Character Discussion Thread

[Diddy Kong]

Shoe in is probably overstating it admitting-ly. That said, I also don't see Ice Climbers in competition with Takamaru, at least not in the sense that Mewtwo/Roy were speculated to be with their series newcomers.

To be honest, Roy plays a little stale in this game...

 

[Geno Boost]

Oh the irony.

Yes, I apologize, I did not do my research on this before liking. So I went to instagram, found the Geno post, checked the likes, and guess what? Sakurai hasn't liked the post.

Here's a link to the post in question for those curious, since some people aren't competent enough to post links: https://instagram.com/p/y8qahli46t/

You have to open it up on mobile to check the likes, but Sakurai never liked it.


And nothing has changed since then in regards to Geno.

Unless you have some sort of proof that it has, but I already know that you don't.

No there is 2 different Geno picture it's down not the first picture and it doesn't have green wallpaper

 

[BKupa666]

Know who else is a one-off side character from a game made in 1996 who'd make me "bear-y" happy in Smash?

Spoiler

Expecting Brash the Bear?

TOO BAD, MALLOW TIME.

In all seriousness, I, like @GoldenYuiitusin claimed to have been, was a pretty sheepy lurker Brawl. . .if I saw enough people saying "this character's popular, this character's popular," I'd eat it up, hook, line and sinker. That was the case with Geno for me. Looking back now, Geno was really a big fad in the vein of "Reggie Fils-Aime for Smash." His fans made petitions, tried hand-delivering bundles to Japan, etc., but faded once he didn't make Brawl.

As a K. Rool fan, I empathize with people wanting a character they like to get into new games, but disputing copyright ownerships and grasping at Instagram straws does nothing to help his cause.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I expected that's why Takamaru wasn't added, but it's still a damn shame. If he wasn't made into an assist trophy he'd still have a chance of being DLC.

 

[---]

I am honestly not surprised Sakurai said this. He said that about Takamaru a long time ago... that he would put Takamaru in Smash if he had a new game. Captain Rainbow doesn't count. Samurai Warriors 3 doesn't count. Nintendo Land doesn't count. Only a new Murasame Castle game counts in Sakurai's eyes. I would consider Takamaru a shoo-in for SSB5 if/when he gets a new game.

Wasn't Captain Rainbow repped through Little Mac, and that the character draft for Smash 4 was made way before NL mattered (and maybe SW3?) and his game was localized?

Not disagreeing with Takamaru's problem, but I don't think this disproves the fact that his situation has been rapidly improving, the big one of course being localization.

 

[Autumn ♫]

I didn't even know Melee existed during Brawl speculation. I was still thinking Smash 64 was the only Smash.

 

[Arcadenik]

Wasn't Captain Rainbow repped through Little Mac, and that the character draft for Smash 4 was made way before NL mattered (and maybe SW3?) and his game was localized?

Not disagreeing with Takamaru's problem, but I don't think this disproves the fact that his situation has been rapidly improving, the big one of course being localization.

Captain Rainbow and fat Little Mac trophies represent Captain Rainbow.

Oh, and Samurai Warriors 3 (Wii version) was released in 2009-2010. So, I guess the SSB4 character draft was made before Nintendo Land was announced at E3 2012 since Sakurai did say he finalized the roster around April/May 2012.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I still want to get a VERY clear answer to know wich company is actually owns Geno I want To hear something from Nintendo about him, we already heared square Enix saying "we have nothing to do with him...you should contact to Nintendo for it" but I really want to hear what will Nintendo say about Geno then we will get a very clear answer because the last time Nintendo talked about Geno was in 2006 but what will Nintendo say about him now?

People were spreading it a lot in the internet I have find a lot of who talked about this

Also here is the massage from square Enix I finally found it

also I don't have enough time to replay to everyone here

WHAT! How did you get "we want nothing to do with Geno" from what they stated?
I have no idea how you read the above statement to mean they do not own Geno, but I am going to need you to show your work on how you jumped to that extreme idea.

Whoever responded to an unshown question about Geno, not only then refers to Geno as a game (not a character), but in no way mentions anything about Geno- they certainly don't claim to want 'nothing to do with him.'

Not only that, it is just by a support member of Square Enix. That is equivalent to calling up Club Nintendo and asking them if a character is in Smash Bros. Not only is that person no authority on the matter, but they respond t show that they have no idea what they are talking about- likely just seeing Geno's name next to Seven Stars as a game,and then seeing their company has nothing to do with the game he is from.

The fact that you take a non authoritative person who expresses his ignorance blatantly, and even on those faults, replace the words 'have' with 'want' and 'game' with Geno,' is lacking any sense of comprehension on the entire argument at hand.

EDIT: congratulation for the people who liked his post because they probably doesn't have Instagram or didn't even search his name or didn't do some research about him sakurai has Instagram since 2014

It did because a youtuber got more than 14000 views on this article

Also- if 14000 views on a youtube video is somehow proof to you of support in an idea, how can you possibly dismiss instagram likes? You are bringing up irrelevant information to support your points, and then denying the same coin if it diminishes it.

No, Geno's legal ownership has not changed since 2003, and no, they do not even care enough to discuss it because to Square Enix, he is a completely superfluous character.

 

[RobinOnDrugs]

I honestly never saw Geno as becoming a playable character, even back during the insanity that was the Brawl speculation days.

 

[AncientTobacco]

Oh well. I hope that Takamaru's AT appearance makes him well-known enough by the time the next Smash rolls around.

That, or just give him a new game already.

 

[Deleted member]

Really, things can only get better for Takamaru.

Sure, he may have been rather obscure (especially compared to "that damned dog"), but look at what's come up so far;

-Guest appearance with his own mode in Samurai Warriors 3
-His game finally being released outside Japan through Virtual Console
-Received an attraction in Nintendo Land
-Still got in Smash 4 via Assist Trophy despite his obscurity (this will especially raise some interest among Smash fans that don't know who he is)

(Not including Captain Rainbow in this, sorry)

Just need to see what the future holds for him and his franchise.

 

[Arcadenik]

I really wish that Takamaru was DLC in Hyrule Warriors considering it's similar to Samurai Warriors 3. It would have done wonders for Takamaru's popularity the same way it did for Impa's and even Tingle's.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I really wish that Takamaru was DLC in Hyrule Warriors considering it's similar to Samurai Warriors 3. It would have done wonders for Takamaru's popularity the same way it did for Impa's and even Tingle's.

Here's to hoping that they'll consider any non-Zelda guest character in a possible Hyrule Warriors 2 in the future. I'm pretty sure after four massive DLC packs that the developers would rather spend their resources on developing for a new project since we basically have the equivalent of 4 times the amount of content of the original game. With all the hype that Warriors spinoff had, I do agree with you on your last point.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Here's to hoping that they'll consider any non-Zelda guest character in a possible Hyrule Warriors 2 in the future. I'm pretty sure after four massive DLC packs that the developers would rather spend their resources on developing for a new project since we basically have the equivalent of 4 times the amount of content of the original game. With all the hype that Warriors spinoff had, I do agree with you on your last point.

I want more.

Though I doubt I will ever finish all the adventure maps;
something about them seems a little obnoxious to me, probably the idea I cannot shake that I need to continually 'hunt' for items in them, which makes it ... not fun for me. Randomly guessing where to use my item cards.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Here's to hoping that they'll consider any non-Zelda guest character in a possible Hyrule Warriors 2 in the future. I'm pretty sure after four massive DLC packs that the developers would rather spend their resources on developing for a new project since we basically have the equivalent of 4 times the amount of content of the original game. With all the hype that Warriors spinoff had, I do agree with you on your last point.

Technically, its not really four times the content. Its a small bit of content on repeat with very few actual new content. That said I don't think they'll do Hyrule Warriors 2 right away, and at the same time I don't think Hyrule Warriors 2 will have non-Zelda characters.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I really wish that Takamaru was DLC in Hyrule Warriors considering it's similar to Samurai Warriors 3. It would have done wonders for Takamaru's popularity the same way it did for Impa's and even Tingle's.

It really is a shame. The reason those two characters are pretty great now is because Omega-Force knows what personality is. Even if the characters personalities ARE over the top (like tingles) they make the characters fun, new, unique, and interesting. They could have done wonders with Takamaru whom I'm still upset over.

 

[Strider_Bond00J]

When I saw this image

I literally broke down in tears. It was looking so good for him at that point in time...

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Takamaru huh?

Funny story:
A few days before his deconfirmation, there was this RTC game and Takamaru was to be rated.
At the beginning, I gave him a 20% want, but on the same day, I became a supporter.
I thought of a moveset idea with all these game elements like Bishops and Kings and what-not.

The next day, I woke up, thinking about the moveset and then I watched the PoTD.

FYI I was salty.

Takamaru would be great, with a system where the charge of a Neutral B changes all projectiles in his moveset.

 

[YoshiandToad]

I always wondered why Geno was the breakout character and no one gave a damn about Mallow. Hell, I know I'd personally take stretchy limbs weather manipulator over Geno beam attacks any day.

That said I'd still expect Toad/Captain Toad, Toadette, Waluigi, Daisy, Paper Mario, King Boo, Petey Piranha, Pauline, Solo Luma, Koopa Troopa, E. Gadd, Goomba, Birdo, Nabbit, Kamek, Lakitu, Wiggler, Fawful, Toadsworth, Paper Luigi, Dr. Luigi, Paper Peach, Paper Bowser, Goombella, Thwomp, Dry Bones, Stuffwell and Baby Pink Gold Dry Daisy before either of them.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I always wondered why Geno was the breakout character and no one gave a damn about Mallow. Hell, I know I'd personally take stretchy limbs weather manipulator over Geno beam attacks any day.

That said I'd still expect Toad/Captain Toad, Toadette, Waluigi, Daisy, Paper Mario, King Boo, Petey Piranha, Pauline, Solo Luma, Koopa Troopa, E. Gadd, Goomba, Birdo, Nabbit, Kamek, Lakitu, Wiggler, Fawful, Toadsworth, Paper Luigi, Dr. Luigi, Paper Peach, Paper Bowser, Goombella, Thwomp, Dry Bones, Stuffwell and Baby Pink Gold Dry Daisy before either of them.

...
*Never considered Wiggler*
*Now on the Wiggler Train*

 

[FalKoopa]

I came into Brawl knowing expecting nothing and wanting nothing. I played Melee and Smash 64 after Brawl.

As a result I don't hate any Brawl newcomers, and am pretty ambivalent towards Melee.

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

I'm terribly sorry if anyone is annoyed that I liked nearly every post from ever since Saturday, but the evidence is clear that this whole "Geno is now owned by AlphaDream" thing is a bunch of junk!

 

[Geno Boost]

WHAT! How did you get "we want nothing to do with Geno" from what they stated?
I have no idea how you read the above statement to mean they do not own Geno, but I am going to need you to show your work on how you jumped to that extreme idea.

Whoever responded to an unshown question about Geno, not only then refers to Geno as a game (not a character), but in no way mentions anything about Geno- they certainly don't claim to want 'nothing to do with him.'

Not only that, it is just by a support member of Square Enix. That is equivalent to calling up Club Nintendo and asking them if a character is in Smash Bros. Not only is that person no authority on the matter, but they respond t show that they have no idea what they are talking about- likely just seeing Geno's name next to Seven Stars as a game,and then seeing their company has nothing to do with the game he is from.

The fact that you take a non authoritative person who expresses his ignorance blatantly, and even on those faults, replace the words 'have' with 'want' and 'game' with Geno,' is lacking any sense of comprehension on the entire argument at hand.





Also- if 14000 views on a youtube video is somehow proof to you of support in an idea, how can you possibly dismiss instagram likes? You are bringing up irrelevant information to support your points, and then denying the same coin if it diminishes it.

No, Geno's legal ownership has not changed since 2003, and no, they do not even care enough to discuss it because to Square Enix, he is a completely superfluous character.

WHAT! How did you get "we want nothing to do with Geno" from what they stated?
I have no idea how you read the above statement to mean they do not own Geno, but I am going to need you to show your work on how you jumped to that extreme idea.

Whoever responded to an unshown question about Geno, not only then refers to Geno as a game (not a character), but in no way mentions anything about Geno- they certainly don't claim to want 'nothing to do with him.'

Not only that, it is just by a support member of Square Enix. That is equivalent to calling up Club Nintendo and asking them if a character is in Smash Bros. Not only is that person no authority on the matter, but they respond t show that they have no idea what they are talking about- likely just seeing Geno's name next to Seven Stars as a game,and then seeing their company has nothing to do with the game he is from.

The fact that you take a non authoritative person who expresses his ignorance blatantly, and even on those faults, replace the words 'have' with 'want' and 'game' with Geno,' is lacking any sense of comprehension on the entire argument at hand.





Also- if 14000 views on a youtube video is somehow proof to you of support in an idea, how can you possibly dismiss instagram likes? You are bringing up irrelevant information to support your points, and then denying the same coin if it diminishes it.

No, Geno's legal ownership has not changed since 2003, and no, they do not even care enough to discuss it because to Square Enix, he is a completely superfluous character.

So the one who works at square Enix doesn't know that Geno was owned by square Enix??? I am so confused right now but alphadream said they have no problem on using him and alphadream were mostly the same people who worked on SMRPG (they were a part of square before) so are they 100% allowed if they want to use Geno and mallow in another game? Or maybe both of alphadream and square Enix can use Geno in any game if they wanted? Maybe It's possible that alphadream created Geno and mallow first in SMRPG (when they were a part of square before they made their own company and be a 2nd party for nintendo) wich might be the reason why he appeared in MLSSS

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

When I saw this image

I literally broke down in tears. It was looking so good for him at that point in time...

To make it worse

The same interview that sakurai said mewtwo is just about 100% complete


He confessed takamaru was orginally going to be playable. He failed because he wasn't known enough.
If thats a factor how the heck did marth and roy get in melee?


(As yes i know this was meantioned earlier in the character forum.) (so no slowpoke jokes here.)

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Do we know exactly what Sakurai said about Takamaru? Was he planned or just considered? I justbdon't want people to be misinterpreting information like always.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I'm not going to talk about Geno. I love the character, I think he'd be cool...but he's not going to happen, even if he WAS owned by Nintendo because he's relatively obscure. I know I'm one to be all about "muh gameplay and muh uniqueness", but there are other factors aside from them.

ANYWAY...after some thinking, I'm actually really surprised at my Smash hopefuls outside of veterans. I want Snake (real bad) but if Kojima leaves Konami, we're going to have a baaaaaaad time imo. BUT...here are some ideas I have for future Smash characters, whether DLC or otherwise.

1) Inkling- Stage control/trap moveset, using ink to cover the stage. Attacks can make enemies slip on the stage, and Inklings can essentially change classes with custom movesets. Attacks consist of projectiles, paint roller, and different weapons from Splatoon! I have high hopes for Splatoon doing well, and I think if it gets a sequel before the next Smash, we're looking at one of the most hyped newcomers for the next wave of characters.

2) Tom Nook or Isabelle- Personally, Tom Nook sounds hilarious with my idea applied to him (smacking people with a sack of money), but I can also see Isabelle being made playable because of her newfound prominent role in Animal Crossing. She could use a furniture pushing mechanic (as could Nook), and while I'm in the developing stage for coming up with a moveset for her, I think she's got a good shot for the next Smash (unless they add AT characters as DLC, which I doubt)

3) Captain Toad- I wasn't a big fan of him at first, but the ideas that his moveset could consist of are actually kinda cool. Some sort of gem collecting mechanic that would alter his weight sounds interesting. The mechanic would result in him being so heavy he can hardly jump, or light to the point where he has AT LEAST decent jumping ability. Stays true to the character of a Toad, but mixes in some Olimar with the concept of throwing gems to lose weight.

...thought I'd have more before I started. I'll add more later

As I said earlier, I'm usually about uniqueness and that is evident here. However, these are qualities that I think are important for character selection.

1) Sales....eh. This is my least favorite quality because it KINDA eliminates some cool new ideas (see: Wonder Red). I get that Smash Bros. is a game that takes quality Nintendo characters, but the roster selection at this point is pretty much running dry no matter how you slice it. You already have a tremendous amount of popular choices among several franchises that have been very successful.

2) Uniqueness. When you have a newcomer pool that doesn't have nearly as many sales across their series as previous iterations of Smash have had, you need to look at characters that make sense and that have great potential in Smash. Few characters (if any) play the same in Smash. Even the clones play differently from their base (except for Dark Pit). Newcomers via DLC should be prime examples of this.

3) Relevance. Ah, the much hated quality. I think it's important. It just doesn't apply to everyone. Retro characters luck out. Otherwise, it likely has something to do with character choice. If you look at the Smash 4 newcomers (), a good chunk of them had a recent game in their series, or had reason to be considered "relevant". To save room, I'm going to put my explanation in spoilers.

Spoiler

Villager- Animal Crossing has been big in general, and New Leaf does nothing but boost that. Not necessarily a relevance thing, but could be.

Shulk- Xenoblade Chronicles (great game btw) is a newer franchise that has a sequel on the way. Relevant in Nintendo's plans for Wii U, and remake on New 3DS

Palutena- Sakurai bias, yes. But Kid Icarus also had a new game, the first in a looooooooong time. Would another director pick her if Sakurai weren't there? I'd wager that they would.

Wii Fit Trainer- I think she's a WTF character, but Wii Fit was a behemoth on the Wii, and Wii Fit U already on Wii U.

Greninja- Added to Smash before X/Y was even released. Obvious case of picking a Pokemon from the latest Generation

Bowser Jr.- newer villain in Mario series and has become fairly prominent. Add in an opportunity to use Koopalings as alt costumes, and you're looking at a good choice in general.

Rosalina- Highly popular character, and a relevant one at that. Appears in almost every Mario game since Galaxy.

Robin and Lucina- Characters from new Fire Emblem. A character from Awakening was a given anyway.

Little Mac- Popular choice, had revival on Wii with new Punch Out!!

This isn't to say that EVERY FREAKING CHARACTER FROM HERE ON OUT is going to be hit with a relevance check. It's that each of the newcomers in Smash 4 (except for clones) has some form of relevance. They aren't going to just throw in any character. It also suggests that "relevancy" isn't the only reason why characters get added. Basically the entirety of the newcomer lists have unique playstyles and movesets. Some are in high selling series, others aren't. It's a mixed bag.

Now, I am not trying to be the guy that says, "K.ROOL ISN'T RELEVANT LULZOR. DIXIE IS MORE RELEVANT AND SHE'S A SHOE IN". What I'm saying is that...being relevant is nothing but something in a characters favor. It doesn't confirm them and it doesn't disconfirm them. But it is a plus. It's never a minus.

That's another reason why I don't think Roy (FE) will be back unless they add him via a Veteran DLC pack.

Man. I went off on a tangent. Sorry

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Do we know exactly what Sakurai said about Takamaru? Was he planned or just considered? I justbdon't want people to be misinterpreting information like always.

Planned.

https://www.google.com/#q=takamaru+planned

 

[Staarih]

As cool as it is of Sakurai to mention Takamaru by name, he probably was in a lot of many other characters who were "considered", so it's probably not a huge deal. That said, and as a Takamaru supporter, I do think he has potential and I have faith in him getting the Little Mac treatment next game. Waiting on that Murasame Castle revival... cmon Kamiya!

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Planned.

https://www.google.com/#q=takamaru planned

I was more so looking for an actual quote from Sakurai

 

[BluePikmin11]

I was more so looking for an actual quote from Sakurai

Ask @PushDustIn about that.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I was more so looking for an actual quote from Sakurai

Not exactly sakurai

But this is kindof the video.

(I coulden't find the full video of the interview.)

 

[Deleted member]

According to PushDustIn, he said Takamaru was briefly considered. Not planned, considered.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Just waiting to hear that Vaati was considered and/or planned.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Just waiting to hear that Vaati was considered and/or planned.

You'll be waiting for a loooooooong time then

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I always wondered why Geno was the breakout character and no one gave a damn about Mallow. Hell, I know I'd personally take stretchy limbs weather manipulator over Geno beam attacks any day.

Personally I've always preferred Mallow over Geno. I don't really get the hype.

He confessed takamaru was orginally going to be playable. He failed because he wasn't known enough.
If thats a factor how the heck did marth and roy get in melee?

I believe Fire Emblem at the time was current and very popular in Japan. Whereas Takamaru would be considered retro in Japan today. It's not exactly the same scenario.

 

[Deleted member]

And even if Fire Emblem wasn't a relatively big series in Japan and Marth wasn't a big request for Smash back then, there's still the simple fact that that was Melee, this is Smash 4.
Things tend to change with time, like the case with characters being excluded from Brawl due to being unsuited for combat regardless of what they could potentially do (i.e. Villager) while Smash 4 prioritized their potential over their suitability for combat.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

According to PushDustIn, he said Takamaru was briefly considered. Not planned, considered.

Yeah, those major YouTubers and news reporters always have to depend on misleading "clickbait" to get their views. Just like when they couldn't tell the difference between genderless and sexless when it came to the topic of the Toad species' gender.

 

[Substitution]

Yeah, those major YouTubers and new reporters always have to depend on misleading "clickbait" to get their views. Just like when they couldn't tell the difference between genderless and sexless when it came to the topic of the Toad species' gender.

Well stupidity does tend to bring in more views. It's Journalism 101.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

It's unfortunate how these new Smash games didn't receive any new characters.

 

[Wintropy]

It's unfortunate how these new Smash games didn't receive any new characters.

...Wait, what?

Either that makes no sense or I'm missing a vital part of your thesis statement.