Character Discussion Thread

[JamesDNaux]

Not really. And he is a mascot of Ubisoft but not someone I'll call iconic. I mean for almost 3-4 years before Origins and Legends, the Rabbids were MORE popular than Rayman himself.

I feel like iconic is stretching it.

If Mega Man qualifies as an icon, then Rayman does as well.

The Rabbids were never more popular, and Rayman is still higher. Combine the two, and the sales are higher than Mega Man.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Can Shantae be considered too sexual for smash?

 

[Kenith]

Can Shantae be considered too sexual for smash?

Depends on the design they use, really. I think the Pirate's Curse design is a bit too sexualized for Smash, but the Half-Genie Hero/Risky's Revenge designs are okay.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Depends on the design they use, really. I think the Pirate's Curse design is a bit too sexualized for Smash, but the Half-Genie Hero/Risky's Revenge designs are okay.

Awww, I love that design based on artstyle alone

 

[Champ Gold]

If Mega Man qualifies as an icon, then Rayman does as well.

The Rabbids were never more popular, and Rayman is still higher. Combine the two, and the sales are higher than Mega Man.

Dude, you're kinda being delusional here. Rabbids pretty much sorta of replaced Rayman and gotten their own show and Ubisoft became more of that 'Assassin's Creed company moreso'. Rayman got somewhat support but it wasn't even close until 2011.

Plus Megaman had 25+ years going for him with MORE influence and history with Nintendo and has been a profitable series for a while before it drop but it still had some steadily sales.

Rayman sales are all over the place and is inflated from ports and mostly been on PS consoles more.

 

[Ura]

I actually knew about the Rabbid series (played a PC game of it before) and only heard about Rayman like once or twice before the leak. Before that happened, I was always under the impression that Rayman was just a typical platformer protagonist.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Dude, you're kinda being delusional here. Rabbids pretty much sorta of replaced Rayman and gotten their own show and Ubisoft became more of that 'Assassin's Creed company moreso'. Rayman got somewhat support but it wasn't even close until 2011.

Plus Megaman had 25+ years going for him with MORE influence and history with Nintendo and has been a profitable series for a while before it drop but it still had some steadily sales..

Sales are sales, that's not delusional.

If Rayman can come back from getting replaced, that definitely says something about him. Rabbids TV show? Rayman had a TV show, he even had his own line of Happy Meal toys. Rayman is the reason Ubisoft is even around, that's a lot of influence.

Ubisoft has been supporting the Wii U and 3DS far more than anyone else to boot.

mostly been on PS consoles more.

 

[Champ Gold]

Sales are sales, that's not delusional.

If Rayman can come back from getting replaced, that definitely says something about him. Rabbids TV show? Rayman had a TV show, he even had his own line of Happy Meal toys. Rayman is the reason Ubisoft is even around, that's a lot of influence.

Ubisoft has been supporting the Wii U and 3DS far more than anyone else to boot.

Yeah and it's support is Just Dance rehashes and that's so wonderful right. Rayman is barely the reason. Are you forgetting Assassin's Creed, Just Dance, their other IPs, Splinter Cell, other Tom Clancy games and their licensing games. Rayman was barely the reason. I'm not saying he didn't do jack but saying he's the REASON they are still around is crazy.

Plus I hate the Snake excuse because it was a favor out of Kojima. Outside of that, he's the only exception. It's why people say begging for Cloud or Sora is bad because they haven't had any major games on Nintendo consoles and is being ate out by the 2.5 HD ports

 

[JamesDNaux]

Yeah and it's support is Just Dance rehashes and that's so wonderful right. Rayman is barely the reason. Are you forgetting Assassin's Creed, Just Dance, their other IPs, Splinter Cell, other Tom Clancy games and their licensing games. Rayman was barely the reason. I'm not saying he didn't do jack but saying he's the REASON they are still around is crazy.

If you think Rayman is not an icon, I cannot help your ignorance. I said he was the reason they are still around, not that he's what keeps them afloat. Back in the 90's Ubisoft was not a big company, they were very small and hardly notable. The success of the first two Rayman games led to them growing into the giant they are today, long before any of those other games existed.

I've already made a case about this many times before, and I don't particularly care to continue getting snarky responses.

 

[Champ Gold]

If you think Rayman is not an icon, I cannot help your ignorance. I said he was the reason they are still around, not that he's what keeps them afloat. Back in the 90's Ubisoft was not a big company, they were very small and hardly notable. The success of the first two Rayman games led to them growing into the giant they are today, long before any of those other games existed.

I've already made a case about this many times before, and I don't particularly care to continue getting snarky responses.

Look he's famous, but I'm not gonna consider him an icon. He's a memorable franchise, I can't lie about that. I know that but to say he's an icon is pushing it. Icon is level of big time famous level, a level where you're one of the biggest name in gaming, I don't consider him the level of Mario, Master Chief, Pikachu, Sonic, Pac-Man or even Link

 

[BluePikmin11]

There you go again, a large chunk of your argument is based on your own assumptions on what Sakurai may or may not do. We have actual evidence of what to expect of a third party, and absolutely no evidence suggesting to the contrary.

I certainly think the ballot is something suggests he may be open to more choices. It's not wrong to assume really, there wasn't any evidence that two Mario newcomers would be added, but some people assumed that Rosalina and her critically acclaimed successful Galaxy games would have Sakurai add her and look at it right now; and a few assumed Bowser Jr. would be added due to NSMB and his recurring appearances in the games and look at the situation right now.

Sakurai isn't going to flat-out say exactly which type of character he's going to add other-wise he'd be giving away the surprise value. Though he does give some hints, though they are sometimes very vague to the point it's hard to guess which one of that type of character he will add.

For example check the article about Sakurai's change of direction with adding characters:
http://nintendoeverything.com/sakurai-change-of-direction-may-be-needed-for-next-smash-bros/

“It isn’t a matter of ‘if the next game has 50 characters, that’ll be enough.’ There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of playable characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive…. In terms of quantity, we’ve probably already reached the limit of what’s feasible. I think a change of direction may be what’s needed.”

Very vague, but it does suggest that the way Sakurai adds newcomers in Smash 4 will change drastically, and the characters like Villager and Wii Fit Trainer show this. And I think the ballot's rule of allowing to vote any video game character shows that Sakurai is able to add a character who is less iconic than what have in the Smash 4 roster already, even though it is very vague and doesn't directly confirm anyone specific. It is a plausible possibility.

Can't compare to retros? That's ironic. You've been comparing her to regular Nintendo characters this whole time.

I mean I don't think he will apply retro logic to third-parties. They really don't correlate with each other. This is another whole argument though, and you don't think retro criteria exists anyway, so I don't want to continue this.

I feel bad for you there, just because the developer teases a sequel doesn't mean it's happening. I know that pain all too well.

Platinum Games isn't owned by Microsoft right now, they pretty much can make games for Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo anytime they want.

Good reviews =/= iconic.

Elvis Presley is iconic, his music lives on long after his death and people around the world know him regardless of if they listen to his music or not. Mario, Pac-Man, etc are comparable to this, even someone with vague knowledge of games knows them and two of them are still living on legacy alone. You have some weird assumption that because Bayonetta has fans, she's somehow iconic. Every character has fans, how does someone using a Bayonetta avatar mean anything? I'm using a Lip avatar, is she suddenly iconic?

Maybe I've been using the wrong word here, but still I do see her pretty often in websites and from many gamers here the six years I've been on the internet. Using your sales logic, the franchise having sold 2 million in total, she is more-so than most games being posted on the app store and many minor indie games on the Wii U that's not garnering much attention right now. Though I'm not just using fans alone, I'm using franchise popularity in account too, and her franchise is pretty popular, though not as uber popular as Mario, Sonic, and Pac-Man. It's enough for me to think she's a qualifiable candidate for Smash DLC.

She caused a minor amount of notice when her second game was Wii U exclusive.

That is false though. It caused a large noticeable amount of controversy with it being a Wii U exclusive within Xbox and Playstation fans alike.

She has to be compared to them because they are the bar she has to meet yet is nowhere near, third party characters are a special case, for far more than one reason. Until Sakurai says "I don't care who it is, if they've been in a game then it's possible" then the iconic status holds true.

She has to? Unless he flat-out states that they have to be very iconic characters, then I don't think the iconic status holds true yet and has to be treated as gospel like Gematsu. Listen, I understand the notion iconic characters here, but both possibilities have to be considered even if the chances are low.

 

[JamesDNaux]

@ BluePikmin11

Your resolve is strong and admirable.


It's increasingly clear that you're not going to sway for as long as that remains, for better or worse.









Or maybe I'm just bad at getting a point across. In any case, I'm done with pointless debates.

Earthworm Jim for Smash.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Wouldn't call it pointless... I did that with Robin and Rosalina and disregarded the possibility that they might get in, and look where that went, after I relied on people who suggest popular characters here and got proven wrong by Sakurai easily, I don't want to deny any possibility anymore. It's why I don't trust most the Smash community and some of the speculators here in Smashboards to help me with my prediction list.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

The pic says it all and @ DustyPumpkin is to blame for making me enjoy the games.

I would mention a certain princess, but she's too controversial to bring up like Ridley.

@Altais I've already sent you an invitation since Sunday. All you have to do is look at your inbox and accept the invite at the group if you want to be on Takamaru's hidden support list.

I'm so happy I can be of service~
Soon everyone shall be on the Savvy side of Style~

 

[Twin Shot]

I want all Vets back.

To me Young Link =/= Toon Link.

Young Link was the character I played as in OoT and MM - which got me into The Legend of Zelda series to begin with. I was not a giant fan of Windwaker - so when Young Link was "spiritually" replaced, I was not a fan. I know, I know, I will give it another shot in the HD version eventually.

You can very much find ways to differentiate the character if brought back - all it takes is imagination. The fact that Sakurai made Dr.Mario his own character again due to him being on his own Melee and that they are bringing Roy back (along with other cut vets) only shows that a lot of vets are coming back - regardless of clone status.

 

[ZeldaMaster]

Here are my stances on the 3 Alt. Costume Promoted clones.

: I was infuriated by his return. But honestly keeps him differentiated from enough because of the number of moves that have differentiation in properties. He's tier in my eyes in terms of "Clone" factor.

: There are threads dedicated to how this could be made better. If there was more differentiation in side+B than launch angle, given a unique down B, and some more unique standard moves and he'd be acceptable. Maybe not likable, but far better off. Otherwise, make him an alternate costume. Nothing prevents him from using the Three Sacred Treasures despite not having used them in the game since he's practically identical to Pit come the end of Awakening.

: I want her as an Alt. Costume in Smash 5. Her difference in the blade is so minute when it comes to actual gameplay when every move she has is the exact same. She should've brought her Lance mastery if she wanted to be made out more unique. Chrom at least had a shield in the form of the Fire Emblem over his daughter for potential to be unique.

Oh really? Dark Pit and Pit are identical in Awakening? Sweet.

 

[Bowserlick]

Some vets back are fine. But I would not every vet back at the cost of new characters. Granted the vets may be quicker to create since the material and resources are there, however they also exist in other games. Some popular characters have not be interpreted into Smash yet.

 

[Burruni]

I want all Vets back.

To me Young Link =/= Toon Link.

Young Link was the character I played as in OoT and MM - which got me into The Legend of Zelda series to begin with. I was not a giant fan of Windwaker - so when Young Link was "spiritually" replaced, I was not a fan. I know, I know, I will give it another shot in the HD version eventually.

You can very much find ways to differentiate the character if brought back - all it takes is imagination. The fact that Sakurai made Dr.Mario his own character again due to him being on his own Melee and that they are bringing Roy back (along with other cut vets) only shows that a lot of vets are coming back - regardless of clone status.

One thing to note is that was originally going to just be an alternate costume, just like . What keeps him differentiated from Mario is more of how has changed since Melee instead of what changes were done to Doc.

is still up in the air and we don't have grounds to really say much other than he did have a couple of completely unique moves such as his D-Smash and Neutral B.

Oh really? Dark Pit and Pit are identical in Awakening? Sweet.

Yep, freudian slip on my part. I meant Uprising =/ But technically they're identical in Awakening because neither of them are in the game at all. TOTALLY SAVED IT.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Oh really? Dark Pit and Pit are identical in Awakening? Sweet.

They even have the same stats and S-Support! Talk about lazy!
No joke, I'd love an FE game where you solely play as Smash characters. Ridley could be a final boss for once to judging by series tradition

 

[Kenith]

They even have the same stats and S-Support! Talk about lazy!
No joke, I'd love an FE game where you solely play as Smash characters. Ridley could be a final boss for once to judging by series tradition

No, Ridley needs to be a unit. I want to see his S-Support with Charizard and Samus.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

No, Ridley needs to be a unit. I want to see his S-Support with Charizard and Samus.

Then we'll have Master Dragon as a final boss
"Hey...You and I aren't too different...Fighting spirit and appearance...I like it"
"Look, I know I kinda sorta ate your mother, but we cool, right? Let's have babies"

 

[DustyPumpkin]

I don't expect Savvy Stylist to be as popular as the major votes like King K.Rool and our Glorious Space Pirate Dragon Leader, Ridley, even against those other lovely ladies like Bayonetta and Medusa she's probably not gonna get a lot of votes, but heck I'm still gonna throw a vote for Savvy Styist when I can.
I might even go back and finish writing up the rest of her moveset

 

[A Distant Demon]

I want to see [Ridley's] S-Support with Charizard and Samus.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I now have a reason for Ridley NOT to be a unit. . .

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I don't expect Savvy Stylist to be as popular as the major votes like King K.Rool and our Glorious Space Pirate Dragon Leader, Ridley, even against those other lovely ladies like Bayonetta and Medusa she's probably not gonna get a lot of votes, but heck I'm still gonna throw a vote for Savvy Styist when I can.
I might even go back and finish writing up the rest of her moveset

I want you to show the results, I'm not a fashion girl, but I'm warming up to Style Savvy as a character

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I want all Vets back.

To me Young Link =/= Toon Link.

Young Link was the character I played as in OoT and MM - which got me into The Legend of Zelda series to begin with. I was not a giant fan of Windwaker - so when Young Link was "spiritually" replaced, I was not a fan. I know, I know, I will give it another shot in the HD version eventually.

You can very much find ways to differentiate the character if brought back - all it takes is imagination. The fact that Sakurai made Dr.Mario his own character again due to him being on his own Melee and that they are bringing Roy back (along with other cut vets) only shows that a lot of vets are coming back - regardless of clone status.

It's hard being an all vets fan because:
is despised for some reason. (Being bad competitively should not be a reason for hatred.)
is thought to be decloned (Young Link =/= Toon Link the same way Pichu =/= Brawl and ssb4 Pikachu)
are thought to be impossible. (I think there is a way, Sakuri just hasn't found it yet.)
is thought to be impossible. (This is understandable, but I still think there is a way.)
has no popularity. (Due to Venusaur and Sceptile being sooooo much better.)
has no popularity. (If we got Pichu, Ivysaur, Squirtle, and Plussle & Minun back, (yup I treat the forbidden seven like cut veterans. Deal with it.) then and only then will I concede on the too many Pokémon argument)

 

[Wintropy]

The only veterans I'm particularly interested in seeing are Wolf, Snake, Roy and Pichu for the lulz~

I'll take Ice Climbers if that's a possibility.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

and Pichu for the lulz~

This gives me an idea. If you guys had to pick a character specifically for laughs, who would you pick?
I'd pick Sandbag. (I'm not seriously considering this what are you talking about?)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

This gives me an idea. If you guys had to pick a character specifically for laughs, who would you pick?
I'd pick Sandbag. (I'm not seriously considering this what are you talking about?)

Tingle, Goku (not THAT one) or Style Savvy

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Tingle, Goku (not THAT one) or Style Savvy

Goku would be bottom tier, his attacks would take too long. ..........Oh wait...........

 

[A Distant Demon]

This gives me an idea. If you guys had to pick a character specifically for laughs, who would you pick?
I'd pick Sandbag. (I'm not seriously considering this what are you talking about?)

none because I dont like the idea of wasting dev time on a joke character

. . . I guess slippy toad

 

[A10theHero]

Caution: Somewhat of a rant coming up
So I was just updating some information on my Spyro4Smash4 site, and I noticed that I had received a comment from someone. It was pretty much just a hate comment saying how Spyro is a dead character, he would be a waste of a spot, and the character he/she was supporting was 1,000,000 times better. The opinion didn't hurt my feelings or anything, but I'm just...surprised.
Seriously, I wonder sometimes if people even understand what I write. A character still relevant in the present day can't be called dead. Death means he/she/it is now completely worthless with a hopeless future. The fact that I use recent games as evidence to back my claims and discuss Spyro's importance to that series should make this really obvious.
In addition, and this goes beyond just my dream DLC, a majority of eligible characters cannot be a true "waste" of a spot. As long as they have something special to add to Smash, their addition is hardly pointless. Also, that claim is implying that some other character is more "deserving" of that spot--as if some birthright was taken from him/her/it. This is a fallacious assumption too. There are no places on the roster reserved for anyone. No character is guaranteed for Smash until Sakurai makes the final call.
Moreover, the character he supported--and I'm not going to name who it was--did have decent chances of getting in. But that doesn't make it "better". It'd be hard to make a case for such a subjective claim. And even if a character is unpopular, if one can make a reasonable argument for him/her/it, I don't see what's wrong with supporting that character.
You know, I'm pretty sure that guy was trying to troll me and/or ruin my day. But still, many people likely do share some of these opinions. And so I just felt like saying something about it.

 

[Wintropy]

Character addition purely for kicks and giggles?

I actually think Nikki would be a hilarious choice.

EDIT: Scratch that.

Master Hand.

You know you want it.

YOU CANNOT DENY THE DIGITS~

 

[Kirby Dragons]

This gives me an idea. If you guys had to pick a character specifically for laughs, who would you pick?
I'd pick Sandbag. (I'm not seriously considering this what are you talking about?)

Ridley.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Character addition purely for kicks and giggles?

I actually think Nikki would be a hilarious choice.

EDIT: Scratch that.

Master Hand.

You know you want it.

YOU CANNOT DENY THE DIGITS~

Why pick Master Hand when you can have crazy hand. Or tabuu for that matter

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Caution: Somewhat of a rant coming up
So I was just updating some information on my Spyro4Smash4 site, and I noticed that I had received a comment from someone. It was pretty much just a hate comment saying how Spyro is a dead character, he would be a waste of a spot, and the character he/she was supporting was 1,000,000 times better. The opinion didn't hurt my feelings or anything, but I'm just...surprised.
Seriously, I wonder sometimes if people even understand what I write. A character still relevant in the present day can't be called dead. Death means he/she/it is now completely worthless with a hopeless future. The fact that I use recent games as evidence to back my claims and discuss Spyro's importance to that series should make this really obvious.
In addition, and this goes beyond just my dream DLC, a majority of eligible characters cannot be a true "waste" of a spot. As long as they have something special to add to Smash, their addition is hardly pointless. Also, that claim is implying that some other character is more "deserving" of that spot--as if some birthright was taken from him/her/it. This is a fallacious assumption too. There are no places on the roster reserved for anyone. No character is guaranteed for Smash until Sakurai makes the final call.
Moreover, the character he supported--and I'm not going to name who it was--did have decent chances of getting in. But that doesn't make it "better". It'd be hard to make a case for such a subjective claim. And even if a character is unpopular, if one can make a reasonable argument for him/her/it, I don't see what's wrong with supporting that character.
You know, I'm pretty sure that guy was trying to troll me and/or ruin my day. But still, many people likely do share some of these opinions. And so I just felt like saying something about it.

The way I see it, Spyro is dead though. He was only used to push sales on Skylanders, just like how Nintendo characters were put in Smash to boost sales

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Caution: Somewhat of a rant coming up
So I was just updating some information on my Spyro4Smash4 site, and I noticed that I had received a comment from someone. It was pretty much just a hate comment saying how Spyro is a dead character, he would be a waste of a spot, and the character he/she was supporting was 1,000,000 times better. The opinion didn't hurt my feelings or anything, but I'm just...surprised.
Seriously, I wonder sometimes if people even understand what I write. A character still relevant in the present day can't be called dead. Death means he/she/it is now completely worthless with a hopeless future. The fact that I use recent games as evidence to back my claims and discuss Spyro's importance to that series should make this really obvious.
In addition, and this goes beyond just my dream DLC, a majority of eligible characters cannot be a true "waste" of a spot. As long as they have something special to add to Smash, their addition is hardly pointless. Also, that claim is implying that some other character is more "deserving" of that spot--as if some birthright was taken from him/her/it. This is a fallacious assumption too. There are no places on the roster reserved for anyone. No character is guaranteed for Smash until Sakurai makes the final call.
Moreover, the character he supported--and I'm not going to name who it was--did have decent chances of getting in. But that doesn't make it "better". It'd be hard to make a case for such a subjective claim. And even if a character is unpopular, if one can make a reasonable argument for him/her/it, I don't see what's wrong with supporting that character.
You know, I'm pretty sure that guy was trying to troll me and/or ruin my day. But still, many people likely do share some of these opinions. And so I just felt like saying something about it.

Spyro as a series? Dead (correct me if I'm wrong. Skylanders doesn't count.) Spyro as a character? Still alive and loved to this day. Even joke characters don't "waste" spots in the roster. My opinion is this: Don't dislike a character because they are from another company, or you have bias to a different character.

Ridley.

I don't think he would count because everyone wants him.

 

[Burruni]

The way I see it, Spyro is dead though. He was only used to push sales on Skylanders, just like how Nintendo characters were put in Smash to boost sales

Spyro with Skylanders feels more like a Rayman: Raving Rabbids scenario.

It was originally sold as a spin-off associated with the name of a fairly significant Video Game Character.

Now that it has established itself with enough of popularity and fanbase, it's further and further separating out.

Spyro Origins on Nintendo NX please.

 

[MainJPW]

Ridley.

Except people actually want him.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Spyro with Skylanders feels more like a Rayman: Raving Rabbids scenario.

It was originally sold as a spin-off associated with the name of a fairly significant Video Game Character.

Now that it has established itself with enough of popularity and fanbase, it's further and further separating out.

Spyro Origins on Nintendo NX please.

I remember reading about a Spyro game being ready at the end of the year taking place after the last game that said Spyro in the title. I was so disappointed when I found out the store likely made it up, heard of a new Spyro game, got excited and then the Skylanders happened. It was that moment when I realized that Spyro was never going back...

 

[A10theHero]

The way I see it, Spyro is dead though. He was only used to push sales on Skylanders, just like how Nintendo characters were put in Smash to boost sales

Yeah, they initially used his name for publicity. But he has his own niche in that series now. He's not just a nostalgia ticket anymore. As the leader of the Skylanders, Spyro has a new role to fulfill. I see it more like a third incarnation of Spyro. He's not the only important character in the series, but he still is a part of it now.

Spyro as a series? Dead (correct me if I'm wrong. Skylanders doesn't count.) Spyro as a character? Still alive and loved to this day. Even joke characters don't "waste" spots in the roster. My opinion is this: Don't dislike a character because they are from another company, or you have bias to a different character.

If you don't use Skylanders, then yes. I don't see why you wouldn't count that game, but yeah. Anyways, I agree with your opinion.

Spyro with Skylanders feels more like a Rayman: Raving Rabbids scenario.

It was originally sold as a spin-off associated with the name of a fairly significant Video Game Character.

Now that it has established itself with enough of popularity and fanbase, it's further and further separating out.

Spyro Origins on Nintendo NX please.

That's a fair comparison. My only question is does Rayman still have at least a somewhat significant role in that game? If not, then that's the only difference I would see between the two series.

I remember reading about a Spyro game being ready at the end of the year taking place after the last game that said Spyro in the title. I was so disappointed when I found out the store likely made it up, heard of a new Spyro game, got excited and then the Skylanders happened. It was that moment when I realized that Spyro was never going back...

Was it perhaps titled Spyro's Kingdom? Cuz that was the initial version of Skylanders.