DGames Summer Mafia Bash - Day 2 Begins. Deadline Day 2 begins - Deadline 8:00 A.M. CST Monday 6/24

[giraffelasergun]

Reposting vote count so it's not new page'd

Vote Count: 7:42 AM CST 6/13 Edition

Rockin (3): KevinM, Tom, Mac,
Marshy (3): Maven89, Ran, JTB
Pythag (2): Kary, Doop,
Ranmaru (1): Pythag
Maven (2): , Marshy, FrozenFlame
Dooplissity (4): Ryker, Gorf, UtopianPoyzin, JeXs
JeXs (1): Rockin
No Lynch (0):

Not Voting (1): Nabe,

Deadline June 17th 7:00pm CST. Takes 9/17 to lynch.

 

[JeXs]

The latter, although I'm null on jexs right now. I'll go more into that later today

Can you elaborate more on what made you feel it was more likely to be "I want to justify calling you scum with meta" rather than "I'd like to get a feel for your meta to understand and read you better"?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

What does him leaning to it to that extent imply in relation to scumhunting in your mind? I'm just curious why you cared to ask him this, when you didn't ask him about Rockin, who had less posts than Maven at the time.

He posted about Maven so I asked him about Maven. It's pretty simple.

I expect to explain the bolded more when I get to my post on Ryker.

 

[JeXs]

Nevermind, I already feeling a carsick and I don't want to throw up during engagement photos, so I'll keep this short for now

I don't like how Jexs and Ran approached questioning UP as the answers he could potential provide have no bearing how to read his alignment. Specifically, Ran asking the questions I previously quoted and Jexs asking something about UP's scum meta that could just be used as a source to push a mislynch.

HOWEVER Ran stands out far more (and this sucks being on mobile because I can't bring up the posts) but the change in how he was posted from questioning the new player UP (questioning every piece of his posts) versus how he responded to veteran player Kevin (very short responses, no questioning) makes me believe that Ran is attempting to earn town points off picking on someone that won't bite back

How ironic that my RVS vote would end up on the person I have as most scummy currently

Why did Ran's responses to Kevin stand out? Kevin basically just said "you're scum" and Ran responded with "no", there wasn't much for him to pick out compared to Poyzin who talks and explains a lot more.

 

[JeXs]

I don't have a problem with this page existing. It is a starting point, so that's fine. The problem is that a lot of those reads are "these are the reasons that I don't actually have a read on that guy." Those are fairly unhelpful. The reads you do have, I mostly disagree with. That's not necessarily a problem. I expect to disagree with you, especially early on. I can take those reads to track and read you later, but right now they don't do very much for me at all. I don't see value in them on their own merit because I think you're mostly wrong. They have minimal value for reading you because they're just the starting point and I don't have future behavior from you, defined reads on others, or player flips to compare to it yet.

That's why I'm not posting one at the moment. I'd call like 4 slots null and tell some of the more difficult slots in the game to read how I'd intend to read them in the future.

At the moment, I essentially just have a baby scum read on Maven and a strong desire to see wagons forming that could cause people to end up as lynched if they fail in the court of public opinion or run out of time and become consolidation lynches. As such, if you gain traction with that Tom vote, I love it. Right now, it's boring.

How did the baby scum read on Maven come about? Can you elaborate on it? At that point in time, the only thing Maven did was to vote for Marshy. Is it related to his inactivity?

 

[JeXs]

I'm currently on page 9 and I don't agree with your Marshy read, Ran. Did you consider that he could merely be reading you wrongly? I concede that I wrongly remembered most of what he has done, in my memory he was actively engaging people and putting out new thoughts and discussions. Most of what he has done at that point was his interaction with Doop. It brings him down to mild town, I can still see him actively trying to read players. I find his reeling me into the game to be a slight town tell and I don't see him asking this to you as scum.

can you talk more about this? like why did you have difficulty getting into this game as opposed to the hyperactive style you usually employ as town from the jump?

It feels genuine to me.

 

[ranmaru]

I will answer you when I return from the store, but is that your answer to JTB?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Ok you can disregard my #756 I found the answer

I have a null read on Ran right now. Also waiting for development on that front. Nothing Ran has said or done yet has caught my eye as particularly scummy, rather curious in stead, hmm.

Who asked?

Nobody. It was something that I had been debating in my head at the time and wanted to post what I was thinking.

I wasn't ignoring the question, I just didn't know whether the person asking was relevant. Is it?

I just think it's strange that you decided to share a read without any prompting. Particularly when that read is a null that you says needs development.
My normal thought process when I have a null read is 'what can I ask this person to improve my read on them' not 'better tell everyone I have a null read'.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Ran, like, combing through your reread post is really showing my attention span capabilities diminishing. But while I try, I want to try tasking you with something. Are you up to the challenge, man?

 

[JeXs]

I will answer you when I return from the store, but is that your answer to JTB?

Yes, my answer to JTB is also in that same post.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

I challenge you to explain your reads with

-Zero meta substantiation
-Zero associative substantiation

 

[ranmaru]

Tell me the task, and I will do my best to accomplish it once I return. Going to the dollar store.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Maven: He posted that Marshy's first post was forced, but never followed up on this nor did he continue posting and is absent right now. So he's more of a question mark I'd consider. Null question mark.

Has yet to follow up on his Marshy vote, nor post at all, as he has been prodded. I'm starting to think he's scum. In our previous game together, he was obvious town, and caught scum instantly in early game. Usually when he's scum he tends to lurk. I can't blame him, as I do the same. Time to wagon Maven.

I don't understand how you re-read Maven's only post and changed your read completely.

What immediate info do you get out of a townMaven or scumMaven if he died right now?

You're right. Not much. There would be some, but since he hasn't said much, nothing yet. I'm fine with him posting content and I'm glad he hasn't actually replaced out because he does need to explain his vote. Then I'd be fine with him dying, because I'm that confident that he's scum.

Ran what do you think of Nabe? Because frankly you are tunneling on Maven right now.

I don't know if that's because you're town and you're just being daft, or because you were in the spotlight earlier and you need to push on someone else.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

man, ran is so ****ing awful as town

 

[KevinM]

Lmao that pretty much obv towns Marshy for me ^

40%jk 60%allday

Bruins lost that sucks, Rockin is still alive that’s bad.

Doop vs Pythag would be B cool but I can’t tell if Doop is scum vibes or new player contradiction vibes.

Macman lurking doesn’t necessarily mean anything yet but he is definitely more indecisive as scum.

JTB smells a lil funky.

Actually down to wagon:
Rockin
JTB
Ranmaru
UP
Nabe
Maven
Doop
Pythag

In that order really.

Wow gotta love a day 1 where I’m cool with half the cast going. That’s how you know it’s gonna be a good day.

 

[KevinM]

I think I’ve got like maybe one or two town leans and that’s as close as I’ve got. I love it what a cluster**** let’s start LYNCHIN.

So many players, so much room for activity!

 

[KevinM]

Can’t wait to not get night killed because I want half the game dead and then win it all on D1 once we get these silly formalities out of the way. Yessss baby! Yessssss!

 

[Pythag]

Ok. I'm going to do my best to explain without using IRL Johns, because I hate them.

#HBC | Kary

What was I expecting from your post? Nadda. Remember I said I didn't like my opening? that was part of it. I was trying to be somewhat active since I knew the game had started. I even misread your 'real post' as 'big post.' So I played reactionary....yet I hadn't even posted yet. During RVS. Yup. Idiotic. Should've just waited till I returned home.


ReRead notes :
I'm concerned with FrozenFlame's finding Jex joining Kevin's wagon as scummy. That is odd. Especially because Later FF claims that he likes kevin more and more. Of course scum can be on a wagon..but that reasoning just strikes me as odd. Especially when the stakes were so low.

I'm also concerned at his scum list in 453 but maybe that's because the only ones on it that make sense are inactives

Ran is aggressive. he's aggressively trying to prove his townness most of the time. I now consider Ran V Tom to be Tvt (Tom's 467 aptly describes what I was thinking)

While Ran is aggressive, I think Doop actually looks similar, but instead of trying to prove his townness, he's trying to prove others scumminess.
(my notes actually have written that I think Doop is a little opportunistic) Earlier I was accusing Ran at grasping at straws, which I think he's done a lot of, but I think doop is doing similar things. I guess I just don't see too many hard cases that can be made D1, and everyone's trying to be Columbo.

I'll have to reread Doop specifically to get more concrete examples, right now I'm just running on gut based on what I read.

Doop looks more scummy to me than Ran in that case. But maybe that's because it seems he's finding like, exact opposite opinions/conclusions than I am.

I liked what Ryker said in 379 with regard to Doop being lawyer-y. That would line up with my opportunistic feel.

#HBC | marshy why was I willing to hitch my wagon to Gorf? I guess it's cause I think he's playing town, and I like most of his reasoning. However I was wrong in what I initially posted. I read wrong, and Gorf didn't vote for Maven. So I guess I'm not hitching my wagon to his at all.

I'm more comfortable with a Maven lynch than a Ran one though, so I'm actually going to keep my vote here. Though I could easily be convinced to switch to Nabe as well. I don't really like inactives.

I don't want to join the Rockin wagon, he's been more active, and I haven't found fault with anything he's said.

Can someone tell me why they think JTB is scummy? Or at least lynchworthy? Nothing I saw really struck me; I'm not convinced.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

not fully caught up yet, but my quote log was getting long

Ran's tone is still weird but now that I have more posts from him I think it's genuine-weird and not scum-weird, so I'm 180ing on his slot.

for the most part doop, i really like your #315. But i still would like to know what about ranmaru's tone rang weird to you

I don't think missing someone finish a post in and of itself is scummy, but it's complimentary of the notion that his scumhunting feels disingenuous dude. Like, if I put myself in Ran's shoes and I felt like I needed to see the rest of Pythag's post to read it, I can buy the reality where I voice that and don't see his second post. I don't know how much I buy the reality where I'm posting again, after noticing more posts have been posted since my initial post (especially with Pythag's #173), and still miss it if I actually care about the push I'm making man. It's not, like, a cornerstone to the building of my weariness, but it helps my inner spirit be at peace with the reality of Ran being a ****ing narc. You know what I'm saying, man?

eh not really but w/e

Nah man. It's a bit more cerebral than that.

I fully expect Ran to ask questions like he's a freakin turret gun too early in the game. But, like, early on, he wasn't doing that man. Poyzin was like the only person he was really bombarding with questions, and outside of that, there wasn't much in the way of that. Questions here and there, sure. But not to any sort of degree of insistence that he had with Poyzin. Obviously it'd be different because he says that tactic is for the new blood, but the Ran I know is like a badly trained puppy. He would still jump at, like, any opportunity to annoy people with questions that didn't make much sense and force me to dissect his intent. That led me to read the Poyzin questioning as, like, a trap he can use to put Poyzin down that spiral a bunch of new guardians of the peace fall into. But it didn't work, and he stopped. Can he have done that as town? Definitely. But the lack of drive around that push at the time leads me to think otherwise. And it's not like there weren't other people in the thread in the first night for him to do it.

At this point he's been called out on doing that and now he's in a form I recognize more, but it's hard for me to just put down the scum vibes when the thread explicitly told him what they expected, he acknowledged it, then changed. At this point I don't wanna restrict my vision super hard, but I still don't like the vibe he's giving out.

while I can grok what you're saying, it still appears to me that Ran's early behavior lines up with what people were saying his meta is

how do you feel about the heat moving away from ranmaru now? you thinking thats a mistake

on recent events/discussion - i'll reread for things that don't involve myself and come back

come back

i had a few outstanding questions for you

in #325 when you post your read on me - i never stated you were scum because you were wrong. also, this might be fundamental difference of opinion, but when you say "he just wants to lynch, and thats scummy," i disagree with you. the lynch is primary tool and i want to use it many ways in a single day, so yes, let's lynch, and let's throw around the lynch too. in the end, though, im not looking specifically for your lynch. i think your defensive responses to me makes you look nervous/anxious - primarily because i was not very aggressive, and also because some of the things you say i've done to paint you as scummy are not correct and probably dont read correct to others - from a perspective, i say your name and the word lynch and you respond calling me scum and start making mistakes.

hey tom, you are still scumreading ranmaru right? you say you're not looking specifically for his lynch, but you'd be very ok with it happening? Also, it seems like a bunch of people have commented on your and Ran's interacton by this point, were you able to read anything from their reactions?

I'm actually thinking a triple wagon of Doop vs Pythag vs Rockin would be nice.

fully agree
adding this to the long list of posts that have me convinced Jexs is town

Ok, so UP. I'm going to let you in on a top player secret that Rockin still hasn't learned.



Rule of thumb: high vote totals, especially if they're early on in the game, are very good.



As I said earlier, we will tend to consolidate onto someone who has votes if things don't change. If things DO change, then we will see how they change and act accordingly. When vote totals aren't high, it's relatively easy for scum to piddle around with multiple options and then use their coordinated advantage to influence where the town snaps to come end of phase. HOWEVER, if most of the town is voting and split between 2-4 options instead of spreading wide on 5 or 6, then they need to move much earlier and more obviously. If someone they don't want lynched could be on the block and they want to change it, they have to fabricate a reason and be somewhere else. If they refuse to play ball, they begin to stick out as a sore thumb as a non-contributor.



In addition to the way it forces the scum team to respond, it forces EVERYONE to weigh in on the game. It creates automatic talking points that, if not addressed, result in action instead of being something everyone just skims and ignores because there is no weight behind the push. It creates a trail to follow back and find those acting with an agenda instead of simply acting to find the guilty.



As such, I posit that, if you have a reason to want someone dead, you should be actively campaigning to make them be dead. Go out there and get votes instead of letting your most powerful tool (your own vote) stagnate on some dead end wagon or on nothing at all. If you do NOT have someone you actively want dead, you should park your vote on one of the wagons with the most votes that you like the best. It means you are still effecting the game with your vote.



tl;dr



Vote someone who already has a sizable wagon. If you don't want to do that, don't be passive with your vote and hope others will join you and instead campaign to get more votes so your vote is now on someone with a sizable wagon. Make sizable wagons. Sizable wagons are good.

preach

 

[#HBC | marshy]

Town:

JTB > UTO > Macman > KevinM > Gorf > Kary > Rockin

Null:

Tom > Nabe > Doop

Scum:

Marshy > Ryker > Maven > Frozen Flame (Only here due to association)

Slight Scum:

Jex > Pythag

you literally hav the towniest ppl (besides kevin) in me, frozen, ryker as scum and jtb as top town is top 2 worst reads in the game

you are essentially another member of the scumteam and this is a repeat of last years game where your reads were the worst in the game. amazing how you do not learn, sincerely

 

[#HBC | marshy]

sorry guys. ran just tilts me. been dealing with this dude not knowing how to play for like 7 years then every game he turns around and does the same ****

kary im guessing youre making the post on ryker. do you hav any opinion of jtb tom or jexs?

 

[#HBC | marshy]

btw i hav a secret scumread im sitting on

posting this now but will talk about it later for reasons (including being really busy today, dont expect much from me if anything)

 

[#HBC | Mac]

lmao, yea that JTB read is preposterous Ranmaru

not gonna say anything about the marshy wagon atm

im feeling KevinMs wagon list (save for UP), too many slots need to die

but I'm not really feeling a doop lynch, at least not over Pythag or Rockin or even Maven / Nabe. I like the way he jumped on and then off the ranmaru wagon before the rest of town started leaning that way.

vote: pythag for now, but consider me on the rockin wagon in spirit

 

[JeXs]

Reposting vote count so it's not new page'd

Vote Count: 7:42 AM CST 6/13 Edition

Rockin (3): KevinM, Tom, Mac,
Marshy (3): Maven89, Ran, JTB
Pythag (3): Kary, Doop, JeXs
Ranmaru (1): Pythag
Maven (2): , Marshy, FrozenFlame
Dooplissity (3): Ryker; Gorf; UtopianPoyzin
JeXs (1): Rockin
No Lynch (0):

Not Voting (1): Nabe,

Deadline June 17th 7:00pm CST. Takes 9/17 to lynch.

I don't remember voting Pythag. Pretty sure I voted Doop?

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

you literally hav the towniest ppl (besides kevin) in me, frozen, ryker as scum and jtb as top town is top 2 worst reads in the game

you are essentially another member of the scumteam and this is a repeat of last years game where your reads were the worst in the game. amazing how you do not learn, sincerely

A "Like" does not quench how much I was laughing reading this post.

sorry guys. ran just tilts me. been dealing with this dude not knowing how to play for like 7 years then every game he turns around and does the same ****

This one too

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Gooooooood morning. Skimmed, I'll be around in a couple hours to actually post.

ranmaru you have a problem that I put my money where my mouth is and continued to use my vote to progress an ongoing wagon rather than parking it somewhere and let it rot?

 

[giraffelasergun]

I don't remember voting Pythag. Pretty sure I voted Doop?

Sorry about that, again. Fixed!

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'm not sure what your issue is.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Yea I totally feel like Ran's reread is waaaaaaaaay too dependent on material that just straight up doesn't hold weight man! I really don't feel killing my high like poking every hole possible, but just for a few:

-Your marshy tells are founded on a meta that involves how he deals with you, TvT. This is, like, with the confirmation bias of knowing you were both town after the games were done. You, like, admit to having a slow start, and just to play the meta game, isn't that contradictory to your town meta? Why should marshy read you as town for reasons you base your whole game on: meta?
-You say he's playing on the armchair or like an IC and watching the game go by. Yet you neglect the post where his contributions actively push narratives and develop connections. This is a six day Day. If people wanna watch what's unfolding, let them watch what's unfolding. This is almost the exact same thing we can say about Ryker, but he's doing it more actively. Why does Ryker need to pioneer cases that he isn't passionate about while being passionate about various other contributions in the thread? Just because they're not loud, doesn't mean they're scum, man. We don't live in a freakin vacuum!
-Your FF read is 100% contingent on associations that don't matter yet because we don't have a flip on players that you have paper thin cases on.
-Your Maven read is 100% contingent on meta that doesn't apply because he's not lurking, he's just not playing.

And to answer Macman's question, the worst part about this is that this riddled with examples of you being almost too dumb to be scum moreso than its scumminess. Like, I can't imagine feeling like you need to contrive reads and thinking these are good ones. But I can wifom the mess out of myself into thinking it shouldn't matter, take it for what it is, and what it is is not ****ing scumhunting. It's playwriting. It's a soap opera. And that's really really pathetic because instead of lynching you, everybody is going to think you're too stupid to be scum. Your reads are based on ****ing nothing. It's meta you've framed in your own head, contingent on your vantage point, and associations that you hope exist.

Mac, I got bored of pushing Ran. Doop is a way more interesting push to me and I'd like to see where him vs Pythag vs Rockin goes. If I had to order those three, I'd say Doop >>>>> Rockin > Pythag

 

[ranmaru]

Ok I'm not wasting anymore time. Let the record state you said the same **** as scum though, Marshy.

Ryker, I don't even care to explain right now. If my reads are ****, no need for me to spend night and day on this game.

I sincerely hope you guys lynch scum today, maybe it is actually Maven. No idea why Nabe has yet to post. I wouldn't mind if he were lynched either.

Unvote; Vote: Maven
Replace out

Adios, I am going to play Splatoon 2 and Smash bros instead.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

>.<

Welcome back to DGames I guess.

 

[Maven89]

Replace me out homes

 

[Maven89]

I thought Marshy’s post was unnecessary, we are all veterans and it came off like a forced attempt to gain town credit. As it was the start it was perfect to talk about.

Anyone can check any of my recent games and see that I’m too inactive to play in any of them. I really wanted to play with all you guys but I got really busy right at the start and don’t have the time or will to read everything now, so my bad for joining in.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Woah. Lost my cool there for a second. Gotta catch my breath man.

Chiiiiiill vibes.

Whoosah

Whoosah

Sorry for that, man.

 

[JeXs]

Ok I'm not wasting anymore time. Let the record state you said the same **** as scum though, Marshy.

Ryker, I don't even care to explain right now. If my reads are ****, no need for me to spend night and day on this game.

I sincerely hope you guys lynch scum today, maybe it is actually Maven. No idea why Nabe has yet to post. I wouldn't mind if he were lynched either.

Unvote; Vote: Maven
Replace out

Adios, I am going to play Splatoon 2 and Smash bros instead.

:<

I thought Marshy’s post was unnecessary, we are all veterans and it came off like a forced attempt to gain town credit. As it was the start it was perfect to talk about.

Anyone can check any of my recent games and see that I’m too inactive to play in any of them. I really wanted to play with all you guys but I got really busy right at the start and don’t have the time or will to read everything now, so my bad for joining in.

Take care, you two. I love you both to bits.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

vote jtb

strongly believe this flips scum

- hasnt done anything to really scumhunt. pull up his posts, ask yourself if jtb is doing anything to progress the town or make reads

- his comment about me not doing anything but buddying ryker is disingenuous. shows hes not actually analyzing my slot and instead looking to simplify what ive done for the sake of spinning it as scummy

- i do NOT for a second buy that he reads rans case, thinks 'this is solid' and votes me as if thats the best thing he can come up with right now. scummy hopping of the wagon

- strongly disliked his posts a few pages ago where he was shading ran and asking him what he gets out of vigging maven or whatever inactive. feels like hes going thru the motions and thats just a weird way to use ones time

 

[JeXs]

Vote: JTB

Wanted to let my questions pan out first but I'm onboard this.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

im down

vote: JTB

 

[KevinM]

Ok I'm not wasting anymore time. Let the record state you said the same **** as scum though, Marshy.

Ryker, I don't even care to explain right now. If my reads are ****, no need for me to spend night and day on this game.

I sincerely hope you guys lynch scum today, maybe it is actually Maven. No idea why Nabe has yet to post. I wouldn't mind if he were lynched either.

Unvote; Vote: Maven
Replace out

Adios, I am going to play Splatoon 2 and Smash bros instead.

Y I K E S

DGames gonna DGames :D.

Anywayssssss about that Rockin wagon?

 

[KevinM]

Whoops ninja edited a misquote sorry I’m on mobile and i cant see through my tears of the bruins losing