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Character Discussion Thread

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TheLastJinjo

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Notable? I'm sure Sakurai is going to explore the rest of the dead franchises besides Muramase's Castle and Panel de Pon.
Those aren't the only ones that are going to make just because they are notable.
Didn't I JUST stress that?

Well I do have one, his name is Little Mac. He's an older Nintendo Character that's been brought back into Smash Bros, isn't he?
A: He's not that old
B: He's not a retro no matter how you want to twist your personal view on what retros are.

I don't think you should intentionally, take Sakurai's quotes so loosely. I thought about using "older characters" as a defense for Samurai Goroh, but I think it's pretty obvious that he's referring to retros.


Lip would be cool..... if she is even considered a "retro" character I guess....

If not then whatever, Lip would still be cool.
The franchise is not, but she is. She was only in the SNES game.
 
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Godzillathewonderdog

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Even if Little Mac is "modern" by the standard that he has a Wii game, his reveal has been hyping the old arcade game of 1984 as a selling point (despite Mac not even being in that game).
Sure there are a few references to the arcade game, (mainly the K.O. meter, which I'm sure was added for gameplay reasons, not because he really wanted to reference the arcade game) but there are also plenty of references to the Wii game as well. For instance, they're using Mac's (and Doc's) Wii design, and they also had references to the Wii game in the trailer like the posters that feature the boxers designs from Punch Out Wii, (including Disco Kid who made his only appearance in that game) he also has a belt which looks just like the ones you get in the Wii game. Also the beginning of the trailer is a reference to the montages that took place in the Wii game, they even eat chocolate bars, which wasn't even a thing until the Wii game. Not to mention the Boxing ring stage is based on the World Circuit boxing ring from the Wii game.
Even in Mac's artwork (which is a reference to the arcade game) they reference the Wii game by having him fight DK.
 

Rockaphin

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Had a feeling it was just them. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
"fro" how'd I miss that?


Pit was included for his popularity. ROB, I don't know.
Wait, Pit was popular before Brawl? Honestly I never heard of him until Brawl but then again, I lived under a rock at that point.
 

TheLastJinjo

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Wait, Pit was popular before Brawl? Honestly I never heard of him until Brawl but then again, I lived under a rock at that point.
He was in the vain of smash similar to how Takamaru is now.

I also lived under a rock as well. Which is why I mistook Pit for a redesign of Roy and ROB for Wall-E and then ROB 64.
 
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Rockaphin

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He was in the vain of smash similar to how Takamaru is now.

I also lived under a rock as well. Which is why I mistook Pit for a redesign of Roy and ROB for Wall-E and then ROB 64.
Haha, I never heard of Takamaru until I saw everyone wanting him. I guess I still sorta live under a rock.
 

M23-X0

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He was in the vain of smash similar to how Takamaru is now.

I also lived under a rock as well. Which is why I mistook Pit for a redesign of Roy and ROB for Wall-E and then ROB 64.
My little brother thought of Daft Punk when he first saw Megaman in the trailer ^^'
 

N3ON

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Pit wasn't popular pre-Brawl. He was only popular among retros, not generally.
 
D

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I don't care that much about which retro character I want to be frank, however :

Who I expect : Takamaru
Who I want more : Mike Jones and Lip

I'll be glad if one of those are in.
 
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Kenith

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I've been really into the idea of Mach Rider as the retro character. His game was a ridiculously difficult and convulted mess an incredibly unique game for it's time and I think a re-imagined Mach Rider would be a great addition.
 

Starphoenix

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Pit wasn't popular pre-Brawl. He was only popular among retros, not generally.
Having hung around Nsider for the year or so prior to the official reveal, I remember Pit being an all-around popular pick. He managed to place in the upper percentile on the Nsider SSB3 character poll they had at that time.
 

N3ON

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Having hung around Nsider for the year or so prior to the official reveal, I remember Pit being an all-around popular pick. He managed to place in the upper percentile on the Nsider SSB3 character poll they had at that time.
Fair enough, but sites all have varying popularity trends, in general Pit was not at the upper echelon of popularity, which to be included due to popularity, you kind of need to be.

Unless it's popularity among a certain group, like most popular among the retro characters.
 

N3ON

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Again, N3ON rejecting what was said straight from the horses mouth.
Pit being called one of the most popular Brawl requests due to a site or two is like calling Bandana Dee one of the most popular SSB4 requests.

If you'd like a picture of Pit's overall popularity pre-inclusion, you can go ask Chrono.
 

TheLastJinjo

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I've been really into the idea of Mach Rider as the retro character. His game was a ridiculously difficult and convulted mess an incredibly unique game for it's time and I think a re-imagined Mach Rider would be a great addition.
I agree whole heartedly. It's certainly a memorable classic (as awful as it looked gameplay wise) and in my opinion, Mach Rider is not only the most deserving retro (besides Takamaru), but just a deserving character in general.

I'd love to see a move set where he separates into particles as an upward special, have a forward special where he rides his Mach Bike and shoots at you with it, and then of course the gun.

There is only one problem that majorly hurts his chances...



:(
 

FlareHabanero

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Pit being called one of the most popular Brawl requests due to a site or two is like calling Bandana Dee one of the most popular SSB4 requests.

If you'd like a picture of Pit's overall popularity pre-inclusion, you can go ask Chrono.
Well, I can already tell you never were around during Pre-Brawl, because comparing Pit to Bandanna Waddle Dee is asinine. Hell, I'd even say Takamaru isn't on par with Pit either.
 
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N3ON

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Well, I can already tell you never were around during Pre-Brawl, because comparing Pit to Bandanna Waddle Dee is asinine. Hell, I'd even say Takamaru isn't on par with Pit either.
Not if we're just talking about site-specific popularity trends it's not. I said nothing about chances or importance.

I know you won't believe me anyway though, which is why I've directed you to someone who was not just around pre-Brawl, but also pre-Melee.
 

OcarinaOfDoom

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Mach Rider would be a cool retro. Can definetly see the appeal, and think he could be a unique character. Support.
 

FlareHabanero

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Not if we're just talking about site-specific popularity it's not.

I know you won't believe me anyway though, which is why I've directed you to someone who was not just around pre-Brawl, but also pre-Melee.
I would go after ChronoBound if it wasn't for the fact that the guy is a little on the hiatus side.

Also, I'm not just talking a specific site either, I'm talking in general. Hence why I'm easily making the claim that Takamaru isn't on par with Pit, with comparisons to then and now.
 

Rockaphin

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Mach Rider gets my vote for Retro Rep, but I don't really care too much.
 

Gunla

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Why not let him use his motorcycle as a melee weapon and a recovery for his moveset.
Is it really worth the effort to make him into a semi-clone?
Go play Crusade, he's broken as all hell
Mach Rider can be a really interesting choice, I think he's a character that could use a revival. Or Taka. Either way, we're likely getting some old series given a breath of fresh air this Smash.
 

OcarinaOfDoom

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I feel like an old series or retro character is all but inevitable at this point. Didn't Sakurai say something along the lines of wanting to revive another franchiser ala Kid Icarus>
 

N3ON

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I would go after ChronoBound if it wasn't for the fact that the guy is a little on the hiatus side.

Also, I'm not just talking a specific site either, I'm talking in general. Hence why I'm easily making the claim that Takamaru isn't on par with Pit, with comparisons to then and now.
Star was only talking about a specific site though. And I was talking about Pit's popularity, nothing more. On some sites it might've been high, in general it was not among the highest. The characters with the highest popularity get included solely due to popularity. If Sakurai were looking for characters to include simply due to being popular, he would've picked a character more popular than Pit. Unless he was looking for the most popular out of a certain selection of characters.

When did I say he was on the same level as Bandana Dee in anything except site-specific popularity trends? Actually I didn't even say they were on the same level, all I did was compare two characters with similarities in that regard. Putting quite a few words in my mouth.
 

Gunla

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Yes he did:
http://www.officialnintendomagazine...-characters-back-to-smash-bros-wii-u-and-3ds/
Which is why I suggest to not leave Mac as the only classic character, as were probably going to get 2-3 franchises revived with a character.
Little Mac's not classic. He got a series revival as well along with Pit in the last console generation or two.
There's someone else out in the shadow who's been dormant, but I can say that Little Mac is surefire back in Nintendo's status quo as a modern series.
 

FlareHabanero

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Little Mac's not classic. He got a series revival as well along with Pit in the last console generation or two.
There's someone else out in the shadow who's been dormant, but I can say that Little Mac is surefire back in Nintendo's status quo as a modern series.
Oh, and technically speaking that wouldn't be stuff like Takamaru and Lip.
 

TheLastJinjo

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Why not let him use his motorcycle as a melee weapon and a recovery for his moveset
Great idea, BluePikmin! You know I never would have thought of that! That should totally make up for all of his Smash attacks, Final Smash, and home stage. If I've said it once I have said it a million times. Having unique abilities and weaponry will not automatically exempt you from being a semi-clone. There are characters that are just meant to share moves with others.

Leif could use magic attacks to differentiate himself from Marth. But, Sakurai wants him to share moves with Marth because of his identical body structure, design, and abilities. And so he dismissed him. He didn't make him unique because THEN he would be viable, he dismissed him as a clone before he became one.

Mach Rider too has painfully similar body structure, design, to the point where he's just Captain Falcon with a helmet and given his extremely similar body structure, design, and role, he can plausibly replicate all that of which Captain Falcon can do INCLUDING his Final Smash.

And I highly doubt Sakurai can make gun based Smash attacks.

Now I have faith that Mach Rider could end up having an original move set. I can't base it on anything Sakurai has ever done, if anything it goes AGAINST what he's done. I can't bring evidence to promote that he won't be a semi-clone because evidence points that he WOULD be, but I believe there is a small chance he could be an exception simply because he's seen as a character who is important enough to implement to where Sakurai could tweak him as much as possible.

But, it's like a 10% chance Sakurai will add him as an original character. And a 90% chance he will dismiss him as too similar to Captain Falcon. Even his stage would be too similar and obviously his Final Smash.

Is it really worth the effort to make him into a semi-clone?
No, but that's not necessarily reason to NOT make characters into semi-clones. The bigger question is "Is it worth the effort NOT to make him a semi-clone" and while the case with Leif was no, I have faith that MAYBE, It IS worth the effort.
 
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TheLastJinjo

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Anybody can be a unique character instead of a semi-clone. But, that's the weakest basis imaginable to assume it will be so.
 
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Gunla

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Oh, and technically speaking that wouldn't be stuff like Takamaru and Lip.
Actually, seeing as how they've actually seen some appearances as of late... possibly. I wasn't actually hinting at any specific character, but overall Sakurai's sentiment to do something with the Nintendo Trashbin.
 

FlareHabanero

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Actually, seeing as how they've actually seen some appearances as of late... possibly. I wasn't actually hinting at any specific character, but overall Sakurai's sentiment to do something with the Nintendo Trashbin.
I meant more so that they won't get picked under some fan criteria that they are dormant characters, because regardless that's wrong.
 

Gunla

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I meant more so that they won't get picked under some fan criteria that they are dormant characters, because regardless that's wrong.
Indeed. Regardless of fan demand, it usually is down to Sakurai and he could just decide something is better than those two.
Fan Demand is only really special in cases like Sonic or Megaman.
 

Tepig2000

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Well, that was still just one Smash. And with a gun that fires different energy.
Up Smash - Fires with energy gun upwards.
Down Smash - Same as ZSS.
Forward Smash - Same as ZSS's Neutral Special.

See? It is not that hard to come up with gun-based smashes. I came up with these in less than one minute.
 

TheLastJinjo

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You know Mach Rider could shoot Ray-Gun like projectiles with his gun instead of using bullets. :p
I don't think anybody mentioned real ammunition. Also Mach Rider using NONE of his body and having Smash attacks that are all firing a gun in a different direction does not seem plausible.

Forward Smash - Same as ZSS's Neutral Special.
You want him to shoot an energy whip?
[/quote]
 
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Tepig2000

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I don't think anybody mentioned real ammunition. Also Mach Rider using NONE of his body and having Smash attacks that are all firing a gun in a different direction does not seem plausible.
*inb4Saturnreadsmycomment*

You know Mach Rider could shoot Ray-Gun like projectiles with his gun instead of using bullets. :p
It would most probably be like that.
 

OcarinaOfDoom

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I don't think anybody mentioned real ammunition. Also Mach Rider using NONE of his body and having Smash attacks that are all firing a gun in a different direction does not seem plausible.


You want him to shoot an energy whip?
No, that's ZSS's Side Special. Her Neutral Special is the paralyzing shot.
 
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