Character Discussion Thread

[Louie G.]

Roy wasn't included for promotional purposes. He was include because Sakurai thought he better differentiated himself as a Marth clone compared to Lief.

Yeah, I pretty much knew someone would point this out.
Roy was still considered because he starred in a recent FE title. The fact that his game wasn't even out until AFTER Melee should at least show people that there was some advertising involved there.

 

[Morbi]

Yeah, I myself would prioritize a second Yoshi character before a second F-Zero, I just think a second F-Zero character is more likely.
Now, onto a new question: what did you think of it, design/ structure wise? This doesn't matter THAT much, but it still would be helpful. :3

I apologize, but would you be so kind as to elaborate on why that is? I am not intending to sound contentious, I am merely curious as to why one would prioritize a second Yoshi character prior to a second F-Zero character.

 

[N3ON]

Yeah, I pretty much knew someone would point this out.
Roy was still considered because he starred in a recent FE title. The fact that his game wasn't even out until AFTER Melee should at least show people that there was some advertising involved there.

Roy was brought to Sakurai's attention because he starred in a recent/upcoming FE title, but like with Ike, it wasn't the release date of the game that caused the inclusion of the character.

Intelligent Systems isn't GF. They suggest characters to Sakurai, they don't impress them upon him. And Sakurai doesn't include characters for promotional purposes.

 

[BluePikmin11]

@ Louie G.
So are we going to end the days for Takamaru and Urban Champion soon?

I would laugh if Sakurai trolls those stupid people by adding Goku... but it is not the Goku from Dragonball Z... instead it is the Goku from Famicom Fairytales... hey, at least Nintendo's Goku would still have the same powers as Dragonball's Goku. It would be pretty cool... he could represent the Famicom text adventure games.

If it's Sakurai's excuse to not add anime characters, I'll probably lol for a while.

 

[JamesDNaux]

who's talking about the internet? im talking about people i actually know. and it seriously sadens me everytime i hear "I Don't know who Megaman is." like honestly it makes me die a little more everytime.

i have yet to meet a gamer alive who hasnt heard of Punch Out. unless ur like 12 i suppose.

I'm asserting that just because someone plays and loves games, doesn't mean that they know every game in existence, regardless of how big that series might be.

The only reason I know a lot of these characters is because of the internet, like I said, I had never seen them beforehand. If the internet didn't exist and I just saw Mega Man get in SSB4 I would have been like "who the **** is this bloke?" But I knew about his popularity beforehand due to people wanting him in Brawl.

Were you, perhaps, living under a certain mass of minerals derived from the Earth?

Can you read? 80-90% of the games I had in my childhood came from relatives. How would I know about Mega Man without someone giving me one of his games? I've known who he is for years now, but only because of the internet, I had never played a single Mega Man game beforehand because I never had a chance to.

 

[Morbi]

Roy was brought to Sakurai's attention because he starred in a recent/upcoming FE title, but like with Ike, it wasn't the release date of the game that caused the inclusion of the character.

Intelligent Systems isn't GF. They suggest characters to Sakurai, they don't impress them upon him. And Sakurai doesn't include characters for promotional purposes.

That wasn't necessarily his point, he was merely asserting that promotion was one of the aspects involved in Roy's inclusion. I highly doubt he intended to insinuate that it was the only reason Roy was included, just one of the reasons.

 

[3Bismyname]

Can you read? 80-90% of the games I had in my childhood came from relatives. How would I know about Mega Man without someone giving me one of his games?

i feel like this is the case with most people when they are children. just saying

 

[?????????????]

Prior to SSB64, I had never heard of Metroid, F-Zero, or Earthbound, though I was even back then a big fan of Punch-Out. Prior to Melee, I had never heard of Fire Emblem, Ice Climber, or the Game & Watch. Prior to Brawl, I had never heard of Ike or Lucas, and I only knew Snake by look and name.

 

[Morbi]

I'm asserting that just because someone plays and loves games, doesn't mean that they know every game in existence, regardless of how big that series might be.

The only reason I know a lot of these characters is because of the internet, like I said, I had never seen them beforehand. If the internet didn't exist and I just saw Mega Man get in SSB4 I would have been like "who the **** is this bloke?" But I knew about his popularity beforehand due to people wanting him in Brawl.


Can you read? 80-90% of the games I had in my childhood came from relatives. How would I know about Mega Man without someone giving me one of his games? I've known who he is for years now, but only because of the internet, I had never played a single Mega Man game beforehand because I never had a chance to.

I apologize, I just found this second notion quaint. I have never played a Mega Man game, I became aware of his existence through word of mouth at school and such. I was internet illiterate as a child.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I'm asserting that just because someone plays and loves games, doesn't mean that they know every game in existence, regardless of how big that series might be.

The only reason I know a lot of these characters is because of the internet, like I said, I had never seen them beforehand. If the internet didn't exist and I just saw Mega Man get in SSB4 I would have been like "who the **** is this bloke?" But I knew about his popularity beforehand due to people wanting him in Brawl.


Can you read? 80-90% of the games I had in my childhood came from relatives. How would I know about Mega Man without someone giving me one of his games? I've known who he is for years now, but only because of the internet, I had never played a single Mega Man game beforehand because I never had a chance to.

Well Sakurai is a Nintendo developer, he's got to know every Nintendo character in existence, he didn't mention characters Urban Champion and Lip for nothing.

 

[3Bismyname]

I apologize, I just found this second notion quaint. I have never played a Mega Man game, I became aware of his existence through word of mouth at school and such. I was internet illiterate as a child.

i didnt even own a computer till i went to college. so ive only been adept at them for about 3 years now

 

[Rock & Roller Wabbit]

Any thoughts on Snake's (potential) return?

 

[3Bismyname]

Any thoughts on Snake's (potential) return?

most people hope for it. i think its possible but just as likely to not.

 

[?????????????]

Any thoughts on Snake's (potential) return?

It's a simple matter of whether or not Sakurai and Kojima want him to return. If they do, he will. Since they wanted him in Brawl, I don't see why that would change now.

 

[Morbi]

Any thoughts on Snake's (potential) return?

I used to be an advocate of his imminent omission, not because I wanted him removed, but merely as it was one of the more logical cuts. However, as someone explained in detail, Snake is going to return based on the notion that Sakurai stated nobody was cut at the time of writing, as such, it is apparent that Snake wouldn't have been removed at that point in time. If we are to apply the precedent of Smash 4's third-party characters, we would find that he acquired the licensing quite early, prior to E3. So why would Snake, a personal third-party character of sorts be missing? The assumption is that he wasn't. Snake is good to go by a preponderance of the evidence.

 

[JamesDNaux]

i feel like this is the case with most people when they are children. just saying

That's the point, people who played Mega Man as a kid are confused when other people never played it as a kid, they aren't taking into account that maybe some people couldn't have played it.

I apologize, I just found this second notion quaint. I have never played a Mega Man game, I became aware of his existence through word of mouth at school and such. I was internet illiterate as a child.

I never spoke with anyone at school, I was a very socially awkward child I'm still pretty awkward, people preferred to bully me then recommend good games. Besides, there are barely any people in my area who play video games, this is the kind of place where you either play sports or you're the outcast who no one gives a **** about. I literally never had the chance to know about some things, I was lucky I had what few games I did.

Well Sakurai is a Nintendo developer, he's got to know every Nintendo character in existence, he didn't mention characters Urban Champion and Lip for nothing.

When was I talking about Sakurai? I'm pointing out that there are in fact people who aren't lucky enough to play every game in existence, shocking I know.

 

[N3ON]

That wasn't necessarily his point, he was merely asserting that promotion was one of the aspects involved in Roy's inclusion. I highly doubt he intended to insinuate that it was the only reason Roy was included, just one of the reasons.

Well there is always an inherent advertising factor that comes with being included in Smash, it's just the by-product of having more minor characters share the spotlight with ones like Mario, Link, Pikachu, etc, in a triple-A game, but implying that Roy was considered because he starred in a recent game (even though Sakurai stated otherwise) and the fact that his game released after Melee, proving advertising was involved (which might be why he was suggested, but not why he was included) as he was saying does seem to insinuate Roy's reasons for being playable lie elsewhere than what Sakurai has previously confirmed.

Like I said, he might've been suggested due to promotion, but Sakurai has stated the reasons for his inclusion, and promotion wasn't one of them.

 

[Rock & Roller Wabbit]

And on the note of He-Fit, who thinks that Sonic's Sonic Boom design will be playable?

 

[NickerBocker]

Can you read? 80-90% of the games I had in my childhood came from relatives. How would I know about Mega Man without someone giving me one of his games? I've known who he is for years now, but only because of the internet, I had never played a single Mega Man game beforehand because I never had a chance to.

Wasn't trying to get on your case, just making a little joke.

I didn't grow up in the late NES era, but that was what I had for video games when I was a kid. I remember getting a N64 with Diddy Kong Racing for Christmas one year, and it literally blew my mind. But anyways, this isn't the time for nostalgia trips.

My point is I didn't have internet when I was young either, but I knew who Megaman was without ever playing a game. Ultimately, if a game was popular, friends and family would talk about it or buy it themselves, and I would get around to be exposed to it. I'm not trying to grill you for not knowing who Megaman was when you were a kid, but I'm trying to point out that good, popular games spread through people talking about it, and if you were lucky enough, a subscription to Nintendo Power (I didn't have one.)

Of course, in your situation it seems like relatives were the main drive to exposure from video games, so if they didn't have Megaman, you never had exposure and that's just how it goes sometimes. I'm sure you had many fond memories from other games, like I did with games like Goemon's Great Adventure, a game no one has heard of even with the internet.

 

[Rock & Roller Wabbit]

I used to be an advocate of his imminent omission, not because I wanted him removed, but merely as it was one of the more logical cuts. However, as someone explained in detail, Snake is going to return based on the notion that Sakurai stated nobody was cut at the time of writing, as such, it is apparent that Snake wouldn't have been removed at that point in time. If we are to apply the precedent of Smash 4's third-party characters, we would find that he acquired the licensing quite early, prior to E3. So why would Snake, a personal third-party character of sorts be missing? The assumption is that he wasn't. Snake is good to go by a preponderance of the evidence.

Now the question is... which of Snake's incarnations will make it?

 

[3Bismyname]

And on the note of He-Fit, who thinks that Sonic's Sonic Boom design will be playable?

unless we are seeing alternate costumes to most of the cast i dont think so. but if we do then sure.

 

[shrooby]

I'm just indifferent to Little Mac, simple as that. Most people who call him a shoe-in are referring to him being in that "leak," which is why I'm calling BS on his overall likelihood.

I think he was talking about that one game that had Jak, Ratchet, and Sly in it.

Most if not everybody here has that character(s) that many love and expect that they don't care about.
I don't care about Palutena or Little Mac. I'd be perfectly fine if they didn't appear.
And I remember many people saying that they don't care about Ridley or K. Rool.
But, and I'm sorry for my misinterpretation if this isn't the case, you seem more than indifferent. It seems more like dislike. Unless what you mean is that you just don't like those who claim he's shoo-in because of such a paltry reason.

And I must do research on that game as I've never heard of it!

Any thoughts on Snake's (potential) return?

I would bet tree fiddy and a whole straw penny on him returning.

 

[Starcutter]

And on the note of He-Fit, who thinks that Sonic's Sonic Boom design will be playable?

I don't, and this isn't the place to discuss alternate costumes.

you can bring that here


also, now that I bring that up, why isn't that topic stickied? it's probably important enough, maybe.

 

[Morbi]

Now the question is... which of Snake's incarnations will make it?

Again, Big Boss is the design that I find myself associating with. However, Solid Snake is the most prominent incarnation, he was the original Snake, he was the Snake included in a Smash context. I believe he will return as the original design of the character is not only more notable, but we have precedent to support this. Smash fans expect Solid to return, it would be slightly awkward to redesign him to correlate with the Metal Gear lore. That being said, I believe Big Boss will be an alternate costume. This is the direction Kojima wishes to continue and MGS5 will be this generations MGS4. So it is only logical in my opinion to include both (predominately implementing Solid Snake, of course).

 

[Mega Bidoof]

OK, I'm back, and my roster should be working this time.

*crosses fingers*

Mega Bidoof's SSB4 Roster
2/8/14 Version

52 Slots. 57 Characters (not counting same-time double fighters like Ice Climbers and Chrom & Lucina)


Explanations:

- Large Roster Size: We don't know what Sakurai is thinking size-wise, so there is no basis on what is too small or too large.


*Lack of Newcomer for Certain Series':
[collapse=Lack of Certain Newcomer Explanations]
-Yoshi & Wario Series': The only reason I didn't add newcomer to these series is just because Mario has a newcomer and Donkey Kong does too. If I added a Yoshi or Wario newcomer it wouldn't be kind of Mario overkill. I also didn't have enough room, and some other series would have deserved a newcomer before them if I had more room.
-If I added them, they would be Kamek and Mona. Or Birdo and Waluigi if they counted as Yoshi and Wario characters.

-Kirby Series: The only real reason I didn't add one is because there isn't enough room on the roster without it getting to big. If I had one more space, I would have to add Bandana Dee. Bandana Dee just seems the most likely, especially with Dedede's "Waddle Dee Throw" not being shown, which @ ????????????? pointed out in his Dedede Dojo update video.
-If I added one, it would be Bandana Dee.

-Pikmin Series: It just doesn't seem necessary to have a newcomer from this series. Nobody would really bring anything new to the table, unless it was an enemy like Plasm Wraith.
-If I added one, it would be The Drake's Crew.

-Mother/Earthbound Series: Mother is such a small series (though it is a beautiful and awesome series) that it doesn't really need another newcomer. Maybe in SSB5, but for now it would be weird to give it more characters than Metroid and F-Zero, and the same amount as Kirby and Donkey Kong.
-If I added one, it would be Porky Minch.

-Starfox Series: Kind of like Mother, it doesn't seem necessary. It doesn't need a newcomer this time around. It would kind of over represent the series, and it is fine with 3 characters for now.
-If I added one, it would be Krystal.
[/collapse]

*Newcomers:

[collapse=Newcomer Exlanations]
- Diddy & Dixie tag-team: Sakurai allegedly wanted to implement this idea in Brawl but couldn't due to time constraints. Why wouldn't he do it now?

-King K. Rool: He is one of the most wanted Smash 4 characters, and is the main villain of the Donkey Kong series, which is the only one of the main 4 Nintendo franchises that doesn't have a villain in it yet (Mewtwo is returning as a "villain" for Pokémon).

-Tingle: Sakurai seems to be looking for more unique newcomers this time around, and Tingle fits that bill for a Zelda newcomer! He is also a recurring role, and only competes with Impa in terms of importance. He is the Zelda newcomer makes the most sense in my opinions.

-Ridley: Almost everyone wants him. Ridley = not too big.

-Palutena: There was that leak that Sakurai indirectly acknowledged in a later "Pic of the Day" when he posted a picture of a Palutena statue. Whether or not the leak is true, Palutena makes sense as a newcomer. Kid Icarus was treated as a main Nintendo series in the trailer along the likes of Kirby and Pokémon, and I think it deserves a newcomer.

-Mewtwo: He is basically shoe-in. You could say his chances are lowered due to Lucario's return, but the fact that Sakurai is making Lucario different means that he could be differentiating him from what he is planning for Mewtwo. Not to mention Mewtwo is really wanted among the Smash fan-base, and was a poster child for X and Y.

-Chrom & Lucina: Since Chrom was the main protagonist of Fire Emblem Awakening, and Awakening was a VERY big game for the Fire Emblem series, Chrom deserves a spot on the roster. But since a lot of people are arguing that Chrom would be too similar to Marth or Ike, he should be on an Ice Climbers-like team with Lucina (another character from Awakening). Being a two character team of swordsman, with one being heavy and strong, and one being fast, light, and quick, would bring a unique play style to the table for a character who is constantly called generic and too similar. Though he could also be on a team with Robin, your avatar from Awakening, who could use magic with him too. I would take either one, though I prefer a Lucina team.

- Samurai Goroh: I feel that F-Zero deserves a newcomer, despite it being a "dead" series. All of the other series from Smash 64 got newcomers for their series (Samus got Zero-Suit which technically is a newcomer). If Earthbound can have 2 characters (don't get me wrong, I love Earthbound, it's my favorite game of all time), then F-Zero can. As for why I chose Goroh, I feel he can bring more to the table and is arguably more important than Black Shadow. Goroh can have Electricity-based moves (since his vehicle is called "The Stingray." Though Black Shadow would be cool in taking Ganondorf's moveset so Ganondorf can get a new one.

- Mii: Mii is slapped into everything made by Nintendo where you can choose your character. He is in all the Mario & Sonic Olympic Games for Wii and WiiU, and has had multiple appearances in his own games like Wii Sports, Wii Play, and Pilotwings Resort. As for his moveset, I have no idea. He could have a somewhat customizable moveset, or a default sports-based moveset. I honestly have no idea.

- Captain N: In both Melee and Brawl, there was an obscure retro, or historical, character. While I am not saying one is guaranteed for SSB4, I think having one is likely and would be cool. Captain N from the old 80s cartoon/comic series would be a hilarious addition to the roster! The fact that he is not from a video game makes him even more of a surprise as a newcomer, and the fact that he was from a show that wasn't very well received makes it even more surprising! Captain N would be a hilarious addition to the roster, and as an obscure and historical character, he makes sense.

- Little Mac: He is another character that is basically shoe-in for Smash 4. Almost everyone wants him, he had a popular and successful reboot for the Wii, and he could bring an unrepresented popular franchise to Smash!

- Sandbag: Smash Bros. has had some original characters (Master/Crazy Hand, Primid, Tabuu) and I think it is time for one to get in. An original Smash Bros. newcomer should be a classic one, and not a recent one like Primid or Tabuu from Brawl. Unless we were to get some sort of full-bodied Master/Crazy Hand, the obvious choice is Sandbag. It would be really funny and awesome to watch Sandbag to ironically beat up his foes with the home-run bat! He has an OK chance, but a very high chance if a Smash Bros. original character were to be included.

- Lip: Just like with obscure/hostorical characters, Melee and Brawl both has a retro character (Ice Climbers and Pit who is no longer retro due to Kid Icarus Uprising). Sakurai has shown to have a soft spot for Panel de Pon, so why not add Lip? There have been various Panel de Pon references in the Smash series (Lip's Stick item, Kirby garbage block transformation, and garbage block in Nintendogs 3DS stage), and I think it is about time to have Lip as a full-fledged newcomer.

- Pac-Man: Though Sakurai said that Namco-Bandai's involvement in the game doesn't guarantee they get a third-party, he also said that any 3rd party would have to be a very important character. Pac-Man fits that description very well! He is one of the most iconic video game characters right next to Mario, and was one of the first arcade games that revolutionized gaming and went down in history forever. Adding him would finish the list of the most famous video game characters: Mario, Sonic, Mega Man, and Pac-Man.
[/collapse]

 

[Reila]

Yeah, I myself would prioritize a second Yoshi character before a second F-Zero, I just think a second F-Zero character is more likely.
:3

Yess. Me too. I still dream with Kamek as Yoshi's second rep. Or perhaps Shy Guy.

 

[Rock & Roller Wabbit]

Most if not everybody here has that character(s) that many love and expect that they don't care about.
I don't care about Palutena or Little Mac. I'd be perfectly fine if they didn't appear.
And I remember many people saying that they don't care about Ridley or K. Rool.
But, and I'm sorry for my misinterpretation if this isn't the case, you seem more than indifferent. It seems more like dislike. Unless what you mean is that you just don't like those who claim he's shoo-in because of such a paltry reason.

And I must do research on that game as I've never heard of it!



I would bet tree fiddy and a whole straw penny on him returning.

It's called PlayStation Move Heroes.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Wasn't trying to get on your case, just making a little joke.

I didn't grow up in the late NES era, but that was what I had for video games when I was a kid. I remember getting a N64 with Diddy Kong Racing for Christmas one year, and it literally blew my mind. But anyways, this isn't the time for nostalgia trips.

My point is I didn't have internet when I was young either, but I knew who Megaman was without ever playing a game. Ultimately, if a game was popular, friends and family would talk about it or buy it themselves, and I would get around to be exposed to it. I'm not trying to grill you for not knowing who Megaman was when you were a kid, but I'm trying to point out that good, popular games spread through people talking about it, and if you were lucky enough, a subscription to Nintendo Power (I didn't have one.)

Of course, in your situation it seems like relatives were the main drive to exposure from video games, so if they didn't have Megaman, you never had exposure and that's just how it goes sometimes. I'm sure you had many fond memories from other games, like I did with games like Goemon's Great Adventure, a game no one has heard of even with the internet.

Well I grew up with the SNES/N64 era, but most of the games I played were from relatives, so I did grow up with an assortment of NES games. My first game was Pac-Man because that is the only game that my dad really played, and he's still pretty good at it. My second was Super Mario Bros. because that was the game my mum grew up with, and it's the only game she even knows how to play (she can't even play any of the other Mario games for some reason), and she's surprisingly damned good at it, knowing every secret in the game. Most of the SNES games I played were an older cousin's, I remember she had Donkey Kong Country, Super Mario World, Mario Kart, etc. I never actually had my own games until I got a Playstation (along with Rayman!) one Christmas, and then an N64 for a birthday.

I never actually even owned my own personal favorite game, as my first friend had it and I would go over to his place and play it almost every day. But like I said, not many people around here play games, and I was lucky I had that one relative with the SNES that really got me into games in the first place. I was really ignorant to the rest of gaming as a whole, as I only played what I had and would only ask for new games on the rare occasion I got to ogle the game isle at the store, hell, I had no idea that RareWare (the developers of my favorite games) had been bought by M$ until years after the fact, I was still sitting and waiting for Banjo-Threeie.

 

[NickerBocker]

Stuff

Pretty good roster, the only questionable one i would say is sandbag, but I know how you feel about that one, and Chrom + Lucina.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Pretty good roster, the only questionable one i would say is sandbag, but I know how you feel about that one, and Chrom + Lucina.

I could understand you questioning those two.

I thought you would have questioned Captain N too.

 

[NickerBocker]

I could understand you questioning those two.

I thought you would have questioned Captain N too.

I don't really know who that is TBH...

*quick research*

Oh ya, that one is questionable too, being from a TV show

 

[Reila]

Mega Bidoof's SSB4 Roster
2/8/14 Version

Pretty good roster, except for Sandbag and LIP (I don't even know who she is). Also, I feel that Pokémon will get a newcomer as usual.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Pretty good roster, except for Sandbag and LIP (I don't even know who she is). Also, I feel that Pokémon will get a newcomer as usual.

Lip is from Panel De Pon, a retro SNES game that Sakurai has said he has a soft spot for.

 

[Reila]

Lip is from Panel De Pon, a retro SNES game that Sakurai has said he has a soft spot for.

I see. She looks cool, so I take back what I said. Sandbag, though...

 

[Morbi]

I see. She looks cool, so I take back what I said. Sandbag, though...

You know, we need to represent Smash in Smash. Smash is the only series pertinent to Smash not represented in Smash! Also... he would be unique. Name another character without limbs!

 

[JamesDNaux]

You know, we need to represent Smash in Smash. Smash is the only series pertinent to Smash not represented in Smash! Also... he would be unique. Name another character without limbs!

Rayman.
UbiSoft should totally ask for a character in Smash.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Sandbag isn't going to be playable. That should be common sense.

 

[Rock & Roller Wabbit]

You know, we need to represent Smash in Smash. Smash is the only series pertinent to Smash not represented in Smash! Also... he would be unique. Name another character without limbs!

Rayman

 

[TumblrFamous]

Sandbag isn't going to be playable. That should be common sense.

Sweetie, even if something should be something means ****.

In all reality, though, a Smash original character in general is very doubtful and personally very unappealing to me.

 

[?????????????]

You know, we need to represent Smash in Smash. Smash is the only series pertinent to Smash not represented in Smash! Also... he would be unique. Name another character without limbs!

Sukapon.