Character Discussion Thread

[Cpt.]

Down air should match Dedede's spinning drilling-ness, albeit with less power, obviously, thanks to their size and consequential capacity for dealing high damage.

I would prefer if they were as different to 3DeDe as possible since they main the same weapon.

If Popo really does end up being solo, I hope they change his title to "The Last Ice Climber".
And give him a tragic backstory explaining how he lost Nana.

Popo the scaless, the last of the ice scalers. He betrayed Nana who was corroded by Nito.

 

[Glyphoscythe]

You mean Blizzard? That's one of their better moves, actually. The Ice Climbers actually have a really great Special set, in which all four have legitimate uses.

Their Down Air, however...

Haha shows what I know (nothing). I never really practiced with them much, so yeah...I'll see myself out.

 

[Deleted member]

I asked "Do you deny Ghirahim has a large fan base and following?" becausee I was going to follow up with me providing my opinion on Ghirahim's chances vs. Ganondorf's that was relevant.

You should have done the opinion right off the bat instead of asking an irrelevant question with the intention to turn it relevant later.
It may have been an opinion backed by faulty logic, but at least it would have been relevant to the concept of Ganondorf vs. Ghirahim.

Quite simply...
Ghirahim's chances IS RELEVANT TO his relevance BECAUSE his relevance affects his chances in mine and quite a lot of other's opinions.


I was saying only one would make it, and I gave my precentages. I said there would be a 40% chance of Ghirahim. So, I was talking about his chances as a whole, because I believe they directly vary with Ganondorf, because I think only one will make it.

You keep saying that word, and yet you don't know how to use it right....

Regardless of your little percentage ordeal, you used it in the context of Ganondorf vs. Ghirahim, which is the context I've been using the entire time. I wasn't arguing Ghirahim's chances; I was arguing the written thought that Ganondorf could potentially be replaced by Ghirahim.
You can yell and scream reasons why Ghirahim could be a newcomer until you're blue in the face. It doesn't change that the concept that he could take Ganondorf's place makes no logical sense, the main point (and only point) I was making that you kept failing to address.

The only arguments you kept providing me was that it makes sense for Ghirahim to be in Smash, not that it makes sense for the most important Zelda villain to be replaced with a relatively minor one.
I've already addressed that Ghirahim could be in Smash with saying that the situation between the two has but two options; both of them or solely Ganondorf.

In the context, yes, that is what RELEVANCE means. When you were reiterating Wikipedia, you convienantly left out something. It said....


Ghirahim IS current.

I left it out because it was irrelevant to the subject at hand, and honestly, it doesn't help your case any better.
Last I checked, "current" didn't mean "about 3 years ago".
Since Skyward Sword, we've had Wind Waker HD, Link Between Worlds, and are soon to have Hyrule Warriors and the Wii U Zelda title that's in development.
Those are more "current" than Ghirahim is, rendering that point null and void.

Aside from that, you have absolutely no grasp at what relevance is and keep using it as "recency", which is NOT relevance.
Relevance is:
-Relation to the subject at hand.
-Applicability to social issues.
-The capability of a search engine or function to retrieve material that satisfies the need of the user.

None of which fall under "he shows up in a recent game from 2011".




EDIT: Now, instead of arguing over whether or not you were making irrelevant points, how about addressing the true argument about how it makes any sense for Ganondorf to be replaced by Ghirahim?

 

[Boss N]

You mean Blizzard? That's one of their better moves, actually. The Ice Climbers actually have a really great Special set, in which all four have legitimate uses.

Their Down Air, however...

As a Wolf main, that down air has been the bane of my existence

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

I would prefer if they were as different to 3DeDe as possible since they main the same weapon.

Yeah, I guess you're right. Don't know what else they'd do though.



Also, this rare, vermillion, Ukranian, fine, fly, cray, turnt, young, fresh, based feller needs your support.

 

[Morbi]

Yeah, I guess you're right. Don't know what else they'd do though.



Also, fine fly young fresh based feller needs your support.

It is funny; I expected Ray for Brawl just because his trophy stood out to me in Melee. After that, he was an assist in Brawl. So who knows? Maybe.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Yeah, hopefully. I've wanted him since i saw he was an Assist haha. He would certainly fit well in the game as a fighter. There's probably a reason Sakurai didn't show him in the Direct. Means he's either back, gone, or promoted to fighter status. I'm guessing he's back as an Assist but I'm really hoping for his promotion.

 

[OblivionWolf]

Yeah, I guess you're right. Don't know what else they'd do though.



Also, this rare, vermillion, Ukranian, fine, fly, cray, turnt, young, fresh, based feller needs your support.

Custom Robo was the **** back in Gamecube days for me. I'd be so happy.

 

[Boss N]

Yeah, hopefully. I've wanted him since i saw he was an Assist haha. He would certainly fit well in the game as a fighter. There's probably a reason Sakurai didn't show him in the Direct. Means he's either back, gone, or promoted to fighter status. I'm guessing he's back as an Assist but I'm really hoping for his promotion.

The only reason I don't see Ray making a fighter is that there hasn't been a new Custom Robo game in 4 years. Unless Nintendo decides to revive the franchise at E3, which would a perfect marketing opportunity to announce him in SM4SH

 

[Bowserlick]

Wario's Waft and Corkscrew can be combined. Wario farts (which can meteor smash near his gas-expelling rump) propelling him in a spinning fashion upwards. Quick time to automatically charge up, not nearly as strong as Wario Waft.

B can be shoulder charge. Full charge has Wario running until he goes off the stage or collides into a wall. If used in air, he travels down diagonal until he hits the floor and then runs in a straight line.

Side B can be his bike.

Down B can be a grab. If he grabs the opponent, Wario starts spinning his enemy around. He can move side to side on the ground. B releases instantly, or Wario automatically releases after a second and a half.

In the air, he can move freely after the grab (the spinning opponent acting like a helicopter blade) before he automatically releases after a second and a half. B to release instantly. Goes into helpless mode afterwards.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

The only reason I don't see Ray making a fighter is that there hasn't been a new Custom Robo game in 4 years. Unless Nintendo decides to revive the franchise at E3, which would a perfect marketing opportunity to announce him in SM4SH

More like 7-8 years, the last one was Custom Robo Arena for the DS. F-Zero hasn't seen a new installment in a decade, Earthbound has been done since 2006, and the Mega Man series hasn't seen a true installment in four years, what makes you think Custom Robo can't make an appearance? Admittingly, it would be kind of weird to bring a series into this game that has been lying dormant for almost a decade...they were allowed do that with Little Mac because of that 2009 game...but still it would be great don't you think?

 

[Louie G.]

Ray would be pretty awesome, but it'd be weird seeing Custom Robo get representation when it's been dormant for so long.
It's not like Mother or F-Zero (which has been represented in Smash since 64) or Mega Man (who was one of the most requested newcomers for Smash 4 and a third party).

 

[Boss N]

More like 7-8 years, the last one was Custom Robo Arena for the DS. F-Zero hasn't seen a new installment in a decade, Earthbound has been done since 2006, and the Mega Man series hasn't seen a true installment in four years, what makes you think Custom Robo can't make an appearance? Admittingly, it would be kind of weird to bring a series into this game that has been lying dormant for almost a decade...they were allowed do that with Little Mac because of that 2009 game...but still it would be great don't you think?

I'm not against him being in smash at all, he's my #1 requested newcomer, and I'm not saying it's improbable either. It's just the only thing potentially holding him back as a full character, he's in a weird limbo state where h's not old enough to be considered classic, (Though 64 games which was the series debut are old enough now so who knows) yet not relevant enough to be called current.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Yeah, dat limbo state doe. It's just something I believe that should happen too, I can't really give any more justifications or reasons why. He was an Assist, so why not make him a fighter? He's already been in the game.

And I know this refers to a completely different series of games and I totally could be wrong on this logic, but Darkstalkers hasn't had a true new installment for a long time and Morrigan, Felicia, Demitri, Hsein-Ko, and Lord Raptor have appeared in several other Capcom games, specifically fighting games and the recent Project X Zone. Then again, some of them were included in games while the Darkstalkers series was still active at the time.

Oh well, I tried. Vote for Ray.

 

[Maxilian]

I left it out because it was irrelevant to the subject at hand, and honestly, it doesn't help your case any better.
Last I checked, "current" didn't mean "about 3 years ago".
Since Skyward Sword, we've had Wind Waker HD, Link Between Worlds, and are soon to have Hyrule Warriors and the Wii U Zelda title that's in development.
Those are more "current" than Ghirahim is, rendering that point null and void.

Aside from that, you have absolutely no grasp at what relevance is and keep using it as "recency", which is NOT relevance.
Relevance is:
-Relation to the subject at hand.
-Applicability to social issues.
-The capability of a search engine or function to retrieve material that satisfies the need of the user.

None of which fall under "he shows up in a recent game from 2011".

I think by he says ghirahim is relevant, not because of him being in "current", i think he wanted to point out that he's relevant in the Zelda story

EDIT: Now, instead of arguing over whether or not you were making irrelevant points, how about addressing the true argument about how it makes any sense for Ganondorf to be replaced by Ghirahim?

As much as i love Ghirahim i know that will never happen

 

[aldelaro5]

hum... actually, I think ray would be a deconfirm by assist candidate and it might come pretty soon.

 

[Morbi]

I think by he says ghirahim is relevant, not because of him being in "current", i think he wanted to point out that he's relevant in the Zelda story


As much as i love Ghirahim i know that will never happen

Yeah, there is no chance that Ganondorf would be replaced be Ghirahim. Even the, "because Sakurai" argument doesn't apply here!

 

[Boss N]

Yeah, dat limbo state doe. It's just something I believe that should happen too, I can't really give any more justifications or reasons why. He was an Assist, so why not make him a fighter? He's already been in the game.

Oh well, I tried. Vote for Ray.

On the bright side Lil Mac started as an Assist so who knows.
Votin for Ray till release day!

 

[Kenith]

Why does/did anyone one think that Ganondorf would be replaced by Ghirahim?
Oh right...

Spoiler

 

[Spinosaurus]

Wario's Waft and Corkscrew can be combined. Wario farts (which can meteor smash near his gas-expelling rump) propelling him in a spinning fashion upwards. Quick time to automatically charge up, not nearly as strong as Wario Waft.

B can be shoulder charge. Full charge has Wario running until he goes off the stage or collides into a wall. If used in air, he travels down diagonal until he hits the floor and then runs in a straight line.

Side B can be his bike.

Down B can be a grab. If he grabs the opponent, Wario starts spinning his enemy around. He can move side to side on the ground. B releases instantly, or Wario automatically releases after a second and a half.

In the air, he can move freely after the grab (the spinning opponent acting like a helicopter blade) before he automatically releases after a second and a half. B to release instantly. Goes into helpless mode afterwards.

Kudos for actually making a Wario special moveset that I actually like the idea of. Your idea of how the shoulder bash does seem interesting on paper but I wonder how practical it would be.
I like the idea of it being chargeable. Perhaps the non charged version would be more optimal for combos. Anything is better than Project M's shoulder bash anyway.

Though not sure I'm fond of the idea of removing the chomp. I liked that move.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Why does/did anyone one think that Ganondorf would be replaced by Ghirahim?
Oh right...

Spoiler

Isn't Ghirahim older than Ganondorf though? After all, Ganondorf didn't start to appear until many, many years later.

 

[Phaazoid]

RAY is actually kind of one of my top wanted newcomers.

Just behind Ridley, and probably tied with isaac.

 

[Deleted member]

Isn't Ghirahim older than Ganondorf though? After all, Ganondorf didn't start to appear until many, many years later.

Well yeah.
Ghirahim's master Demise is Ganondorf's "ancestor" or whatever you want to call it.
Ganondorf is the living embodiment of Demise's hatred as the curse he placed upon Zelda and Link's descendants.

 

[Boss N]

This Ganon vs Graham Cracker debate is never gonna die is it?

 

[Kenith]

Isn't Ghirahim older than Ganondorf though? After all, Ganondorf didn't start to appear until many, many years later.

Well, if Ganondorf is truly a reincarnation of Demise's hatred, he is older.

Plus, Ghirahim is designed to be the same age (physically) as Link.

Let that sink in for a bit.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

The hatred of Demis is infinite, the manifestations of that hatred are mortal, and therefore vary in age.

 

[False Sense]

Plus, Ghirahim is designed to be the same age (physically) as Link.

Let that sink in for a bit.

Uh... Really?

That's remarkably disturbing.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Not really.

 

[Kenith]

Uh... Really?

That's remarkably disturbing.

Yes, it's true. It says that in the concept art section for Ghirahim in Hyrule Historia.

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

How is that disturbing? If that's the case then he probably just has a slow growth rate physically, like the Manaketes from Fire Emblem.

 

[Kenith]

Also, you know, he's a

Spoiler

sword.

http://www.hyrulehistoria.com/first-story/p015/

“Upon completion of design 4, we’d pretty much firmed up Ghirahim’s look. First, we decided that we wanted him to be around the same age as Link and act as a contrasting counterpart to Fi, and through this, the design of the evil sword spirit gradually revealed itself. His third form had textured diamonds all over his body that would reflect light.”

-Hirono / Kinouchi / Kaneko, designers

 

[Jerry Applesauce]

Well then that's not disturbing at all. Better than having him look like an old man or an adolescent boy. If I made Ghirahim I'd make him look that age.

 

[Floor]

You should have done the opinion right off the bat instead of asking an irrelevant question with the intention to turn it relevant later.
It may have been an opinion backed by faulty logic, but at least it would have been relevant to the concept of Ganondorf vs. Ghirahim.



You keep saying that word, and yet you don't know how to use it right....

Regardless of your little percentage ordeal, you used it in the context of Ganondorf vs. Ghirahim, which is the context I've been using the entire time. I wasn't arguing Ghirahim's chances; I was arguing the written thought that Ganondorf could potentially be replaced by Ghirahim.
You can yell and scream reasons why Ghirahim could be a newcomer until you're blue in the face. It doesn't change that the concept that he could take Ganondorf's place makes no logical sense, the main point (and only point) I was making that you kept failing to address.

The only arguments you kept providing me was that it makes sense for Ghirahim to be in Smash, not that it makes sense for the most important Zelda villain to be replaced with a relatively minor one.
I've already addressed that Ghirahim could be in Smash with saying that the situation between the two has but two options; both of them or solely Ganondorf.



I left it out because it was irrelevant to the subject at hand, and honestly, it doesn't help your case any better.
Last I checked, "current" didn't mean "about 3 years ago".
Since Skyward Sword, we've had Wind Waker HD, Link Between Worlds, and are soon to have Hyrule Warriors and the Wii U Zelda title that's in development.
Those are more "current" than Ghirahim is, rendering that point null and void.

Aside from that, you have absolutely no grasp at what relevance is and keep using it as "recency", which is NOT relevance.
Relevance is:
-Relation to the subject at hand.
-Applicability to social issues.
-The capability of a search engine or function to retrieve material that satisfies the need of the user.

None of which fall under "he shows up in a recent game from 2011".




EDIT: Now, instead of arguing over whether or not you were making irrelevant points, how about addressing the true argument about how it makes any sense for Ganondorf to be replaced by Ghirahim?

Agreed on arguing over the word "relevant" and all that is "relevant" I've noted that we will never be in agreement on that as it turns out.

It doesn't change that the concept that he could take Ganondorf's place makes no logical sense, the main point (and only point) I was making that you kept failing to address.

I didn't address it because it was your opinion, but...

, how about addressing the true argument about how it makes any sense for Ganondorf to be replaced by Ghirahim?

Fine, but keep in mind these are just our opinions.

Ganondorf is more likely over Ghirahim, due to a variety of factors, which I'm sure you know. Reoccurring in Smash and Zelda, ect... All I'm saying is that there is a CHANCE, however big or small, that he Ghirahim could make an appearance in Smash. However, I also don't think the rep. cap. per franchise will exceed 5 this time around, making me think both will not make it. Only Ganondorf(likely) OR Ghirahim.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

Well, if Ganondorf is truly a reincarnation of Demise's hatred, he is older.

Plus, Ghirahim is designed to be the same age (physically) as Link.

Let that sink in for a bit.

Wow um....that's uh....weird


Eh kinda like the branded from Fire Emblem.


Anyway, what's the current topic about?

 

[Phaazoid]

@ Floor


You don't think there will be 6 pokemon?

 

[Kenith]

Oh great, the five rep rule again.

Well, I'll just take my leave, then. If you guys need me, I'll be on the Social thread expecting six Pokemon characters.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Inb4 Ghirahim's confirmed ...... as a trophy.

 

[Kenith]

Inb4 Ghirahim's confirmed ...... as a trophy.

Oh believe me, I'm expecting it every single day...if it's going to happen, it could at least happen sooner.

 

[False Sense]

Oh believe me, I'm expecting it every single day...if it's going to happen, it could at least happen sooner.

I'm still waiting for the day someone from the Gematsu leak is shown off as a trophy.

 

[Kenith]

I'm still waiting for the day someone from the Gematsu leak is shown off as a trophy.

Me too. Fingers crossed for Marshall. (Sorry, Louie G., I just can't see it happening)

Pacman I'd be fine with, I just don't expect.

Chrom's reveal is probably the only character I'm actively expectant of that will result in me rolling my eyes when he's revealed.

Miis...let's just not discuss them.