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Elements and Attributes Mafia - Game Over!

Foxy the Silver Fox

Anomandaris_Rake|Ranmaru
Joined
May 7, 2013
Messages
255
Clearly your 'wagon' on Kantrip will be far more successful than a concerted push onto PJB who becomes agitated easily.

Please - show me your results since you seem so intent on halting mine.

And what good does PJB becoming agitated do? Seriously tell me that.

I also don't see why you ask this of me now. How can I? I have yet to get a response. I also don't see how I'm halting your progress.
 

~ Gheb ~

Life is just a party
Joined
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Messages
16,916
Location
Europe
5. Gheb_01 - Ghebbers. I think I'll like you this game, can you read Hando?


Should be no problem as long as he actually posts. Reading through inactivity and sparse posting isn't really my main forte but if he makes regular input I should have no issues handling it.

Anyone have any issues with me (Swiss, not Adum) assuming leadership of town? If so speak up asap - don't want to waste time.

By anyone, I mean Gheb or Handorin - since no-one else will have the backbone or experience to pipe up (Ryker will keep quiet). To save time; I'm better than both of them so ignore them if they protest.

Vote PJB
OK with it actually, especially after your play in Golden Sun. I mean, it's not like it's up to me to decide whether you'll achieve "leadership of town". That's up to the sheeps and the tools and you already correctly implied that I'm not part of them so even if you actually assume leadership at one point I'd have to deal with it. I think as long as I don't read you as scum [yes, I can actually do that] the pros of letting you do your thing will outweigh the cons anyway.

I don't see any reason to join the PJB wagon. I do think you and Swords should explain why you think it is good to be on him, and Kantrip should explain why exactly he voted him.
U can't see the benefit of an early wagon? Against the most defensive kind of player that could possibly exist? When he's already spreading FUD by discrediting power players? Like any other player in this game, S&S is innocent until proven guilty and therefore: Vote PrivateJoker-Brown

Laundy should be payed attention to early, imo. He has the habit of starting off with an acceptable activity level and dropping various scumtells during Day 1 [check Ryu's Toonami and Golden Sun for reference]. Later in the game he has the tendency to become inactive and I have reason to believe that Ryker won't be that much more active. The earlier we can read the slot the sooner we can be sure whether we should lynch it or ignore it.

:059:
 

#HBC | Joker

Space Marine
Joined
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Messages
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St. Clair Shores, Michigan
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HBCJoker
3DS FC
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How is an unwillingness to sheep somebody that I have no reason to trust the same thing as spreading FUD? That's a pretty gross misrepresentation of what I said.
 

#HBC | Joker

Space Marine
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Like, I might be willing to follow S&C if I think they're town, but I'm not gonna just hand them thread power based on absolutely nothing. That's stupid, and it's not something I'm willing to do with anybody. The fact that it's S&C is irrelevant here.
 

Foxy the Silver Fox

Anomandaris_Rake|Ranmaru
Joined
May 7, 2013
Messages
255
Gheb stop twisting my words. I didn't say there wasn't merit in early wagons, I don't see any reason to join this one.
 

~ Gheb ~

Life is just a party
Joined
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Messages
16,916
Location
Europe
OK, FUD might be a bit too harsh a word but the fact that you say "it remains to be seen whether he's town or not" bothers me. For two reasons mainly: first, what remains to be seen is whether he's scum or not because we're all innocent until proven guilty. You've twisting this inherently fundamental logic of scum hunting. As long as it's not being taken overboard then it's OK to sheep a power player a little and see what happens. It's not like we don't learn anything about the waggoned player, the "leader" and the sheeps. Discouraging a wagon on such principles is anti-town. Getting hooked on a provokative term like "sheeping" and "buddying" not a justficiation imo especially if you look at the way these terms have been handled in this game's context so far.

Second, you create a problem that doesn't exist. Why is it a problem that Kantrip chooses to sheep Swiss? Not only is Swiss' judgment more trustworthy than Kantrip but we can also learn a lot about the relationship between Kantrip and Swiss by seeing how far Kantrip is willing to sheep Swiss. All facts considered, it's pretty clear why the wagon makes sense and we might just found our first scumbag already. You can't hide behind your destructive cynicism forever.

Gheb stop twisting my words. I didn't say there wasn't merit in early wagons, I don't see any reason to join this one.
I twisted your words? You said you don't see the reason to join the PJB wagon and I gave you some. That's not twisting words, in fact it's the opposite of it.

:059:
 

Foxy the Silver Fox

Anomandaris_Rake|Ranmaru
Joined
May 7, 2013
Messages
255
U can't see the benefit of an early wagon? Against the most defensive kind of player that could possibly exist? When he's already spreading FUD by discrediting power players? Like any other player in this game, S&S is innocent until proven guilty and therefore: Vote PrivateJoker-Brown
Gheb, I was talking about the underlined. It reads as if you were echoing 'words' I said back to me, which I haven't said. If you didn't mean it that way, I would ask you to not word your questions in such a confusing way.

This is Ranmaru.
 

#HBC | Joker

Space Marine
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Personally, I'm not of the opinion that sheeping somebody who's alignment you don't know is a good idea. Even if it's technically harmless, I'm not willing to put myself in a position where S&C flips scum later, and then people come in later saying stuff like "lol, look, pjb must be scum cuz he sheeped S&C early on!" Needlessly connecting myself to players I don't necessarily trust is just... not smart.

Now if S&C were making points that I agree with, that's a different case entirely. But that's not something that has, ya know, happened yet. The game just started.
 

Foxy the Silver Fox

Anomandaris_Rake|Ranmaru
Joined
May 7, 2013
Messages
255
Joker, is there anyone you trust ? If so why, and how far ?

Joker being concerned with early thread appearance - Null
 

#HBC | Joker

Space Marine
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Joker, is there anyone you trust ? If so why, and how far ?

Joker being concerned with early thread appearance - Null
I don't trust anybody yet. That's not to say I'm automatically suspicious of everyone, although I'm sure Gheb's gonna go ahead and interpret it that way. I'm just saying that at this stage of the game, I don't trust people, I trust information. If what you're saying makes sense to me, I'm listening, but I'm not gonna trust anyone simply because they are X player. That's dumb.
 

#HBC | Joker

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See, Ran? That's twisting words.

:059:
How is it twisting words? Kantrip asked me if I thought it was cool for him to sheep S&C, and I said that was a bad idea. Then you came in, said I was spreading FUD, and proclaimed baseless sheeping of power players to be perfectly acceptable.

If that's not what you were saying, then fell free to correct me.
 

#HBC | Joker

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Second, you create a problem that doesn't exist. Why is it a problem that Kantrip chooses to sheep Swiss? Not only is Swiss' judgment more trustworthy than Kantrip but we can also learn a lot about the relationship between Kantrip and Swiss by seeing how far Kantrip is willing to sheep Swiss. All facts considered, it's pretty clear why the wagon makes sense and we might just found our first scumbag already. You can't hide behind your destructive cynicism forever.


:059:
See, I disagree with this point entirely. I'm not of the opinion that you should sheep people who "have better judgment". If you don't trust your own judgment, then why are you even playing? How will you be able to make the decision to stop following them if you think your judgment is bad? I'm plenty willing to read someone's argument and decide for myself, but I wouldn't consider it "sheeping" if I happened to come to the same conclusion as somebody else, even if it was based on evidence they showed me.
 

#HBC | Joker

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I dunno what else to tell you, Gheb. I don't think that coming into a game with the attitude of "This guy is smarter than me. Imma just do what he says and hope he helps me win." is a good way to play, and it certainly won't help you improve.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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1. Handorin - Are you actually going to play this game or...? I have no time for useless players.
2. BadWolf28738 - I'd suggest you outline to me your D1 strategy, you are under no obligation to respond.
3. Aggressive Mediation - Let us not derail the day phases because one of us is scum. My thread D1. Do make sure Laundry posts - he is, I think, the only player who gets progressively worse each game he plays/
4. Dark Horse - How did you answer your questions and why?
5. Gheb_01 - Ghebbers. I think I'll like you this game, can you read Hando?
6. JTB - ?
7. frozenflame751 - I don't particularly care if you are inactive, I'll be having the doc so I guess you'll die earlyish again.
8. Potassium - Sheep me
9. Sworddancer. - Sheep me
10. Red Ruy - Sheep me
11. PrivateJoker-Brown - I am very interested in you.
12. Foxy the Silver Fox (Anomandaris_Rake/Ranmaru) - Have you decided which head of the hydra will be your shot caller?
13. Scylla & Charybdis (adumbrodeus/Swiss) ()

Anyone have any issues with me (Swiss, not Adum) assuming leadership of town? If so speak up asap - don't want to waste time.

By anyone, I mean Gheb or Handorin - since no-one else will have the backbone or experience to pipe up (Ryker will keep quiet). To save time; I'm better than both of them so ignore them if they protest.

Vote PJB
I'm leading this game, you will sheep me.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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Personally, I'm not of the opinion that sheeping somebody who's alignment you don't know is a good idea. Even if it's technically harmless, I'm not willing to put myself in a position where S&C flips scum later, and then people come in later saying stuff like "lol, look, pjb must be scum cuz he sheeped S&C early on!" Needlessly connecting myself to players I don't necessarily trust is just... not smart.

Now if S&C were making points that I agree with, that's a different case entirely. But that's not something that has, ya know, happened yet. The game just started.
Bad post.

You think people would simple connect because you joined an early RVS wagon?
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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Lol RR, good one.

Oh wait, you're serious? You really think we'll concede leadership to you of all people when we're alive and let you lynch through all the obvious town? >_>
My reads are superior, because you are likely scum.

I have gained enlightenment.

I have become superior.

~

Real talk though you should help wagon Rake/Ran, then we Wagon PJB to read them.

Deal?
 
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