ENTER THE HARDBODY

[#HBC | Kary]

and postponing it til tomorrow gets us... maybe a 3rd vig shot? Not anything I'm super psyched about.

And in the meanwhile, slots like PJB and Rockin can just sit on their (justifiable) Nabe scumreads.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

force my hand why don't you.

Well then

Vote: Nabe

I remain confused as to why you avoiding a night kill is a good thing.
Mayhaps scum choose to kill someone obvtown. Why are we in a better situation then?

I honestly can't remember the last time I saw such self-interested play. Add to that my general distaste for your scumpicks and

BIG ANGRY FACE

Nobody's forcing anything. You can make your own decisions. Really bizarre move from you given your original "LEAVE NABE ALONE" platform But I don't feel concerned about this vote, because it has nothing to do with the substantial evidence I've presented in my defense. This is only (publicly) a shallowly directed attempt at getting me to claim, and looks (more deeply) like you're buying back your original standpoint on the issue.

 

[Orboknown]

reading up, but doing a paper. i'll get at you in pieces.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I agree that Soup is scum, this roots back to the point I voted Nabe and gave my thoughts on Soup. I'll tell you which points stood out to me:



You talk about him showing signs of being able to join Bardull's wagon, yet he stayed reserved. I agree to him being really reserved, and waiting on others before pouncing on the attack. His "Kat or Circus?" question seemed a bit leading. I mean sure, it was 24 hours till Deadline, but this would be an easy question to ask as scum, especially since he could mask the responsibility because it was so close to deadline. Now in that quote, it seems like Soup is prepping Bardull before joining his wagon, and giving him an opportunity to spread mis-information before possibly going down. I also felt it was odd that he was putting his analysis of MexBardull on hold for PJB. (Which is why I asked his read on me)

Unvote Vote: Soup

The only point I'd have to say about Soup is that there's some posturing
...which isn't unheard-of for a town Soup anyway.

What do you mean by "prepping Bardull"?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

yay nice strawman.

Remind me why you should avoid eating a bullet?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

It looks like Riddle from Bust a move mafia

Riddle-Riddle, or Laundry?
This is actually a dumb question but bear with me.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

we can solve those CCs now; tomorrow we might not have a vig to solve them.

If I get CC'd at any point, then I'm scum and you can take a lynch to solve the problem. Since, after all, that's the point of lynches. Why is it an issue of time to you?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

If you get CC'd at a point where we do not have a mislynch spare, we cannot just take a lynch, we have to make the right decision between your claim and someone else's. Which is why it is important to do it sooner rather than later.

Your claim is essentially another flip. It is more information for town. I don't know why you'd want to hide it.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

yay nice strawman.

Remind me why you should avoid eating a bullet?

I assume this is at me. I have no idea why you would call this a strawman (Part of it? The whole thing?), given that it's an ordered statement of events in the thread paired with my reads on the results.

Since I've already said why I should avoid an NK, in multiple posts, one of which was specifically directed at you and hasn't garnered a response, I'm left scratching my head at you.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

If you get CC'd at a point where we do not have a mislynch spare, we cannot just take a lynch, we have to make the right decision between your claim and someone else's. Which is why it is important to do it sooner rather than later.

Your claim is essentially another flip. It is more information for town. I don't know why you'd want to hide it.

Ah, so the logic is that scum will CC me. Noted.
Luckily, I've already shown I'm not scum, so this all works out.
(But you needn't worry that other steps haven't been taken to ensure everything's hunky-dory, babe.)

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Or that town will CC you. But either way, you reduce the amount of information that we have to work with.

And no, you haven't shown ****.

 

[Orboknown]

preliminary, since I've been skimming along since the game started, Nabe should claim. Less of a headache earlier is better.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I assume this is at me. I have no idea why you would call this a strawman (Part of it? The whole thing?), given that it's an ordered statement of events in the thread paired with my reads on the results.

my bad. maybe you've just completely misunderstood everything i've said. but my stance has always been:
a) do not lynch nabe without a claim
b) nabe should claim

Since I've already said why I should avoid an NK, in multiple posts, one of which was specifically directed at you and hasn't garnered a response, I'm left scratching my head at you.

you've told me you want to avoid a nkill. you haven't told me why that's protown, why its more valuable than having you cleared

 

[#HBC | marshy]

votecount 2.09
nabe (2) - pjb kary
pjb (2) - orbo nabe
orbo (2) - kataefi ran
not voting (3) - rockin circus death bear

voting log
orbo -> pjb
pjb -> nabe
rockin ->
death bear -> nabe -> none
ranmaru -> nabe -> none -> pjb -> orbo
circus ->
nabe -> pjb
kataefi -> nabe -> orbo
kary -> nabe

with 9 ballin it takes 5 to hardbody. deadline is 3/29 11:59:59 pm est

 

[Orboknown]

Unvote till I'm caught up.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

And no, you haven't shown ****.

You should show specifically how what I've said is wrong, rather than making blanket statements that suggest I should have my tail between my legs.

you've told me you want to avoid a nkill. you haven't told me why that's protown, why its more valuable than having you cleared

Yes, I literally have.

 

[Orboknown]

Nabe how is you being alive, and a question mark, more valuable to town without use of your role then having you cleared, even if for a day, and narrowing the pool of scum?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Without use of my role? I've already claimed my kill/results in all possible cases. And I can continue to generate results the more Nights I'm alive. That's where the value is.

Finish up a read and tell me if there's something wrong with my arguments in part or full rather than just interjecting, yeah? As far as I'm concerned, it's already been shown that I'm not scum, but replies against that that aren't specific issues with that argument aren't valuable to me.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

You should show specifically how what I've said is wrong, rather than making blanket statements that suggest I should have my tail between my legs.

my apologies for being short with you. I sometimes get frustrated because you refuse to, say, scumhunt at all?

Maybe you were town because Bardull pushed you? Let's just put aside that if you were buddies he could have known you would claim.

Maybe you were town because you made a ballsy claim? except that seems much too like WIFOM for my liking.

Without use of my role? I've already claimed my kill/results in all possible cases. And I can continue to generate results the more Nights I'm alive. That's where the value is.

The possibility of one more use of your PR is not nearly enough value to justify you being kept out the line of fire.

Apparently you were ok with being CC'd and subsequently lynched yesterDay, otherwise you wouldn't have pulled such a gambit. But having laughed in the face of a lynch, you're now concerned about being night killed?

why the **** did you even claim in the first place, Nabe?

Please stop pretending for some reason you're cleared without claiming. Then claim.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Maybe you were town because Bardull pushed you? Let's just put aside that if you were buddies he could have known you would claim.

So let me get this straight: my scumpartner decided with an extension to the Day, he was going to generate a pressure wagon on his own partner to make him claim a role he didn't have, in the hopes of... what? It's either a bus or it wasn't, yeah? But if I were looking for information through a counter-claim, I'd have claimed the info role, not hider. And hider is immune to nightkills, so obviously I wasn't baiting a CC to salvage the lynch by killing a PR. What was the purpose of it?

Maybe you were town because you made a ballsy claim? except that seems much too like WIFOM for my liking.

I've never made this argument. (Read my posts.)

The possibility of one more use of your PR is not nearly enough value to justify you being kept out the line of fire.

What keeps me out of the line of fire is all the evidence that says I'm town, and the justification of it is: I'm town. Again, I am going to repeat, go look at my actual posts, instead of just shooting statements at me.

Apparently you were ok with being CC'd and subsequently lynched yesterDay, otherwise you wouldn't have pulled such a gambit. But having laughed in the face of a lynch, you're now concerned about being night killed?

These two statements have nothing to do with each other. I was okay with the possibility of being CC'd and subsequently lynched yesterDay because risking that was the only option to survive the lynch and the subsequent Night phase. If I had claimed this way D1, I'd have been killed that Night for lack of a better target. I'd rather not get killed toNight, either, hence why I keep saying that's the case. No idea what you mean about laughing in the face of a lynch -- yesterDay or toDay? Where's the laughter?

Please stop pretending for some reason you're cleared without claiming. Then claim.

Read and respond to my posts (the one's you're challenging and the specific one that you're asking me for that was addressed to you) and I'll treat what you have to say with respect. Asking me for posts I've already made, and ignoring me when I tell you they exist, is a really strong sign that I'm not the one "pretending" anything. Show me how my reasoning is flawed.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

aiight nabe i'm done. i'm clearly not going to get what i want from this so **** wasting any more time on it. suffice to say that if **** goes down tomorrow and i'm still about you're going to get twice the earful you've already got from me. expect .gifs

Unvote

if there's anything you think i should still address then let me know

 

[Orboknown]

through page 13 but about to run out the door. I'll finish before work tomorrow.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

change of pace

I still want Nabe to claim ASAP. Don't understand the value in him avoiding a nk, don't like him being a question mark.

I want all the prods sent to Circus. Where the **** is that guy and what are his reads?

And as it happens, I have a question for PJB toDay: Given your read on Hilt, how did you find yourself on his waggon?

I had only a slight dislike for Hilt's slot, but it was getting near the deadline and people kept hopping wagons left and right. I settled for hilt, because the other options were Circus, and... I believe Rockin? I just remember thinking the other lynches that had been proposed were terrible ideas, and that Hilt was an acceptable compromise. In hindsight, the lynch probably went through so easily because scum were eager to take what they could get.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

guys give a warm welcome to my homie zozo also known as xonar who replaces jerkus also known as circus

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I had only a slight dislike for Hilt's slot, but it was getting near the deadline and people kept hopping wagons left and right. I settled for hilt, because the other options were Circus, and... I believe Rockin? I just remember thinking the other lynches that had been proposed were terrible ideas, and that Hilt was an acceptable compromise. In hindsight, the lynch probably went through so easily because scum were eager to take what they could get.

aight. could you please flesh out for me a little bit why a Hilt lynch was better than the other options, i.e. talk about the benefits of a Hilt lynch?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Hi.

Reading up in the evening. Won't be posting, I'll be dead tired after this workday.

Someone give me a breakdown though. Do I get to take the lead this game? Man, sure has been a while.

 

[Death Bear]

Bardull was scum.
Kuzi was hider.
Swords was killed.

General running theory is kuzi hid behind Swords.

 

[Death Bear]

Everything else, is up in the air.

 

[Orboknown]

Should be done reading soon, be at a comp in twentyish

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Read and respond to my posts (the one's you're challenging and the specific one that you're asking me for that was addressed to you) and I'll treat what you have to say with respect. Asking me for posts I've already made, and ignoring me when I tell you they exist, is a really strong sign that I'm not the one "pretending" anything. Show me how my reasoning is flawed.

aiight nabe i'm done. i'm clearly not going to get what i want from this so **** wasting any more time on it. suffice to say that if **** goes down tomorrow and i'm still about you're going to get twice the earful you've already got from me. expect .gifs

unvote

Vote: Kary

Kary is acting like I'm being difficult to deal with, when I've told him in precise detail exactly how to get "what he wants from this" in the post prior to his, and in various other posts.
Kary is avoiding having to deal with an argument he's started by vocally diverting the argument until toMorrow, when he knows by nature of DG this will all be forgotten, and me dragging up these then-old posts against a wagon will look desperate.
Kary is apparently giving up on a strongly-held principle (getting me to hard-claim, as expressed through a vote for me) that he says he's held all Day and wasn't going to budge on, despite my argument apparently being 'illogical'. This suggests he's actually giving up because I'm putting up too hard of a fight (or because I'm right), which is in stark contrast to the advertised importance of what he's been arguing for.
By all of the above, I can only conclude that Kary is scum.
Kary giving up on me until "tomorrow" also means giving up on me as a scum target for toDay, which implies that Kary (a) believes I'm town but is arguing on the principle of my actions against a town ideal, (b) believes my arguments to be valid but is arguing, again on principle, or (c) believes either of the first two but is scum and was arguing to get a lynch. It's not (d), that he really believes I'm scum and is letting me go, because Kary (town in that instance) doesn't drop scumreads after a little aggravation.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Need to remember to switch to BBCode every time so my posts in this new system don't look so wacky.


@hider as someone else pointed out, there's also the possibility that Kuz hid behind scum. But it doesn't matter what Kuz did if there's no indication of who he targeted, and given his inactivity in the second half of D1, I doubt there is.

Someone could still look. not It

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Yo Nabe there's no need to be like that. For starters why would I be pushing you to claim so bad if I was scum? You're not even examining my actual stances, you're just saying 'ah he changed his mind he's scum'. Yawn.

 

[Death Bear]

If I had a nickle for every time a DGamer changed a read;
I wouldn't need a full time job.

Nabe, explain why Karyscum decides to switch so visibly, and why he couldn't just keep pushing you, which from my pov would be much easier to waste his time on as scum.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Oh and in case it wasn't obvious Nabe, my stance is still exactly the same:

a) don't lynch Nabe without a claim
b) Nabe should claim

the only difference is that i'm not wasting any more time or attention trying to make b) happen. If you wanna like claim to lend some support to your awful push on me then please do.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

@marshy don't have my role yet, can't start reading like this

 

[#HBC | Joker]

aight. could you please flesh out for me a little bit why a Hilt lynch was better than the other options, i.e. talk about the benefits of a Hilt lynch?

Hilt just seemed like more a lurking scummer to me. He had so little activity, and when he came into the game, all he did was make weak pushes against other inactive slots.

look at his #569
His top lynch pick at that point in the game was J, a slot who had basically never even posted. Only showing up often enough to look like you're doing something, and "pushing" inactives once in awhile is such safe scum play. Just screamed of lurker scum there.

Circus could maybe be argued the same, but I just didn't see it the same way. He seemed like he was inactive cuz he wasn't around, not cuz of playing it safe. He wasn't popping in to maintain appearances.

Rockin just seems like one of the few people in this game (you being one of the others) with his head screwed on straight. I don't want that dude gone at all, cuz I think he'll make the right call in a lylo situation.

 

[Orboknown]

2. PrivateJoker-Brown-town side of null. he seems like he's putting his own thoughts out there, but not entirely sure on him.
3. Rockin-dumb, but i dunno if he's scum. can't recall much form him and i just read half the game this mornign.
4. J Red Ruy Death Bear (Anomandaris_Rake/Red Ruy hydra)Don't see the scum intent. town.
5. Ranmaru-His hammering on vardull's RVS vote seems like scum doing early distancing but he's been better of late. Null but I'd be down to lynch him.
6. Xonar Circus who's this guy?
8. Nabe The bardull disconnect seems a tad wifomy to me. it's like soupvbw in toonami. Should claim.
10. Kataefi-Dislike his early stuff. can't make up my mind on his later posting because I know kat's a good scum player. prolly need to read him in iso.
12. Kary-town.

 

[Orboknown]

more specific stuff tomorrow probably.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

**** this game why did i join a game with both J and Red Ruy luckily they're the same slot can we just lynch them it'll make the game a lot easier

okay jk

but not really I wouldnt mind a J lynch from what Ive read so far

esp if its also red ruy because thats a policy lynch i definitely support

ok reading

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Ok, so is anyone else even looking at Nabe's terrible push against Kary? Can we just lynch this guy already? He can claim if he wants to, but if he keeps refusing then we really should just get rid of him.