PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

[Mogwai]

I have a serious question:

http://www.youtube.com/user/thewaffle77?blend=1&ob=4#p/u/3/aBl0Re4Hsfc

from 3:10 - onwards, what could mango have done to not potentially lose the match? Besides not approach.

sit in shine on the other side of the screen? I guess that falls under not approaching. Before I get into how I'd approach BO, I'd just like to point out that I REALLY STRONGLY think that not approaching was prudent in this situation.

stealing laser control back from another Falco who currently has it is pretty much impossible when you stay on the same plane, so his decision to approach from platforms seems correct to me (especially considering that Mango's lasers are awful for a player of his caliber).

The first part that I think was stupid was when he was trying to do some fancy double jump **** near the edge of the platform around 3:19 and got caught with double lasers from the ledge which re-grounded him. honestly, I would've just walked towards the ledge on the platform and tried to respond to the ledge lasers with a CC low angled ftilt or dsmash.

Then he tried to walk up and ftilt BO's invincibility frames from the ledge, which is just... come on... I've seen enough of Mango to know he's capable of being the smartest player in the world, it makes no sense that he would make such a decidedly wrong decision...

And then he tried to DJ immediately after DIing into bthrow, which is an auto stock loss vs. ftilt, BO just refused to dair him... He needed to DI away from that bthrow or save his jump, doing neither is 100% wrong.

uhg, wtf BO, why didn't you just dair him when he DJed into the bthrow -> ftilt? you won that match...

 

[unknown522]

^ that's fair. I know that not approaching was the best option, but I was just wondering how to approach that kind of crap.

 

[Mogwai]

Falco camping under the side platforms near the ledge is very annoying and hard to break. Eggm calls it the Bass Cave cause of his crewmate Bass who used to camp there religiously.

The idea is to get on the platform near him without getting hit because once you establish a position there his lasers are no longer safe. The issue is that if he reacts quickly, he can respond to your movement to that platform with uair or shine to platform. Of course, if you're Falco, you can answer this by landing on the platform with dair, but if you do that and he didn't attack, you leave yourself open momentarily.

But I'm talking too much, the short answer is that that ****'s really annoying when executed by someone who can respond to your advances well.

 

[unknown522]

true. Makes sense.

 

[Life After Death]

CC ALL U HAVE TO DO IS CC! cc is the way to go wit falco

 

[Igcoris]

CC ALL U HAVE TO DO IS CC! cc is the way to go wit falco

if chops says it, it must be true.

 

[unknown522]

CC ALL U HAVE TO DO IS CC! cc is the way to go wit falco

CC is so ****ing broken.

It's like on par with the laser.

 

[PEEF!]

Falco camping under the side platforms near the ledge is very annoying and hard to break. Eggm calls it the Bass Cave cause of his crewmate Bass who used to camp there religiously.

The idea is to get on the platform near him without getting hit because once you establish a position there his lasers are no longer safe. The issue is that if he reacts quickly, he can respond to your movement to that platform with uair or shine to platform. Of course, if you're Falco, you can answer this by landing on the platform with dair, but if you do that and he didn't attack, you leave yourself open momentarily.

But I'm talking too much, the short answer is that that ****'s really annoying when executed by someone who can respond to your advances well.

Perhaps more info on how to make this work for the falco doing it? I like the summary, but it would be awesome if you could make something a little more in depth. Falcos ignore stage specific tricks way too much. Does this work on all plat stages? What characters is it strong against? Who counters it easily?

 

[Mogwai]

you can do it on all platform stages, it tends to be most effective on DL, then PS, then BF, then FoD/YS, but I can't really write more on it cause I have fairly sucky reaction times and can't do the sort of **** bass does when people try to get at him on the platform he's camping under.

 

[PEEF!]

Is all it consists of shls and the run off the side dj lasers?

 

[PB&J]

good stuff pp

 

[Mogwai]

pp sry I haven't been online like, at all, I have been sick as hell and have been just sleeping after work .

 

[Dr Peepee]

Ahh, I was wondering about that haha.

No worries man. I have a long break. =p I'll just finish up Marth and maybe write a little something on Peach to feel productive while you're out(if that's alright).

Feel better soon man.

 

[unknown522]

pp and mogwai, your thoughts on falco vs the marios please?

 

[KirbyKaze]

Mogwai's Falco vs Mario guide

1) Bair
2) Dair sometimes
3) Sometimes do combos, but they're not really necessary because you have Bair
4) Don't awkwardly attack them at the edge poorly
5) Bair
6) Use non-Bair moves sometimes but try to limit yourself to your broken moves because you don't need to use bad moves to beat bad characters, just overwhelm them with good things (like Bair) and eventually they'll die

 

[Mogwai]

kk, tells it like it is

 

[KirbyKaze]

That guide is also effective against terrible characters.

 

[Dr Peepee]

LOL

yeah, I should probably play the matchup like that(aka Bairs), but I like to combo the Marios sometimes, so I tend to Dair more.

It's a bad habit. =p

 

[Life After Death]

bair is only good at high % unless if u miss ur spike and they are at bair range u can bair at low % to f smash or shine or up tilt.......

 

[unknown522]

alright. I just wanted to see what you guys had to say about that

 

[Dr Peepee]

I finished up the Marth matchup.

I leave for PA tomorrow but I'll be sure to look over questions/votes for the next matchup(if Mogwai and I aren't working on them by then)/people telling me I suck/etc when I get back(the 28th).

 

[unknown522]

nice post.

I want to add more to it, but my friend's laptop won't let me make semi-long posts.

I'll post later.

 

[Mogwai]

I finished up the Marth matchup.

I leave for PA tomorrow but I'll be sure to look over questions/votes for the next matchup(if Mogwai and I aren't working on them by then)/people telling me I suck/etc when I get back(the 28th).

I'll be better (I hope) and partially bored by the 28th, so I'll IM you and we can try to crank the top 8 out then.

 

[KHON™]

very helpful dr.pp

 

[unknown522]

PP, mogwai, sheik advice! GoGoGo!

 

[`DNS`]

does laser combo into anything?
and if not is it a pseudo-combo( if they're in the air)?
i did this pretty kwl combo.. on battlefield on the right side i got him off the edge about 2-3 bowsers off, he DJed, i ran off dj double laser grab
is this legit or could he get out?

edit: i guess if it doesn't work on the ground (roll/dodge) they could also airdodge, but then they're left open after your grab ends..

Thoughts?

 

[unknown522]

lasers legitimately combos into:

shine
grab
all tilts
jab

dunno about n-air.

 

[`DNS`]

hm.. how many frames of lag/stun does it generate?
it could obviously change depending on where you are in the air when the laser hits..

 

[KirbyKaze]

Definitely not Nair.

 

[unknown522]

hm.. how many frames of lag/stun does it have?

dunno.

those are the moves I can get to combo in training mode.

 

[`DNS`]

ledgecancelled laser->nair?
edit:^oh

 

[AvengerAngel]

lasers legitimately combos into:

shine
grab
all tilts
jab

dunno about n-air.

You mean Dtilt as well?! o_O
I never managed to do a laser > dtilt combo in Training Mode and I thought it wasn't possible o_o

Laser > reverse utilt is **** sexy but also pretty hard x(

 

[TheLake]

Mr.pp! I thought this would be a unique way to get your attention...Welcome to pittsburgh!

In honor of you and Hungryboxes arrival we were gonna hold a little tourney

If you wanna smash check the atlantic north section under the pittsburgh weeklies thread

Oh merry belated christmas little falco players (: (especially mogwai *wink*)

 

[KirbyKaze]

You mean Dtilt as well?! o_O
I never managed to do a laser > dtilt combo in Training Mode and I thought it wasn't possible o_o

Laser > reverse utilt is **** sexy but also pretty hard x(

I managed Laser --> D-tilt a few times and I don't even play Falco.

Training mode is misleading, though. Its consecutive hits meter is generous by a frame or so.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Oh wow I missed that tournament......whups lol.

 

[PEEF!]

Dont let Dr PP tell you any way otherwise.

His key to winning is roll>turnaround utilt. It pushed Jman's peanut butter mad hard son.

 

[Dr Peepee]

It's a good fucin strat.

 

[Mogwai]

It's a good fucin strat.

you're never on aim

 

[Dr Peepee]

Oh yeah....I should do that lol.

Edit: I'm on more when I'm actually at home haha. Had no internet access from the 23rd-28th aside from a couple short instances.

 

[KirbyKaze]

PP, mogwai, sheik advice! GoGoGo!

When she's hiding on a side platform, try to laser her. Or better yet, forgo lasers and approach with Nair or Fair because they'll lead to **** combos :D

Lasering her so she has to approach, patiently waiting for her to approach, poking with Uairs when she's on a low platform, and U-tilting her through her aerial approaches are all horrible strategies and should never be used. Similarly, crouch cancel is completely awful against her so don't do it.