Croi
Smash Lord
E: nevermind, img tags not working for me I guess?
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Dirtiest Player in the Game - Wario Social Thread
- Thread starter TheReflexWonder
- Start date
Labernash
Smash Lord
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- Sep 10, 2010
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- 1,674
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!i!!!!!bite comes off the tongue easier
get it
off the
oh you guys
Iota
Smash Lord
No matter how many times I look at that gif I don't get it. What's it supposed to mean? =C
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
Question
How's the lucario and sonic match up with wario?
How's the lucario and sonic match up with wario?
Lord Chair
Smash Master
its boring and dumb
Lucario's ridiculous rolls and great range on aerials make him difficult to hit in general. His D-Air makes it hard for us to land a Wario U-Air.
I don't have much experience with Sonic, but I imagine it's something like, "His ground speed is really irritating to deal with."
I don't have much experience with Sonic, but I imagine it's something like, "His ground speed is really irritating to deal with."
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
If you can get in touch with DMG (who's probably played Espy) or Malcolm (who plays Wario and played Sonic), they would probably be able to give you the information you need.
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
Will do thanks.
Just learn the chaingrab and don't run into his moves. It's really not so bad (and definitely worse for Kirby than Wario).
Labernash
Smash Lord
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I just wish he would run into MY attacks. I can't manage to deal the right damage with Wario to even be able to do the chaingrab.
With Kirby, I just do Fthrow > Uair > fthrow > uair > fsmash, for 51%, then bair a bunch for another 50%, then Fsmash to kill him. Chaingrab for me 30%? I'll crouch lasers after that, he approaches, I bair. Utilt > Utilt > bair.
I dunno why, but I struggle fighting Falco with every character. But, it was MUCH easier with Kirby for some reason. Lasers, bair, chaingrabs make it hard for Falco. Two of three of my troubles are gone with Kirby. Atleast, imo.
With Kirby, I just do Fthrow > Uair > fthrow > uair > fsmash, for 51%, then bair a bunch for another 50%, then Fsmash to kill him. Chaingrab for me 30%? I'll crouch lasers after that, he approaches, I bair. Utilt > Utilt > bair.
I dunno why, but I struggle fighting Falco with every character. But, it was MUCH easier with Kirby for some reason. Lasers, bair, chaingrabs make it hard for Falco. Two of three of my troubles are gone with Kirby. Atleast, imo.
Falco SDIs the U-Air and then goes back to running away. The only chaingrab that is reliable...is Wario's. 
Labernash
Smash Lord
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Yeah, that's happened to me a couple times, but I can either run forward and resgrab, or bair, depending on where he SDI's. I mean, who knows the Kirby MU anyway, haha! But, even if he gets away, holding down is a lot less annoying than trying to laser and stuff. He'll get impatient first, he approaches, I can finish the chaingrab. I can atleast Fthrow > Upair > Utilt > Bair. Another bair, they're at 50% again. It just feels easier and safer to me with Kirby.
The Kirby MU thread says Falco is +1 for Kirby, so I like it!
The Kirby MU thread says Falco is +1 for Kirby, so I like it!
Lord Chair
Smash Master
Labernash my boy, your reasoning applied to the Falco-Wario MU:
I just show him I want to time him out from the beginning of the match on the SV platform and then he gets impatient tries to PC boost pivot grab me and I just predict that and uair > nair > air release fsmash him. Then he gets scared and airdodges and then I'll read his airdodge and because my super awesome unescapable-with-SDI combo on the platform got him to roundabout 49% I only have to pummel him twice to get him into chaingrab percentages (he won't mash because he's a bloody wánker) and then I CG him to 120% and instead of fthrowing him then I'll dthrow again because he's going to be afraid of the grab so he'll spotdodge instead of something smart like rolling away (AFTER ALL, SPOTDODGE IS A GRAB COUNTER AMIRIGHT?) and I'll predict the spotdodge and then just fart him for the kill.
I repeat all this twice and proceed to win the match.
There you go folks! If you can decypher everything that's wrong with that scenario I'll brand you with the mark of 'This Man Has Proven Himself Not To Be A Darned Zany' and you can join the brotherhood of 'Lads who somehow have a half decent idea as to what to expect at high level play'.
That's...really surprising to me. I definitely disagree with that matchup ratio (Kirby vs. Falco). Even at worst, but Falco probably wins, IMO.
Labernash
Smash Lord
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I'm not sure what you're trying to say or what I'm supposed to pull out of this. I am a scrub no doubt. But, my combos I listed for Kirby are not theorycraft. That's the Gonzo Combo, and it's legit. Use Gonzo Combo and Bair. Poof, you now know how to use Kirby.
Maybe this can clear some stuff up, although you may not want to read a bunch of mess on a MU for a character you don't play. Anyways, this is from the BBR MU chart thread, which states Kirby vs Falco as a 0:
(Kewwky)
Another character that has never gone below the highest tiers, Falco is one of those characters with the ability to both camp all match then come in for the kill, and play aggressive while staying relatively safe. A well-played Falco will always make it into the higher tourney placings, it’s only a handful of characters that have an edge over Falco, and it’s always for some different reason. Lucky for us, Kirby has some small advantages over Falco! This MU has been debated quite fiercely in the past, people saying it’s Kirby’s advantage, others saying it’s Falco’s slight advantage, and many others supporting the other more even areas. His famous lasers and chaingrab make up most of his metagame, and thanks to Kirby’s light weight, multiple jumps, floatiness and small crouch, we can get around this relatively easy.
One thing you have to know in this MU is that Falco chains his laser into many things. When he lasers while landing, he has no landing lag, so he gets frame advantage even if you shield them. His jab is also fast enough to get him frame advantage, so expect a lot of chaining from lasers and jabs against you. Your goal should be to get yourself somewhere where Falco is forced to commit to a longer-lasting attack, so the air is where you want to be. He has decent aerials, but half of them are multi-hit so you can SDI them and bair him for doing them, and the others won’t hit you if you’re hovering at the right distance (bair and dair are the only single-hit aerials of his, also his aerial movement is slow so uair isn’t something you have to be afraid of). If he jabs you or lasers you from close-up at lower %s, he’s going to dthrow chaingrab you. We only take about 25% from dthrows, but he’ll try and end in a dair or a gatling combo (dash attack + usmash) for an added 10-15% damage, so evading his grabs is a necessity, simply space your rising bairs and you’ll be safe. He’s a fastfaller but the slowest of the space animals, so strings/combos/chains won’t work as much against him as they would against the other two… Once you get him offstage, all you have to do is bair. Dair won’t knock him out of his sideB unless you aim it well, but bair will always knock him away, so stick to bairing him. If he’s below stage-level, a single dair hit will kill him, so if you see him upB’ing towards the ledge, jump after him and dair.
Falco kills with his usmash (boosted usually, its his most surprising smash since he can hit you with hit from long distances), fsmash (has some start-up so you should always know to not jump into his fsmashes, usually Falcos do it as an edgeguard/punish when you’re near them), dsmash (has relatively low range, and usually punishes you for landing near him or rolling into him), and bair (kills at high %s, so don’t worry much about it). He has no killing throws, so if you’re torn between taking a hit or getting grabbed at high %s, you should always choose to get grabbed. If he hits you with a multy-hit aerial while you’re on the ground and at high %s, make sure to buffer a shield so that he can’t kill you! If you’re offstage he can’t do anything to you but laser, and if you’re below stage-level you’re safe from everything, and he risks dying if he jumps down to try and hit you. When aiming for the ledge, don’t upB too high and always go for the lowest sweet-spotting possible, since he can dair your upB and kill you! He can also kill you with uair, but you should make sure that, with your multiple jumps, you won’t get uair’d and die. Apart from these things, there’s no need to worry about Falco’s killing options.
You, as Kirby, will do what you always do to kill: fsmash punishes (he can wavebounce lasers when recovering from high up to trick you into fsmashing, so only do so if you’re confident it’ll hit), dsmash his landing attempts (fresh dsmash kills him at if he predict you’re not gonna shield and dairs/nairs you for it, fsmash him next time… Our fsmash trades hits with all his aerials so he’ll die), uthrowing him (platformed stages mainly of course, kills him at ~180% from the ground at BattleField and ~160% from the top platform), bairing him (after refreshing it with pummels, or after respawning when it’s fresh), and dairing him offstage (situational since Falcos will always try to recover from high, but it’s common sense that they always aim for the ledge due to them falling faster than they move horizontally in the air). If you can, take Falco to a stage with no ledges/lack of ledges and no walkoffs to see him struggle while recovering. One offstage Falco in these is guaranteed death if you intercept him with bairs all the time until he’s at high %s.
On a side note, our fsmash clashes with his sideB, and doesn’t hit him. Stick to bairing the recovery attempts unless he goes for an upB while offstage.
One thing you have to know in this MU is that Falco chains his laser into many things. When he lasers while landing, he has no landing lag, so he gets frame advantage even if you shield them. His jab is also fast enough to get him frame advantage, so expect a lot of chaining from lasers and jabs against you. Your goal should be to get yourself somewhere where Falco is forced to commit to a longer-lasting attack, so the air is where you want to be. He has decent aerials, but half of them are multi-hit so you can SDI them and bair him for doing them, and the others won’t hit you if you’re hovering at the right distance (bair and dair are the only single-hit aerials of his, also his aerial movement is slow so uair isn’t something you have to be afraid of). If he jabs you or lasers you from close-up at lower %s, he’s going to dthrow chaingrab you. We only take about 25% from dthrows, but he’ll try and end in a dair or a gatling combo (dash attack + usmash) for an added 10-15% damage, so evading his grabs is a necessity, simply space your rising bairs and you’ll be safe. He’s a fastfaller but the slowest of the space animals, so strings/combos/chains won’t work as much against him as they would against the other two… Once you get him offstage, all you have to do is bair. Dair won’t knock him out of his sideB unless you aim it well, but bair will always knock him away, so stick to bairing him. If he’s below stage-level, a single dair hit will kill him, so if you see him upB’ing towards the ledge, jump after him and dair.
Falco kills with his usmash (boosted usually, its his most surprising smash since he can hit you with hit from long distances), fsmash (has some start-up so you should always know to not jump into his fsmashes, usually Falcos do it as an edgeguard/punish when you’re near them), dsmash (has relatively low range, and usually punishes you for landing near him or rolling into him), and bair (kills at high %s, so don’t worry much about it). He has no killing throws, so if you’re torn between taking a hit or getting grabbed at high %s, you should always choose to get grabbed. If he hits you with a multy-hit aerial while you’re on the ground and at high %s, make sure to buffer a shield so that he can’t kill you! If you’re offstage he can’t do anything to you but laser, and if you’re below stage-level you’re safe from everything, and he risks dying if he jumps down to try and hit you. When aiming for the ledge, don’t upB too high and always go for the lowest sweet-spotting possible, since he can dair your upB and kill you! He can also kill you with uair, but you should make sure that, with your multiple jumps, you won’t get uair’d and die. Apart from these things, there’s no need to worry about Falco’s killing options.
You, as Kirby, will do what you always do to kill: fsmash punishes (he can wavebounce lasers when recovering from high up to trick you into fsmashing, so only do so if you’re confident it’ll hit), dsmash his landing attempts (fresh dsmash kills him at if he predict you’re not gonna shield and dairs/nairs you for it, fsmash him next time… Our fsmash trades hits with all his aerials so he’ll die), uthrowing him (platformed stages mainly of course, kills him at ~180% from the ground at BattleField and ~160% from the top platform), bairing him (after refreshing it with pummels, or after respawning when it’s fresh), and dairing him offstage (situational since Falcos will always try to recover from high, but it’s common sense that they always aim for the ledge due to them falling faster than they move horizontally in the air). If you can, take Falco to a stage with no ledges/lack of ledges and no walkoffs to see him struggle while recovering. One offstage Falco in these is guaranteed death if you intercept him with bairs all the time until he’s at high %s.
On a side note, our fsmash clashes with his sideB, and doesn’t hit him. Stick to bairing the recovery attempts unless he goes for an upB while offstage.
Kirby is a good character. He should really be in Borderlined Tier, or higher - Atleast his MU's say so. It's just that nobody uses him.
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
nope! I already asked Malcom. He gave me alot of stuff but I been asking him alot though. I'll be posting it as soon as I get every info.
You are the Lucas that played me at Next level lan. I didn't know you had a Wario or I would have done some Wario dittos with you lol.
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
There no other Lucas main in florida besides me...and Galeon whom I wish he could get back in this game.
but anyways...why dittoes xD? But we should do that though.
Doesn't hurt to get info from multiple scources, definitely ask Bassem and Jnig, I don't know if Malcolm has current sonic metagame experience around where he is even though he was a good Sonic back in the day.
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
And I asked him on what stage to ban but he haven't got back to me on it.
Easy ban vs Sonic is often FD/YI. I personally love YI as Wario, but I'm not sure how much I could love it if I were to face a Sonic there. He has an annoying glitch that lets him spindash with invincibility, which means your aerials and bite can't hurt him, so covering a landing will be very difficult there. Wario's poor ground game won't deal with it very well either. The uneven ground can let sonic grab release wario into Fsmash in some spots as well.
FD is usually not great for Wario, while being a good Sonic stage, but since Sonic can't force an air release on Wario, I'd definitely call it the lesser of 2 evils here.
FD is usually not great for Wario, while being a good Sonic stage, but since Sonic can't force an air release on Wario, I'd definitely call it the lesser of 2 evils here.
Make sure you never stay in place for long. That's how certain characters start to overwhelm you, like Sonic and Zero Suit Samus.
Pwneroni
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2008
- Messages
- 1,065
Hmmm does Sonic's spindash beat bouncing tires? My gut tells me that it destroys them... hmmm how to use tires in this matchup... I feel that Uthrowing tires and creating a consistent hitbox on the field may be beneficial, and if Sonic is really high in the air you could use tires to pressure him into airdodging or spinning. I don't have a lot of Sonic experience, since apparently Oregon is anti-Sonic haha. Every smashfest Sonic is banned LOL. Well it's really more like a soft ban.
Sonic is way too fast to be cornered or pressured by tires. Tires can probably beat spindash if it hits the top, but otherwise I'm pretty sure it will just clank or beat the tire (either way the tire is gone). He also has a pretty strong item game and can more than likely apply more pressure with tires than Wario can with better item throws and glide tosses.
Labernash
Smash Lord
- Joined
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Lolololol, in Tyler, this one venue has been known to do items on and Sonic Banned.
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
Knowledge is power, Espy =P. And the fact that I don't know the match up. getting knowledge is key to victory, after all.How do you have problems vs. Sonic?
No one who plays Wario should ever have a problem with Sonic.
Ever.
just saying.
Lord Chair
Smash Master
but then youll cancel your cancel into a cancel and dair us
Strawhat64
Smash Ace
Inception much?
Pwneroni
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2008
- Messages
- 1,065
I dunno man, I really think Wario's item game is better than Sonic's. His Nair and Bite + tires are quite a deadly force. Are there any legit Sonic videos out there?
Lord Chair
Smash Master
tbh using bite as a counterapproach only works when you actually decide to approach
the actual reward of landing a bite is mediocre, unless you decide to go in more often than feigning an approach the risk reward of hard countering an engage with bite is not worth it considering you can just punish the cooldown lag with a grab
all this in pretty much comparable to why you don't spam bite in the wario ditto even though it beats a lot of options, only wario punishes whiffs a lot harder
the actual reward of landing a bite is mediocre, unless you decide to go in more often than feigning an approach the risk reward of hard countering an engage with bite is not worth it considering you can just punish the cooldown lag with a grab
all this in pretty much comparable to why you don't spam bite in the wario ditto even though it beats a lot of options, only wario punishes whiffs a lot harder
Croi
Smash Lord
What part of Applejack don't you understand?
I like Project M's Wario. He's fun and still capable of jumping around, but, it's like they forgot to Melee-fy him. Everyone is faster than him, and he's lacking in pretty much every aspect.
I guess it wouldn't be right if the character I enjoy (I dislike everyone else I've used so far) in the spiritual successor to Melee were any good.
I guess it wouldn't be right if the character I enjoy (I dislike everyone else I've used so far) in the spiritual successor to Melee were any good.
Player-1
Smash Legend
shut up reflex