Dealing with Air Camping

[-Mars-]

Wanted to discuss this with some Sheik mains so I hope you guys don't mind. I don't necessarily feel that Sheik would have too much of an issue dealing with this, I may be wrong who knows? But iirc as of yet no Sheik player has had this happen to them(correct me if i'm wrong). Let's put our heads together and look at the various ways we could attempt to deal with the matter.

Fair:

Fair seems like a decent option but it's sort of a reach if you're attempting to outrange a move like MK's dair because it simply can't. Fair is fast and ends quickly so you may be able to position yourself in the air to use it without the fear of getting punished but I doubt it. This one is kind of a maybe to me.....what do you guys think?

Bair:

In my opinion this would be the way to go. Her mid-air jump is high enough and bair possesses enough range that I could see it being used similiarly to how DEHF used Falco's bair against Dojo. I'm not sure how good Sheiks aerial acceleration is but from my experiences I would say that it is more than adequate to bait and even punish a frame 2 move lol Sheik is so fast.

Nair:

Her fastest option and the one with the longest duration........I don't feel that nair would be of much use here with the range and all though.

Uair:

Might be a potential use for uair that would be helpful to her metagame. Good range and it has a lingering hitbox......i'm not sure if bair would be a better option over this but if it is it's not by much. I'm fairly certain that it can't compete with MKs dair however so the window for it to land would be very small.

Vanish:

Just throwing this one out there. It does have invincibility frames but getting into position for it to actually connect would be fairly difficult. I could see it being relatively safe though as you could land and auto cancel the move or land on a platform etc. etc.

DACUS:

Could possibly punish if the air camping isn't done at the proper height. Can also punish them on landing.


So what do you guys think? We already know that Sheik has no problems with Planking but what about air-camping?

 

[saviorslegacy]

Bair and Uiar is how to deal with this doucheyness..

Vanish is also a good option. It boosts you up into them while you have invincibility frames.

 

[j0s3ph]

What about needles?
I think between bair and nair we can deal pretty well with air campers. Maybe even a dacus sometimes if they are low enough.

 

[ddonaldo]

DACUS can severly punish air camping if timed well. But like you said b-air is probably the safest and best option

 

[-Mars-]

Whoops forgot about DACUS.......edited first post.

Edit: I'm not really confident that needles would have the speed to punish a landing unless your opponent is close to you.

 

[choknater]

everyone is gonna answer yes cuz this is the sheik boards lol

 

[saviorslegacy]

What about needles?
I think between bair and nair we can deal pretty well with air campers. Maybe even a dacus sometimes if they are low enough.

no... wont work

DACUS can severly punish air camping if timed well. But like you said b-air is probably the safest and best option

Uh... not Dair camping but when they land it can be.

everyone is gonna answer yes cuz this is the sheik boards lol

That's cua we have Ninja Tools.

 

[ddonaldo]

thats why I said if timed well. im being extra careful to say exactly what I mean now XP

 

[choknater]

mk's air camping is hard to deal with sometimes but sheik is fast enough to uair him

i can catchup with even wario

im not really gonna have trouble against air camping besides against metaknight, anyone else isnt really hard at all. even then mk isnt that bad

 

[Tristan_win]

I'll imagine sheik uair, bair, vanish and needles is what she would use if this ever occurred.

Sheik 2nd jump is one of the fastest in the game and air camping relies mainly on reactive play because of this switching up uairs and vanish would work against meta knight dair. Bair would also of course be useful but mainly as a mix up and needles are Very good to punish landing lag although one platform will make them pretty useless for that.

Dacus is pretty much the same argument as needles just takes longer, require sheik to be put in danger of a counter attack, and weaken sheik best kill move.

 

[iLight]

sheik can deal with air camping using bair/nair/uair just like you say in the top post


something i wanted to ask about is what you guys would do against say a ROB aka someone like sudai who plays with his character floating off stage, i'm talking about wayyyyyyy near the blast zone

I know what to do but i wanted you guys to think about it/come up with ideas

 

[ddonaldo]

I have never played someone like that yet, but what I think I would do is needle spam, since I am assuming they would be on level with the platform for most part.
I would not attempt to jump off-stage to get them but wait for their return and pressure it

 

[Cold Fusion]

I should vote no just to break the 100% yes. I am not really qualified to vote though, seeing as how I am not very knowledgeable about Sheik.

 

[iLight]

I have never played someone like that yet, but what I think I would do is needle spam, since I am assuming they would be on level with the platform for most part.
I would not attempt to jump off-stage to get them but wait for their return and pressure it

needles are only sort of effective against that strategy, because unless he's rising into them he probably won't get hit by the many, and trading like 3 needles for a laser, is not to your advantage. Also ROB's stop would completely block a clip of needles

 

[Leafplayer452]

Lol @ Me being the first person (might be only) to vote no

 

[ddonaldo]

needles are only sort of effective against that strategy, because unless he's rising into them he probably won't get hit by the many, and trading like 3 needles for a laser, is not to your advantage. Also ROB's stop would completely block a clip of needles

dont we have the advantage since we can shield and such whereas he cannot
anyways im curious to hear the answer
(btw im assuming ROB is in the lead and therefore we cant just camp ourselves)

 

[#HBC | Scary]

It is manageable but 5 Dairs and a Tornado have a high probability of shield poking so you have to be ready to angle your shield or else your eating damage. Powershielding Dairs is also good because it allows you to hit without a chance of being hit by another Dair. Even crouching the Dairs is a good idea but it basically has be done on reaction lol.

As far as ROBs like Sudai, I would imagine getting a few needles out there. How close to the blast zone are we talking eh? Could be a situation better suited for Zelda but if we have to stick to Sheik, then I would recommend avoiding the stuff he can throw and maybe try chain guarding him if he's recovering low or hinder if going high or medium-high. I'm not the best at fighting ROB because I still suck at getting out of Dsmash. Any hints lol?

 

[ddonaldo]

good point, thinking outside the box, completely forgot about zelda and dins fire.
about getting out of robs dsmash, i recommend tap DIing sideways (mashing the control stick sideways) and smash DIing up (mashing the c-stick upwards)

 

[saviorslegacy]

Who ever voted no needs banned from the Sheik forums.
I personally think Tristan done it.

 

[ddonaldo]

lol check the first page savior

 

[Leafplayer452]

Who ever voted no needs banned from the Sheik forums.
I personally think Tristan done it.

lol check the first page savior

Laughing My *** off

ROFL

 

[iLight]

savior jumps to conclusions lol, don't mind him

essentially the problem i came across fighting sudai is that he would get a lead then immediately go to the ledge and shoot projectiles from there, then if i try to get him off of it he would slowly fly farther and farther back towards the blast zone forcing me to go back to the stage and wait for him potentially eating projectiles in the process, then rinse and repeat

 

[saviorslegacy]

savior jumps to conclusions lol, don't mind him

****, how does he know all of this stuff. <,<

 

[iLight]

/troll

10xtroll

 

[saviorslegacy]

/troll

10xtroll

Well you're the one just posting to post. <,<

 

[iLight]

that's because i suck and know nothing

related post:
air camping is gay, but sheik can beat it and then ground camp =]

 

[Sudai]

I name search and just want to point out that switching to Zelda to Din's a ROB off stage is going to do more than needles, but it's not worth it imo. All of ROB's aerials will eat Din's fire so even if he's in his up-b, he's safe.

Oh, and Light, I didn't edge camp you that much in our friendlies, did I? I honestly can't tell sometimes. ><

 

[iLight]

lol not too much, but i know what it would have been like if you had, the only thing that kept me in the game was keeping you from getting too far ahead in percent by staying like | |<----- this close to you half the time hahaha. i remember a few times that i took you like 0 - 110 a few times

 

[Sudai]

Yeah. You had some ridiculous read strings on me in our friendlies. ><

But yeah, if we ever meet in tourney you know what to expect. Take the small amount of time I spent ledge camping and multiply it by the whole match. XD No stops in tourney though. *pokes his title* <3

 

[iLight]

its ok, i'll just take the lead from you and never give it back =]

 

[-Mars-]

Saviors please, let's get along i'm just happy that Light finds it worthwhile to actually post now......let's please try to learn as much as we can from him. No need for people to start arguing.

Leaf I would love to know your opinion on why Sheik can't deal with air camping? Good to get different opinions.

I'm also curious as to what Light thinks we could do against a ROB like that.............i've been thinking maybe keep grabbing the edge for invincibility frames until he has to return??? *shrugs*

 

[Sudai]

its ok, i'll just take the lead from you and never give it back =]

I'd expect no less. :]

 

[#HBC | Scary]

I name search and just want to point out that switching to Zelda to Din's a ROB off stage is going to do more than needles, but it's not worth it imo. All of ROB's aerials will eat Din's fire so even if he's in his up-b, he's safe.

Oh, and Light, I didn't edge camp you that much in our friendlies, did I? I honestly can't tell sometimes. ><

Thanks Sudai, that is a really good point. Honestly I completely forgot that his aerials can beat Din's. If anything it's good for pressure and you might get some free damage but unless you can do the Zelda vs. ROB matchup well, Sheik will probably be a safer option.


Man, the more and more I look at Zelda, the worse she gets. It makes me .......I won't drop her though.

 

[saviorslegacy]

Saviors please, let's get along i'm just happy that Light finds it worthwhile to actually post now......let's please try to learn as much as we can from him. No need for people to start arguing.

lol.. we were both joking. I talk to him on AIM time to time.

 

[Tristan_win]

Who ever voted no needs banned from the Sheik forums.
I personally think Tristan done it.

I'm taking that to heart, say your sorry.

 

[iLight]

lol sheik boards are silly

and @ marsulas

the easiest thing to do against what sudai does is give him no room most of the match and keep the lead or like 1 hit from the lead the whole time till you get up by a stock, never chase off stage unless he is actually coming back towards the stage, not away from it

sheik can combo ROB a lot especially if your good at reading DI and baiting dodges so if he wants to camp with the lead he will have to be very careful to not get combo'd, so you just have to keep him from getting too big a lead and being able to camp off the side

 

[saviorslegacy]

say your sorry.

your sorry

:EDIT:
I agree with the chasing off stage part. Sheik's need to learn how to keep people from reaching the stage, not doing fancy gimps that can be punished if you're not careful.

 

[choknater]

my edge guarding game became amazing lol

guys keep using those chain-> invincible bairs man

invincible ledge drop bairs

invincible ledge hop bairs

they eat everything

 

[Leafplayer452]

Reason I say that is cuz 1.

Needles help, not much though if someone stays above ground needle level (Kirby, MK) your fcked (and air needles are ******** lol)

2. If you approach them (which you will prolly do) your fcked too

Personally I dont think you guys think about your opponenet more than yourself, cuz then that will result in you getting your azz whoop and not doing as good as you thought

And Im a person that thinks of every situation before I make a move so I can make the best/correct choice.

My motto is: If you wanna win, kill me, if you wanna kill me, come at me.

And believe me, Ill have the higher percent at the start of the the match.

But remember this is my opinion

 

[ddonaldo]

Thanks Sudai, that is a really good point. Honestly I completely forgot that his aerials can beat Din's. If anything it's good for pressure and you might get some free damage but unless you can do the Zelda vs. ROB matchup well, Sheik will probably be a safer option.


Man, the more and more I look at Zelda, the worse she gets. It makes me .......I won't drop her though.

I've given up on zelda. I used to switch to her all the time a year ago whenever I got the opponent above 110%, but good players will SDI her fsmash, and wont approach you so the only KOing attack you can really use is Usmash, which becomes blatantly obvious. Now I find it easier to kill with sheik, except for kirby.

And light, do I win 1/2 a cookie?