Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Guynamednelson]

The only thing I'm left hoping for is that they've done their priorities

Considering the Switch reps we got in FP2 are from 2017 and everything newer is either already playable, spirited, or in the case of LM3 represented by introducing the new Poltergust...

 

[warubyun]

This. People dont seem to get this. every dlc launches with music, a stage, and spirit challenges of supplementary characters. in other words: LORE. waluigi offers none of that. he has nothing to pull from and already his moveset would be generated from thin air.

Do you really believe that there is nothing left from the myriad of Mario spin-off titles to pull a stage, music and spirits from? And that there is nothing from Waluigi's playable appearances in said titles that could be used to design a moveset?

 

[ArkSPiTFirE]

Considering the Switch reps we got in FP2 are from 2017 and everything newer is either already playable, spirited, or in the case of LM3 represented by introducing the new Poltergust...

So you're saying there's a cha-
Nintendo: Hey! Have you heard there's this cool new game called Pokémon Unite?

Do you really believe that there is nothing left from the myriad of Mario spin-off titles to pull a stage, music and spirits from? And that there is nothing from Waluigi's playable appearances in said titles that could be used to design a moveset?

Jumping in on this.
.
.
Yeah.

Nah, he has moveset potential, I dunno where that comes from. That's like saying Wario wouldn't have moveset potential unless you picked something wacky from WarioWare. Of course he'd have something.

That said, he really doesn't have a lot of content to his name that's not already in Ultimate. I'm sure they could find something, but how meaningful would it really be if it's just more various Mario music? I see Waluigi's introduction to Smash being perfect as a solo DLC character (like plant) or a base game addition. It's sad that it's looking more and more like we're not getting that 1 bonus character, but I'd love to be proved wrong. It'll just be funny.

 

[chocolatejr9]

So you're saying there's a cha-

Nintendo: Hey! Have you heard there's this cool new game called Pokémon Unite?

No.

But I HAVE heard of Dragalia Lost.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

inb4
Luigi, body and soul, will be saved and put an end to Carmilla's troubles.

Only to get his *** kicked by King Boo

 

[ArkSPiTFirE]

No.

But I HAVE heard of Dragalia Lost.

Weird, I haven't :')

(Though it is available in the UK, I guess I can't really use that excuse)

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Crackpot Smash Ideas: Zero is added, but he doesn't wield the Z-Saber. Instead he wields the Z-Glaive, which is about 50% taller than he is. None can escape from his range now.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The thing about Spirit Boards is they don't need to be hard-tied to a character, just relate to their franchise. There's tons of Mario characters who don't have a Spirit among various mooks, bosses, etc. So what if they don't directly tie to Waluigi? That doesn't matter. It's easy to put them in because it's the same franchise.

He doesn't lack moveset potential(though it's more a matter of Sakurai figuring out a coherent moveset design for him than lacking moves. He has signature abilities like his air swimming).

There's unused Mario music anyway. That's not an issue either.

It's pretty easy to fill out practically any character pack. You need two songs minimum, and a few spirits(let's say... 8). You can even use a few base game spirits and redo them for the Spirit Board, as Min Min showed. if you were actually desperate for them(Hint: There's not in Waluigi's case).

Crackpot Smash Ideas: Zero is added, but he doesn't wield the Z-Saber. Instead he wields the Z-Glaive, which is about 50% taller than he is. None can escape from his range now.

And then he's used as a base for Nightmare later.

 

[Slime Master]

I don't see Nintendo deciding against a character, the main selling point of a CP, just because it'd be tricky to fill in the side content that approximately 0 people buy the pack for. It just doesn't make much sense from a marketing perspective.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Crackpot Smash Ideas: Zero is added, but he doesn't wield the Z-Saber. Instead he wields the Z-Glaive, which is about 50% taller than he is. None can escape from his range now.

Ah, a way to continue the tradition of Zero being top tier in every fighting game

 

[DarthEnderX]

No, X is a nickname. His full name is "Mega Man X".

Dunno what to tell ya. The intern that wrote that is wrong. Cause he's only ever referred to as X in the games.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

In fact, Mega Man X...is not named Mega Man X. His name is just "X".

Sigma's dialogue in Mega Man X2 before fighting X and Mega Man X4's character select screen, which lists X as "Mega Man X": "Am I a joke to you?"

(If you're wondering, Sigma's dialogue before his boss fight in X2 goes as follows: "You are merely a bothersome insect, Mega Man X! It is about time that I crush you beneath my heel!")

And keep in mind, that boss fight invented the concept of drip, as seen here:

 

[DarthEnderX]

(If you're wondering, Sigma's dialogue before his boss fight in X2 goes as follows: "You are merely a bothersome insect, Mega Man X! It is about time that I crush you beneath my heel!")

Only in the NA localization.

 

[Cosmic77]

I know it sounds stupid on paper to claim that Nintendo would care about bundles having a solid theme when choosing characters, but...that's sort of how things have gone in the past ten bundles. Every bundle has focused on either a single game or an entire franchise if the franchise had little to no prior content. Doesn't seem unreasonable to assume the last bundle will follow suit.

I don't have an issue with characters like Waluigi, and I'd love to be wrong. Going off what we've gotten so far though, I have a hard time picturing Waluigi coming with a mix-match of random Mario Kart, Mario Party, Mario sports spinoff content.

 

[Inferno7]

Jumping in on this.
.
.
Yeah.

Nah, he has moveset potential, I dunno where that comes from. That's like saying Wario wouldn't have moveset potential unless you picked something wacky from WarioWare. Of course he'd have something.

That said, he really doesn't have a lot of content to his name that's not already in Ultimate. I'm sure they could find something, but how meaningful would it really be if it's just more various Mario music? I see Waluigi's introduction to Smash being perfect as a solo DLC character (like plant) or a base game addition. It's sad that it's looking more and more like we're not getting that 1 bonus character, but I'd love to be proved wrong. It'll just be funny.

This is pretty much my stance on the subject
He can certainly have a functioning/unique moveset, Legacy XP and SSF2 already did that.
But still, you'd have to pull off a whole list of C and D-listers aka literal scraps in order to make a cohesive spirit board. Say what you want, but all of them include very important characters and aspects from their respective franchises (XC2 has Rex, Minecraft has Ender Dragon, FF7 has Tifa and co., Tekken has Heihachi and Jin, Banjo has Gruntilda, etc.). Not to mention that spin-offs aren't exactly lacking in content either, we just got the party dice, tennis spirits and lots of stuff like the karts and MK songs.

Whatever they include, I don't really think it will be meaningful enough. Not to say he can't get in by any means, just food for thought. Personally, I think he'll be used as the selling point for Smash 6.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I know it sounds stupid on paper to claim that Nintendo would care about bundles having a solid theme when choosing characters, but...that's sort of how things have gone in the past ten bundles. Every bundle has focused on either a single game or an entire franchise if the franchise had little to no prior content. Doesn't seem unreasonable to assume the last bundle will follow suit.

I don't have an issue with characters like Waluigi, and I'd love to be wrong. Going off what we've gotten so far though, I have a hard time picturing Waluigi coming with a mix-match of random Mario Kart, Mario Party, Mario sports spinoff content.

The problem with this argument is that Mario Spin-Offs is in itself a theme, and it gets stronger the more you narrow it down. The only concern here would be the fact that Mario Kart music is listed separately from the other Super Mario tracks.

Don't think they'd use any content that isn't on the switch? Well at this point we've got Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, Mario Tennis Aces, Mario Golf: Super Rush, Mario Party Superstars, and Super Mario Party. That's plenty to fill out a pass.

Waluigi is unlikely for various reasons, but this isn't one of them.

 

[Theguy123]

This is pretty much my stance on the subject
He can certainly have a functioning/unique moveset, Legacy XP and SSF2 already did that.
But still, you'd have to pull off a whole list of C and D-listers aka literal scraps in order to make a cohesive spirit board. Say what you want, but all of them include very important characters and aspects from their respective franchises (XC2 has Rex, Minecraft has Ender Dragon, FF7 has Tifa and co., Tekken has Heihachi and Jin, Banjo has Gruntilda, etc.). Not to mention that spin-offs aren't exactly lacking in content either, we just got the party dice, tennis spirits and lots of stuff like the karts and MK songs.

Whatever they include, I don't really think it will be meaningful enough. Not to say he can't get in by any means, just food for thought. Personally, I think he'll be used as the selling point for Smash 6.

I think the only problem with waluigi is that he doesn’t appear in a mainline game or series. Sakurai usually makes each characters move set based around their appearances in mainline games with spin-offs barely getting any love whatsoever.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I think the only problem with waluigi is that he doesn’t appear in a mainline game or series. Sakurai usually makes each characters move set based around their appearances in mainline games with spin-offs barely getting any love whatsoever.

This is probably because their mainline appearances are where the character's most notable abilities come from. Even then, Peach's Forward Smash is from the Mario Sports series and Bowser Jr.'s Side Special is based on the Mario Kart series, so it's not like they're avoiding them at all costs. Since Waluigi only appears in spin-offs, why would they avoid giving him spin-off stuff?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

This is probably because their mainline appearances are where the character's most notable abilities come from. Even then, Peach's Forward Smash is from the Mario Sports series and Bowser Jr.'s Side Special is based on the Mario Kart series, so it's not like they're avoiding them at all costs. Since Waluigi only appears in spin-offs, why would they avoid giving him spin-off stuff?

I mean, the user did say "barely any spin-off love". So to be fair, it does exist, just not often.

Either way, I don't think Sakurai would remotely avoid it. The Mario spin-off series is barely tapped in potential, and that's a possible way for Waluigi to shine. There's also a crapload of spin-off only characters who make sense as Spirits. But as you said before, that's a theme too. Whether it's Sports-based(there's multiple sports outfits that could be spirits, even), or just spin-offs(I mean, there's a dice character in Mario Party. Easy spirit. Etc.)

 

[3BitSaurus]

I think the only problem with waluigi is that he doesn’t appear in a mainline game or series. Sakurai usually makes each characters move set based around their appearances in mainline games with spin-offs barely getting any love whatsoever.

With Daisy only having one mainline appearance to her name (and even that barely influencing her moveset at all) as well as Rosalina using moves that belonged to Mario in Super Mario Galaxy (as well as entirely made-up stuff), I don't think that's a hard restriction tbh.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

With Daisy only having one mainline appearance to her name (and even that barely influencing her moveset at all) as well as Rosalina using moves that belonged to Mario in Super Mario Galaxy (as well as entirely made-up stuff), I don't think that's a hard restriction tbh.

Two, actually. Super Mario Run she isn't a cameo like in Super Mario Maker(another mainline game). But same point, yep. Super Mario Run is a bit less traditional than Super Mario Maker is when it comes to the stages, but... I was only surprised at first. It makes sense why both are mainline. Super Mario Land deviated more in a sense. XD

Really, it doesn't matter if they're from a spin-off or not. All that matters is if they can figure out how to make a coherent moveset with the options available. In some cases, spin-offs aren't needed(Mario until at best his Final Smash, which may be loosely based upon Super Mario RPG. Peach pretty much combined Super Mario RPG, Mario 2 USA, and some extra magical made-iup moves).

 

[Theguy123]

With Daisy only having one mainline appearance to her name (and even that barely influencing her moveset at all) as well as Rosalina using moves that belonged to Mario in Super Mario Galaxy (as well as entirely made-up stuff), I don't think that's a hard restriction tbh.

fair enough with the daisy argument but the rosalina comparison doesn’t hold up because rosalina gives mario the spin move so she can probably already do it and she’s a goddes who can use her wand to do things so her move set was based around what she’d be able to do with it. Not to mention she uses the Luma’s which are hers and come from the game she originates in and uses the launch star from the game she originates in so the rosalina comparison doesn’t hold up

 

[FreeFox]

Well, there are a couple of Waluigi refernces I would demand for the complete Waluigi experience.

 

[Sucumbio]

Ya know I've never played Golden Sun ... Are any of them on switch?..

Waluigi is annoying af just like wario they deserve to team up in this series and it kinda threw me when they added so many characters in ultimate but wario is still alone.

 

[Slime Master]

Smash only doesn't have Mario spinoffs as playable characters, there's plenty of spinoff content in music, stages, items, and spirits. And even then you have to count Dr. Mario as an exception (which is valid, but every asterisk adds up). I think it's just that the characters we've gotten so far have been a higher priority than spinoff characters.

I'm also not a big fan of separating Mario into mainline and spinoff games in the first place, but that's probably a different debate.

 

[Cosmic77]

The problem with this argument is that Mario Spin-Offs is in itself a theme, and it gets stronger the more you narrow it down. The only concern here would be the fact that Mario Kart music is listed separately from the other Super Mario tracks.

Don't think they'd use any content that isn't on the switch? Well at this point we've got Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, Mario Tennis Aces, Mario Golf: Super Rush, Mario Party Superstars, and Super Mario Party. That's plenty to fill out a pass.

Waluigi is unlikely for various reasons, but this isn't one of them.

As far as Nintendo having an incentive to choose Waluigi for promotional reasons, I see little to none. Can Waluigi promote all those games you listed? Yes. Waluigi along with just about every other Mario character in Ultimate can promote those games. Compare that to Byleth, Min Min, and Pyra who don't have anyone on the roster who could promote their games.

Personally, I see fanservice as Waluigi's only path to F11, and even then you have other characters who could qualify as fanservice AND promote something that isn't already decently represented. I think Waluigi has a better shot as a base game character, but that's just my take.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

I'm also not a big fan of separating Mario into mainline and spinoff games in the first place

Makes sense, seeing as there's too many Mario games to count.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Ya know I've never played Golden Sun ... Are any of them on switch?..

Waluigi is annoying af just like wario they deserve to team up in this series and it kinda threw me when they added so many characters in ultimate but wario is still alone.

Sadly Wii U only at this time. Or you can find the carts for... a decent price offline? Maybe? I see 'em usually in the 20 dollar ranger lately with the full box/etc. But that's in one location, so. It's only the DS game that is more controller-based, so of course it's only really good for a hard copy at this time on its own. The others are super traditional controls and have easy options.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Ya know I've never played Golden Sun ... Are any of them on switch?..

Nnnnnope!

There are theories that they will bring back the series, but it's all wishful thinking IMO.

Waluigi is annoying af just like wario they deserve to team up in this series and it kinda threw me when they added so many characters in ultimate but wario is still alone.

Technically he would still be alone because they won't freaking put him in Wario's games.

As far as Nintendo having an incentive to choose Waluigi for promotional reasons, I see little to none. Can Waluigi promote all those games you listed? Yes. Waluigi along with just about every other Mario character in Ultimate can promote those games. Compare that to Byleth, Min Min, and Pyra who don't have anyone on the roster who could promote their games.

Personally, I see fanservice as Waluigi's only path to F11, and even then you have other characters who could qualify as fanservice AND promote something that isn't already decently represented. I think Waluigi has a better shot as a base game character, but that's just my take.

And that I think is one of the bigger reasons as to why he isn't the last character; Not because he doesn't have enough content associated with him to theme his pass around, but because he wouldn't be picked in the first place.

 

[blackghost]

The only thing that does is offer another chance to promote a video game, which shouldn't be the only thing that counts. It didn't count for Banjo, or Duck Hunt. It barely counted for Little Mac. Like, why do some retro characters get a pass for this and others not?


The only thing I'm left hoping for is that they've done their priorities and can now consider something more retro to end us off :>

banjo is a promo for nintnedo and xbox relationship and banjo also had some people VERY high up in microsoft pulling for him.
duck hunt isnt a dlc so his inclusion isnt the same at all. lil mac had a game come out right before he was added.

Do you really believe that there is nothing left from the myriad of Mario spin-off titles to pull a stage, music and spirits from? And that there is nothing from Waluigi's playable appearances in said titles that could be used to design a moveset?

naw i dont think he does. what spirits does he bring, what stage, music, ect? the fact that immediately you went to MARIO spin-offs for content says a lot. waluigi has less to offer than most other mario secondary characters. being an internet meme doesnt mean he has lore to bring.
compare him to zero, alucard, shovel knight, isaac, all main characters in beloved series who have movesets that reference beloved games. DLC in ultimate have either been Nintendo promotion or 3rd party legends. no in between.

 

[subterrestrial]

As far as Nintendo having an incentive to choose Waluigi for promotional reasons, I see little to none. Can Waluigi promote all those games you listed? Yes. Waluigi along with just about every other Mario character in Ultimate can promote those games. Compare that to Byleth, Min Min, and Pyra who don't have anyone on the roster who could promote their games.

Personally, I see fanservice as Waluigi's only path to F11, and even then you have other characters who could qualify as fanservice AND promote something that isn't already decently represented. I think Waluigi has a better shot as a base game character, but that's just my take.

waluigi easily has the most fan demand out of any other character

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

waluigi easily has the most fan demand out of any other character

This is most likely false once you consider 3rd parties, and even then Nintendo would have to care enough to have fan demand as the only reason to add him.

 

[Theguy123]

Always thought king boo would be the next mario rep. Not biased or anything, it’s just that Luigi Manson 1,2 and 3 have all sold exceptionally well and the poltergeist is already in smash as apart of Luigi’s moveset and Luigi mansion series is directly connected to mainline mario games.

if we end up getting a new mario rep I’d have thought it would be king boo.

 

[Cosmic77]

I know it'll probably never happen, but Luigi's Mansion really does deserve to be separated from the rest of the Mario franchise like Yoshi and Wario were. It's gotten big enough to where multiple reps seems fair.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I know it'll probably never happen, but Luigi's Mansion really does deserve to be separated from the rest of the Mario franchise like Yoshi and Wario were. It's gotten big enough to where multiple reps seems fair.

I disagree. It still markets itself as a Mario game, and we'd get annoying oddities like Luigi either no longer being considered a Mario character or not being considered a Luigi's Mansion character within Super Smash Bros.

EDIT: I'd be fine with them adding both Professor E. Gadd and King Boo (in fact, they'd both probably be my jam), but they should be considered Mario characters.

 

[TheCJBrine]

This. People dont seem to get this. every dlc launches with music, a stage, and spirit challenges of supplementary characters. in other words: LORE. waluigi offers none of that. he has nothing to pull from and already his moveset would be generated from thin air.

I perosnally dont even bleieve he is as popuylar as the echo chamber leads people to believe. Nintendo certainly doesn't think so they barely use the character in any way that matters (even other secondary mario characters show up in other ways down to daisy)

If an AT gets an upgrade (which im 99% sure wont happen) why would it be waluigi over alucard, shovel knight, or Zero? that makes no business sense.

if mii costumes dont hard deconfirm, im jumping back on the dante train.

Based on how Waluigi is used in the Nintendo community, I’m pretty sure he’s more popular than you’re giving him credit for. Characters are usually highly popular memes because people like them and like making or seeing funny stuff with them in the first place, and this is beyond funny images.

Also saying Nintendo barely uses him for anything important outside of spinoffs isn’t saying much; there are other popular characters of theirs they barely or rarely acknowledge themselves lol, with some they do acknowledge but not another popular version of them (Wario Land Wario).

And there’s no rule that the packs have to be brand new lore stuffs. The packs are constructed around the character, they don’t pick based on what could fill out a pack, and there are certainly things they could add/do with Waluigi.

He, of course, probably won’t happen, but he’s certainly not impossible.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I think the biggest evidence against a Super Mario character is that we didn't get it during the anniversary. Yes, Smash reveals almost never coincide with anniversaries, but considering that Nintendo was planning to throw a big marketing campaign for their star franchise on their anniversary, and add one of their characters in Super Smash Bros., which would put a ton of eyes on the franchise, why would they decide to not have them coincide and instead reveal them an entire year later?

 

[Theguy123]

I disagree. It still markets itself as a Mario game, and we'd get annoying oddities like Luigi either no longer being considered a Mario character or not being considered a Luigi's Mansion character within Super Smash Bros.

EDIT: I'd be fine with them adding both Professor E. Gadd and King Boo (in fact, they'd both probably be my jam), but they should be considered Mario characters.

Problem with this though is that king boo and E gadd originated in a Luigi game and not a Mario game. It feels confusing and a bit weird to stick a Luigi rep in the mario slot.

Luigi’s had enough games now to Warrant his own slot.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

fair enough with the daisy argument but the rosalina comparison doesn’t hold up because rosalina gives mario the spin move so she can probably already do it and she’s a goddes who can use her wand to do things so her move set was based around what she’d be able to do with it. Not to mention she uses the Luma’s which are hers and come from the game she originates in and uses the launch star from the game she originates in so the rosalina comparison doesn’t hold up

It still means that mostly every move is made up with things associated with her rather than things she actually did, which Waluigi could easily match given the plethora of events he’s been a part of.

Besides, lanky limbs, whacky personality and a penchant for cheating. Movesets have been made with less so I don’t get why people get their knots twisted when a character occasionally plays tennis instead of scrimblo bimbloing his way to the flaggoalend.

Problem with this though is that king boo and E gadd originated in a Luigi game and not a Mario game. It feels confusing and a bit weird to stick a Luigi rep in the mario slot.

Luigi’s had enough games now to Warrant his own slot.

King Boo and E. Gadd both also appeared in various other games, not in the least in Super Mario Sunshine. If Geno, Paper Mario and Dr. Mario can all carry the Mushroom symbol, King Boo can too.

 

[Theguy123]

It still means that mostly every move is made up with things associated with her rather than things she actually did, which Waluigi could easily match given the plethora of events he’s been a part of.

Besides, lanky limbs, whacky personality and a penchant for cheating. Movesets have been made with less so I don’t get why people get their knots twisted when a character occasionally plays tennis instead of scrimblo bimbloing his way to the flaggoalend.



King Boo and E. Gadd both also appeared in various other games, not in the least in Super Mario Sunshine. If Geno, Paper Mario and Dr. Mario can all carry the Mushroom symbol, King Boo can too.

the difference being geno, paper Mario and dr mario all first appeared in a Mario game. King boo and E gadd first appeared in a Luigi game.

there’s a massive difference