CounterPicks Against Marth?

[Yunior597]

¬¬ this is really bothering me a little bit... i always start winning but end up losing due to CP...

In my last tournament(DR) i lost to a marth twice due to CP, i think so...

I won first match in a 2/3 then he won and in last match i choosed Lylat... i dont know why... i tough it was gonna be good... but it didnt seems like that.

After that i made to it grand finals... and it was 2-2 then i choosed bringstar but lost there due to some stranges extended hitboxes that marth had under the ledge...

So i wanna know any good counterpick against marth... for now i do it fine in smashville and pokemon stadium 1, but i need more stages...

 

[Orion*]

assuming he bans RC theres nothing to gay that you can pick, just preference imo

 

[iRJi]

assuming he bans RC theres nothing to gay that you can pick, just preference imo

no, not exactly true. Frigate is one of his bad stages.

 

[-Jumpman-]

no, not exactly true. Frigate is one of his bad stages.

Key word:"imo".

Go Battlefield for the platforms.

 

[Excellence]

Key word:"imo".

Go Battlefield for the platforms.

"In my opinion" doesn't belong in objective discussion. Rainbow Cruise, Orpheon Frigate, and Lylat Cruise are what come to my mind. I'm not sure how great Lylat Cruise is but I would guess the tilting could really hurt Marth's recoveries and aerial game.

 

[iRJi]

Key word:"imo".

Go Battlefield for the platforms.

I guess you missed the beginning part, then the "imo". his "imo" was referring to "it's by preference because he does good on almost all the legal stages". What I am saying is that Frigate is not a good stage for him also, so if he bans RC, you can take him to Frigate.

 

[Enzo]

brinstar tears marth a new hole

 

[Blacknight99923]

lylat screws with Gr like no other stage
RC is gay
if you actually land a Uair sharking marth he sucks on delphino.
brinstar is gay AND ****s with grab releases

 

[Player-4]

Key word:"imo".

Go Battlefield for the platforms.

BF is Marth's best stage...

 

[-Jumpman-]

Looking at Orion's post I can conclude in his opinion Frigate is not gay enough to be mentioned seperately. The reaction saying "no that's not true" is in no way disproving this. Please, think before posting.

How is BF good for Marth when you can't be GRd?

 

[Laem]

brinstar is definitely good vs marth

out (Y)

 

[-Jumpman-]

Good enough for the opponent to pick Link in GFs.

Laem obviously is referring to Orion's matches with Mr-R. Naturally MK is good on Brinstar, I have no idea how Marth does on Brinstar.

 

[Player-4]

How do you not know how good Marth is on BF? The GR doesn't make the MU win on lose, and you can still GR him on BF

 

[Kaffei]

I would go Brinstar/RC if they're legal. If not I would, try frigate.
For characters, try DDD/DK. They don't counter Marth but they are arguably his worst match ups along with MK

Who ever said you can't be GRed on BF is ********

 

[Enzo]

Jumpman when will you stop trolling Orion.
I think the poitn was visible in the Marth boards

 

[Enzo]

^Wrong. There is no reason for him to not pick MK for the Marth MU its pretty much 60-40 which is a clear cut adv. DK has a even MU with mARTH but that means he will have to outplay him with DK. DDD is 55-45 DDD favor but if the marth plays smart its a winnable mu also. I dont have any great suggestions on this mu but dont drop MK for another character for the marth mu,

 

[-Jumpman-]

I would never be trolling on these boards, I respect Smashboards.

Also, could anyone explain why Marth is good on Battlefield against MK?

 

[Kaffei]

^Wrong. There is no reason for him to not pick MK for the Marth MU its pretty much 60-40 which is a clear cut adv. DK has a even MU with mARTH but that means he will have to outplay him with DK. DDD is 55-45 DDD favor but if the marth plays smart its a winnable mu also. I dont have any great suggestions on this mu but dont drop MK for another character for the marth mu,

People have personal ways of dealing with match ups. Diddy vs MK is 55-45 MK; M2K doesn't like that match up, yet Anti is good at it. MK vs GW is 60:40 MK, but I am bad at that match up. Playstyles vary and switching to a different character that has an equal chance or more is still a viable option.


@GWJumpman: I don't think it's good against MK nor bad it's just that I wouldn't pick that as a counterpick.

 

[Enzo]

I would never be trolling on these boards, I respect Smashboards.

lOL do you remember this post back on the marth boards?

I don't give a **** ramin, I can't respect anyone doing that lol. But I really shouldn't care about people with no life telling me **** was funny. I mean, I'd laugh ****ing hard if some people fell in front of a train.

yeah noeone will forget that


@Kaffei: i gues that's true. I personally , <3 the marth mu sicne i get to play it alot vs. my bro

 

[-Jumpman-]

Well that's my point, what is the reason for not picking BF?

BLM my friend, it's the truth. Also, respect for smashboards was referring to the administration allowing me to be a DL for the MK boards.

 

[Player-3]

don't pick bf agaisnt marth... because you always have better stages to pick, jumpman

rc, brinstar, lylat

 

[-Jumpman-]

That's easy to say, not explaining why those stages are better. Also, RC is banned here, so Lylat is the only option, and I'm not convinced Lylat is good vs Marth.

Battlefield is a good stage for Marth because it allows Marth to juggle using the platforms and the small stage. However, versus Meta Knight Marth cannot juggle and this same principle allows Meta Knight to juggle Marth even more. So this added to the fact that Marth can rarely do damage or kill through grab releases makes me think Battlefield is a good stage to pick against Marth.

 

[Kaffei]

If RC/Brinstar are banned why not Frigate

 

[C.J.]

First of all, Marth's best stage isn't battlefield. His best stages, in general, are Smashville and Lylat. Platform canceling ***** hard. =D

Marth does really really well on Brinstar vs everyone not named MK or maybe Ness. You lost because you were unfamiliar with on trick he had on it. That means it's inexperience, not a bad stage vs Marth. Against MK on Brinstar, just ouch. Easily the best or second best CP you have on him.

Lylat isn't terrible for marth against MK, but it's by no means good. Slanting of the stage and the fact the middle platform is lower, hurts GR a lot more than BF does, but, we can still probably get re-grabs from you landing on a platform thanks to platform canceling.

Frigate isn't horrid for marth vs most characters either since he has the tools to get his opponent off the stage before he goes off easily. Once again, vs MK... ouch.

Delfino, idk. I have next to no experience vs MK there since I usually get CPed somewhere more gay. It's a better CP than Lylat, possibly not better than Frigate though.

RC is obviously one of the two best choices.

As for Battlefield, this is probably the most neutral stage in the game for this MU, imo. The platforms are amazing for Marth, but, it is MK so it is offset some. The grab releases are important in the MU, but they don't make/break it. And you can still grab release MK quite a bit, although it is true the platforms will stop some of them.
Also, Marth can juggle MK. It's hard, but it can be done. Uair and bair both outright beat MK's dair and if you try to nado down counter hits you back up.

Counterpick Marth to, in order:
RC
Brinstar
Frigate/Delfino
Lylat
Smashville (Just be careful not to get grabbed on the platform. We get a GR to tipper fsmash from it iirc.)
Battlefield
Yoshi's
FD
You should definitely be banning FD and try to avoid YI for Game 1. (The slants make GRing MK easier it seems, although that may just be me.) Battlefield is fine, it doesn't really help either character more than the other. You just have six better options.


Marth doesn't really get ***** on any stage but RC (and because you're MK, Brinstar) so it really comes down to what you prefer.

 

[-Jumpman-]

If RC/Brinstar are banned why not Frigate

Why not Delfino?

I wasn't even discussing the stage compared to Frigate.
And like Orion mentioned before: preferrence.

 

[Player-3]

marth sucks on frigate... i'm convinced

like i would cp a marth to:

brinstar
frigate
rc
lylat
bf

imo

 

[-Jumpman-]

Well I assume the OP got enough info to make a good decision, we're done.

 

[Yunior597]

Ok thanks everyone... ill need to practice more on brinstar i guess... i forgot to say but yes he banned RC everytime...

Frigate seems good ill try it... lets see if i get the replay so you can all watch it...

 

[Orion*]

frigate has a very low ceiling and sometimes the platforms in the bottom on the 2nd transformation aid marth recovering, and getting gimps in this mu is HUGE for mk >_>

i think that brinstar or delph are the best options, then frigate and maybe lylat but the low ceiling is REALLY gay, marth actually can air trap mk pretty well w/ uairs and dieing @ low percents sucks xD

also, i am drunk but w/e

 

[Kaffei]

LMAO @ ORION. giving pro advice when he's drunk

 

[Yunior597]

what about delphino?

 

[Orion*]

its probably your best choice after RC unless youre REALLY good on brinstar, or moreso than the marth

i feel like winning on brinstar has a lot to do w/ stage experience in comparison to most other cps, like obv if you practice on one cp you are going to be better on it than someone else but stages like brins/rc are very different, whereas something like frigate has a lot more normal occurances, so its easier to adapt to.

metaknight against marth is not "free"on brins, but he def *****. delfino takes much less practice than brinstar, so if you generally know both stages, delf > brins

and yee kaffei i am enjoying this 16 years + drinking age in EU

 

[Exdeath]

Looking at Orion's post I can conclude in his opinion Frigate is not gay enough to be mentioned seperately.

 

[Enzo]

its probably your best choice after RC unless youre REALLY good on brinstar, or moreso than the marth

i feel like winning on brinstar has a lot to do w/ stage experience in comparison to most other cps, like obv if you practice on one cp you are going to be better on it than someone else but stages like brins/rc are very different, whereas something like frigate has a lot more normal occurances, so its easier to adapt to.

metaknight against marth is not "free"on brins, but he def *****. delfino takes much less practice than brinstar, so if you generally know both stages, delf > brins

and yee kaffei i am enjoying this 16 years + drinking age in EU

^ I agree with this post 100% i personally have a lot of experience on brinstar but little to no experience on RC.

Actually the last tourney i went to i was up against a snake and he banned brinstar and in my head i was like "bannin brinstar i don't care i still got 3 dawg" and i took him to RC but my lack of experience made me lose embarassingly.

Moral of the story: don't CP a stage you don't know **** about just because a song called mk da bess makes it seem like it's impossible to lose there

 

[lilseph]

I used to main Marth, so going RC is the best.

BUT assuming he bans that, go to brinstar.
Brinstar is a fantastic Marth stage and the marth boards even said that it would be his best counter pick... if not for MK. Its a good stage to go to, its not auto win but its a good pick.

Lylat and BF are bad ideas, Marth thrives on those stages.

 

[Jem.]

FD is marths best stage, why are you guys saying it's battlefield.

 

[demonictoonlink]

I 100% agree with Orion's Brinstar stuff.

 

[Enzo]

BF is Marth's best stage...

I know this is kinda late, but BF is marth's best stage.
Just not vs MK cus it pretty much messes up his grab releases, an important/ kinda vital part to playign this MU as marth

 

[V]

I know this is kinda late, but BF is marth's best stage.
Just not vs MK cus it pretty much messes up his grab releases, an important/ kinda vital part to playign this MU as marth

Marth can still bait things with grab release on the platform, like if you expect him to fair and you shield and he throws out a shield breaker. The big reason BF is good for Marth is his ability to juggle. Marth's aerial mobility > MK's aerial mobility. Marth's uair > MK's dair. He can juggle us and the platforms help. FD is probably his safest stage for this particular MU because it's a straight up spacing game. Lylat is a solid stage for him too. RC, Brinstar, and Frigate Orpheon for sure depending on your preferance