Character Specific Counterpicks/Bans: Kirby

[Alphicans]

GaW isn't that mobile? That's news to me. His aerial mobility is among the best, and he can alter the speed at which he falls. His running speed is faster then pika's, and any mobility he lacks he can make up for it in zoning/spacing and keeping opponents in the air with uair.

 

[gamesuxcard]

ps1 seems like a place where we can play around gaw, I usually counterpick that stage and I feel comfortable playing against gdubs there. try it out.

 

[King~]

i second isaccards mention of ps1

 

[gamesuxcard]

high five, yoshi.

 

[KayLo!]

His running speed is faster then pika's,

Ha, I didn't know that. Poor Pika.

However, I think you're underestimating Pika's mobility a bit as well. Saying we'll be forced onto Lylat's platforms enough that it'll significantly affect our stage choice is a bit meh. If Pika doesn't wanna land on a platform, he doesn't have to land on a platform, lol.

Like Tag said, we have SB and QA, which together allow us to pretty much land wherever we want as long as we're low enough for the second part of QA to take us to the ground. Besides that, I think most Pikas who know the matchup well will be smart enough to save their second jump, and Pika has a decently fast fastfall speed.

I'm not a Lylat fan, nor am I saying that Pika will want to go there vs. G&W, I'm just giving my opinion on the platform issue.

ps1 seems like a place where we can play around gaw, I usually counterpick that stage and I feel comfortable playing against gdubs there. try it out.

Details? I'm interested in what specifically you like so much about it in this MU. =X (You too, Kyoshi!)

 

[PZ]

Rainbow Cruise is most likely mgw's best stage cuz of all the platforms and the moving of the stage. Camping and fthrow combos are weakened for pikachu and mgw has nair **** there.

 

[Alphicans]

I am just curious as to what you'll do after QaC'ing across to other platforms. Tjolt is pretty much out of the question. Even if it means taking a usmash, I'll gladly fill 1/3 of my bucket in exchange for that. Also, it's not even the landing on the platforms, it's the limited options you have with the platforms in the way. If you're in the air, I am gonna nair you.

Either way, I don't see pika gaining anything from this stage against GaW. All it does is give GaW the opportunity to apply mass shield pressure, whether or not you think it's easy to avoid is up to you, but the fact of the matter is that the chance of it happening increases. The idea of this thread is to know what to CP/ban, and lylat is not a good CP, but clearly not a good ban either. Just be ready to get taken there, because if other good GaW stages are banned, he could take you there.

 

[bigman40]

Rainbow Cruise is most likely mgw's best stage cuz of all the platforms and the moving of the stage. Camping and fthrow combos are weakened for pikachu and mgw has nair **** there.

Just wanted to do this

 

[KayLo!]

@Alphicans: All I was doing was disputing your statement that Pika has to land on the platforms. x.o

Assuming that G&W will strike Yoshi's, SV, and FD, I would probably try to get Delfino as the neutral, tbh. But that's just my personal taste.... I like that stage a lot.

@Bigman: That took way too long to type itself out. x.x

 

[Stealth Raptor]

Just wanted to do this

ahahahahaha best objection ever

 

[bigman40]

@Bigman: That took way too long to type itself out. x.x

It's k. We know you read too fast.

 

[KayLo!]

>=( @Bigman, I just noticed that.

I no longer like Green Greens..... then again, I've only played it against a DDD and a Lucario, so that might be why.

I couldn't really CG DDD because the stage is too short, and the ****ing blocks get in the way of tjolts. And DDD has such an easy time throwing you against them for stupid *** tech chases.

The apples are fun, though. Vs. Lucario, I'm pretty sure I got too impatient, but there's no safe way to approach him on GG.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

>_> So should I just give up on this or are people gonna input?

Spoiler

*sigh* I ****ing hate the pikachu boards sometimes...most times...

 

[KayLo!]

We already gave input for G&W, lol. I was waiting for you to move on to a different character.

And as much as you *****, our character board is one of the most productive and active out of all the Brawl character forums, so count your lucky stars. Take a look at the DDD forum or the ICs forum, then see if you still feel like complaining.

Pikachu lacks good players. If you really want to improve the boards, go bug Anther, PikaPika!, and Z, and get them to contribute more often. Otherwise, there's not much to be done.

Sorry for the rant, but as much as I appreciate your input as one of the only talented Pikas to post and help out, the whining is a little much. Our board is fine. It could be better, but it's not as bad as you make it out to be.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Just because we are one of the most active doesn't make us good, it just makes us better than poop. Poop with sprinkles on top still tastes like poop, just a little better.

 

[KayLo!]

Like I said: there's nothing more to be done. We have all the basic threads we need, we generally get input from the people who actually post, and there's nothing else to talk about most of the time.

The only thing that could make the board better would be if the top Pikas actually posted, but that's probably not gonna happen. PikaPika! occasionally says a few words, Anther posts once in a blue moon, and Z posts his tourney results every so often..... but that's likely the best you're gonna get out of them. That's just how it is. You can't force people to be more active.

I mean, since you seem to be the man with all the answers, what do you think could be done better -- realistically? I'm all for suggestions. I want the boards to be the best they can be.

It's just a little annoying when everybody's doing their best and you still **** on it.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Apathy cannot be fixed Kaylo. It just sucks that it happens with our character to blame.

Also, who is trying their best? You? I'll say yeah you are. Me? Maybe. Stealth? Now that he is running the tournament thread sure. Anybody else? Not really. 3 people trying their best obviously = everybody trying their best.

 

[KayLo!]

Not everybody has the knowledge or experience to run a thread or contribute like we can. You gotta remember that there aren't many tourney Pikas to begin with, and many of the players here are new or relatively inexperienced. There's also the fact that people have lives outside of SWF.

I feel like you look at the forum from a negative side, and I look at it from a positive one. Imo, your expectations are unnecessarily high. I'm not saying that people couldn't do better, but from my experience managing people and running projects online and offline, I know how people are, and I know that this board is running pretty high as far as what its potential is.

We have the basics and more..... we don't really need anything else. You can only discuss the metagame so much before there's nothing more to say. Like I said, if you have an idea for a thread or discussion that you feel we're missing, by all means, suggest it. But sometimes there's literally just nothing left to talk about.

EDIT: As far as other Pikas I think are doing a good job, shoutouts to Prime, LDPK, ENNH, occasionally Kyoshi (but you can do better ), isaccard, OriginChu, Lawrence, Zeroxius, and Bigman. I probably missed some people (and I was thinking strictly gameplay stuff, not things like the interview thread), but my point is that there are plenty of people who give their 2 cents when they can. I'd rather have that than have people force it and contribute on stuff they know nothing about.

Anyways. Take Ganon anywhere, the flatter the better. I'd advise against cramped stages because of the sheer power of his moveset, but we can outmobilize him on pretty much any stage.

Ban Brinstar, counterpick FD, SV, or RC (just be careful about his dair at the top).

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I wouldn't CP RC. It is too much hassle for our CG which is basically 0-death.

 

[KayLo!]

I like walling him and getting crazy gimps. But that could just be me..... I've won against two Ganons on RC pretty easy, so I have good memories of this stage against him, lol.

 

[Anther]

RC Seems like it'd be fun to run circles around him Imo... and a lot more awkward kills against ganondorf.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Lol of course the thing that anther responds to is the ganondorf discussion lol.

I'm talking about efficiency, not fun.

 

[Vex Kasrani]

FD and SV, Lylat and YI are also decent because its harder for him to autocancel there, get rid of Brinstar/BF

 

[Anther]

Of course it is ESAM XD.

True true, but in terms of it not being a bad stage..., I think it's a good CP if you end up against ganon in a best of 5 set and running out of the basic CP stages... (Which I don't think can happen vs ganon.. XD)
Trick him into not banning FD or SV..

sigh brinstar.

 

[~automatic]

Ban Brinstar or Norfair if you're at ML(ol)G.

CP FD, RC or CS.

 

[KayLo!]

Explain CS? Walk-off CG?

 

[PZ]

Yea like Klo said we can only do so much. Every1s not perfect sure You can try but thats the best ya got. I do think some of our pika pros may be a little inactive but think about it they could be busy with they may go to tournies alt cuz u have to pay so work gets in the way while some of us pikanoobs are busy with school. I myself find myself stressing alot and being nervous but then when I think about it this year been by fast. Any1 out there already working? Do you think time has gone by fast lately? If you do then your this has been the fastest 2 years of my life. Im 15 now and have to make alot of choices for the future. I have wifi but I have a VERY limited choice of ppl to brawl. 5 hrs plus aint fun either but I can still do it when my dad comes cuz hes a great dad. I have the greastest mom ever all I have to do is make sure my grades are straight and I can be sitting in my room being lazy. Of course the timing of the tournies really effect me coming but I can come. Regardless of being divorce they're pretty awesome and I dont ask for much even if you gave me a million I wouldnt care unless it was up to some1 else I would.With that to say ill end with a random comment and stage discuzzam.

Omg anther is posting 3 new moonz.O_o

Nuetrals: Lylat cruise and Yoshi's island are your best choices cuz the slanted level makes AC ganon's dair and uair harder and since they're huge levels camping is easier and fthrow is easier too. Avoid Bf platforms and straight level.

Cps: whatever your most cmfortable at.

Bans: JJ reason: SPARTA KICK!

 

[Syko_Lemming]

personally, I'd ban pirate ship if it's a legal CP. Water spikes are not pleasent.

 

[~automatic]

Explain CS? Walk-off CG?

Yeah the walkoffs are the main reason. The third transformation is comparable to FD in size so you have some good CG space there if Ganon is at low % but that bump+the tilting of the platform can **** the CG up as well as Ganon's recovery. Plus peeps don't really know how to play on that stage since no one actually CPs Castle Siege.

 

[PikaPika!]

I'd post more but I get an infraction every time I do.

 

[PZ]

I'd post more but I get an infraction every time I do.

how would you get a infraction?

 

[KayLo!]

No johns, PP!, plenty of people (most of them, in fact =D) manage to post infraction-free.

I keep forgetting about MLG stages..... I guess I'd still ban Brinstar, though. It's pretty easy to stay out of the water on Pirate Ship, although stage hazards (the enemy ships, the low gravity part, the ship landing and making the ground tilted) might mess up your CGs.

I'll invite the Ganons tomorrow when people are awake.

 

[gamesuxcard]

I'd post more but I get an infraction every time I do.

I know how you feel.

 

[PZ]

I know how you feel.

lulz I wonder how people do that.

 

[KayLo!]

Yeah, I don't think we're gonna get any input from the Ganons...... probably because they know the stage doesn't really make a huge difference in this MU, lol.

But we've gotten a good amount of input from Pikas alone (+ Vex, who counts as a Ganon), so....... on to the next one?

Artificial bump: ESAM, you should probably bump your thread with a notice when you switch characters..... that's prob why you don't get responses for a long time. x.x

 

[Vex Kasrani]

MLG rules, strike FD, BF, SV, and Stadium or YI

Ban FD, obv

 

[gamesuxcard]

Taking ICs anywhere that's not flat just results in them switching to another character, usually MK. For the first game though I would agree with Vex for stage striking, but I would always go stadium over yi. even with awesome planking on yoshis island iceblocks are mean, and that big platform makes double jumping jolts at their domes pretty difficult.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Yeah I would go PS1 over YI any day. The platforms on PS1 are good for us, whereas the platform on YI sucks for us...

 

[Lore]

Lylat Cruise isn't that bad against IC's either, in my experience.

I agree with Vex for stage striking, but I would take out PS1 and just stick with YI.

 

[KayLo!]

I gots no input since I go all Zelda for this matchup. x.x

Inviting the ICs.