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And...we're done here.
You understand me. *bows*
Diddy Kong's last major appearance in a "main" series DK game was DK64 all the way back in 1999, nearly a decade before he made his playable debut in Brawl. His last appearance in general was just the year before, in Barrel Blast.
I can't tell what you tried to say with your post. But I guess you agree with me? I love the king and want to be eating my words at launch. But I also want these boards to be more real with themselves as we near launch instead of pretending like K Rool is definitely in. My Rosalina argument in my post is what I consider to be the most valid one.
If I understood you correctly, you basically said "An old character can get in if they are from an unrepresented franchise," and "an old character can't get in if that franchise is already represented." You used Lucario as an example, showing that the new character from the old franchise got in over a big fan request, I pointed out that you seemingly ignored the Pokemon Trainer, three (four, representation wise) old characters who also became playable alongside the new character.
This is Smashboards. You've already sealed your own fate.
Diddy, however, was relevant due to Mario Kart titles and I believe Diddy Kong Racing DS came out around Brawl. My Rosalina argument is the stronger one.
Well, yeah, because there's no one like K.Rool. Smash characters who haven't appeared in a long time are either characters that bring a whole new series representation (thus bringing diversity to the roster and in turn raise awareness to the series), or they were in Smash before when they appeared recently.
The thing is that relevance has evidence to back it's claim, though it's no way set in stone, it is a definite factor, especially for a character taken out of their reboot. Too big argument makes zero sense as plenty of people have shown models that work for characters like Ridley, and has been disproven by Olimar.
Diddy Kong was only ever in Double Dash and Wii, DD was nearly five years old by the time Brawl came out, and MKWii came out just before Brawl and had no bearing on his appearance in it. If DD can influence him appearing in Smash, then surely K. Rool playing baseball with Mario a few years back can influence his appearance in Smash 4.
Again, ignoring Rosalina for the moment, Pokemon Trainer, the old character, had priority over Lucario, the new character. What does "recency" say to that?
Maybe, but we don't really know right now.
That's partly why I made the comparison, because I can twist the existence of Palutena, Rosalina, Female Wii Fit Trainer, and Female Villager, as well as the additional emphasis placed on Sheik and ZSS, to claim "Sakurai is focusing on female characters this time around." Could you assume such a thing? Yeah, sure, but there's nothing concrete supporting that other than me just repeating that "Yes, it's a factor! Yes it is!"
Majora's mask has been in everything too. Link between worlds, Club Nintendo's 2013 reward, Skull Kid Assist,... yet no Majora's mask 3d. It seems more like they just are making references at this point. Also, Mario has always been lacking human characters anyway. I feel like they want to add another human to the main cast.
I'm not understanding your point. How was Pokemon Trainer prioritized when Pokemon Trainer was cut from Smash 4 but Lucario still is? They were both in Brawl. The Pokemon Trainer and his pokemon are more iconic that K Rool, but I do see where you are coming from with your argument, I just don't think it is enough to say that K Rool has a fighting chance against Dixie.
But in a way aren't the arguments for K Rool being in the game just as twisted and stretched? He is a wanted character, but that doesn't make him a shoe in, unless I say it does? Kremlings are in Smash Run, but that doesn't make K Rool playable, unless I say it does.
I think the evidence against him, as already stated by many, far outweighs the evidence for him, which just seems to be "he deserves to be".
It almost seems like you're doing this on purpose.
Actually, if we're going with that, then FR/LG were the most recent games when Brawl's roster was decided.
It doesn't make him a shoo-in; very, very few people are saying this, especially after "bottom of the barrel of videos" bit from Friday. Aside from the known factors that apply for K. Rool and keep him a contender, a lot of that is guesswork relating to the Kritters and "Large Kremling" in Smash Run. They've never been used as enemy mooks without him involved somehow (mooks, not spin-off cameos), and they're the only Nintendo enemy to my knowledge to not be in the newest game in their series, so people hypothesize based off of that. Yeah, some people desperate for any news on K. Rool probably blow it out of proportion, but it's certainly worth looking into in any case.
Pokemon Trainer is a weird case, and I don't think anyone will deny that. The way I see it is that Pokemon Trainer is for sure relevant. No one expected him, but people generally accepted him. Pokemon Trainer, as well as those pokemon have been in every pokemon leading up to Brawl, and still are. With K Rool, he has not been in the reboots of his franchise, which is where you would refer to when looking for DKC representation now. A character being left out of their franchise is a huge deal, and people here seem to downplay that. Yet they upplay things such as Kremlings.
I agree with you here. The things I am presenting are to those who claim that K Rool has a for sure role in this game. To those who blow stuff out of proportion.
The odd part is that Lucario has had more anime involvement than Greninja, so Greninja's popularity probably came from the fact that players often like to choose Froakie as their starter in X/Y.
Not even that actually, because Greninja's popularity was coincidental. Sakurai confirmed in the roundtables that Greninja's slot was a placeholder until Game Freak sent him concept arts of some X/Y Pokemon and he chose Greninja based on his design alone. Smash doesn't have a traditional Japanese styled ninja (Sheik isn't one), so I guess it's understandable. It's why Greninja's moveset lacks notable Pokemon moves beyond Water Shuriken (in the concept art) and substitute (It's a ninja, lol).
On the contrary, Lucario is a gift to you after you've gotten the Mega Ring. Of all the confirmed Pokemon reps, only Pikachu could be caught in the wild in X/Y. Of course, you could also catch a Riolu, and evolve it to get Lucario.
I think you misunderstood me there. I meant an X/Y Pokemon of their caliber, which doesn't really exist.
Pokemon Trainer was actually a big request, if my memory is correct. But even if you want to make excuses by calling him a "weird case," there is still plenty of evidence to debunk "recency." SSB64, Luigi was added as a character despite being missing from Super Mario 64, and just being a pallet swap of Mario for player two in all of his previous appearances. In Melee we got Mewtwo and Pichu, another pair of old and new, also from Pokemon, Mewtwo was a completely new character while Pichu was a clone added at the last minute, where was "recency" then? Again in Melee, Falco was added over Wolf for the sole fact that he looked more different from Fox, while Wolf was the more recent character who was considered for Melee. Melee once more, Marth appeared as the Fire Emblem rep, he was the first protagonist in a very old game, while Roy, the extremely new guy, was again added solely as roster padding clone material. In Brawl, instead of the newest Star Fox character, Krystal, Wolf got in because he was more requested. Coming back to this game, I again bring up Mega Man, he doesn't fall under retro, he has no new games to promote with any sort of "recency," he's completely based on his NES appearance, and he got in because of fan request, and he's third party.
There are fans of Ridley overseas, but not nearly as many. Pretty much the only time he comes up is basically as "that one character the west likes so much."
Actually, Emerald was the most recent as it came out in 2005, a year before the roster was finalized for Brawl. DP did come out that same year, but it was after the finalization by a few months, unlike XY, which came out a full year after the roster was decided in 2012.
Are you seriously attempting to objectively refute "recency" with a few examples of when it has not applied? It is always going to be a contributing factor to inclusion, but it is never going to be the sole reason that a character was added. Period.
I do indeed believe that Chrom might have a chance. I try to remain objective, every character has a chance. Albeit, Chrom has a more feasible chance than say, Kaepora Gaebora.Does anybody think that Chrom might have a chance? I sure hope so, although his playstyle will have to be between Marth and Ike...maybe Roy?
Yikes, I completely forgot Emerald came out after FR/LG. My bad then.
I'd say that Chrom is all but guaranteed at this point, but not likely to be announced on Monday. I just hope that he's different enough to warrant three blue-haired swordsmen from Fire Emblem.Does anybody think that Chrom might have a chance? I sure hope so, although his playstyle will have to be between Marth and Ike...maybe Roy?
No, I'm trying to prove a point that "recency" isn't the sole deciding factor of the entire roster. He was saying that a character couldn't get in if they hadn't had any recent appearances, while there was a newer character standing in their way. Rather, more often than not, both the old and new character get in, but there are also cases of older characters getting in over newer charcters.
