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Character Discussion Thread

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3Bismyname

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Lloyd Irving is the main character from Tales of Symphonia. He has his own fanbase for Smash, and even got into the Flash title Super Smash Flash.
Of course, only the former really helps him.
i dont think that helps him at all. i mean Goku and Naruto are in that game as well. and its pretty unlikley that they'll join Smash anytime soon.

edit: oh wait u said former. oh well i just dont see it. hell i honestly never heard of the franchise until fairly recently. so i dont have to much judgement overall. i mean Geno has a smash fanbase as well. so... yeah
 
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G0LD3N L0TUS

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i dont think that helps him at all. i mean Goku and Naruto are in that game as well. and its pretty unlikley that they'll join Smash anytime soon.
Yeah, I acknowledged that the Flash game doesn't really help him ("Of course, only the former really helps him"), though it does help show and boost his popularity.
 

KingofPhantoms

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Pac-man's chance really all depends on whether Sakurai sees any potential in Pac-man. Given Rosalina's moveset, I wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai is able to make a unique and interesting moveset for Pac-man.

I suppose Namco being involved with the development could potentially help Pac-man's chances, but as it was specifically stated that Namco won't be getting any special treatment, I'm in doubt it would affect Pac-man's chance very much.
 
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SuperBrawler

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i dont think that helps him at all. i mean Goku and Naruto are in that game as well. and they'll never join Smash.
Fix'd

Just checked the Smash 4 Speculation Chart. Apparently the ideal 3rd Party candidates are Sonic, Mega Man, Snake, Pac-Man, Bayonetta, Slime, and Professor Layton. And I am really warming up to the idea of Professor Layton.
 

3Bismyname

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Yeah, I acknowledged that the Flash game doesn't really help him ("Of course, only the former really helps him"), though it does help show and boost his popularity.
i edited it. yeah i read through the post to fast. :p

Fix'd

Just checked the Smash 4 Speculation Chart. Apparently the ideal 3rd Party candidates are Sonic, Mega Man, Snake, Pac-Man, Bayonetta, Slime, and Professor Layton. And I am really warming up to the idea of Professor Layton.
i somewhat like the idea of Layton. he's not my ideal 3rd party as of right now. but come Smash 5, sure why not? Pac-Man is the only 3rd party left i still hold out for honestly.
 
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FlareHabanero

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That sounds pretty damn similar to a certain blue hedgehog.
Sonic the Hedgehog makes more quality games then Pac-Man ever could, nor do the games leech off nostalgia. In fact it only leeched off nostalgia for Sonic Generations, and that was justified considering that game was a celebration of the Sonic series 20th anniversary.

I don't see how that should affect him in the first place, this is Sakurai we're talking about, if he does Pac-Man, he'll do him right. Hell, if Mega Man is anything to go by, Pac-Man would probably look more like his old designs too, and he'd take more inspiration from his older games. Gotta keep an open mind about it.
Keeping an open mind for such an incredibly mediocre character is a big fat no.

Also, Sakurai has done a terrible job making many characters right.
 

Starphoenix

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I will say this regarding guest characters: if Sakurai goes through the trouble of making Geno playable after all these years, I will probably bust up. Just looking at his journal entries for Brawl remind me how big a fad he was then. Would anyone even be excited if he were playable now? I guess I would be, but there would be some slight bitterness for overlooking the Dragon Quest series.
 

SuperBrawler

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Sonic the Hedgehog makes more quality games then Pac-Man ever could, nor do the games leech off nostalgia. In fact it only leeched off nostalgia for Sonic Generations, and that was justified considering that game was a celebration of the Sonic series 20th anniversary.


Keeping an open mind for such an incredibly mediocre character is a big fat no.

Also, Sakurai has done a terrible job making many characters right.
I dunno about that last part. I mean sure maybe in the past but I really like the way Sakurai is taking Sm4sh.
I will say this regarding guest characters: if Sakurai goes through the trouble of making Geno playable after all these years, I will probably bust up. Just looking at his journal entries for Brawl remind me how big a fad he was then. Would anyone even be excited if he were playable now? I guess I would be, but there would be some slight bitterness for overlooking the Dragon Quest series.
I dunno, I would be fine with practically any character, and I know if Sakurai adds Geno he would have a reason.
 
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Kenith

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I'm noticing a lot of dislike of Roy.

Not thinking he's unlikely, mind you.

Just hating the character...
Yeah, that
Sonic the Hedgehog makes more quality games then Pac-Man ever could, nor do the games leech off nostalgia. In fact it only leeched off nostalgia for Sonic Generations, and that was justified considering that game was a celebration of the Sonic series 20th anniversary.
Also, Sonic Generations was awesome. That game needed DLC.

Speaking of DLC, what do you guys think of DLC for this game?

With route should Nintendo go?:

50 Characters available on the disc (But no DLC)
48 Characters available on the disc (With 10 more released over the course of 16 months)
 
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JamesDNaux

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Sonic the Hedgehog makes more quality games then Pac-Man ever could, nor do the games leech off nostalgia. In fact it only leeched off nostalgia for Sonic Generations, and that was justified considering that game was a celebration of the Sonic series 20th anniversary.


Keeping an open mind for such an incredibly mediocre character is a big fat no.
Just a wild guess, but I'd say Sonic 06 is worse than anything Pac-Man's ever churned out, hell I think the only thing worse than 06 is ET.

Sonic has a wide plethora of mediocre games anyway, sure he's got a few good ones every now and then, but the only reason he's still going is because he's Sonic the Hedgehog and he's "leeching" of of his own name. It's the exact damn thing, Pac-Man's newer games have nothing to do with the original, but he's "leeching off of nostalgia" just because of who he is, just like people keep buying Sonic games just because of Sonic, regardless of quality.

It's you're own personal opinion that his character is mediocre, and that's fine if you don't like him, but telling people off because they like him is just being an arse.
 
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3Bismyname

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Sonic the Hedgehog makes more quality games then Pac-Man ever could, nor do the games leech off nostalgia. In fact it only leeched off nostalgia for Sonic Generations, and that was justified considering that game was a celebration of the Sonic series 20th anniversary.
im sorry but Sonic hasnt had a good game since the 90s. and im not talking as some retro ignorant fanboy cause i have at least tried most of them, skipping over the likes of Secret Rings and Black Knight obviously, but Sonic would definitely benefit moreso from nostalgic going the nostalgic route. Sega should focus on it's lesser franchises instead of beating this stupid horse more than it already has.
 

N3ON

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I dunno about that last part. I mean sure maybe in the past but I really like the way Sakurai is taking Sm4sh.
I wouldn't put a great amount of stock in someone advocating Sakurai not to keep an open mind when it comes to characters. Without an open mind, we wouldn't have ended up with some of our most unique additions, including several from this time around.
 

Pacack

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Pac-Man talk, huh?

Here's how I see it. Snake is an example of a character getting in due to the owner's (/owners') relationship with Sakurai. The character is only debatably important to Nintendo, and, while it's popular in the general video game community (and, as such, fits Sakurai's credentials for "legendary"), the character is getting in mainly because Sakurai's being loyal to his friends.

Sakurai considers Snake's creator to be a friend, so he added him when his friend asked. That was the core reasoning. (even though Snake fits Sakurai's criteria to an extent regardless.)

Now, knowing that, let's think for a second.

1. Sakurai is working extremely closely with Namco-Bandai for this game. (Close enough that he moved next to their headquarters to cut down travel time.)

2. Sakurai is pouring his heart and soul into this game; he's working himself to the absolute limit and letting people see him both at his strongest and at his weakest due to his calcific tendonitis. He bugfixes and models and brainstorms with these people daily. He spends his lunch break playing this game with his colleagues, likely creating precious memories and developing a strong sense of kinship with these people.

Don't you think he just might consider these people his close friends now? Just like he's friends with Kojima? Don't you think that, maybe, just maybe, he'll want to do something to show these people that he appreciates them? Don't you think he might jump at the chance to see him friends and colleagues happily playing with one of their very own mascots? Don't you think that it's also a possibility that the idea of such an icon being in his game might also excite him? And that's not even mentioning his relationship with Miyamoto. He might go for it just because he knows that one of his close friends loves the character of Pac-Man.

Does that explain my train of thought as a Pac-Man supporter well? Do you see why I not only want, but expect Pac-Man to make it in? I'm not just crazy; I have a logical thought process behind this.
 

Starphoenix

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Oh, and for anyone not in the know on what Sakurai's Brawl journals were, they were a public journal where he answered random questions from people. He also mentioned several characters multiple times which was tallied into a collection based upon each mention:

King Dedede(5)
Diddy Kong(4)

Geno(4)
Ike(4)
Ridley(4)
Captain Olimar & Pikmin(3)
Krystal(3)
Takamaru(3)
Windwaker Link(3)
Animal Crossing MC(2)
Claus(2)
Demiru(2)
Isaac(2)
Jeff(2)
Kawasima(2)
King K.Rool(2)
Lip(2)
Lucas(2)
Mega Man(2)

Oguma(2)
Ouendan(2)
Sukapon(2)
 

SuperBrawler

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Yeah, that


Also, Sonic Generations was awesome. That game needed DLC.

Speaking of DLC, what do you guys think of DLC for this game?

With route should Nintendo go?:

50 Characters available on the disc (But no DLC)
45 Characters available on the disc (With 12 more released over the course of 16 months)
I guess 45 on the disc.

I guess the only DLC I could imagine is Dr. Mario, Young Link, Pichu, Roy, and maybe Samurai Goroh for being in the Melee trailer for some reason. If they aren't confirmed, and if Mewtwo and Ridley are confirmed, that is.

Either that or my Smash 4 speculation is getting mixed up with who I want in Project M.
Pac-Man talk, huh?

Here's how I see it. Snake is an example of a character getting in due to the owner's (/owners') relationship with Sakurai. The character is only debatably important to Nintendo, and, while it's popular in the general video game community (and, as such, fits Sakurai's credentials for "legendary"), the character is getting in mainly because Sakurai's being loyal to his friends.

Sakurai considers Snake's creator to be a friend, so he added him when his friend asked. That was the core reasoning. (even though Snake fits Sakurai's criteria to an extent regardless.)

Now, knowing that, let's think for a second.

1. Sakurai is working extremely closely with Namco-Bandai for this game. (Close enough that he moved next to their headquarters to cut down travel time.)

2. Sakurai is pouring his heart and soul into this game; he's working himself to the absolute limit and letting people see him both at his strongest and at his weakest due to his calcific tendonitis. He bugfixes and models and brainstorms with these people daily. He spends his lunch break playing this game with his colleagues, likely creating precious memories and developing a strong sense of kinship with these people.

Don't you think he just might consider these people his close friends now? Just like he's friends with Kojima? Don't you think that, maybe, just maybe, he'll want to do something to show these people that he appreciates them? Don't you think he might jump at the chance to see him friends and colleagues happily playing with one of their very own mascots? Don't you think that it's also a possibility that the idea of such an icon being in his game might also excite him? And that's not even mentioning his relationship with Miyamoto. He might go for it just because he knows that one of his close friends loves the character of Pac-Man.

Does that explain my train of thought as a Pac-Man supporter well? Do you see why I not only want, but expect Pac-Man to make it in? I'm not just crazy; I have a logical thought process behind this.
Great, now I need a good reason to expect Pichu to be in.
 
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Kenith

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I guess 45 on the disc.

I guess the only DLC I could imagine is Dr. Mario, Young Link, Pichu, Roy, and maybe Samurai Goroh for being in the Melee trailer for some reason. If they aren't confirmed, and if Mewtwo and Ridley are confirmed, that is.

Either that or my Smash 4 speculation is getting mixed up with who I want in Project M.
I can whip up a hypothetical DLC roster.
 

3Bismyname

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Yeah, that


Also, Sonic Generations was awesome. That game needed DLC.

Speaking of DLC, what do you guys think of DLC for this game?

With route should Nintendo go?:

50 Characters available on the disc (But no DLC)
45 Characters available on the disc (With 12 more released over the course of 16 months)
i could see Nintendo forcing the team to release before the game is completely fleshed out due to their current financial burdens thereby making some characters unavailable at the get go. similar to how PSABR was "supposed" to launch with Isaac and Kat and the Heavenly Sword/Wipeout stage in the game but due to not being done on time they were available dlc later. in this scenario i can see characters, stages, trophies and music, maybe/hopefully costumes and future patches down the line at least within the first year.
 
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FlareHabanero

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Just a wild guess, but I'd say Sonic 06 is worse than anything Pac-Man's ever churned out, hell I think the only thing worse than 06 is ET.
First off, I will say that people claiming Sonic Next Gen is one of the worst games ever created are exaggerating how bad the game is. Going by the Sonic series alone, I can name several games that are much worse then that game, like Sonic Labyrinth, Sonic Eraser, Sonic Blast, and Shadow the Hedgehog. That's not even dwelling into legitimately atrocious games like Stargazers and Awesome Possum ...Kicks Dr. Machino's Butt.

Sonic has a wide plethora of mediocre games anyway, sure he's got a few good ones every now and then, but the only reason he's still going is because he's Sonic the Hedgehog and he's "leeching" of of his own name. It's the exact damn thing, Pac-Man's newer games have nothing to do with the original, but he's "leeching off of nostalgia" just because of who he is, just like people keep buying Sonic games just because of Sonic, regardless of quality.
Sonic isn't the series that constantly reminds you of the existence of the first installment with every single installment in the series.
The only leeching here is the company SEGA itself being heavily reliant on the series, but that's a different subject for another day.
Also if this logic is truly one in the same, how come the Pac-Man series does a lot more horribly in practice?
 

Kenith

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Sonic isn't the series that constantly reminds you of the existence of the first installment with every single installment in the series.
The only leeching here is the company SEGA itself being heavily reliant on the series, but that's a different subject for another day.
Also if this logic is truly one in the same, how come the Pac-Man series does a lot more horribly in practice?
I'm not entirely sure what this pertains to but it's true.
 

3Bismyname

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let's kill off Sonic and make Billy Hatcher the new company mascot. (i've been playing a lot of that game lately and i want a sequel now)
 
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JamesDNaux

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First off, I will say that people claiming Sonic Next Gen is one of the worst games ever created are exaggerating how bad the game is. Going by the Sonic series alone, I can name several games that are much worse then that game, like Sonic Labyrinth, Sonic Eraser, Sonic Blast, and Shadow the Hedgehog. That's not even dwelling into legitimately atrocious games like Stargazers and Awesome Possum ...Kicks Dr. Machino's Butt.


Sonic isn't the series that constantly reminds you of the existence of the first installment with every single installment in the series.
The only leeching here is the company SEGA itself being heavily reliant on the series, but that's a different subject for another day.
Also if this logic is truly one in the same, how come the Pac-Man series does a lot more horribly in practice?
06 was riddled with glitches and loading screens that were just completely awful and should not have been in a finished game. Though I can see personal opinions coming through here, since you listed Shadow the Hedgehog as being worse than Sonic 06, I found it to be an enjoyable game for what it was.

Pac-Man does worse because there are less people who still have nostalgia for it and still play video games, whereas most Sonic fans are still waiting for the next Sonic game so they can trash it to hell and back. Sonic does better because he's become more prominent, not because his games are better.
 

Johnknight1

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That is humorous, entirely arbitrary, but humorous nonetheless. If I recall correctly, did people not say the same exact thing about Wii Fit Trainer? Actually, they didn't, as literally no one expected such an absurd addition.
No one thought of Wii Fit Trainer because (in my case) we didn't know it was a character or because we were too busy listening to people argue over minute and quite frankly "no hope" characters (like one Anna), or falsified debates like Medusa vs. the Eggplant Wizard vs. Palutena, Sheik vs. Impa (still causes cancer), and everything Fire Emblem and Pokémon.

Also, if we're going to apply the "because Wii Fit Trainer" idea, apply it to the characters that fit her description:
-Hugely unique and has a moveset, skillset, and playstyle unlike any other potential character.
-The main character of a franchise that has sold over 40 million copies.
-A character that draws a unique market from a unique IP.

I'm sorry, but Anna isn't that. Anna isn't and never will be on the Wii Fit Trainer's level.

And if you're going to pull up that point randomly with no basis, then tell me, did people not say the same thing about Link's Uncle from A Link to the Past=???
 

Rebellious Treecko

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This is my roster with 10 DLC Characters:
View attachment 8167
Ridley is DLC. Sadness, but not much sadness. No third FE character sadness me a bit, too.

Overall, it's a "safe" roster. I'd love the DLC characters in. And Dillon's a cool guy.

----

And I've been wondering: I noticed that I critique rosters based on what I want for the most part, rather than based on any real predictions...
I mean, I don't like rosters with some characters removed, no newcomers for certain series, etc. but it's a very real possibility nonetheless.

Does anyone else wonder about this?

Then again, I don't know what to predict exactly.

-----
 
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Kenith

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And I've been wondering: I noticed that I critique rosters based on what I want for the most part, rather than based on any real predictions...
I mean, I don't like rosters with some characters removed, no newcomers for certain series, etc. but it's a very real possibility nonetheless.
Does anyone else wonder about this?
Then again, I don't know what to predict exactly.
-----
Ah, the unseen art of cynical speculating.
 
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NintenRob

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this my roster

Mario: Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, Rosalina.
All these characters are confirmed, but even if Rosalina hadn't been revealed I would still have her.

Mario spin-offs: DK, Diddy, Cranky, Yoshi, Wario.
Cranky has dixie beaten in about every category besides popularity, he's more relevant and has a greater moveset potential.

Zelda: Link, Zelda/Sheik, Ganondorf, Toon Link, Tingle.
Wether you like it or not Tingle is the most likely Zelda newcomer as he's the only character in the series to get his own games, I'm not saying he's the only character who could get in but he is most likely.

Space characters: Zero Suit/Samus, Ridley, Fox, Falco, Wolf.
I don't think Ridley is to big therefore I think he should be playable (is there anyone who thinks that ridley isn't to big but shouldn't be playable?) and Star Fox series is fine and should just make Falco more unique.

Sakurai's pets: Kirby, King Dedede, Meta Knight, Pit, Palutena.
We had the leak, she has good potential and extremely popular, why wouldn't I have Palutena on my list.

FE/EB: Marth, Ike, Robin, Ness, Lucas.
Robin because of magic and hair colour but I wouldn't care that much if chrom got in first. no reason to cut the others either.

Pokemon: Pikachu, Greninja/Braixen/Chespin, Lucario, Blaziken, Jigglypuff.
Kalos Trainer and Blaziken is completely personal preference and what I think would be the best characters. I cut the original trainer to avoid overrepping gen 1 and because the new games need a character and these guys would be the best bet.
also Blaziken is one of the most popular pokemon in eyes of both casual and competitive pokemon players and is most likely to have an important role in the anime.

vet single reps: C. Falcon, Olimar, Ice Climbers, R.O.B., Mr Game & Watch.
do I really need to explain these? no reason to cut Rob.

newcomer single reps: Villager, Little Mac, Shulk, Wii Fit Trainer, Takamaru.
Sorry Isaac, I don't know you well enough and Xenoblade is probably more popular than all your games combined.
Little Mac is an obvious choice afte
r having his series revived with punch out wii.
As stated above Xenoblade was very popular and Shulk would make a good modern ip rep.
Takamaru would be the Retro character like Pit and Ice Climbers, has good potential aswell.

Third party: 8-Bit Man, Sonic, Megaman, Pac Man.
8-Bit Man Would be like the G&W of the 8-bit era, he would also be the new retro WTF character of the game. for an idea of what he would do, go check out the moveset I made for him.
Pac Man seems like an obvious choice because namco's helping with the game and he's nearly as well-known as Mario. I think he has nice potential as well.
I have no idea what to think of snake because sony I've heard wants to put him in psasbr and if that happens I doubt Nintendo will allow sakurai to put him in, and wasn't he put in brawl as a favour and it could take another to make him return???? I don't know so I just left him out.

what do you think? be sure to check out the 8-Bit Man support thread.
 

AEMehr

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I've come to a decision, here's my newest roster (completely redone again back to the coloured squares).

Time to give some short descriptions, firstly, there are no cuts, as per usual. Though this time I've opted to leave out Roy.
I'd like to start by saying that I like the way the roster looks, but I think it would look better if the main 10 characters were in the center instead of at the edges. But the icon design looks really nice.
Also no Little Mac? Living dangerously there pal, considering he's like the only newcomer everyone would generally consider a shoe-in at this point. But yeah interesting choice there, any reason why you chose to not include him (Out of curiosity)?
King K. Rool and Ridley: Getting this out of the way, they're the two most requested newcomers and their time is long overdue.
I can agree with this.
Dixie Kong: A few series got 2-3 new characters before, and DK has always gotten the shaft, it's about time he gets some more newcomers.
I could see this happening, but I personally think it's not that likely.
Takamaru: The expected retro choice and the last one needed to have the "Famicom Four" back together.
Famicom Four? Are you referring to Link, Pit, and Samus as well? Never really thought of it like that, hmm...
Palutena: Even if that very convincing leak is a fake, she's still the best option for the second Kid Icarus character.
#teamreal
Isaac: A popular character with a shot of getting promoted, though if we get any other character, they're taking his spot here.
I can agree with this mindset.
Krystal: A unique and popular choice that Sakurai would probably go for this time, there's nothing holding her back other than a made up "max reps" rule.
I wouldn't agree with Star Fox getting Krystal, but that really is mostly for the Maximum Characters per Franchise "rule". However for the sake of essentially having something basically the same but for another franchise, maybe consider Black Shadow? Guy is supposedly elite in Japan because of his voice actor.
Chrom: Since people seem to hate Roy, and a Fire Emblem newcomer is so inevitable, I just went with the safest option available because I don't give a ****.
Makes sense, not my personal choice but makes sense all the same.
Lip: A series often referenced by Sakurai, he once feared adding her because of obscurity, but with FE gaining global popularity, Lip could use the boost.
Eh, two majorly Japanese exclusive characters? I dunno, I think you might have to pick between Lip and Takamaru. I just don't see it happening this time around.
Pac-Man: What, no Little Mac? Miis? Right, I don't believe that "leak" for a second, the Pac is here on his own merits, with a little help from Namco's involvement.
Pac's an okay choice. I mean I'd love to see him in the game, but for a third-party character he doesn't really add to the hype-meter substantially (Unlike Snake, Sonic, and Mega Man did). He's more expected than wanted which may not be worth the extra effort to be added into the game.
---
This is my roster with 10 DLC Characters:
View attachment 8167
Well 8 new characters in the main roster would kinda be disappointing.
Ridley being DLC would be pretty disappointing.
Ghirahim and Syrup as DLC would be very disappointing. s:
But Dillon being in there fixes pretty much all of this (But seriously, I'd much rather have Ridley be in the main roster).

Also, partially late but...
Takamaru. Though, considering how unknown he is...

Do you think he will be grouped with Little Mac and Ice Climbers, or Mr. Game & Watch?
I imagine Takamaru would either be grouped with the Zelda franchise or the Ice Climbers.
Game&Watch will probably be paired with the Third-Party characters again (Or Otherworldly fighters as I've titled the row / column).
 
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AEMehr

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Ghirahim is on my roster regardless.
Figured.
Basically, the DLC roster was a test.
Do you want a great amount immediately,
or do you want way more over the course of as year?
I'd like to see more characters come out as the year goes by, sure.

But I think Ridley is more like an essential character to be put in the main roster than an extra, considering pretty much every other DLC character you have there aren't really necessary. So yeah, I'd be moreso fine with this concept if fighters like Mewtwo and Ridley were in the main game from the getgo.
 
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Kenith

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Figured.
I'd like to see more characters come out as the year goes by, sure.

But I think Ridley is more like an essential character to be put in the main roster than an extra, considering pretty much every other DLC character you have there aren't really necessary. So yeah, I'd be moreso fine with this concept if fighters like Mewtwo and Ridley were in the main game from the getgo.
Alright, Takamaru is DLC, then. I honestly dislike it as I'd rather have a complete package when I get the game.
 

AEMehr

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Alright, Takamaru is DLC, then. I honestly dislike it as I'd rather have a complete package when I get the game.
Oh I would too, but more content overall is always nice. And considering the best case scenario is fifty characters (with people generally considering something around 45 more likely), an additional 5-10 characters isn't that bad when you think about it.
 
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XStarWarriorX

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Yes i'm back, though not i'm not everywhere like I usually am. been busy.

Though I can't sleep.....

To stay on topic and not get told by the lovely harley....


This is my roster with 10 DLC Characters:
View attachment 8167
Love your character choices. Although I don't believe the game will be getting DLC, those 10 characters seem like cool choices, some may not happen ( like lucy) but you have cool taste. I still think the roster will be 45-50 no cuts, no DLC.

bye for now.
 
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Vez

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Apart from Chrom, who I've never really cared about, I'd totally be down with that roster.
 
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