Character Discussion Thread

[Morbi]

Exactly.



Because I don't think having them both together is technically stable, honestly.
And honestly doesn't make that much sense.



What I mean to say is that Chrom would be the "Awakening" newcomer everyone expects. Lucina (or "Masked Marth") would be Fire Emblem's answer to Toon Link. As in, a different "incarnation" of the character as a semiclone.

Since it's clear no one here will even just let me want her, that's the best way around it. We expected Toon Zelda for so long, what's wrong with this, really?

Toon Zelda was actually supported by an implied intent precedent, a character coming from one of the biggest Nintendo series. She was meant to represent a completely different aspect of the franchise. Many also hoped that she would lead to Tetra, for some reason. Lucina is a semi-clone of what many believe to be a redundant character from a smaller franchise that already has its most important characters; a series where many already expect a completely individual and unique newcomer that was well-received to be cut based on his hair color.

That is the difference, good sir. Is there anything inherently wrong with it? Of course not, that doesn't mean that people are going to see her as an ideal choice though.

 

[False Sense]

Should I remind that the reason Demise and therefore, the existance of EVERY single villain in the franchise is ghirahim fault?
Without him Link would still be a common boy, groose would still be a jerk, impa would have never met zelda and basically all the events in the entire franchise would have never happened

True, if you want to look at it from a purely story perspective, Ghirahim is one of the more important Legend of Zelda characters. However, in terms of importance to the franchise, he's only the main villain of one Zelda game. He's not that significant.

 

[jweb22]

Not exactly a good arguement when we got Greninja.

Well...Greninja is a fan favorite of Gen 6 along with Chesnaught. I assume the spot was between those 2. However I thing Ghirahim is in battle with Ganondorf for the spot and I highly doubt Ganondorf loses that battle.

Assuming it is a 5 character limit instead of 6

 

[Morbi]

Well...Greninja is a fan favorite of Gen 6 along with Chesnaught. I assume the spot was between those 2. However I thing Ghirahim is in battle with Ganondorf for the spot and I highly doubt Ganondorf loses that battle.

Assuming it is a 5 character limit instead of 6

There isn't a limit; and if there was a limit, it would be, at the very least, seven.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

Canonically, yes, but the number of appearances matter more for selection into Smash. Sheik is an oddball, but keep in mind that OoT was HUGE when Melee was in development. Skyward Sword didn't have quite as much fanfare, so to speak.

True, if you want to look at it from a purely story perspective, Ghirahim is one of the more important Legend of Zelda characters. However, in terms of importance to the franchise, he's only the main villain of one Zelda game. He's not that significant.

This isn't a good logic with all respect, "Chrom is only the main protagonist of 1 game, he is not that important to the franchise", I'm 99% that Ghirahim will appear in at least another zelda game

 

[Rockaphin]

No, if we get a sixth Mario character, this is who it must be

Easy, Paper Mario! While I think Toad and Bowser Jr. also deserve the slot, I think Paper Mario has the most potential. I'd like to see some of the RPG side of Mario represented much better. At least a song or two geez.

 

[Kenith]

Toon Zelda was actually supported by an implied intent precedent, a character coming from one of the biggest Nintendo series. She was meant to represent a completely different aspect of the franchise. Many also hoped that she would lead to Tetra, for some reason. Lucina is a semi-clone of what many believe to be a redundant character from a smaller franchise that already has its most important characters; a series where many already expect a completely individual and unique newcomer that was well-received to be cut based on his hair color.

That is the difference, good sir. Is there anything inherently wrong with it? Of course not, that doesn't mean that people are going to see her as an ideal choice though.

...what would Toon Zelda add to the game other than Tetra (which is now proven to be not possible)? Having two Toon versions of existing characters completely trivializes Toon Link, honestly.

Plus, Zelda has it's most important characters as well. And how is Marth redundant? Unless you mean Chrom.

 

[Zhadgon]

I made it. I just combined a few pics I found so I could use the head, it isn't that impressive.



Lol. Well that's just too bad, because those are my three most wanted characters. Krystal was an afterthought because I wanted an even 54 characters.

Everyone should know that by now.

Good job, it looks great.
.n_n.

 

[Cobalsh]

So, after asking myself who could be better than Batman on steroids, I found someone.

Space Doctor Who.

 

[Morbi]

This isn't a good logic with all respect, "Chrom is only the main protagonist of 1 game, he is not that important to the franchise", I'm 99% that Ghirahim will appear in at least another zelda game

That is a bad example, friend. Awakening is the Ocarina of Time of Fire Emblem. It is the most important game (best received)... by faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar.

 

[Deleted member]

That is the difference, good sir. Is there anything inherently wrong with it? Of course not, that doesn't mean that people are going to see her as an ideal choice though.

No character will ever be an ideal chocie. Doesn't matter who it is, you're always gonna find people whining that "This character got in over my requested character." or they simply "Don't find the appeal"

What's better than Batman on steroids?

Serious Sam.

Checkmate

 

[Cobalsh]

No character will ever be an ideal chocie. Doesn't matter who it is, you're always gonna find people whining that "This character got in over my requested character." or they simply "Don't find the appeal"



Serious Sam.

Checkmate

Check my other post. I beat you by a mile.

 

[False Sense]

This isn't a good logic with all respect, "Chrom is only the main protagonist of 1 game, he is not that important to the franchise", I'm 99% that Ghirahim will appear in at least another zelda game

Comparing Fire Emblem and Legend of Zelda isn't very good logic. The Zelda series has a cast of recurring, important characters, even if they take on different appearances in different games. Fire Emblem constantly changes characters and protagonists. The process of choosing characters has to be adjusted for each individual franchise.

 

[Starcutter]

...what would Toon Zelda add to the game other than Tetra (which is now proven to be not possible)?

waitwaitwait


WHY? am I missing something?

 

[jweb22]

There's no such thing as a "spot." Programming all a character's moves into another character wouldn't take up that much less resources than making a new model that's mostly derived from another character.

What do you mean there's no such thing as a "spot"? I'm sure Sakurai and his team have a set number of how many characters are gonna be playable so if Falco does get in, he is taking a SPOT away from another potential character.

And yes that would be easier, it would also be LAZIER when there are more deserving series needing to be represented.

 

[Morbi]

...what would Toon Zelda add to the game other than Tetra (which is now proven to be not possible)? Having two Toon versions of existing characters completely trivializes Toon Link, honestly.

Plus, Zelda has it's most important characters as well. And how is Marth redundant? Unless you mean Chrom.

I never advocated for Toon Zelda; I was merely asserting the differences between her and Lucina.

I was alluding to Chrom; many find him redundant, mostly because of his established role (blue-haired, male, swordsmen, lord, etc.).

 

[FalKoopa]

This isn't a good logic with all respect, "Chrom is only the main protagonist of 1 game, he is not that important to the franchise", I'm 99% that Ghirahim will appear in at least another zelda game

Zelda doesn't have a history of reusing villains not named Ganondorf and Vaati, so I find it really unlikely that he'll appear again in another Zelda title.

 

[Rockaphin]

Also, I changed my previous roster a little bit. I now has an even 54 characters, I believe.

View attachment 12940
Cut Nightmare and added Paper Mario and Krystal. I only added Krystal because there was literally no one else that made sense to add.

Also, I researched Krystal, it turns out she added a dynamic of sexism to Starfox that wasn't there before. She could've been a cool, progressive character in Dinosaur Planet, but nope, had to become a damsel for Fox to save just because the one of the protagonists looked like Fox. Ugh.

I've got to say, this is a really good roster. Paper Mario? Mach Rider? You sir, deserve a medal.

View attachment 12950
Here's my 54 character prediction roster. Fire away.

. . . Sorry KenithTheGatherer, I'm taking your medal away and giving it to Cobalsh.

 

[Cobalsh]

Comparing Fire Emblem and Legend of Zelda isn't very good logic. The Zelda series has a cast of recurring, important characters, even if they take on different appearances in different games. Fire Emblem constantly changes characters and protagonists. The process of choosing characters has to be adjusted for each individual franchise.

Um... Anna, Tiki, and Marth Ike and Lyn constantly make appearances. So... no, I guess?

What do you mean there's no such thing as a "spot"? I'm sure Sakurai and his team have a set number of how many characters are gonna be playable so if Falco does get in, he is taking a SPOT away from another potential character.

And yes that would be easier, it would also be LAZIER when there are more deserving series needing to be represented.

... What? Is your logic that you're ASSUMING that Sakurai thinks that way? That's the dumbest thing I've ever read here. You are the king of Bull****, pardon my french.

. . . Sorry KenithTheGatherer, I'm taking your medal away and giving it to Cobalsh.

YAY!

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I honestly don't believe that ignoring detriments to the roster is a feasible proposition.

DAMMIT MORBID! Stop wording your posts so intellectually that I have to read it twice to understand what it means!

But seriously, I say this to everyone, being upset about a character only causes butthurtness, and others to be annoyed by said butthurtness. If you don't like a character, then don't play as it.
End of story.

I don't like Ghirahim- he's a one time Zelda villain who's not important to the franchise. Star Fox feels over-repped as it is, I doubt Lucina and Chrom will make it and Chrom is much more likely, and I love Paper Mario but i just don't see them doing it.

Trust me, I don't see Krystal, Lucina, or Paper Mario getting in either.
I just had to mention that it doesn't really make sense for someone to like the roster more if it had less characters. Likeliness is a whole other story.

No hard feelings though.

Oh, and as for Ghirahim, I am starting to think he has a decent chance.
Look at the Mario and Pokémon newcomers, Rosalina and Greninja.
They were both added due to the fact they are newer and popular characters, who's popularity is at its peak, and because they are unique, and have lots of moveset potential. This got them on the roster, despite them not being important in the grand scheme of things.

Ghirahim is the same.
He is a fresh, new character, who is very popular at the moment.
As for his moveset, he has a crap-ton of swords!

So yeah, I am really starting to see Ghirahim getting in.

 

[Cpt.]

Zelda doesn't have a history of reusing villains not named Ganondorf and Vaati, so I find it really unlikely that he'll appear again in another Zelda title.

Heck it barley reuses Vaati enough.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I figure I'd share a roster update while I'm here. Obvious cuts include Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon, Snake, and (dare I say it) Ridley. The later is obviously because of his possible boss role. Don't mind the placement or images for which I need to grab a bite real quick.

 

[Kenith]

I never advocated for Toon Zelda; I was merely asserting the differences between her and Lucina.

I was alluding to Chrom; many find him redundant, mostly because of his established role (blue-haired, male, swordsmen, lord, etc.).

Well, then, let's just not have him. If being male is actually a problem for him, then Robin or Lucina would easily be a better choice.

waitwaitwait
WHY? am I missing something?

Tetra and Toon Zelda can't be a transforming character, which would defeat the purpose of Toon Zelda because most thought she was necessary to get Tetra.

 

[Arcanir]

Not exactly a good arguement when we got Greninja.

Pokémon is not a good comparison as the way its characters are done differ from how Zelda's are. Pokémon has a large cast of characters that are always present, and the ones that stand out are the ones that get more attention. Zelda only focuses on three main characters while the rest of the cast greatly varies, it rarely focuses on other characters and very few recur after their initial appearance. With a differing treatment like that, you can't contribute the same methods of elimination and choice that you can with the other, there has to be a varied method in respect to those franchises.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

View attachment 12950
Here's my 54 character prediction roster. Fire away.

First Kenith, now you?
Did I start something with 54 character roster?

But anyway,
Palutena for Medusa.
Black Shadow for a Zelda newcomer.
And fit Snake back in there if you can.

That's about it.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

That is a bad example, friend. Awakening is the Ocarina of Time of Fire Emblem. It is the most important game (best received)... by faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar.

Zelda doesn't have a history of reusing villains not named Ganondorf and Vaati, so I find it really unlikely that he'll appear again in another Zelda title.

Ghirahim is the dark master sword, I find very unlikely that Eiji will forget that concept so easily, ghirahim and his abilities have more potential than any other one villain not named ganondorf and possibly vaati, he is in a different position than say malladus or bellum has he actually has potential to return and be important in at least another game

 

[Morbi]

Um... Anna, Tiki, and Marth Ike and Lyn constantly make appearances. So... no, I guess?
... What? Is your logic that you're ASSUMING that Sakurai thinks that way? That's the dumbest thing I've ever read here. You are the king of Bull****, pardon my french.
YAY!

He is being completely rational; the objective fact is that there is going to be a certain amount of characters; if Falco is one of those characters, it attenuates the chances of another character lower on the priority list. I am not sure why you do not find this logical; it is the methodology by which every fighting game is developed, it is common sense.

 

[thesandman]

So who would have a better chhance of getting in? Mewtwo, or girahim. Both are extremely requested but which has more evidence for it?

 

[Cobalsh]

Heck it barley reuses Vaati enough.

I read somewhere that the Zelda Wii U game is a sequel to twilight Princess..? Imagine getting Midna back. Then I could support her being a playable character.

 

[False Sense]

Um... Anna, Tiki, and Marth Ike and Lyn constantly make appearances. So... no, I guess?

While it's true that there are a couple of characters that make multiple appearances within the series, there isn't a consistent cast of Fire Emblem characters throughout the series. For example, in Legend of Zelda, Link is the protagonist of every game. Fire Emblem doesn't have a character like that, the closest probably being Marth, who we already have. So yes, there are some Fire Emblem characters that appear in multiple games, but as a whole, the series lacks a main set of characters that consistently appear.

 

[jweb22]

... What? Is your logic that you're ASSUMING that Sakurai thinks that way? That's the dumbest thing I've ever read here. You are the king of Bull****, pardon my french.

So you are assuming that at the start of production, Sakurai didn't have a set number in his head about how many playable characters he wanted in the game?

 

[Morbi]

So who would have a better chhance of getting in? Mewtwo, or girahim. Both are extremely requested but which has more evidence for it?

Mewtwo; by a landslide, or some other natural disaster.

 

[False Sense]

So who would have a better chhance of getting in? Mewtwo, or girahim. Both are extremely requested but which has more evidence for it?

Mewtwo. Ghirahim doesn't even come close to Mewtwo in terms of requests, and doesn't have nearly as much going for him.

 

[Kenith]

Ghirahim is the dark master sword, I find very unlikely that Eiji will forget that concept so easily, ghirahim and his abilities have more potential than any other one villain not named ganondorf and possibly vaati, he is in a different position than say malladus or bellum has he actually has potential to return and be important in at least another game

I love Ghirahim to death and also think he might appear again, but I don't there will be any story connections to other games unless it's directly tied to Skyward Sword.

 

[Cobalsh]

So you are assuming that at the start of production, Sakurai didn't have a set number in his head about how many playable characters he wanted in the game?

There's that word again. Assuming. Ugh, it's an awfully overused word. But yes, I am ASSUMING that he had and idea of the number he wanted, it's just that everything doesn't work out perfectly like we want it too. Falco will most likely stay; the best time for him to leave would've been in Brawl with the other minor clones.

 

[Starcutter]

Tetra and Toon Zelda can't be a transforming character, which would defeat the purpose of Toon Zelda because most thought she was necessary to get Tetra.

Tetra is more likely and more promoted than Toon Zelda, other than in spirit tracks, since Tetra has her own game.

 

[jweb22]

I read somewhere that the Zelda Wii U game is a sequel to twilight Princess..? Imagine getting Midna back. Then I could support her being a playable character.

Midna was already confirmed as an Assist Trophy.

 

[Cpt.]

I figure I'd share a roster update while I'm here. Obvious cuts include Pokemon Trainer's Pokemon, Snake, and (dare I say it) Ridley. The later is obviously because of his possible boss role. Don't mind the placement or images for which I need to grab a bite real quick.

I don't see Wii Fit, Mii and Takamaru all getting in.

 

[Zhadgon]

Is it me or we need characters with axes, chains, bo staffs and other weapons?

.n_n.

 

[Starcutter]

So who would have a better chhance of getting in? Mewtwo, or girahim. Both are extremely requested but which has more evidence for it?

Mewtwo has the highest chance out of everyone even now.