being a boat...

8) Its important to count a characters role, were not gonna add a character with a small role in the zelda games (HMS) over one with a big role in the game (midna)

9) Tatl and navi just targeted the fes, midna crated fields to rapidly attack more than one enemy, and with the help of the fused shadows, she can pretyt much take on anyone...

10) So what? its thelatest entry in the series, shes quite possibly the most important and most interesting character in the game, yet still she thinks she wont make it?

11) and how is skull kid important to the series? In MM he was important, but not in TP, he just open some "doors" so u can get to the temple... thats it, and he lacked a role in WW, makin him unimportant...

12) so ur saying there are only 25 charactes in the game? and sheik shouldnt be couunted? guess I should tel the people in the tourneys that sheik cant be counted to be played...

13) U say sheik is the same identity as zelda when I say sheik has only one appearance b4 melee was released, thus if she can be added so can midna, then u go, but shes the same identity as zelda, ok true yet sheik never apepared in the retro games, so yes she had 1 appearance b4 melee...

14) How is he important to the series, justc cause he has 3 appearances? (2 of them were lame) that doesnt make sense, bowser jr, petey priahna, king boo, waluigi and all of those should be added by ur logic...

15) Sorry for not thinking out of the box, I mean i can picture slippy as a fun character and being almost invicible,even when I dont like him, but im realistic, some characters wont be added, and every one of them can be unique...

16) Wel i for one havent called u a prick, idiot or anything, uve been doin it in every post, and im unfased by then, thus u fail in every post...

17) haha no no no, he wouldnt rep the 64 era, he would if he had the mask in OoT, but he didnt, only in MM, by ur logic, midna will represent both the GC and the wii, being in both the consoles...

18) Not very funny, jokes tend to be funny...

19) We may never know, he could have been added but the deadline was near, thus they couldnt...

20) So stop saying I burn myself by saying those things about skull kid and will affect midna, its a totally diferent story...

21) Im just saying, with more time, more characters can be added, including midna, clones may not return, the top tiers will be nerfed, and the low tiers will be improved, win-win situation, all im saying...

22) Arent the handheld games spites, not cel shade? (except phantom hourglass) anyway, I still have my doubts about vaati but I do admit (unlike u with midna) that he has a good shot...

23) I doubt they ahve to do with the series, and I hardly c how tingle>midnas, but u and creo fail to show me how that works...

24) Yeah Idk about how theyll consider WW link, ok lets leave this part alone rite?

25) Have u ever seen a videogame character like midna b4? didnt think so...

26) Dark magic, hiding abilities, teleportation, princess of twilight

27) I agree on the fighting part, but seriously barnes from barnes bomb shop is original, and as well as the postman, and sumo guy from ordon, should we add them?

28) IDK, impish character seems more original than some guy that sells masks...

29) I dont offend u or anyting, u constantly said idiot and stuff like that to maybe provoque fear or somethin, it aint workin, if ur saying all of that to take u serious, then u fail, I take u more of a kid with those words, calm down, use logic and I will take u serious, rite now ur the imature one...

Wiseguy is wise, listen to him...

 

[Stryks]

Sorry for double post

1) They're as important with the combat and basically everything but the cutscenes. If there was some way to explain it I'm sure Navi would have teleported me from A to B, the technology just wasn't there and the world wouldn't have allowed it. And Midna also repeats the same thing over and over except it's gibberish, making it even more annoying. I prefer Navi's helpful "Watch out!" to Midna's "OHSHIZZLEZ MY NIZZLEZ" in gibberish, which she might as well be saying.

2) Except Kirby is perfectly rounded, as is basically Metaknight and 'Puff. Mario and Wario appear in different shapes and sizes with each game... Midna is in one game, in one size, and it's a freakish one. A purposely freakish one. There's no one to compare her to except those legendary Pokemanz of the lake from D/P.

3) 'Couldn't possibly be that you're hanging by a thread on nearly all this...

4) Uh... You are a moron. Saying it "can't be Skull kid" is like saying that Mario is not the same Mario every game. We don't have much proof, but the proof we do have is positive. Yet you choose to ignore it and post your opinion instead.

And he doesn't need the mask in the latest game to have it in 'Brawl, fool.

1) he technology was there, u could teleport with the ocarina, why not just add an extra command when talkin to navi saying : want me to teleport u? isntead of playing the song, the technology was there cmon, navi bothered u every time u canted to lock on an enemy, when u were walking, and in many other places, midna says a lot of gibberish, but shes doesnt go HEY! WTACH OUT!! everytime an enemy apepared, when she needed to talk to u, or anything, she just laughed, adn when she talked, u could here taht weird voice, wich addin voice in tp is a plus for me...

2) but he doesnt have arm nor legs, metaknight doesnt have legs their out of propotion!, and mario and warios head are bigger that theyre supposed to be in the games, their out of proportion! see the point, midna was transform into an Imp, imp are supposed to be small, have out of proportion parts of the body, and look freakish...

3) Could u possibly think b4 posting?

4) Mario has always been the same person in all of his games, same with samus, but in zelda, in every game there are diefent timelines, does it could be that TP skull kid aitn the same one from MM, not to mention the look, thats what gives it away, we all know TP link aint the one of OoT, ww and all the others cause of the timeline...

Yeah lets add a total generic bad guy in brawl, and not add the mask that mad ehim unique 10 years ago...

 

[Vampirekain]

And it is only him in OoT because no one knew it was Zelda.

Sheik is a MALE transformation...Of course "he" is a she cause it was Zelda all along but the idea behind it is "I will use my powers to transform into a man to evade Ganondorf"
There is actually nothing to debate! Sheik is female because she is Zelda.She only shaped into a guy..And that guy is called Sheik of the Sheikah tribe! Like Impa for example.

 

[Creo]

I'll leave all the posting to Numa.
True Midna did star on GC and Wii but if you want to get technical, Skull kid starred on 64 and GC. In MM and OoT. Plus, Skull Kid was in TP.
(above) I said that like two or so pages ago.

 

[Stryks]

Cmon creo got nothing to defend ur post??

 

[Creo]

What is there to defend.

 

[Stryks]

U said tingle, the fairis and skull kid>midna yet I still dont c why, all I get is:

Tingle pwns midna!

Which aint really very convincing...

 

[Creo]

Ok lets just start it. He has starred in two of his own games plus has been in way more Zeldas than Midna probably ever will.

 

[Stryks]

Midna has had one of the bigegst roles in the zedla series in comparison with other characters, actually fights, and is the twilight princess [the game is called LoZ twilight princess ]

and appearances doesnt guarantee u a spot in brawl, look at pit, ICs, sheik, GaW, roy, all of them had only one apperance b4 melee was revealed, thus apperances do not affect ur status in gettin in brawl...

 

[Creo]

Thats fine but I never said it would bump his chances for Brawl. This is about my opinion of Tingle>Midna.
Yes she has had a really important role, you don't have to keep saying it because you say that every time. But, Tingle still has about 7 game appearences and helps out on your quest. I highly doubt we will even see Midna again and if we do, one more game.

 

[Vampirekain]

Doesn't matter how many pages ago you said that...
Anyway this debate about the chances and popularity of Skull kid and Midna is simply ridiculous.I mean some of you people REALLY need to chill out..Yes Numa you really do First of all Stryks is not immature at all. He just doesn't like the fairies at all and likes different things than you.I personally like Navi the best,I also loved Tatl,also I loved Daphnes and Midna as well.Some obviously don't like Midna and some others Tatl,Daphnes and Navi. That reflects personal taste! Now about Tingle versus Midna...Tingle has games and also is loved throughout Japan so Tingle is beating the crap out of Midna.(HATE that fact) Now Tingle vs Skull kid.Same Tingle just has more to support him than Skull kid does! Don't start saying that Skull kid had a big role in MM and made appearances to both OoT and TP..You know NOTHING I don't so no need to argue.Midna vs Skull kid now..The great debate! Midna=Up to date Skull kid=Out of date That is a fact...But Nintendo has no problems with old games or anything! *Thumbs up for Pit and Ice Climbers*

 

[Stryks]

Just because he has more appearances doesnt mean he pwns her, that doesnt mean he will be in brawl b4 her, apeparances mean almost nothin, look at the characters Imention in my last post, one appearance and yet they all had/have the shot, and believe me, if tingle and midna actually fight, midna would just use the spiek vines and pop tingle, what would tingle doo? say tingle tingle kaloolimpa til she suicides herself of the chessiness?

Thumbs up for vampirekain, she can tell im not the imature one numa, but pit and ICs are retro characters, skull kid aint that retro lol...

 

[Creo]

Well you got that from my sig and I spelled it wrong. I am sure Nintendo would make a decent attack set for Him. Last time, I didn't say he would be in Brawl before her but has more of a chance because he is more popular amongst people. And his appearences does pwn her because Midna will be a forgotten character and Tingle...no. Plus, Tingle helps in all the games not as a main Like Midna but is an important character. Examples: Wind Waker.

 

[Stryks]

Fine I guess this debate is done, true tingle does have a bit more of a chance, yet midna has a chance as well, im glad u explain on what exactly tingle pwns midna, tough true, she may be forgotten a la shiek, she is a good candidate for brawl... Now I gotta wait for numa dudeds response and c what he posted, so I can prove its wrong and hopefully the mature numa dude wont call me imature... the mature part was sarcasm btw

 

[Wiseguy]

300th post! Now if I only had a magic mustache, all my dreams will have come true...

Sorry to barge in here, but I don't see how Tingle stands nearly as much chance of being in Brawl as Midna.

True, Tingle has appeared in more Zelda games than Midna has - but Tingle has always been a relatively minor, supporting character in each games story. He was also conspicuously absent from the latest Zelda game entirely. Conversly, Midna was more central to the plot of Twilight Princess (the most most recent and heavily hyped Zelda game since OoT) than Link was.

Although Tingle has appeared in his own spin off series, it has not yet been released worldwide (although I think one of them has been confirmed for European launch...) undoubtably due in no small part to his extremly limited appeal outside Japan.

With Twilight Princess selling like crazy and getting rave reviews, I think its a safe bet that most of the Zelda characters and maps in Brawl are going to be from this game. That gives Midna a definite edge over characters like Skull Kid and Tingle.

 

[Creo]

Well we have to wait for Numa to post now. That is the biggest advantage of Midna being in Brawl. She was in the latest game and that is the biggest thing.

 

[Numa Dude]

1) U break ur record every day

It's hard to be insulted by someone who spells worse than a grade schooler.

2) Ok look at ur melee trophies list, check the ganondorf trophy (im guessin u have it) and check when he 1st appeared *wait for u to check* c OoT, same as sheiks, thus just because zelda has appeared in all the other games, and ganon as well, means ganndorf and sheik have more than one apeparance, thus a character can have one appearance and can be added tro smash...

Your repeating the same points over and over again. Ganondorf is Ganon and Zelda is Shiek even though they both appeared first in OoT doesn't change the fact that they are both the same entity as their transformation meaning you can't use that as why Midna can get in brawl.

3) True she may not be an all star, yet she has an important role rite now in zelda, if she continues that role then she becomes an all star, if not, then she will become just like sheik (who was in melee)

Important role in one recent game does not equal importance to the series and importance to the series is what matters most.

4) Tatl and midna have similair personalities yet midnas is more defined, she may not have the biggest role in the zelda series, but she did had the biggest role in TP, and if u compare the roles of the sages, zelda in 64, and others, she still has a bigger role than them in comparison...

For the love of god stop putting Midna on a high pedestal and stop acting like her role in one game is bigger than other characters roles in other games.

5) YEp, but has a bigger role than tatl, thus no way tatls pwns midna...

OMG we agree on something!

6) and yet u say skull kid has more of a shot...

Yes, you can go back and look at me and Smash Daddy's previous posts to see why.

7) Thats pretty much all the king did really, tell u the story of hyrule, tellin u stuff of the hero, and being a boat...

He is still just as important as Midna story wise.

8) Its important to count a characters role, were not gonna add a character with a small role in the zelda games (HMS) over one with a big role in the game (midna)

Wait weren't we talking about the king of red lions compared to Midna? Anyway the characters importance to the series is the most important thing and neither of the above two are important to the series enough to get in.

9) Tatl and navi just targeted the fes, midna crated fields to rapidly attack more than one enemy, and with the help of the fused shadows, she can pretyt much take on anyone...

They still helped you fight even if they just gave you hints. Sometimes hints are better than a partner that helps you in combat

10) So what? its thelatest entry in the series, shes quite possibly the most important and most interesting character in the game, yet still she thinks she wont make it?

As I've said before recent is nothing. It's all about importance to the series and Midna is not important to the series yet.

11) and how is skull kid important to the series? In MM he was important, but not in TP, he just open some "doors" so u can get to the temple... thats it, and he lacked a role in WW, makin him unimportant...

Skull Kid has a more important role in the series than Midna does because he has been in more games being a major character in one having a cameo in one and having a supporting role in another. All Midna has is major character in one and you said it yourself she may not be coming back because of the ending of TP even though we can't be sure.

12) so ur saying there are only 25 charactes in the game? and sheik shouldnt be couunted? guess I should tel the people in the tourneys that sheik cant be counted to be played...

You're not listening to me. Shiek counts as a whole character but because her and Zelda are the same person that means that a rep spot isn't taken.

13) U say sheik is the same identity as zelda when I say sheik has only one appearance b4 melee was released, thus if she can be added so can midna, then u go, but shes the same identity as zelda, ok true yet sheik never apepared in the retro games, so yes she had 1 appearance b4 melee...

She was still Zelda though just in a costume. I get what your saying but you still aren't listening to me. Shiek is Zelda and Zelda is Shiek although Zelda only had one appearance as Shiek she was still Zelda inside.

14) How is he important to the series, justc cause he has 3 appearances? (2 of them were lame) that doesnt make sense, bowser jr, petey priahna, king boo, waluigi and all of those should be added by ur logic...

You asked me why he is important already and I answered. Bowser jr. has a good chance but lets not talk about that here.

15) Sorry for not thinking out of the box, I mean i can picture slippy as a fun character and being almost invicible,even when I dont like him, but im realistic, some characters wont be added, and every one of them can be unique...

Well yes any character could be unique but some have more potential than others.

16) Wel i for one havent called u a prick, idiot or anything, uve been doin it in every post, and im unfased by then, thus u fail in every post...

Since I can't tell what you are are doing in real life you could be crying about my insults for all I know. But of course neither of us can see what the other is doing so you saying you're un fased could easily be a lie.

17) haha no no no, he wouldnt rep the 64 era, he would if he had the mask in OoT, but he didnt, only in MM, by ur logic, midna will represent both the GC and the wii, being in both the consoles...

Well the GC and Wii don't need rep unlike the classic older consoles. I see no logic in you saying he needs the mask in OoT to rep the 64 era.

18) Not very funny, jokes tend to be funny...

Not all of them.

19) We may never know, he could have been added but the deadline was near, thus they couldnt...

It seems we have reached an impasse.

20) So stop saying I burn myself by saying those things about skull kid and will affect midna, its a totally diferent story...

It's not a different story. They are in the same situation and you know it.

21) Im just saying, with more time, more characters can be added, including midna, clones may not return, the top tiers will be nerfed, and the low tiers will be improved, win-win situation, all im saying...

That still doesn't change the fact that she isn't important to the franchise enough to get a spot.

22) Arent the handheld games spites, not cel shade? (except phantom hourglass) anyway, I still have my doubts about vaati but I do admit (unlike u with midna) that he has a good shot...

No they where cell shaded. Midna doesn't have a good shot for brawl for the next one maybe but not brawl.

23) I doubt they ahve to do with the series, and I hardly c how tingle>midnas, but u and creo fail to show me how that works...

Tingle has been in more games than Midna and has his own spin off franchise so thats why Tingle over Midna.

24) Yeah Idk about how theyll consider WW link, ok lets leave this part alone rite?

Agreed

25) Have u ever seen a videogame character like midna b4? didnt think so...

I have actually. She is an imp like Skull Kid, a brat like Tatl and a princess like Zelda.

26) Dark magic, hiding abilities, teleportation, princess of twilight

Skull Kid has the first three and Zelda is also a princess.

27) I agree on the fighting part, but seriously barnes from barnes bomb shop is original, and as well as the postman, and sumo guy from ordon, should we add them?

Well HMS had a role in MM that actually mattered to the story so he is over those guys.

28) IDK, impish character seems more original than some guy that sells masks...

Almost everyone refers to Skull Kid as an imp, not that original.

29) I dont offend u or anyting, u constantly said idiot and stuff like that to maybe provoque fear or somethin, it aint workin, if ur saying all of that to take u serious, then u fail, I take u more of a kid with those words, calm down, use logic and I will take u serious, rite now ur the imature one...

Sorry, I guess all the pent up rage I repressed from all of the other times we argued and you acted like an arrogant smart *** who's opinion is almighty came to the surface and I exploded. Seriously though you wouldn't piss as many people off if you would just understand that not everyone agrees with you and your opinion is not almighty and right.

Wiseguy is wise, listen to him...

He is and I do.