Official DLC Character Discussion Thread - Read the new sticky/announcement

YoshiandToad · Sep 11, 2015

Mask and Mirror said:
Toad isn't a single character though, it's a species, a species with many different representatives across lots of games. There's no definitive Toad personality, and certainly no fighting style associated with them. I'd much rather have, say, Goombella or Vyvian from Paper Mario, to bring a point of difference.

He is now though. I'm still not confident mind.

No personality? If you're talking specifically the guy above;

Nope none at all. He's certainly not on par with the majority of other Mario characters in the game. Hell, Yoshi's my favourite character but personality wise he's what? Hungry and friendly? Captain far outdoes that by being greedy, cowardly, clumsy, lucky, lazy and overall happy and proud.

Not that lacking personality actually stops you getting in the game anyway unless you're trying to tell me every character on the roster at current has incredibly well reknown or defined personalities. Or abilities in some cases.

Similarly; whilst I can somewhat understand Vivian getting a mention when it comes to moveset potential, what does Goombella exactly bring to the table? Footstooling? Guidance quotes?

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

Yes, I agree; I don't like Yoshi much either, but at least he has several of his own games. I don't hate toads by any means, I just think there are many characters higher on the list, including lots of Mario reps. Captain Toad is a different issue. I still don't rate his chances highly, but at least he's a specific character.

I'd go for Vivian too. Goombella's probably not a good idea, as you say, but I mentioned her because she's a mushroom with character!

pupNapoleon · Sep 11, 2015

Mask and Mirror said:
Yes, I agree; I don't like Yoshi much either, but at least he has several of his own games. I don't hate toads by any means, I just think there are many characters higher on the list, including lots of Mario reps. Captain Toad is a different issue. I still don't rate his chances highly, but at least he's a specific character.

I'd go for Vivian too. Goombella's probably not a good idea, as you say, but I mentioned her because she's a mushroom with character!

I think there just... has to be some level of implied video game history.

Toad is packed with Game history. Vivian is... well... who knows? I honestly do not.

Kenith · Sep 11, 2015

The only way I could see them adding Vivian into the game is if she's one of Paper Mario's "partner" summons if he gets in.
Otherwise she has a very, very, very low chance.

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

I only cited her as an example, though I originally thought of her because I thought she'd provide an original playstyle, which is important too. Paper Mario would be one of my top choices though.

And again, all of those toads are different individuals. I can't think of many toads that appear in more than one game definitively. Again, I don't hate them, but they're background characters, like Piantas or Goombas, and if they were to put one in the game, it'd have to be a particular one.

Kenith · Sep 11, 2015

Mask and Mirror said:
I only cited her as an example, though I originally thought of her because I thought she'd provide an original playstyle, which is important too. Paper Mario would be one of my top choices though.

And again, all of those toads are different individuals. I can't think of many toads that appear in more than one game definitively. Again, I don't hate them, but they're background characters, like Piantas or Goombas, and if they were to put one in the game, it'd have to be a particular one.

No...there's a specific Toad that appears in many games in the Mario series. He is the THE Toad. In Japan he even has a different name from the generic Toads.

Wolfie557 · Sep 11, 2015

I want Medusa in, but I don't think she will be DLC because it will take a lot of resources to animate and make her hair and everything properly plus she isn't a popular choice, like, at all. :/ oh well.

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

KenithTheGatherer said:
No...there's a specific Toad that appears in many games in the Mario series. He is the THE Toad. In Japan he even has a different name from the generic Toads.

Is that true? Most of the games starring toads contain many of several colours without naming any of them. I guess the western Mario 2 and the cartoon show qualify, but what games in particular are specific about him? I'm especially interested if the specific toad you mention has been a character in more recent games but has been left out of the western release?

memoryman3 · Sep 11, 2015

KenithTheGatherer said:
Um...okay. Sure.
In that case, so is Daisy, who's been in the series for longer and actually did appear in a platformer (and is more popular)
Should she get the shaft over Waluigi?

Well she DID get shafted in Mario Maker in favour of him. But more costume DLC was confirmed anyways....

Zerp · Sep 11, 2015

Sorry if I'm derailing the current topic a bit, but, out of curiosity, since I rarely see discussion on this character, how many of you would find it to be deserving or undeserving?

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gi7AkzeKJBERbBeegrrYlk0F6L8tKpzN6ioRK1GU+AqC7i1BLYjxFIivtq09OmRnR1cmFbaTuvr0GD65eFSQzD5hUeHXl/qF3U22wH6Vxyrv7Q3UfTG68Oc3Ol7EAJhu+LLx+05ilO7oq7wutIK4GDgYLp7lapWKs97ZqyHepThwFBQ0rldk/X4eoLm9pJ7p12eKAXL9VX6nJ8l/1BKK/9bco/Q84THWGOh61kwAAAABJRU5ErkJggg==

The character's the main antagonist for 3 Kirby games, each of these not receiving any representation in Smash outside of music, and is heavily implied to have counterparts

Dark Mind and Dark Crafter

which were also final bosses, a fellow member of it's species

Dark Nebula/Zero

which was also a final boss,and is also implied to influence another,

Magolor

.Now obviously, the character has little to no chance due to low support (which I'll never understand, he's basically the K. Rool for Kirby and is pretty popular among Kirby fans), but what I want to know here is how many would regard the character as deserving, regardless of whether or not you personally want the character. All-star material, yea or nay?

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

Maybe sometime in the future, but unlikely yet. I'm not a DK fan, so K. Rool doesn't interest me particularly, but I think he's more likely even though I think Kirby is a much more worthy series.

Deleted member · Sep 11, 2015

Zero Soul said:
Sorry if I'm derailing the current topic a bit, but, out of curiosity, since I rarely see discussion on this character, how many of you would find it to be deserving or undeserving?

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gi7AkzeKJBERbBeegrrYlk0F6L8tKpzN6ioRK1GU+AqC7i1BLYjxFIivtq09OmRnR1cmFbaTuvr0GD65eFSQzD5hUeHXl/qF3U22wH6Vxyrv7Q3UfTG68Oc3Ol7EAJhu+LLx+05ilO7oq7wutIK4GDgYLp7lapWKs97ZqyHepThwFBQ0rldk/X4eoLm9pJ7p12eKAXL9VX6nJ8l/1BKK/9bco/Q84THWGOh61kwAAAABJRU5ErkJggg==

The character's the main antagonist for 3 Kirby games, each of these not receiving any representation in Smash outside of music, and is heavily implied to have counterparts

Dark Mind and Dark Crafter

which were also final bosses, a fellow member of it's species

Dark Nebula/Zero

which was also a final boss,and is also implied to influence another,

Magolor

.Now obviously, the character has little to no chance due to low support (which I'll never understand, he's basically the K. Rool for Kirby and is pretty popular among Kirby fans), but what I want to know here is how many would regard the character as deserving, regardless of whether or not you personally want the character. All-star material, yea or nay?

Dark Mind and Dark Crafter have no confirmed connection to Dark Matter. Nor does Magolor.
There may be some similarities, but it is just a recurring theme among Kirby villains.

I wouldn't really go out of the way to call Dark Matter the "K. Rool" of the series, either. It was important for the "Dark Matter Trilogy" (of which Zero/02 is the true villain and the Dark Matter are merely entities he spawns from himself), but hasn't been plot-relevant in a majority of the series, being overall the third main antagonist the series had (Dedede and Nightmare came first), with Squeak Squad being the first time since the trilogy that Dark Matter was part of the plot through Dark Nebula (and even then, it's status as "main villain" is rather debatable considering the events of the game).

That's not to say that Dark Matter isn't iconic as a Kirby villain. It's probably one of the most iconic ones solely because it has appeared more than once while no other nightmarish final boss (except Magolor, but he's not a nightmarish villain normally) has. But it doesn't really belong as a Smash fighter any more than say, Nightmare or Marx.

AncientTobacco · Sep 11, 2015

KenithTheGatherer said:
No...there's a specific Toad that appears in many games in the Mario series. He is the THE Toad.

Yeah, apparently. Though it's often unclear whether it's him or just a generic Toad. What we do know is that Captain Toad is a separate character.

KenithTheGatherer said:
In Japan he even has a different name from the generic Toads.

False. The Toad species as a whole is callled Mushroom People or something, but individual Toads, including "the Toad" are all "Kinopio".

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

Thanks for that, my Elizabethan friend. There are specific Toads; Toadsworth, Captain Toad, to mention two of very, very many with vastly varying personalities. Even the Toads in the original super Mario Bros are different. Toad isn't a dreadful idea, but they're not by definition a specific character

Verde Coeden Scalesworth · Sep 11, 2015

Kinopio is the only name of the main Toad in Japan. He doesn't have another name at all.

The generic Toad is also referred to as Kinoko-tachi or Kinoko-ichizoku.

The "main" Toad's first official appearance is Super Mario Bros. 2 USA. He's also the same one in the Mario Karts, Parties, and pretty much the playable one in most of the the various games. However, Captain Toad, as said above, is a different Toad as well. Besides the Paper Mario-related Toads(and others that have appeared), Toadette and Toadsworth are the only other notable Toads at all. There's 4 unique ones among the regular games right now, and the rest are generic species.

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

They're all unique, aren't they? That 'main' Toad then, is not in many games, and doesn't get much of a developed personality. He's little different to the Koopa Troopa that appears in Mario Kart in that sense. His appearance in Mario 2 USA is the only thing that sets him apart, and for Japanese audiences, that's fairly obscure. Tatanga is a more likely rep than him

Kirby Dragons · Sep 11, 2015

Zero Soul said:
Sorry if I'm derailing the current topic a bit, but, out of curiosity, since I rarely see discussion on this character, how many of you would find it to be deserving or undeserving?

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gi7AkzeKJBERbBeegrrYlk0F6L8tKpzN6ioRK1GU+AqC7i1BLYjxFIivtq09OmRnR1cmFbaTuvr0GD65eFSQzD5hUeHXl/qF3U22wH6Vxyrv7Q3UfTG68Oc3Ol7EAJhu+LLx+05ilO7oq7wutIK4GDgYLp7lapWKs97ZqyHepThwFBQ0rldk/X4eoLm9pJ7p12eKAXL9VX6nJ8l/1BKK/9bco/Q84THWGOh61kwAAAABJRU5ErkJggg==

The character's the main antagonist for 3 Kirby games, each of these not receiving any representation in Smash outside of music, and is heavily implied to have counterparts

Dark Mind and Dark Crafter

which were also final bosses, a fellow member of it's species

Dark Nebula/Zero

which was also a final boss,and is also implied to influence another,

Magolor

.Now obviously, the character has little to no chance due to low support (which I'll never understand, he's basically the K. Rool for Kirby and is pretty popular among Kirby fans), but what I want to know here is how many would regard the character as deserving, regardless of whether or not you personally want the character. All-star material, yea or nay?

Given that Sakurai doesn't want to add a whole lot of Kirby characters, I don't see him making it in at any point.

If we're talking Kirby villains and their deservingness, there are Bonkers and Bugzzy. Both are reoccurring midbosses throughout the Kirby series. They may be worthy, yet, I don't see them making it either, as Bonkers is a Smash Run enemy, and we already have Dedede as a hammer user. Bugzzy likely wouldn't make it without Bonkers getting in first.

Overall, there may be deserving Kirby villains, but none are likely at this point.

WeirdChillFever · Sep 11, 2015

Kirby Dragons said:
Given that Sakurai doesn't want to add a whole lot of Kirby characters, I don't see him making it in at any point.

If we're talking Kirby villains, there are Bonkers and Bugzzy. Both are reoccurring midbosses throughout the Kirby series. Yet, I don't see them making it either, as Bonkers is a Smash Run enemy, and we already have Dedede as a hammer user. Bugzzy likely wouldn't make it without Bonkers getting in first.

Overall, there aren't any Kirby villains likely at this point.

I have one.
His name begins with Mag and ends with Olor.

It's Magolor

Kirby Dragons · Sep 11, 2015

WeirdChillFever said:
I have one.
His name begins with Mag and ends with Olor.

It's Magolor

Considering he's only had 1.5 major roles in a video game, I personally don't see him happening either.

aldelaro5 · Sep 11, 2015

YoshiandToad said:
He is now though. I'm still not confident mind.

No personality? If you're talking specifically the guy above;

Nope none at all. He's certainly not on par with the majority of other Mario characters in the game. Hell, Yoshi's my favourite character but personality wise he's what? Hungry and friendly? Captain far outdoes that by being greedy, cowardly, clumsy, lucky, lazy and overall happy and proud.

Not that lacking personality actually stops you getting in the game anyway unless you're trying to tell me every character on the roster at current has incredibly well reknown or defined personalities. Or abilities in some cases.

Similarly; whilst I can somewhat understand Vivian getting a mention when it comes to moveset potential, what does Goombella exactly bring to the table? Footstooling? Guidance quotes?

I never actually got the requests for vivian and goombella tbh because first, why put them on their own instead of wanting paper mario that has them? (partners weren't really made to be a full characters.......they just have a couple of moves).

And the tattle btw is more something that I think is an easter egg more than anything.......

though, you could put a specilal footstoll gimmick on paper mario, but you also get the idea that it's not just that

Sabrewulf238 · Sep 11, 2015

aldelaro5 said:
I never actually got the requests for vivian and goombella tbh because first, why put them on their own instead of wanting paper mario that has them? (partners weren't really made to be a full characters.......they just have a couple of moves).

And the tattle btw is more something that I think is an easter egg more than anything.......

though, you could put a specilal footstoll gimmick on paper mario, but you also get the idea that it's not just that

I imagine it has something to do with not wanting three Marios. Although personally I prefer Vivian to Paper Mario.

(Although I would prefer Fawful to Vivian)

aldelaro5 · Sep 11, 2015

Sabrewulf238 said:
I imagine it has something to do with not wanting three Marios. Although personally I prefer Vivian to Paper Mario.

(Although I would prefer Fawful to Vivian)

I just question the practicality of it.

Just ptoential you have a problem because evivian does have couple of moves, if you try to make a moveset, jsut good luck finding a unique playstyle. It's just......much harder to do than it should.

While as paper mario it;s not only easy to find mvoes, but it also can be on a playstyle that actually improves the diversity AND can include vivian if well done.

So, no matter how mario paper mario is (which I think has become a bit less applicable since paper jam tbh), I still don;t see the point of putting vivan over......

also, from a paper mario repping perspective, this hardly make sense to me......

Like, I;ll just never get why.....

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

Paper Mario would be so obviously different from the other two Marios, but another Paper Mario character would have the bonus of not having three Mario's. I really think the Paper Mario franchise should have a rep though

Sabrewulf238 · Sep 11, 2015

Honestly as much as I like Vivian I always thought her body would pose a problem for Smash Bros. If she jumps in her original game her body (shadow?) stretches. So I don't know how they would make her body work for Smash when she's going to have to be flying all over the place.

Mask and Mirror · Sep 11, 2015

Slinking into the scenery like an inkling would be awesome. I know what you mean, though. She'd take some work, but then, so did Ryu. What rep do you think would be the best for Paper Mario, besides the main character?

Burruni · Sep 11, 2015

The conversation to have a partner from Paper Mario instead of the main man himself... it... boggles me.

It's on par of saying we should have get Rush or Beat instead of

, a Pikmin instead of

, or Slippy & Peppy before

&

.

Paper Mario is the namesake, face of, and protagonist of the entire series. Outside of cameos, no partner has had a role past their home game. Not only that, the last game to include the true partner system is over a decade old.

We have no case of someone getting into Smash before the protagonist of their series... because the protagonist is most often the far more iconic, long-lasting, and often more popular as well as fleshed out character.

If we were to have to go outside of Paper Mario for a character, I'd have to say Paper Bowser actually has interesting potential.
He'd share his iconic flame breath with his other self, possibly the general spinning in his shell for a down-special, but otherwise?

Kloopa Klown Kopter for a limited flight recovery, usage of the Star Rod for either a temporary buff like

's deep breathing or a projectile, any of the Pixl buddies, assists like Kammy or paperized minions of the Koopa army (which, being "flat" characters like

or

's wild gunmen should keep them fairly low for system pressure) and of course the idea of having his Final Smash turning into the Shiny Bowser final boss fight from Sticker Star.

And, ironically, he'd share more of that grounds to the basic attack moveset of

Bowser which would be interesting to help "preserve the old playstyle" that people say that they see in

.

Though his flaily arms have to be his dash attack akin to

's.

CrusherMania1592 · Sep 11, 2015

Bowserlick said:
How about Yes, Tingle is going to visit you in your sleep, snuggle up to you with his butt in your face, and throw glitter all over the sheets. Your mom will come into the room and see two people in the covers with a string rising upwards, out of the tangle of cloth and bodies, ending in a red balloon.

Sorry, I don't do men in onepiece outfits. That's just ****ing creepy

There are FAR more characters from Zelda who deserves to make the cut over Tingle

Bradli Wartooth · Sep 11, 2015

What's all this fuss about having to be specific? Doesn't Villager exist? A general villager to represent the millions of different ones out there?

EDIT: This was at the Toad argument. I got tired of reading and scrolled straight to the bottom to add my two-cents, only to realize that the Toad conversation fizzled out.

PIXLEsauce · Sep 11, 2015

Bradli Wartooth said:
What's all this fuss about having to be specific? Doesn't Villager exist? A general villager to represent the millions of different ones out there?

EDIT: This was at the Toad argument. I got tired of reading and scrolled straight to the bottom to add my two-cents, only to realize that the Toad conversation fizzled out.

Not that anyone cares but Robin is also a nonspecific avatar character

Kirby Dragons · Sep 11, 2015

Burruni said:
We have no case of someone getting into Smash before the protagonist of their series... because the protagonist is most often the far more iconic, long-lasting, and often more popular as well as fleshed out character.

Yes, we do. Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Pichu, and Mewtwo all got in before the Pokémon Trainer. Then, the trainer got cut.

BluePikmin11 · Sep 11, 2015

Keep spreading the word!

Yomi's Biggest Fan · Sep 11, 2015

WhiteEaglePL said:
I want Medusa in, but I don't think she will be DLC because it will take a lot of resources to animate and make her hair and everything properly plus she isn't a popular choice, like, at all. :/ oh well.

Yep, Hades is considered a better character and more memorable Kid Icarus villain by a long shot. Not even Medusa's classic status would be enough to convince people to view her as any better than the God of Trolling. :/

Cutie Gwen · Sep 11, 2015

I saw Vivian. I expected people to go all tumblr and say 'muh LGBT rep'

Schnee117 · Sep 11, 2015

TehEpicRyuga said:
I saw Vivian. I expected people to go all tumblr and say 'muh LGBT rep'

But

though.
~~Stupid Brianna Wu and her Neo-Feminists~~

Deleted member · Sep 11, 2015

Burruni said:
The conversation to have a partner from Paper Mario instead of the main man himself... it... boggles me.

Two things.
1.

2. There's only one option for a Paper Mario character that isn't Paper Mario....

.....AND HIS NAME IS RAWK HAWK!

(He seriously needs to show up more......)

Kirby Dragons · Sep 11, 2015

BluePikmin11 said:
Keep spreading the word!

inb4 Reckless Safety Man gets the highest score.

G0LD3N L0TUS · Sep 11, 2015

CrusherMania1592 said:
Sorry, I don't do men in onepiece outfits. That's just ****ing creepy

There are FAR more characters from Zelda who deserves to make the cut over Tingle

I think you might be exaggerating. Can you give examples? I can't think of many that compare to Tingle, honestly.

Deleted member · Sep 11, 2015

Kirby Dragons said:
inb4 Reckless Safety Man gets the highest score.

Watch it be someone even more ridiculous.

Putuk · Sep 11, 2015

RegiGiygas117 said:
But though.
~~Stupid Brianna Wu and her Neo-Feminists~~

Goddammit.

Yomi's Biggest Fan · Sep 11, 2015

TehEpicRyuga said:
I saw Vivian. I expected people to go all tumblr and say 'muh LGBT rep'

We already have one in the form of

who can wear whatever he/she wants, even crossdressing in New Leaf. :troll:

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