Final Fantasy Tactics Advance Mafia - Game Over!

[#HBC | Gorf]

Apology accepted.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Nabe if you've got scummates and are trying to plan I'd really prefer you just answered my questions. Even if you're on invisible (I'm not so you know when I'm here!) I can still see the number of Users and Guests viewing and the odds of it going down by 1 the same time it goes up by 1 is slim, so I know you still have the window open. =P

You are a ****ing asshole.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Why are you so intent on protecting Nabe?

Why is Nabe your proxy vote?

Because the case on him is on ballskin-over-face levels of dumb. He is my proxy vote by his choice.

 

[#HBC | J]

Nabe, although you are a busy responding to OS, I'd like some responses to the questions I've poised.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Okay I will concede if I was incorrect in understanding that conversation, but when I am viewing on my phone when I am directing/at work, I am not going to post. However, when a tense conversation happens I do comment on it when I come into the thread later, so what is your point against me?

There is no point. I gave up on pursuing you toDay when I voted JD. If I was mistaken, then I am mistaken, but given that I'm not actively pursuing you, that's where my side of the argument ends.

 

[#HBC | J]

What? That doesn't give you the reason to ignore my questions on your reads on Myself/Dabuz and some explanation. If I didn't voice that I would like this, I am now. I don't care that you aren't pursuing me, you posted reads that are left unexplained especially on two reads I have a one strong town read and one, know is town so that begs the question of why.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Your mafia tone reminds me of J Pierrepont Finch.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

What? That doesn't give you the reason to ignore my questions on your reads on Myself/Dabuz and some explanation. If I didn't voice that I would like this, I am now. I don't care that you aren't pursuing me, you posted reads that are left unexplained especially on two reads I have a one strong town read and one, know is town so that begs the question of why.

I intended a reread toDay that would let me collect information. I didn't complete that reread; I don't have any information prepared. What you do have from me is the statement I made prior, your contrast with Vult etc. which is an opinion that hasn't changed, and forms the basis for what would be a case if I had enough to create one.

 

[#HBC | J]

Don't know who that is. May I inquire what that is from?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

How to Succeed's main character lol

 

[#HBC | J]

I intended a reread toDay that would let me collect information. I didn't complete that reread; I don't have any information prepared. What you do have from me is the statement I made prior, your contrast with Vult etc. which is an opinion that hasn't changed, and forms the basis for what would be a case if I had enough to create one.

I wanna say I have already responded to it. Also the point you are talking about is beyond moot so I am just going to read your final line over and over and go off the assumption you have no case at the present time and will live with that as your answer. Continue on.

 

[#HBC | J]

How to Succeed's main character lol

I'm blonde and dumb as ****. Please shoot me.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I wanna say I have already responded to it. Also the point you are talking about is beyond moot so I am just going to read your final line over and over and go off the assumption you have no case at the present time and will live with that as your answer. Continue on.

Good, because that's exactly what I said, just in less words.

Any day @ Maximum Carnage , I mean it's not like I'm running an actual marathon in the morning.

 

[Hardbody Warrior]

I'm not really caught up, and I can't stay on long tonight, so I'm going to keep this kind of short.

it's scummy to throw out reads without justification.

And yet, to me, it seems like that's exactly what you did with that post. Apologies if you had explained them but it really doesn't seem like it.

don't have one yet. /: posts not memorable.

Okaaaaay. So what are your thoughts on the wagon that's been forming for his lynch? Does anything strike you as odd or noteworthy with him or the people on the wagon? I know you asked for somebody to make a case but I want your thoughts on everything surrounding it.

@SangfroidWarrior
@marshy
@ Hardbody Warrior

At least explain one read to me: Dabuz. How is that a read you are feeling is scum? I don't see it like at all. I want Sang's opinion more because I feel I will get a much more detailed answer rather then "***** is scum yo."

I'm guessing by this you want more than just my read in the reads list I posted earlier (in my 749)?

 

[Maximum Carnage]

- It's not a town confirm on Dietz if he gets a MOD vote, it's a confirm that he's either town, or another factional pick role who decided for any reason that doc was a good choice, or another hard role with the same restriction.

Good, glad you agree with me.

- If (unlike me) people treat Dietz as a confirm, he will die toNight.

A claimed Doc in a game with multiple potential doctors dying on N1 when it is most likely for an additional doc to target him? I'll roll the dice on that. Win/win, we either block a NKill, have a doc stick around and someone else die, or one of the D1 pushes is clarified and it gives us some information.

- I am not willing to die, by lynch or otherwise. This is not a vanilla game, and I'll be damned if I let go of my role and let you have any single insignificant bit more of control over the thread.

Well I know your level 2 and those are the powerful ones, so I don't really care too awful much about your role. "I'm a double voter who is willing to be voteless on D2 by pushing a townie lynch. Also I don't do anything in-thread" isn't exactly a power player. You've proven all of D1 that you're not willing to contribute, why would we expect more on D2 with no vote?

For pete's sake you are playing as Gorf's proxy vote. The only real vote you've made is for one of your own town reads, someone you believe is a Doc.

You leave no trail, none, on purpose. That's scummy. You want my trail? Look it up, I've posted my reads and reasoning on everything.

You are a ****ing *******.

Yes, but I also demand responses. I've gotten virtually nothing from you all game until suddenly your head is on the chopping block and you're still trying to hold stuff back. Your defense is "Well, I'm town and I feel I'm worth more than JDietz so I'll lynch him".

Know what? JDietz is a claimed Doc. He's worth himself plus whoever we want to protect and your slot hasn't contributed anything. I don't work on IOUs, Nabe. I told you I wanted content from you far earlier in the day and I didn't let up and you've brushed it off. Now we're here.

I have Ditzy as town, but Gorf's logic is sound. Saying scum "wouldn't" pick a deliberately townie role as a pseudo safe-claim is not correct.

There is the possibility that JDietz is scum with a forced pick of lv 2 priest or an equivalent role as scum. If this is the case, we'd find out if he couldn't hammer pretty fast, so it'd only work if he had the same restriction. Other than that we cannot see this. That said, we CAN direct it and remove Mafia's ability to kill one player each Day as if they were Doc'd. That's the bonus we get. Not as good as lynching scum, but good.

But we know scum wouldn't "pick" lv. 2 doc.

But JDietz claimed it. Why would he claim a priest role unless he has the restriction? There are many roles he could claim, but he chose lv. 2 priest. My instinct tells me that it's because he has that restriction, with the role or not.

He can do two things: Reflect or Protect.

If he's scum, mafia can't kill the player will direct JDietz to protect. If they try, either their NKill will fail or JDietz will be outed.

If he's town, mafia will want to kill him ASAP. If they don't they just get the hurt and no gain. Especially if Nabe flips scum.

Now if he's scum, he might have the REFLECT ability, not protect. No scum would pick protect. It makes no sense, there's no killing roles.

So if JDietz is scum, logically speaking his safe claim was "lv. 2 priest" when in reality he's lv. 1 priest. He can reflect, not protect. This would allow him to help scum by protecting them from things like roleblocking. This is how we'd catch him via NAs, but we'd still be able to use him as a town Doc by telling him to protect whomever we want, as that player couldn't die.

Smart lv 1 priests out there of town alignment would go the extra mile and cast reflect on JDietz; if JDietz is town and protects someone, mafia's best bet is to RB JDeitz, NKill his protector, and then try to frame JD in that way. Reflecting JDietz would result in mafia RBing themselves and losing their NKill, so now that this is out in the open that'd be a pretty large gamble.

Okay I want to explain a read clearly to at this juncture: I want to like Alex, but I also want to run Alex and his cockamamie reasons for my lynch and hit him with a truck.

I'd prefer your vote on Nabe to speak for you, as this is awfully fence-sitty. From what I've heard that is indicative of your D1 play but now is not the time.

 

[#HBC | J]

Bingo, Sang, bingo is the name-o.

 

[#HBC | J]

My read on Alex isn't fence-sitty. I want to like him but his reasoning for his push on me is ****. Null-town but he's a herpaderp when he talks about me. (<--- more clear) I don't get how that quote entails you to ask for my vote on Nabe.

 

[Maximum Carnage]

Still Scary?

My read on Alex isn't fence-sitty. I want to like him but his reasoning for his push on me is ****. Null-town but he's a herpaderp when he talks about me. (<--- more clear) I don't get how that quote entails you to ask for my vote on Nabe.

It's fence sitty because there's one of two options, a Nabe lynch or a Not Nabe lynch.

What do you think about Nabe's FoS on you at the beginning followed through with his push on you later? Do you think he came in with a bias against your slot, or just circumstance?

 

[Maximum Carnage]

oops at the "still scary" post, doing a re-read and cataloguing posts

 

[Maximum Carnage]

random question but does anyone know how to clear the freaking draft copy? It has a giant quote in it that keeps coming back I have to erase o_o

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

A claimed Doc in a game with multiple potential doctors dying on N1 when it is most likely for an additional doc to target him? I'll roll the dice on that. Win/win, we either block a NKill, have a doc stick around and someone else die, or one of the D1 pushes is clarified and it gives us some information.

This isn't a benefit to me. If Dietz's death is a foregone conclusion, I will take it toDay over my own, which is not.

Well I know your level 2 and those are the powerful ones, so I don't really care too awful much about your role. "I'm a double voter who is willing to be voteless on D2 by pushing a townie lynch. Also I don't do anything in-thread" isn't exactly a power player. You've proven all of D1 that you're not willing to contribute, why would we expect more on D2 with no vote?

Yes, but I also demand responses. I've gotten virtually nothing from you all game until suddenly your head is on the chopping block and you're still trying to hold stuff back.

This is what you say in response to your badgering me, again in 5-8 minute periods between my posts, from some arcane divination that "this time, he really won't respond to me". This all began from a 12-hour period in which I didn't post, and you magically decided that wasn't cool. Since then, you've made sure that every post you've made has contained my name, and for ****ing what? You've acknowledged that it's irrelevant to what I post, and yet you're still doing it and ****ing justifying it by standards you've already denounced. This is grade-A bull****, even from you.

your slot hasn't contributed anything. I don't work on IOUs, Nabe. I told you I wanted content from you far earlier in the day and I didn't let up and you've brushed it off. Now we're here.

You didn't have any intent otherwise. You have been on me all game, unreasonably, when I have given 200% more here than I have ever given in a D1, in any game I've ever played. Your ignorance of my meta aside, several slots in this game are blank slates, and I am not ****ing one of them.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Bro the draft thing is annoying as ****

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

EBWOP @the second quote: Let's try not to rolefish given I still have decent votecount standing and intend not to be lynched toDay, thank you very ****ing much. I certainly hope for Dietz to be scum, and that in lynching him I'll still have a vote, and that I even manage to lynch him, but let's start with that one.

 

[Maximum Carnage]

You didn't have any intent otherwise. You have been on me all game, unreasonably, when I have given 200% more here than I have ever given in a D1, in any game I've ever played. Your ignorance of my meta aside, several slots in this game are blank slates, and I am not ****ing one of them.

Bull****.

I saw your slot and didn't know how to read it. It doesn't mean a thing how many posts you have, only what's in 'em and what information you give about yourself and your reads.

I couldn't read you so I called you out. Your response was "buzz off". The appropriate response to that is "vote that player until they give content" and it's only at the chopping block you're even willing to pretend to say anything, and even now your biggest contribution is pushing a lynch on someone you believe to be a town Doc.

There is no "meta". There is your play in this game, here and now. If this is your gold star of D1 contribution then you need to step your game up.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I'm out of this awful thread for the night. In future, can't you all come on 12 hours earlier so I can be motivated and catch some sleep at night rather than this?

If I get hammered make sure to tag Gova for a premature Day's end~

 

[Maximum Carnage]

The following is Nabe's post history for this game up until right before #1100 (right above this post), for your viewing pleasure:

FOS: J

Let's go out for a sundae.

@ScaryLB59
What do you think of the dabuz wagon? Do these players have an aim?

It might be polite, but it's not conducive to reads.

He's right in saying that it's just #HBC. I wanted to see if he would come to that conclusion given how recent he is to DG.

What's the comparison here?

Yes.
Not to him at the moment.
Then I'd presumably be more interested in him at the moment.
No.

I get the sense you'd like me to make something up from thin air?

@ Maximum Carnage

What will the gist be of WashedLaundry's first post to you upon your entrance into the game?

>"Extremely lurky"
>Said in post made exactly 24 hours after the start of the game

I apologize. I will never again attempt to engage a player's interest for interest's sake in D1.

10% holding to a "I'm Carnage and I'm crazy" schtick
10% Overswarm
80% saying my name a lot in conjunction with synonyms for "intentionally quiet" just because you can


why god

You being incessant is why I haven't been arsed to respond to you, at all. And when I'm not here, surprisingly enough, I'm not here.

The game is very recently underway. Stop using my name as a catchphrase and wagging your **** around, as if you've caught me twigging the thread every five minutes and feel the need to personally stamp it on my forehead with a squishy slap. Being aggressive for the sake of aggressive and annoying for the sake of annoying impairs anybody reading you, and that's the point if scum, while as town you'd be seeing it as a clever joke: meeting the expectations that other people have of an OS/Ryker hydra, and in doing so subverting the system because, in your eyes, your play is always a persona tailored to the game anyway. Well, yomi be damned, because there is no nuance to a slap in the face.


You and I both know who the double voters were on dabuz if any, and I know that you think it's terribly cute putting it as a question to me, and why you think as much, and if only knowing made you palatable by the pleasure. I'll take a pass on the mystery; frankly, I wish I'd known when it was going down so I could have been an additive influence.

Request votecount

@massively polarizing thread issues regarding Gheb
who cares
As Laundry put well, a bit of talking shop with this setup is unavoidable.


@Nameless
It's good to see that you came at this setup with at least half of my mindset. I'm looking for an un-hetero take on these points of interest:

- I'm apprehensive about J's approach to Gheb. Specifically I can't help but contrast to Vult who plays the third-of-the-thread social game but doesn't keep up pretense of good form.
- WRT Town PR, there's been some hydra discog, but I think that's to be expected from Glyph and especially Ran.
- Should DSH get a pass on their ***-backwards play thus far? This is referring to their play being stances without action.

Mindset is @your Lv.2. It's D1, try to save "I hate that you Like posts" until D3 at leastttttttttttt, we do not always have to interact super-abrasively.

@ Jdietz43
OS wants me to hammer you, how do you feel?

good lord how do I get proper responses out of people

I'm going to hammer you in your next post. What do you have left to say?

In? After.

What would marshy be getting away with?

The Liking was WRT his post @ Maximum Carnage
OS is only talking about a voting block because I told him to GTFO about doublevoters
I would take Laundry and Vult in a voting block

no

k

Isssssssssssss that true though? Feels null to me.

I'm fine with Dietz.

well yeah

@WL, I don't think he's right and I don't think he thinks he is either; at some level setup spec is necessary by nature of the setup, and while it shouldn't define a player's play or be what reading a player is about, it needs to factor in. Gheb posting content soon would be great -- his previous stuff is null IMO.

no, read better

I want a read here from Ryker at least before tooooooooooo long.

****ing annoying garbage-*** only-vying-for-thread-control ****bag
so, null

I said I would hammer Dietz, never anything about hammer range.

You and Vult are both playing within segments of the full player list. You haven't addressed the whole cast, and you've reached out to certain players more strongly. You always play the social game -- you're about people rather than facts, and every time you make a post, your full attention is on someone. That would be taxing, so it's reasonable that your focus is on less than the full list of players. But you're not really public about that, and that's something I admire in Vult's posts so far -- he doesn't ever give the impression that he's got his eye on everyone. Sometimes, I feel like you're paying a player's name lip service when you're really not thinking of them, but rather, of how you would look if you didn't.

@ "outburst", I was calm when I told OS off. Neither head of that hydra can be allowed to lay grounds for the other to dig in, and that's what will happen unless you're straight with the one trying to cause their version of trouble. But if you're referring to something else, then I haven't understood.

When did we last play together?



- DSH, I suppose. There's something twigging me with both heads, but where I'm put off of a lynch is that I'm missing the gutscum on Ryu I normally expect. In general, I think he's been trying to change his gameplay, so my confusion could be owed to that. dabuz is another scumread; dabuz' play has been similar to Scary (read below) but I recall more of an agenda. As it was related to me, I wasn't impressed.
- Thus far this is shaping up to be a very level-headed game. Likely recipients of the cut are Town PR/me/Gheb, in that order, but I don't think anyone else is too far behind, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a last-minute turn on any player, save Laundry and maybe Gorf.
- Regarding MC/Scary as separate players, I assume. Scary is a flat null who is either not posting enough, or not interacting with enough people (some Vinyl vibes). OS is a very pointed null -- give me Ryker and I can generally make something of him. I've listed the motivation for both factions in what that slot is doing, but in recent posts my read of those motivations has shifted, as I wouldn't have expected either faction to put me forth as a lynch as they've done. But again, there's the null: OS always changes his play when he's being talked about. There's nothing to be made of it in a Day phase.

Vote: Gorf

Unvote
That should be enough to garner a mod vote if I were that role.

Teach me how to intentionally misread posts, Senpai~

thanks for telling me how to do this; i'm a fish

You're very good at treating information as if it were important, and leveraging it anyway. For example, the implication that telling you you're wrong is within the same order of magnitude of time as showing you that you're wrong, being used to demonstrate that I'm "not posting anything important" in this crucial time period. Or the implication that a player must not be planning or willing to justify an accusation if they haven't yet done so in the span of time between your own coffee break and lunch break, used for the same.


Now, don't worry about responding. I've taken the liberty of preparing several responses for you, each of which hit a single note of disrespect designed to show me my place in the food chain.



And here's one more option (which might even be the best): just post this again, quoted from yourself, without anything additional.



Feel free to choose the one(s) you like best, and rephrase it as necessary to fit the persona of the day. Don't worry about citing me as a source; this post won't remain in the public consciousness for any longer than the memory of a fish. The bears write the history.

ooh that's a good one

i miss ryker

Still Scary?

who where what

Vote: @ScaryLB59

Rarely posts, never thinks there's anything that needs talking about, questions the necessity of posting even and especially after being reminded that posts comprise the entirety of the game.

It's not the fairest comparison, but you could be putting in more than you are.

I was never going to hammer Dietz at that juncture, if he had been in range which I did think he was at the time. I took OS' post, which said "You should vote with Nameless," and cheekily twisted it into "I guess I have to hammer you, Dietz!", and then followed with "I really am going to hammer you!" The intent here was to prod Dietz into posting and about more varied subjects, and I'm content with what he's been doing since. His single braintrack prior was stifling the thread.

The reason I queried Gorf about who to vote was about reading him, as well as whoever the vote would be on. That it happened to be you worked well, because I also want you to give me more content.

By my count you're L-3.

Does your own reading back up what was said by Carnage?

You were in LM?

Not one. Do you get those vibes? Because I always understood where both heads were coming from in Throne, even when they were spouting what I knew was bull****. And it was a Ryker-driven hydra, whereas here I haven't felt his influence.

I have trouble understanding why Ryker won't engage me...

Is this the first time you've read? Gheb was referring to the Scary wagon.

Question stands. Is this your first time reading/posting in the thread?

@Red Ryu please post soon thx

Unvote

kay i have a nifty burn on my hand all of a sudden so i'll handle this now
I was waiting for DSH to post, prompted Ryu to post while he was in-thread etc. no response
I don't have any sort of scumread on DSH, I just wanted to give them something pointy to respond to
my apologies dabuz for making you wait slightly, i'm incorrigible


@dietz there is no point to claiming unless the circumstances of your role justify whatever the wagoners are saying about you
but if you're going to waffle in public and say "I want to claim but OBVIOUSLY" etc. then that makes me want a claim too


how did OS manage to turn a question about examples of dabuz's posting style into another nabe soapbox?

ouch night all

i was hoping more for specific considerations of accusations made against you and how they relate to whether or not you should claim

@Town PR @Detective Sherlock Hound @ Hardbody Warrior @ScaryLB59 @ #HBC | Gorf

If you can describe your content flow as, "I sit in my chair until this player posts, and between his posts I tell people he doesn't post," you have a problem.


Because they haven't been posting, and the posts they did make 12 pages ago show an intentionless null, because they haven't talked about anything. By calling them a scumread, I am giving them something concrete to respond to that isn't going to amount to a vague reads&catch-up post.


Dietz has never been my wagon. I have never voted him. I have voiced nothing against him for many pages now, and nothing prior that is now relevant to my read on him (which I've been public about (townlean)). Why would I justify accusations against him by other players when he implies they don't exist?

What I did instead is took an action that makes sense: I tagged every player on the wagon to alert them to his claim and to his response to my question. His response, I read as being a pointed version of "there is no case", and after making it he followed up with a small piece stating that he really didn't think a case had been made against him. And for a large part I agree; the reason I asked was to see if he might instead try to counter old posts by slantedly rephrasing them.

I have every intention of continuing to develop my read on Dietz, and moreso the players on his wagon. But I have no intention of helping to drive that wagon forward without case or cause to do so. I'm not sure what you expected my response to be.

Recap of last night:
I post V/LA, and Ryker uses that knowledge to engineer a wagon in that absence, while posting tags towards my slot as if he's giving me a chance to respond all the while.

Given the lynching power in this game, and given the night crowd playing between 11-3 who are known to generate large numbers of posts while intermittently catching up, against the MC propaganda train tagging every player and saying "Lynch Nabe", I think it's astounding I didn't receive an HBC last night. The numbers were here for it to happen, and MC made a direct appeal to every one of them. That it didn't happen is only a footnote.


Should lynch one of these players toDay:
- J
- @dabuz

Would accept a lynch of one of these players (i.e. would hammer at deadline):
- @ScaryLB59 (play hasn't improved since added pressure by myself and Gorf, still wouldn't comfortably call him scum)
- @ Maximum Carnage (what the **** was that last night if not opportunistic? Not yet a scumread but neither head is providing context for their play)
- @ Jdietz43 (against my own lynch only, and only then because it would simplify reads on his wagoners)

Let's put something into perspective.

Post count (D1) including solo heads of hydras:
Dietz: 166
WL: 120
MC: 91
dabuz: 67
HBW: 60
DSH: 58
Nabe: 54
J: 47
Gorf: 44
Scary: 40
Gheb: 39
TPR: 39
Raz/Acro: 20
Vult: 12


to be referenced soon

This, and a post prior to directed to HBW. It's referring to the general assertion that I thought they were scum with bad play. In the post you've quoted, I brought up my magic skill to read Ryu, which always gets his attention.

I can only read Ryu when he ****ing posts.

Vote: Jdietz43

cannot believe I am going to espouse the lynch of a townlean doc claim
i hate all of you
please lynch the doc claim kthx

Yes, Ryu really ****ing does have an activity problem. The slot dips out somewhere around page 10, and made two posts recently. They do not have stances. They have not been here.


Stick to a wagon, or make Sang post 1000x more than you, please.

J still isn't posting. J has been in and out, sitting here unsure of what play to make.

Are you playing Overswarm against Ryker? I don't understand.

You're a brick wall to read and you flip like a paper in the wind and I want to stuff my oops in your wow

real talk
what small fractional part of you agrees with a single post overswarm has made all game
why do you suddenly and implicitly trust a hydra slot where ryker is the subservient head, suggesting evil shenanigans
why does the simple fact of a vote have enough curb appeal to switch your curbstomping focus

What could this possibly mean? I'm pretty sure giving people "courtesy" doesn't have any effect on the truth value of what I say, and if you're suggesting that OS is somehow owed any courtesy against his treatment of me, then a) you're mistaken, but mostly b) that has nothing to do with what's transpired between me and him. (And I use the word 'between' very loosely.)

You know I do.

You know I don't.

You were in the thread when I posted that, and I've seen your name in and out for a while during tense conversations. I wasn't here when OS started on me, and nor was the assertion, "Nabe is watching but not posting".

It sounds like for once you've read my posts correctly.

There is no point. I gave up on pursuing you toDay when I voted JD. If I was mistaken, then I am mistaken, but given that I'm not actively pursuing you, that's where my side of the argument ends.

oh sorry, let me take another look

Here, you restate the content of my JD vote post in its entirety, and then strap on a question mark, implying that you are digging for further information on my voting motivation when in reality, you know there is nothing extra to it, having just read my very unambiguous post and reasoning in order to be able to form this question.





How about this:

I have zero interest in proving Dietz' restriction or in his eating a MOD vote. Dietz is very likely town. I am town. There is no one-is-town-one-is-scum voting dilemma to necessitate this. You are being slimy.

Case: Dietz is not me, interested parties might take his lynch instead of mine, and I know I am town 100%, and cannot swing a lynch of anyone but Dietz.

- It's not a town confirm on Dietz if he gets a MOD vote, it's a confirm that he's either town, or another factional pick role who decided for any reason that doc was a good choice, or another hard role with the same restriction.

- If (unlike me) people treat Dietz as a confirm, he will die toNight.

- I am not willing to die, by lynch or otherwise. This is not a vanilla game, and I'll be damned if I let go of my role and let you have any single insignificant bit more of control over the thread.

You are a ****ing *******.

I intended a reread toDay that would let me collect information. I didn't complete that reread; I don't have any information prepared. What you do have from me is the statement I made prior, your contrast with Vult etc. which is an opinion that hasn't changed, and forms the basis for what would be a case if I had enough to create one.

Good, because that's exactly what I said, just in less words.

Any day @ Maximum Carnage , I mean it's not like I'm running an actual marathon in the morning.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Bull****.

I saw your slot and didn't know how to read it. It doesn't mean a thing how many posts you have, only what's in 'em and what information you give about yourself and your reads.

I couldn't read you so I called you out. Your response was "buzz off". The appropriate response to that is "vote that player until they give content" and it's only at the chopping block you're even willing to pretend to say anything, and even now your biggest contribution is pushing a lynch on someone you believe to be a town Doc.

There is no "meta". There is your play in this game, here and now. If this is your gold star of D1 contribution then you need to step your game up.

Cool. I dig the newfound interest in reading me, as opposed to simply tagging my name in posts in conjunction to synonyms for "timid" 12 hours after the start of the Day

anywayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy please leave me five specific questions detailing exact things you want from me and I'll be happy to answer since that's a standard model of human interaction! Toodles!

 

[Maximum Carnage]

As my above post is in Chronological Order, I fully suggest you browse through it and try to pinpoint when it is I called Nabe out for not posting because I didn't have a read on him. Be honest with yourself and ask yourself if you did too!

anywayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy please leave me five specific questions detailing exact things you want from me and I'll be happy to answer since that's a standard model of human interaction! Toodles!

More than 5 questions, but 5 topics.

1. You believe JDietz and Yourself are town. If this is the case, why have the wagons between yourself, JDietz, and Scary all been stalled wagons? What does this imply from your perspective? If JDietz really is town Doc why isn't scum just making a bold push towards JDietz in an apathetic manner? You literally posted a vote on him and say "Ugh, my town doc read but it's not me so oh well" and I was the only one who called you out on it. Scum could have easily gotten away with pushing on JDietz.... but ditto with you! What gives?

Carnage thoughts: JDietz could be scum and Nabe could actually be scum as well, which would be swell. More likely, scum is simply hiding in the background and not taking an aggressive approach this game and instead hoping that louder and more influential players like myself and hardbody would do the pushing and they can just tack on.

2. You saw both JDietz and the Scary wagon stall at around 4 votes with no additional push. Gheb commented that this was grimy and that scum was spread out there. Do you agree? How does this fall in line iwth the current situation?

Carnage thoughts: @ Gova @mod REQUEST VOTECOUNT to make this way easier

3. You are Gorf's proxy vote. What is the purpose of this?

4. You have expressed irritation with other players for "not posting" because you can't read them without their posts. Is this different than my feelings on you?

5. If you are lynched toDay, who are three top candidates for a lynch / pressure for toMorrow? Why those players?

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

I'm actually finding it hugely effective to put Carnage on ignore when I read through the game in order to cut down the time I need in order to catch up. I also think that I'll do another read through with Jdietz on ignore in order to cut out a lot of noise from this game that's been detracted by mechanic speculation which has never been my strength in my analysis. I've skimmed through the first seven pages and then jumped to page twenty and am somewhere around page twenty three. I really want to bring up dabuz's post in #765 since it was completely ignored and virtually passed over.

Scooby directly asks Dweebu what his feelings are on Jtard. Dweebu's response on the analysis was uncommitted. It's not the fact that responses need to have an element of commitment or resolution to them, however I consider it to be a discrepancy when a response gets structured (number bullets) with the points being observations ending with a blatant open conclusion i.e. "... he handled the pressure poorly and I don't see why" and "... seemed EXTREMELY out of place, i'm still trying to wrap my head around it."

Out of place elements and having 'poor' reactions are the opening act of developing a fos in any given game. However, in D1 and early game phases they aren't often sufficient to fully justify a scum read on another player slot. The simple reality of the situation is that observing contradictions in a game or a player's behavior often isn't the entire basis for laying down an implication that the slot is scum. Most of Jtard's play from what I've grasped this game has been very shallow and surface level play and I find him to be inconsistent with his surface level reasoning and logic i.e. his fos placement on Scooby and mentioning Rooby as being a lynch pick along with Nooby in his #769. His depth of insight from what I've seen so far is remarkably shallow and his mechanic speculation bores me and seems to have detracted from the game instead of adding to it. He's a perfect target for wasted discussion and useless foses noting his bad play and emphasizing it for what it is, bad play.

If we were to take Dweebu's confusion at face value, he doesn't know what to do with inconsistencies pointed out in the game because they are just that. Moving on, Dweebu quotes Jtard's post in #577 which I have to refer to my paraphrased notes ran as follows:

"Accounting. Hastys? Why votes! Getting real paranoid about an alpha vote."

Dweebu observes that this post encapsulates what most of us observe as being a: 1 + 1 = 3 play and explains that 1 + 1 should not equal 3. He's grabbed throw from the QB, he now should run with it. In other words explaining how this inconsistency fits into a general mafia model that he has or a larger theme or observation of Jdietz's play that aligns with a scum read. Instead, he notes that Jdietz is actively posting observing that 1 + 1 = 2. Dweebu references that he has notes on Jtard, but he hasn't formed any relevant opinions of him. However, thanks to Scooby he is going to re-read the last couple of pages.

Why only the last couple of pages? Why not re-read the notes you wrote? Is it because the notes you wrote have most relevance in the past couple of days which is why you are now going to re-read the last couple of days you already read and wrote notes on already. I want to press another idea of organic thinking, in other words identifying that the people you are playing with are really thinking about who the mafia is rather than emulating town behavior and going through the motions of playing a mafia game. I don't find it natural that someone who read Scooby's shallow question to Dweebu which was, "Feeling about Jtard?" Would merit a re-read of a couple of pages with notes already written on the topic. For one, you have notes already pre-written to reference to give to Scooby. Second, I would not re-read for that question because it isn't a specific question that would make me question an observation I already made when I was initially reading. Third, I wouldn't stop in the middle of a post in order to re-read a couple of pages to come back to the post and finish typing an opinion because going back and looking at the source material means that I am going seriously at this and I might end up with a new conclusion that might not be on the same path with the response I'm typing right now.

I feel a very emulated play here, instead of getting a genuine vibe that what has been typed can be taken at face value. Near the end of the post he reference post #638. Why #638? Is there any particular reason for a #638? Maybe some Scooby v. Nooby? He says that Jtard just throws his opinions out there. To which I drew a diagram of a half page split writing 'here' on the left side and 'out there' repeatedly on the right side. Dweebu must be demonstrating his point as a figurative observation because a literal interpretation would have us all literally throwing our opinion out there, although I would call it out here. Dweebu mentions that Jtard has no notable posts. No notable posts. No notable posts. No notable posts. And then Dweebu references page 15. Is page 15 special was there a notable deadline we missed that came at page 16? Maybe Dweebu's notes are page annotated? And then Dweebu is a scum lean or lean scum because of 'strange' reactions. But can't find mucho, mucho scaro, no materialo, no understandlo.

And then Dweebu realizes that he can ask Jtard questions and Dweebu will do that. He types out that he will ask Jtard questions. He doesn't type out a question for Jtard, he types out that he has the ability to ask Jtard a question and he will do it.

I don't believe I've ever seen a townie type like this. Then again, I also don't believe that I've seen something like this in any game I've played. I won't put my vote down here, until I finish re-reading and I get a complete picture of what is going on this game.

 

[Hardbody Warrior]

Bingo, Sang, bingo is the name-o.

You're asking for a lot here, but without going back and looking at his posts individually, we find him scummy because he's jumped around so much and he is (was) on a pointless vote that, I feel, he's on just to attain points for being an individual even though MC's slot has been contested numerous times and still is. WRT to his 1017, his reasons seem simply like he's trying not to justify unvoting MC, but justify why he was voting him in the first place, and it reeks of OMGUS. He's jumped on various wagons that are popular, and hasn't given decisive reasons for being on them besides explanations that are vague, poor, or completely nonexistent. In his 1017, he's given reasons to lynch both of the main wagons, but his logic for voting either of them doesn't seem like anything but "Nabe didn't do anything but he did more than Scary until Scary was pushed" which is the exact same thing that is happening with Nabe right now.

 

[Maximum Carnage]

I really need to go to bed.


Hardbody, what are your thoughts on these questions (reword them in your head for you):

1. You believe JDietz and Yourself are town. If this is the case, why have the wagons between yourself, JDietz, and Scary all been stalled wagons? What does this imply from your perspective? If JDietz really is town Doc why isn't scum just making a bold push towards JDietz in an apathetic manner? You literally posted a vote on him and say "Ugh, my town doc read but it's not me so oh well" and I was the only one who called you out on it. Scum could have easily gotten away with pushing on JDietz.... but ditto with you! What gives?

Carnage thoughts: JDietz could be scum and Nabe could actually be scum as well, which would be swell. More likely, scum is simply hiding in the background and not taking an aggressive approach this game and instead hoping that louder and more influential players like myself and hardbody would do the pushing and they can just tack on.

2. You saw both JDietz and the Scary wagon stall at around 4 votes with no additional push. Gheb commented that this was grimy and that scum was spread out there. Do you agree? How does this fall in line iwth the current situation?

 

[Maximum Carnage]

Okay, really going to bed.

Vote Nabe D1 2014

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Adding to the previous post, Dweebu has been asking a lot of questions. But I don't understand how the follow-up questions after this post have helped him to complete any of his hands with getting a full flushed read on any player slot. This observation is actually glossed over by Gorf who brings it up in his #810 post when he asks Spot (SangM) whether there is a town vibe to be gained from such behavior and references Luigi's mansion. Interestingly enough, Gorf notes that there is a correlation in play between question shooting in Luigi's mansion and this game, however I presume that he has a deep down gut feeling his Gorf heart that this time dabuz's line of questions aren't indicative of mafia intent. But if there is a deviation to patterned behavior there should at least be some small idea that makes you think this time it's different. He's not emulating questions, he's actually asking these questions because he cares about getting answers to them. There should be something more than just that gut feeling, right Gorf?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Umm yea it's actually not gut, why I'm town reading dabuz. I mean I just think you're wrong when you interpret his posts as not leading him to anything cuz I mean truth be told the questions he just drops have been few and far between, whereas it's usually THE common theme for dabuz. If I wanted to I can pull original, personally driven substance for dabuz in this game. Most games I really can't.

 

[Hardbody Warrior]

LYNCH NABE D1 2014!!​

 

[Gova]

1. Hardbody Warrior (2) Vult, Gheb
2. Acrostic ()
3. Maximum Carnage ()
4. WashedLaundry ()
5. Detective Sherlock Hound ()
6. J ()
7. Gorf (1) MOD
8. Dabunz ()
9. LBScary59 (4) J, TPR, dabuz, dabuz
10. Town PR ()
11. Jdietz43 (4) DSH, Scary, Nabe, Nabe
12. Gheb_01 ()
13. Nabe (5) WL, HBW, HBW, MC, Jdietz
14. Vult Redux ()

Not voting - Acrostic, Gorf

With 14 playing it takes 8 to lynch!

Deadline is February 17th at 11:59 PM CST (GMT-6)

 

[Hardbody Warrior]

I feel like I am HBW's mirror this game. I have pretty much contrasting views based on seeing the other side of the coin save for a few in the null/slight lean department.

You keep cockblocking everyone I want lynched and I'm doing the same to you with Scary. This is annoying because you are literally not down to lynch anyone who isn't Scary who I have no interest in going. Our townreads (DSH/Gorf are two examples off the top of my head) largely align.

You're much more lenient on ******* than I am. I remember Celebrity Rehab where you townread vander and Rockin and I made a post quoting it and hitting you with the thumbsdown. They were scum and I then proceeded to get nightkilled due to our local doctor not knowing how to play dayphase mafia. Have some faith in me man.

 

[#HBC | J]

Celeb rehab I had 5/6 scum nailed where Rockin was my only flub. So you are remembering wrong. Plus I am basing my statement off sangs read post.

 

[Jdietz43]

Someone please out together a Nabe case compiled into a single post because I don't have a read on him and would like to be able to put out a better vote even if I'm not able to catch up completely by deadline. It seems really out of the blue to me atm

Well I'm only caught up on the votecount and page 26 so far but I think this is a pretty good single page case against Nabe:

Dietz has never been my wagon. I have never voted him. I have voiced nothing against him for many pages now, and nothing prior that is now relevant to my read on him (which I've been public about (townlean)). Why would I justify accusations against him by other players when he implies they don't exist?

What I did instead is took an action that makes sense: I tagged every player on the wagon to alert them to his claim and to his response to my question. His response, I read as being a pointed version of "there is no case", and after making it he followed up with a small piece stating that he really didn't think a case had been made against him. And for a large part I agree; the reason I asked was to see if he might instead try to counter old posts by slantedly rephrasing them.

I have every intention of continuing to develop my read on Dietz, and moreso the players on his wagon. But I have no intention of helping to drive that wagon forward without case or cause to do so. I'm not sure what you expected my response to be.

Recap of last night:
I post V/LA, and Ryker uses that knowledge to engineer a wagon in that absence, while posting tags towards my slot as if he's giving me a chance to respond all the while.

Given the lynching power in this game, and given the night crowd playing between 11-3 who are known to generate large numbers of posts while intermittently catching up, against the MC propaganda train tagging every player and saying "Lynch Nabe", I think it's astounding I didn't receive an HBC last night. The numbers were here for it to happen, and MC made a direct appeal to every one of them. That it didn't happen is only a footnote.


Should lynch one of these players toDay:
- J
- @dabuz

Would accept a lynch of one of these players (i.e. would hammer at deadline):
- @ScaryLB59 (play hasn't improved since added pressure by myself and Gorf, still wouldn't comfortably call him scum)
- @ Maximum Carnage (what the **** was that last night if not opportunistic? Not yet a scumread but neither head is providing context for their play)
- @ Jdietz43 (against my own lynch only, and only then because it would simplify reads on his wagoners)

Vote: Jdietz43

cannot believe I am going to espouse the lynch of a townlean doc claim
i hate all of you
please lynch the doc claim kthx

Unless you can find me the silver bullet amazing stance changing posts on page 26 in between those on why he'd change to me after saying all that even after HBW of all people says it's not going to happen... that's pretty disgusting.

 

[Jdietz43]

Btw J's wall:

NEVER think of not holding somebody accountable because of their sobriety. If they're ******** enough to get themselves caught they're ******** enough to get themselves caught, and hey a wise man once said that alcohol makes you say what you're dying to say sober so yea.



I made sure to only skim hard enough for me to get an impression of all your stances since you like put the effort to put em there... And correct me if I'm wrong... But are Nabe and Scary your only non null (town lean / slight town lean doesn't count as not null in this context) reads you have? Oh and I'd love to see the sheer amount of effort I've put into mud slinging that doesn't include trolling you hard last night.



Oh okay cool. The bolded was actually part of the reason I was trollin ya. While most of the reason was just to troll, I noticed before that while marshy was the main voice backing up your lynch before he was nothing outside of his naturally abrasive self, and you responded to him by dogging his play and calling em mean and whatnot. I was wondering whether or not you'd respond the same but after sleeping on it, well I mean I guess town can get worked up too when they have somebody directly going after em. It's interesting that you did though.

J was a town read, and I think at this point we can up Nabe to full scum, but other than that that's right. After them sadly yes everyone else is hovering around in lean-ville USA to varying degrees, but hopefully a flip from one of my firmer reads will help that out a lot more. And honestly yours wasn't rated as more town only because I had NO idea what the point of attacking me personally was, it looked like a really terrible attempt to undermine what was left of my slot's integrity as an ad hom which would have been awful.