Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SMAASH! Puppy]

A more helpful point of view. Though now I'm questioning why it is an item that would be more suited for FE than for other series, such as Zelda.

Well...as a tactical RPG, Fire Emblem does have a butt ton of characters that they could add much like Pokémon, but I believe a better answer would simply be that other series don't really have an item that summons other characters (beyond a small group or individual like Blades or Epona). For a comparative example, Fire Emblem fans would get more mileage out of Braidablik (or however you spell it) than Xenoblade Chronicles fans out of Core Crystals since Braidablik can summon literally anyone within the series while Core Crystals can only summon Blades from Xenoblade Chronicles 2.

To my knowledge, the only item that could match Braidablik in terms of scope within this niche (EDIT: other than the Poké Ball) would be the Dream Rod, since while it only summons Dream Friends in the original game, that's a pretty wide scope of important characters, and it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to say that it can summon whoever.

EDIT EDIT: As for which item would be better: Braidablik, or Dream Rod (or any other similar item that I don't know about)? I don't think there's really an objective answer.

 

[BlondeLombax]

EDIT EDIT: As for which item would be better: Braidablik, or Dream Rod (or any other similar item that I don't know about)? I don't think there's really an objective answer.

How about Einherjar? They're cards that can take on the shape of most any named character in the series. I always sort of saw them as a potential summoning item for Fire Emblem.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

This conversation has made me wonder what other items we could have that have a summoning theme. Here's what I came up with:

• Pal Pill
  • Creates 8 8-bit versions of the character that form a circle around them. While there are 8 of them visually, there are functionally only 4 due to the gameplay being 2D only. The Pal Pills will mimic the movements of the character that summoned them, dealing damage to whomever they touch. They can also clash with attacks, but doing so causes them to die and disappear.
  • The main draw here is just the 8-bit characters to be honest.
• Double Cherry
  • Creates a double of the character. Now they are the Ice Climbers. If they already were the Ice Climbers, this duplicate’s the climber that picked up the item. The double disappears after taking enough damage.
  • You cannot pick up this item if it is already active on you.
  • This item isn’t currently feasible in general.
• Character Barrel
  • Like a normal barrel, but it summons Diddy Kong, Dixie Kong, or Cranky Kong when broken. The Kongs will hop on the shoulders of whoever broke the barrel, and use their signature abilities:
    • Diddy Kong shoots his Peanut Popgun whenever you use your Neutral Special.
    • Dixie Kong gives you an extra jump.
    • Cranky Kong does his pogo cane thing when you press down in the air.
  • The Kongs die and disappear when you take enough damage.
• Dream Rod
  • Summons a random Dream Friend. They act on their own accord for the most part similar to an Assist Trophy, but you can interact with them via Friend Abilities. For example, if you hit Rick while he’s using the Stone ability with an ice attack, or one of Inkling’s ink based attacks, you can power him up and send him flying across the stage. You can also hold up, and the Dream Friend will try to activate a Friend Ability.
• Breidablik
  • An item similar to Assist Trophies that summons Fire Emblem characters. Unlike Assist Trophies, this has multiple charges. However, the summons are typically less dangerous.
• Telly Spawner
  • Spawns Tellys at a rapid pace that have low health, but constantly move toward the nearest fighter, dealing contact damage.
• Core Crystals
  • Summons a Blade that enhances your attacks in a similar fashion to Arsene, but each weapon class throws out different hitboxes. You also get a meter that allows you to use Blade Specials when you do a Smash Attack input.
• Summon Materia
  • Basically what’s on the Midgar stage, but none of the summons can warp the stage like they can on Midgar (for example, causing a giant current to appear is possible, but cutting the stage in half or moving the semi-solid platforms is not).
• Mob Spawner
  • Spawns in hostile mobs like Spiders, Zombies, and Creepers that attack everyone until destroyed.
  • If that sounds bad to you, then you could alternatively make it like a crate that summons mobs to attack everyone else after being thrown.

How about Einherjar? They're cards that can take on the shape of most any named character in the series. I always sort of saw them as a potential summoning item for Fire Emblem.

Eh. It sounds like it's 6 to the half dozen of the other. The only reason I can think of that you'd want one over the other is if you added Kiran, but still want a Fire Emblem summon item.

 

[Schnee117]

How about Einherjar? They're cards that can take on the shape of most any named character in the series. I always sort of saw them as a potential summoning item for Fire Emblem.

Einherjar basically got phased out and aren't relevant to the series at the moment

Briedablik covers more characters due to Heroes being a long running gacha and could also allow for fun stuff like summoning Christmas Bernadetta with her magic house or one of the many Gods in the series like Ashera petrifying foes or even a Legendary version of one of the Protagonists.

It's also a gun.

This conversation has made me wonder what other items we could have that have a summoning theme. Here's what I came up with:

• Pal Pill
  • Creates 8 8-bit versions of the character that form a circle around them. While there are 8 of them visually, there are functionally only 4 due to the gameplay being 2D only. The Pal Pills will mimic the movements of the character that summoned them, dealing damage to whomever they touch. They can also clash with attacks, but doing so causes them to die and disappear.
  • The main draw here is just the 8-bit characters to be honest.
• Double Cherry
  • Creates a double of the character. Now they are the Ice Climbers. If they already were the Ice Climbers, this duplicate’s the climber that picked up the item. The double disappears after taking enough damage.
  • You cannot pick up this item if it is already active on you.
  • This item isn’t currently feasible in general.
• Character Barrel
  • Like a normal barrel, but it summons Diddy Kong, Dixie Kong, or Cranky Kong when broken. The Kongs will hop on the shoulders of whoever broke the barrel, and use their signature abilities:
    • Diddy Kong shoots his Peanut Popgun whenever you use your Neutral Special.
    • Dixie Kong gives you an extra jump.
    • Cranky Kong does his pogo cane thing when you press down in the air.
  • The Kongs die and disappear when you take enough damage.
• Dream Rod
  • Summons a random Dream Friend. They act on their own accord for the most part similar to an Assist Trophy, but you can interact with them via Friend Abilities. For example, if you hit Rick while he’s using the Stone ability with an ice attack, or one of Inkling’s ink based attacks, you can power him up and send him flying across the stage. You can also hold up, and the Dream Friend will try to activate a Friend Ability.
• Breidablik
  • An item similar to Assist Trophies that summons Fire Emblem characters. Unlike Assist Trophies, this has multiple charges. However, the summons are typically less dangerous.
• Telly Spawner
  • Spawns a stupid number of Tellys that have low health, but constantly move toward the nearest fighter, dealing contact damage.
• Core Crystals
  • Summons a Blade that enhances your attacks in a similar fashion to Arsene, but each weapon class throws out different hitboxes. You also get a meter that allows you to use Blade Specials when you do a Smash Attack input.
• Summon Materia
  • Basically what’s on the Midgar stage, but none of the summons can warp the stage like they can on Midgar (for example, causing a giant current to appear is possible, but cutting it in half or moving the semi-solid platforms is not.
• Mob Spawner
  • Spawns in hostile mobs like Spiders, Zombies, and Creepers that attack everyone until destroyed.
  • If that sounds bad to you, then you could alternatively make it like a crate that summons mobs to attack everyone else after being thrown.

Eh. It sounds like it's 6 to the half dozen of the other. The only reason I can think of that you'd want one over the other is if you added Kiran, but still want a Fire Emblem summon item.

DK's summon should be an Animal Buddy crate with a defined summon the moment it spawns so if Rambi is on the box you'll get Rambi but if it's Espresso or Enguarde, then it's them

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Briedablik covers more characters due to Heroes being a long running gacha and could also allow for fun stuff like summoning Christmas Bernadetta with her magic house or one of the many Gods in the series like Ashera petrifying foes or even a Legendary version of one of the Protagonists.

spit takes

I hadn't considered the holiday/seasonal variants. While I don't think they'd add them, it would be hilarious.

DK's summon should be an Animal Buddy crate with a defined summon the moment it spawns so if Rambi is on the box you'll get Rambi but if it's Espresso or Enguarde, then it's them

Eh probably. I had actually considered the idea but went with the Character Barrels instead since I could explain them better. I do like the Animal Buddies concept better though (EDIT: I don't remember what most of them do).

Poor Enguarde would get robbed though since most stages don't have water so he'd be like Goldeen most of the time, and mostly just a match stalling tool whenever you can use him.

 

[Schnee117]

spit takes

I hadn't considered the holiday/seasonal variants. While I don't think they'd add them, it would be hilarious.


Eh probably. I had actually considered the idea but went with the Character Barrels instead since I could explain them better. I do like the Animal Buddies concept better though (EDIT: I don't remember what most of them do).

Poor Enguarde would get robbed though since most stages don't have water so he'd be like Goldeen most of the time, and mostly just a match stalling tool whenever you can use him.

I think they can take liberties with Enguarde and have them float in mid air for the sake of having them charge across the stage a few times, Kyogre is just fine out of water for example, Goldeen's just the joke summon

Honestly I don't know why it's Goldeen doing Splash, that's Magikarp's thing and you could have it evolve into an enraged Gyarados if hit enough times.

 

[Goombaic]

Poor Enguarde would get robbed though since most stages don't have water so he'd be like Goldeen most of the time, and mostly just a match stalling tool whenever you can use him.

Alternatively:

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I think they can take liberties with Enguarde and have them float in mid air for the sake of having them charge across the stage a few times, Kyogre is just fine out of water for example, Goldeen's just the joke summon

I don't think that would make much sense since there's no precedent for flying Engarde. Granted it doesn't really make sense for the aquatic Pokémon either, but they are at least magical creatures.

Honestly I don't know why it's Goldeen doing Splash, that's Magikarp's thing and you could have it evolve into an enraged Gyarados if hit enough times.

My best guess would be that it's a reference to the anime where Misty throws it out even though there wasn't enough water for it to battle in order to bide time for Ash.

 

[Idon]

How about Einherjar? They're cards that can take on the shape of most any named character in the series. I always sort of saw them as a potential summoning item for Fire Emblem.

That's a specific side bonus thing of Awakening whereas the Breidalbilk does the same thing, looks goofy, and is still relevant.

 

[Schnee117]

I don't think that would make much sense since there's no precedent for flying Engarde. Granted it doesn't really make sense for the aquatic Pokémon either, but they are at least magical creatures.


My best guess would be that it's a reference to the anime where Misty throws it out even though there wasn't enough water for it to battle in order to bide time for Ash.

The lack of precedent is why it's a liberty in this scenario. I don't think it's too egregious to let Enguarde actually function there.

 

[DarthEnderX]

This conversation has made me wonder what other items we could have that have a summoning theme.

I just want Boss Trophies. So it's not just Rathalos, but also, they're separate, like the Master Ball.

 

[ArkSPiTFirE]

So this question has probably been asked before but who’s is everyone’s top 5 safe picks (picks that are highly likely) for the last spot.

I don't know about safe, but i've been doing a lot of analysis on who's left. Also from a business perspective, I feel like the last pass will be first party. So with that in mind, here are my top 5. I feel they have to be from this list if I was going to choose.

1. Isaac/Felix (Golden Sun)
2. Waluigi (Mario/Misc)
3. Zelda Newcomer (Either one of the assists or something new like Impa)
4. Paper Mario (Paper Mario)
5. Pokémon Gen 8 (Can't even decide who)

Pokémon only barely makes the list, because I feel like they already have a lot going against it in the form of Ultimate already having a rep, and a Sw/Sh spirit event. But it's also the biggest franchise in the world, and it's Nintendo we're dealing with. I really hope its not the case.

Mario did also get a rep in Ultimate, but I feel Paper Mario is different enough to warrant a fighters pass for the franchise. Waluigi has way less going for him, and the assist trophy doesn't do him any favours. I'm only keeping him on because fan demand could still play a factor and it'd be a hilarious way to end.

I'm a bit biased but Golden Sun is the most likely unrepresented first party franchise. Isaac's popularity skyrocketed before the assist essentially deconfirmed him, so I'm hoping Nintendo caught onto that and will give Golden Sun its second chance, like ARMS.

 

[Gengar84]

What’s up with everyone still predicting Ryu Hyabusa? I thought his developers basically deconfirmed him a while ago in an interview. Did something change recently that makes him likely again?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

What’s up with everyone still predicting Ryu Hyabusa? I thought his developers basically deconfirmed him a while ago in an interview. Did something change recently that makes him likely again?

The people predicting him either want him like how every top 5 safest picks list has at least one of their most wanted on there or believe that the interviews mean nothing as realistically, nobody would say "Yeah they're in"

 

[BlondeLombax]

What’s up with everyone still predicting Ryu Hyabusa? I thought his developers basically deconfirmed him a while ago in an interview. Did something change recently that makes him likely again?

I was wondering that, too. Normally when the company themselves say it isn't happening, that's the final nail in the coffin. It seems like the Denial is present as it's ever been at this point.

As for my "Safe Picks..."

Spoiler: Expletive, don't open if you don't like bad words

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

Lowkey I think Magnus from Kid Icarus Uprising might be our final fighter.

He would fit the "disappointing final fighter" that Nintendo likes to do due to being another Kid Icarus fighter (which people had problems with back in Smash 4) and he's an anime swordsmen.

In addition, his assist trophy is strangely absent despite being one of the most notable and popular Kid Icarus characters and one of his lines refers to him being late, which would be perfect in Smash as he would be the final fighter because he's late.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

I think it would be ironic in a way.

Pokemon is a huge series. The highest grossing media franchise of all time to be exact. While one can argue (which I can agree with to an extent) that any Smash reveal is a big reveal, Nintendo would easily think that Pokemon would be treated as such a universal "LETS GOOOOOO" kind of reveal due to the series' mass popularity, and thus, they'd assume that they were able to end off the DLC on a high note for many people. However, it seems that most people would prefer if this WASN'T the outcome for the final fighter.

 

[ArkSPiTFirE]

I think it would be ironic in a way.

Pokemon is a huge series. The highest grossing media franchise of all time to be exact. While one can argue (which I can agree with to an extent) that any Smash reveal is a big reveal, Nintendo would easily think that Pokemon would be treated as such a universal "LETS GOOOOOO" kind of reveal due to the series' mass popularity, and thus, they'd assume that they were able to end off the DLC on a high note for many people. However, it seems that most people would prefer if this WASN'T the outcome for the final fighter.

Yes! I hate that I can predict this scenario happening. By all accounts that I usually write off characters, Pokémon shouldn't get a mention, but I just can't write it off.

I don't hate the series even if I did pass on Sw/Sh, but I really don't need more of it in Smash right now.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Yes! I hate that I can predict this scenario happening. By all accounts that I usually write off characters, Pokémon shouldn't get a mention, but I just can't write it off.

I don't hate the series even if I did pass on Sw/Sh, but I really don't need more of it in Smash right now.

I feel ya dude lol

Can't wait for people to watch the reveal like

 

[osby]

Lowkey I think Magnus from Kid Icarus Uprising might be our final fighter.

He would fit the "disappointing final fighter" that Nintendo likes to do due to being another Kid Icarus fighter (which people had problems with back in Smash 4) and he's an anime swordsmen.

In addition, his assist trophy is strangely absent despite being one of the most notable and popular Kid Icarus characters and one of his lines refers to him being late, which would be perfect in Smash as he would be the final fighter because he's late.

Correlation does not imply causation. Nintendo isn't choosing final characters specifically to be disappointing.

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Correlation does not imply causation. Nintendo isn't choosing final characters specifically to be disappointing.

All things considered it's a business decision. It's no surprise Smash Ultimate started off strong with characters like Ridley and King K. Rool, too fan favourite titans in the Smash community and ended off with Isabelle and Incineroar, popular characters but standing nothing to the previous characters in terms of uh wantedness? Not sure that'd a word lol.

The pre-orders must have been coming in hot after E3 of 2018 instead of saving the big fan favourites for last. The same also applies for DLC. Had Byleth been the first DLC fighter revealed, I'd imagine there would be less inclination to buy the season pass as there was when Mr. Popular Joker who was as unexpected as he was unknowingly popular (if Persona had a stronger Nintendo connection, I could see him being a popular fan request before well... he broke down those expectations.)

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Keep in mind that there are folks who haven't even bought the whole pass let alone any of the FP2 characters individually. Some people wait for ALL the reveals to happen and THEN depending on what they like and don't like, they may make a purchase. Ergo, this final character will still play a role financially, if that makes sense.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Lowkey I think Magnus from Kid Icarus Uprising might be our final fighter.

He would fit the "disappointing final fighter" that Nintendo likes to do due to being another Kid Icarus fighter (which people had problems with back in Smash 4) and he's an anime swordsmen.

In addition, his assist trophy is strangely absent despite being one of the most notable and popular Kid Icarus characters and one of his lines refers to him being late, which would be perfect in Smash as he would be the final fighter because he's late.

I don't think Magnus really fits in line with how Nintendo chooses their own characters. Two things that Byleth, Min Min and Pyra/Mythra have in common is that they are currently Nintendo's newest characters and they all debuted on the Nintendo Switch. Going back to the Kid Icarus series which was last on the 3DS in 2012 would be a pretty bizarre and unlikely move for Nintendo. Being disappointing and having his assist trophy gone don't feel like compelling arguments when you could say the same for Saki Amamiya.

 

[osby]

Keep in mind that there are folks who haven't even bought the whole pass let alone any of the FP2 characters individually. Some people wait for ALL the reveals to happen and THEN depending on what they like and don't like, they may make a purchase. Ergo, this final character will still play a role financially, if that makes sense.

I mean, all characters play a financial role as they need to sell themselves for individual purchases. Even with Byleth, I don't think Nintendo was completely counting on people to buy them as a part of pass 1 but also as a character from the hot new Switch game.

Hence, I don't think our final character will be some random nobody except people will treat them like that out of salt

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

I don't think Magnus really fits in line with how Nintendo chooses their own characters. Two things that Byleth, Min Min and Pyra/Mythra have in common is that they are currently Nintendo's newest characters and they all debuted on the Nintendo Switch. Going back to the Kid Icarus series which was last on the 3DS in 2012 would be a pretty bizarre and unlikely move for Nintendo. Being disappointing and having his assist trophy gone don't feel like compelling arguments when you could say the same for Saki Amamiya.

The 3DS/Wii U era kinda had a last hurrah with Inkling, Isabelle and Incineroar in the launch roster and DLC is definitely taking advantage of Nintendo's Switch era for characters.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Lowkey I think Magnus from Kid Icarus Uprising might be our final fighter.

He would fit the "disappointing final fighter" that Nintendo likes to do due to being another Kid Icarus fighter (which people had problems with back in Smash 4) and he's an anime swordsmen.

In addition, his assist trophy is strangely absent despite being one of the most notable and popular Kid Icarus characters and one of his lines refers to him being late, which would be perfect in Smash as he would be the final fighter because he's late.

Complaints about KI bias disappeared for Ultimate's base game as it lost quite a bit of content, like how people yelled Kirby and Star Fox bias in Brawl and then said Sakurai hated those franchises in 4

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Tbh before we get another Kid Icarus character, I'd like to see a remake or a new game. That'd be real sweet.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I actually only have three safe picks

1. Octoling/Off the Hook
2. Phoenix Wright
3. League of Legends champion

I want to say Elma but that ship has sailed, at least for this game

 

[Theguy123]

Here’s my safe predictions

1) a sega rep of any kind

2) professor Layton (it’s a lot safer pick when you actually think about things)

3) a Nintendo rep from one of the 3 companies. Animal crossing, Zelda (hyrule warriors to be specific) or Mario

4) a second atlus rep

5) a second snk rep.

 

[Gengar84]

I actually only have three safe picks

1. Octoling/Off the Hook
2. Phoenix Wright
3. League of Legends champion

I want to say Elma but that ship has sailed, at least for this game

Do you expect the Octoling to be at least a semiclone of Inkling? If so, I’m not sure if they would want to end the pass off on a character that wasn’t completely original. I’ve never played Splatoon so maybe Octoling has a lot more to offer than I’m imagining, in which case, would be totally fitting as the final DLC. Either way, I think Octoling is a very safe pick for Smash 6 at the very least.

 

[RileyXY1]

Do you expect the Octoling to be at least a semiclone of Inkling? If so, I’m not sure if they would want to end the pass off on a character that wasn’t completely original. I’ve never played Splatoon so maybe Octoling has a lot more to offer than I’m imagining, in which case, would be totally fitting as the final DLC.

I myself only see Octoling getting in as a clone fighter.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

3. League of Legends champion

Ngl I'm surprised you said this as one of your safe picks. I'm definitely open to the idea, but idk...

Would make for a banger of a final challenger pack tho haha
It would be neat if that 4chan leak was right all along

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

Ngl I'm surprised you said this as one of your safe picks. I'm definitely open to the idea, but idk...

Would make for a banger of a final challenger pack tho haha
It would be neat if that 4chan leak was right all along

Rie's safe picks are usually her most wanted.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

Rie's safe picks are usually her most wanted.

Makes sense.

 

[Gengar84]

Rie's safe picks are usually her most wanted.

Same with me although I tend to leave out my pipe dreams like Zegram and Magus. I usually list characters I want a lot that I feel are very underrated in Smash speculation but I believe still have a realistic chance.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

The day a pokemon is the last DLC fighter is the day I finally get to archive smash on my switch

 

[GilTheGreat19]

inb4 they pull a Sm4sh and end it off with a hype character that's also broken af

 

[3BitSaurus]

Ngl I'm surprised you said this as one of your safe picks. I'm definitely open to the idea, but idk...

Would make for a banger of a final challenger pack tho haha
It would be neat if that 4chan leak was right all along

That's pretty much why I don't see it tbh. It just feels like too big of a note to end on, especially since we're probably looking at a Direct reveal.

Sure, you could stretch that it would be close to Worlds 2021, but still... we've never ended on such a big game/series before.

 

[MattX20]

Oh for the love of...if they really wanted a Gen 8 rep, they wouldn't have made a spirit event for Sword and Shield near the end of the Fighter Pass. FE3H had nothing at all until Byleth's reveal, and that's the point people apparently keep forgetting

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I mean yeah they’re my most wanted (well, Phoenix is more a very low key want)

but they also don’t have anything really against them chance wise

I’m just a lil baffled also by everyone putting Hayabusa despite the interview but to each their own I guess