Elite Smash?

Telek

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I'm not really qualified to try to get elite on anyone else, but i'll see if I can. If anyone gets elite with GSP < 2332 from now on lemme know. Since the number cannnot go *down* without a ladder wipe, if anyone does that all but confirms it. I'll try Gdorf, since that was the anecdote mentioned.
 

Sucumbio

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I got knocked out at 2.348 and subsequently got 10 straight ffa tem matches with ppl in the 2.2s lol! I hate to say I'll only be truly happy if they bring For Glory back. Yeah omega stages got kinda old but at least I could play without items consistently. And team battle too. This games online is just too reminiscent of Brawl days. Game sequels should always go forward not backwards! I guess I could stick to Arenas but that's got its own problems.
 

Garolymar

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I'm really confused about this system. I play Olimar and I have like 2.3m and I'm in Elite but my Brother who has 2.4m on Ganondorf can't ever break into it. I don't even understand why I'm in it.
 

LIL ELF

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Hey, I know the GSP needed to get in Elite smash gets higher everyday, so I was wondering how high is it now? I've have many character which are over 2,3 mill gsp but still none of them has been accepted in elite smash! Thanks
 

REZERO

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I'd say the gsp increases about .7m - .15m a day so if about 4 days ago the cap was 2.3m it would be about 2.8m. Not saying it was 2.3m 4 days ago but thats the guestimate. Expect an increase from those numbers during sales or holidays.
 

LIL ELF

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I'd say the gsp increases about .7m - .15m a day so if about 4 days ago the cap was 2.3m it would be about 2.8m. Not saying it was 2.3m 4 days ago but thats the guestimate. Expect an increase from those numbers during sales or holidays.
Alright thanks mate
 

zipzo

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I believe we're going to start seeing a fork in the necessary GSP needed per character to reach elite at some point. I'm at around 2.5 mil last I played this morninh but I hazard a guess that entering elite for Zelda is probably around 2.35 mil.

2.8 sounds a bit of an overly high guess.
 
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seanbean

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I read somewhere that GSP has less to do with getting into elite than a very positive win/loss record. Like you may have to have at least 25 more wins than losses, and be on a heavy winning streak to get in. This may make sense as to why I get in, get knocked out, beat enough people to get my GSP higher than it was before and still don't get it again.

Also those in elite will get matched up with non-elite players if they can't find an elite match for them.

I don't know how legit these sources are, but thought it sounded interesting.
 
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leafgreen386

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2.591 for Palutena just now. Win rate is about 57% (112/194) overall, 60% for last 50, and 70% for last 10.

I don't think overall WR has much to do with it, it's just based on the behind-the-scenes matchmaking system, which probably uses something similar to Elo. It's only natural that you're going to need to have a high WR going into it, since you need to raise your Elo for it to recognize you as worthy. It doesn't require an absurd winrate, though; it just requires not losing to people "worse" than you, and sometimes beating people "better" than you. That's enough to steadily climb.

GSP isn't an exact representation, but it's the closest approximation of rank we can get.

edit: Has risen to 2.607 since this posting, without me even playing a match. Kind of a silly system tbh.
 
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Wyti

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Got back in with Palu at 2.612M, interestingly not playing during the holidays was enough to loose my elite spot.
 

Polymus

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I had unlocked Elite Smash around 2.1m GSP, then lost it the next day after a few matches. Haven't been able to get it since. Are there perhaps just hidden ranks based on GSP numbers? Yeah, the required GSP keeps rising cause we keep getting more, eventually better people. But that GSP could be based on like a top 100 system or something of that nature. Kind of like Rank X in Splatoon 2.
 

leafgreen386

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Are there perhaps just hidden ranks based on GSP numbers?
The opposite. There are hidden ranks that *GSP is based on*, which it uses for matchmaking. It's probably something similar to the Elo system.

But that GSP could be based on like a top 100 system or something of that nature
Could be. It seems to be approximately the top 3%, from about 2.605M to about 2.685M, as of this posting. It could just be the top 80,000 players, or it could be the top 3%. Without exact numbers, it's hard to tell.

edit: Saw another post claiming the current GSP to get into elite smash is 2.615M, and that their own GSP ws 2.691M. Still too close to tell whether it's 3% or 80,000.
 
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R208

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The opposite. There are hidden ranks that *GSP is based on*, which it uses for matchmaking. It's probably something similar to the Elo system.


Could be. It seems to be approximately the top 3%, from about 2.605M to about 2.685M, as of this posting. It could just be the top 80,000 players, or it could be the top 3%. Without exact numbers, it's hard to tell.

edit: Saw another post claiming the current GSP to get into elite smash is 2.615M, and that their own GSP ws 2.691M. Still too close to tell whether it's 3% or 80,000.
At this point, I'd say that I have no idea. If you find someone close to you, and win, you get 1k GSP at that level. (Source: Me. I made the post lol) I'd expect gains to be even lower if it was the 3% threshold because that'd only be 4k off of "Max" GSP. (2.615m / 97% = 2.695m). It'd be insanely close. That's, like, 20 wins from people well below you close. I refuse to believe my random-*** Ganon is near the GSP max cap LMAO.

And 80k flat wouldn't make sense, really. That'd be less then 3% of the entire community in... Well, about a week. I guess I can personally de-confirm that soon.
 
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leafgreen386

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At this point, I'd say that I have no idea. If you find someone close to you, and win, you get 1k GSP at that level. (Source: Me. I made the post lol) I'd expect gains to be even lower if it was the 3% threshold because that'd only be 4k off of "Max" GSP. (2.615m / 97% = 2.695m). It'd be insanely close. That's, like, 20 wins from people well below you close. I refuse to believe my random-*** Ganon is near the GSP max cap LMAO.

And 80k flat wouldn't make sense, really. That'd be less then 3% of the entire community in... Well, about a week. I guess I can personally de-confirm that soon.
Flat 100k is also possible, and would make more sense than 80k. It's a system made by humans, so it's probably going to be a nice "round" number. Whether it be 3%, 4%, 80k, or 100k. It would be rather strange if it was something like, say... 3.4%.
 
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Crystanium

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I activated my Nintendo eShop 12 Month Membership card today, played a number of people with my characters in my signature, and now I'm in Elite Smash with Samus. It only took me about an hour-and-a-half to get on Elite Smash. That's pretty funny.
 

zipzo

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I activated my Nintendo eShop 12 Month Membership card today, played a number of people with my characters in my signature, and now I'm in Elite Smash with Samus. It only took me about an hour-and-a-half to get on Elite Smash. That's pretty funny.
What's your GSP?? The post is meaningless without GSP context.
 
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leafgreen386

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So I'm thinking the number of times you use a character definitely affects the GSP earned or lost. Some of my characters have only been used a few battles and gain leaps and bounds whereas my mains barely move now win or lose.
Yeah, that gives credence to it using an Elo system behind the scenes. The Elo system gives more weight to a newcomer's initial matches, so as to place them where they belong in a more reasonable period of time. After they've played enough games to establish themselves, Elo will shift much more slowly.
 

Sucumbio

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Yeah, that gives credence to it using an Elo system behind the scenes. The Elo system gives more weight to a newcomer's initial matches, so as to place them where they belong in a more reasonable period of time. After they've played enough games to establish themselves, Elo will shift much more slowly.
Not to sound like a dunce but what is Elo short for lol? Or is it some kinda game mechanic from other games or something? Never heard of it before it was mentioned here...

Edit nvm Google is my friend. Very interesting! I think you're onto something.
 
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leafgreen386

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For the sake of others that are less willing to google it: Elo is a ranking system originally devised to rank chess players, by a man named Arpad Elo. It's not an acronym, just a name. It's a zero-sum system where the winner gains points equal to the amount of points the loser lost - and this amount is based on the probability of a given player winning based on their current scores. As I mentioned before, it also gives extra weight to a player's initial matches, to more rapidly place them.

This system is excellent for rating either individuals or teams, as long as there are only two "competitors" in a match, so it's often used in games, even games that it maybe shouldn't be. Since smash online can have more than two players, it can't use a pure Elo system, and must modify it somehow to account for FFAs. It's likely that for 1v1s, the system is very close to conventional Elo, though. It also deviates from a traditional Elo system in that when characters first place, they start at a value based on your existing average, rather than the average of all players.
 
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Crystanium

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What's your GSP?? The post is meaningless without GSP context.
My GSP for Samus is 2,742,457. Dark Samus and Ridley are also at 2.7+ million for GSP, but I made it there for Samus first at over 2.6+ million yesterday.

By the way, my 10 win rate is 90%. My 50 win rate is above 80%. I've also defeated 10 players who have higher GSPs than me, according to the unlocked images. Maybe that plays a role? Like I said, I started yesterday and within about an hour-and-a-half of gameplay, I ended up in Elite Smash.
 
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sanicdude246

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Many people say it's gsp or it's win/lose ratio. My luigi is on 200,654. idk how to get elite smash for him

help....
 

R208

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My personal observation has been that there is a minimum GSP that needs to be met and that is it. This comes from observing my lowest Elite and comparing my Non-Elites and seeing that none of them break the minimum set by the lowest Elite.

Win/Loss ratio is kinda silly. You have to win more then you lose to climb GSP, so having a positive Win/Loss is kinda a byproduct of getting to Elite.

As for the current threshold, it's well over 2,700,000.
 

Oneiros5321

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I believe the GSP you need to access Elite Smash is always changing and is not the same for every character.
As for your rank, 200 000 is too low for any character to get to Elite Smash. I am not in either so I cannot say for sure, but I got my Mario up to 1,3mil and still didn't get to Elite.
 

zipzo

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It appears that ZeRo has reached the very top of GSP. In his stream with cloud, he won a match and he gained absolutely no GSP which means there is no one higher than him at that moment.
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/358842384?t=06h28m52s
That might just mean the person he faced was not high enough to where his GSP would increase...

That's the inherent flaw of GSP as a concept, you have no idea who is above you, just below, and even that has been proven to be not truly accurate with 1 GSP being attainable by more than 1 person.
 
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That might just mean the person he faced was not high enough to where his GSP would increase...

That's the inherent flaw of GSP as a concept, you have no idea who is above you, just below, and even that has been proven to be not truly accurate with 1 GSP being attainable by more than 1 person.
Shouldn't it increase regardless of the other person's GSP? Sounds like a waste of effort to win a game and not increase even at the slightest.
 

leafgreen386

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Shouldn't it increase regardless of the other person's GSP? Sounds like a waste of effort to win a game and not increase even at the slightest.
That's the thing, even if your hidden rating goes up, if you're either at the very top of the ladder or if it wasn't enough to pass the next person above you, you won't notice any change. Zero's rating certainly went up there, but it just didn't make a difference in the stack ranking of players.
 

zipzo

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Shouldn't it increase regardless of the other person's GSP? Sounds like a waste of effort to win a game and not increase even at the slightest.
Once you're as high a GSP as he likely is (relatively), not every player you beat is going to yield GSP because not every player you beat is going to qualify as a worthy opponent, comparatively. GSP is supposed to represent an approximation of how many people you are better than, so beating someone and the rank not going up only says that the player he beat wasn't better than him by a long shot to begin with, and there weren't any players he leapfrogged to being better than either as a result of that win.

If it only queued him up against people he serves to gain rank from, I'd imagine his queue times would just be ridiculous while sitting at such a high rank (which is actually sometimes the case for high rated players in games of all genres). In Smash you wanna be able to fight people relatively consistently and go match to match relatively quickly, even if it means someone you're nearly preordained to beat.

There could be a higher ranked player that he simply just hasn't queued up against.

That's why GSP is stupid, it's basically impossible to know without nintendo giving us a better rating system, and/or tracking information in the form of a leaderboard or something.
 
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JKincaid

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Still nothing. I peaked at 2.7 mil with Bowser, 2.6 currently. My win rate is like 60% so that might be why.

I imagine Elite will still be full of Marth/Roy/Lucinas spamming SH Nair, mashing Side-B on whiff, roll behind to F-Smash, "I lost so I won't rematch" dweebs
 
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