Character Discussion Thread

[Morbi]

I always wondered why isn't Dark Samus more requested ? Is that because of Ridley ?
I didn't played enough Metroid, but isn't she basically Metroid Prime's main antagonist ? I know that Ridley orphaned Samus and all, but wouldn't Dark Samus a little more popular than now ?

I suppose most prefer the universal main antagonist. Not only that, but you wander into the realm of redundancy; we already have Zero-Suit Samus in addition to Samus... do we really need a dark variation of Samus on the roster as well? Many do not enjoy the notion that it reaffirms that Metroid's only feasible character is Samus.

Although, based on empirical evidence, Dark Samus is the second most requested Metroid representative. There is always Higgs, but most people introduce him in a more humorous manner. Dark Samus is probably the more realistic choice (but some people don't want a third Samus).

 

[Gunla]

I always wondered why isn't Dark Samus more requested ? Is that because of Ridley ?
I didn't played enough Metroid, but isn't she basically Metroid Prime's main antagonist ? I know that Ridley orphaned Samus and all, but wouldn't Dark Samus a little more popular than now ?

Unfortunately Other M has pretty much accidentally negated parts of Metroid Prime's mythos. I'm not joking. It's like those games didn't exist at all.

 

[AncientTobacco]

That's true, but there names literally mean "bad Mario" and "bad Luigi"

Not literally.

 

[NickerBocker]

I am slightly confused, why is popularity (Smashboards popularity, to be more specific) being used (predominately) to speculate the chances of newcomers? You guys are just doing it for fun, correct?

Well i am doing it for fun, i know some take it more seriously (I somewhat do, because I am actually interested in what people think because, generally, taking a sample from the population, ie Smashboards, gives pretty good insight on who may be included in the future)

Popularity is definitely a factor taken into account when adding characters, which is why i think people talk about it so much. Of course, popularity isn't the only factor that will get a character into the game, which is why some people like/dislike the polls taken.

 

[Morbi]

Well i am doing it for fun, i know some take it more seriously (I somewhat do, because I am actually interested in what people think because, generally, taking a sample from the population, ie Smashboards, gives pretty good insight on who may be included in the future)

Popularity is definitely a factor taken into account when adding characters, which is why i think people talk about it so much. Of course, popularity isn't the only factor that will get a character into the game, which is why some people like/dislike the polls taken.

I don't have a problem discussing popularity (more specifically Smashboards popularity), obviously it is inherently fallacious to an overt extent. As long as people don't actually use polls as definitive evidence, there is nothing wrong with it. I am an adamant believer that there are many aspects of inclusion, that includes popularity. Notions people blatantly dismiss such as gender, recency, smash relevance, sales, reoccurring roles, and impact are not overlooked by yours truly.

 

[M23-X0]

Unfortunately Other M has pretty much accidentally negated parts of Metroid Prime's mythos. I'm not joking. It's like those games didn't exist at all.

Never played Other M, but it's not good for Dark Samus if this is the case...

 

[Morbi]

Never played Other M, but it's not good for Dark Samus if this is the case...

I would usually argue that the Prime trilogy is one of the most prominent in regards to Nintendo. However, it is apparent that Smash 4 will take inspiration from Other M (based on redesigns and revealed stages). I don't necessarily believe Dark Samus doesn't have a chance, but it is clear that the notion was attenuated.

 

[Gunla]

Never played Other M, but it's not good for Dark Samus if this is the case...

The gameplay is actually quite fun. It's based partially off of Ninja Gaiden and it rather uses Samus well.
Story wise is the issue. The massive, blatant monologue issue. And Samus is Other M styled in 4 and Dark Samus was a no-show. That's one of the big things with Metroid: It's practically Ridley or nothing at this point.

 

[NickerBocker]

I don't have a problem discussing popularity (more specifically Smashboards popularity), obviously it is inherently fallacious to an overt extent. As long as people don't actually use polls as definitive evidence, there is nothing wrong with it. I am an adamant believer that there are many aspects of inclusion, that includes popularity. Notions people blatantly dismiss such as gender, recency, smash relevance, sales, reoccurring roles, and impact are not overlooked by yours truly.

Indeed. I try to look at all the factors responsible for character inclusion. Popularity, clearly isn't the only factor, and it is usually distorted on the polls, due to a few reasons. One may be people mixing both want and chance, without actually thinking about it. Another thing, and I believe this is more important, is the people who are actually taking these polls. Usually the people taking these surveys are the the most hardcore fans of the Smash, i would assume. I mean, its hard to deny when were talking about a game we know little about, on a website called Smashboards. So the most hardcore of fans who actually have done the research will have a much different view than your casual gamer who will pick up this game one day and play it. But this game isn't made to satisfy the hardcore audience, otherwise, we would probably know the roster by now. It is made to satisfy every audience member, from the person who will play the game 2 or 3 times at a friends house, to those who pour hours upon hours training to become the very best.

So Smashboards popularity should really be taken with a grain of salt, because we are not the only audience members who want to play this game. Granted, we may do the most research and look into the finest of details, so we may think we know more, but at the end of the day, there will be characters in the game that casuals expect, and characters in the game that hardcores will expect.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Unfortunately Other M has pretty much accidentally negated parts of Metroid Prime's mythos. I'm not joking. It's like those games didn't exist at all.

It's more that the Prime trilogy told its own little story that's contained within only the trilogy, there's no reason for the Prime games' influence to seep into future Metroid games, unless it's a direct continuation, since its main focus was on Phazon, which was completely eradicated in the trilogy's last entry. I'm not sure if Retro shot themselves in the foot with that concept in terms of leaving a lasting legacy on the franchise, or were wise to simply make their own stuff with it. Other M also took place after Super Metroid, so it had no reason to associate itself with the Prime games since those events had passed 2 games ago at that point.

 

[JamesDNaux]

How is it bad organization if i grouped each character by series? I just did it horizontally...

Pokemon is randomly next to Zelda, where Metroid should be. Kid Icarus isn't beside Metroid, but under it instead. Other characters are randomly strewn about, particularly Layton, who is a third party and is by Zelda for some reason. That's just personal opinion however.

I personally think he's got a fair chance

Layton is a third party

These two statements contradict each other.

Well I haven't put one up in a while so here goes

It's almost the same as mine, just missing three characters.

Overall, I give it a 7/10 for the exclusion of Snake.

S Rank - Mega Man, Mewtwo
A Rank - King K. Rool, Ridley, Little Mac
B Rank - Roy, Krystal, Palutena, Chrom, Paper Mario
C Rank - Dixie Kong, Isaac, Shulk, Tetra, Vaati, Pacman
D Rank - Bandana Dee, Waluigi, Ghirahim, Mii, Lucina, Tingle, Samurai Goroh

Revised?

Miis on D Rank? Way too high.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Fair chance when it comes to only third parties.

 

[Morbi]

Fair chance when it comes to only third parties.

I agree with that sentiment; however, the only 3rd party character that has an adequate chance is Pac-Man. So technically he (Layton) doesn't.

 

[Knight Dude]

I still would prefer Ridley over Dark Samus. Most of the people here would likely agree with that. But I am fond of the idea of using either of them. I think they are cool villains.

Fair chance when it comes to only third parties.

I'm not sure I entirely agree with that. If anything, third parties have to be "legendary". Kind of hard to beat Megaman, Sonic, and Solid Snake.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Sakurai never specifically said "legendary," we don't really know if special situation applies to only legendary third parties.

 

[Shorts]

Well I can't speak for Waluigi, Wario has done plenty to become more than just "Bad Mario". He has two vastly different worlds he lives in, besides the Mushroom Kingdom. Waluigi is still, Luigi's negative. He's yet to be fleshed out.

 

[Curious Villager]

Oh Layton.... His best hope is that his creator pulls a Kojima and approaches Sakurai whilst requesting him to put him in Smash. Apparently he's good friends with him too according to some people so eh.

As much as I hate to admit it. Layton's chances are pretty slim. :/ I wouldn't go as far as to call it impossible though...

 

[Knight Dude]

Oh Layton.... His best hope is that his creator pulls a Kojima and approaches Sakurai whilst requesting him to put him in Smash. Apparently he's friends with him too according to some people so eh.

As much as I hate to admit it. Layton's chances are pretty slim. :/ I wouldn't go as far as to call it impossible though...

Not to say that's it impossible. But I wouldn't put him on the previous third party characters levels. At least Layton is still a well known character regardless of that.

 

[Curious Villager]

Not to say that's it impossible. But I wouldn't put him on the previous third party characters levels. At least Layton is still a well known character regardless of that.

Yeah that sounds about right. I agree.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I could think of a few third parties that would be far above Layton.

Hell, we'd probably get Geno first.

Though I don't like thinking about them in the first place, the three we have are more than enough. Pac-Man would be a fine fourth addition if he gets in though.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I think Layton is ahead of Geno in terms of chances.

 

[Opossum]

The fact that Geno's a Square-Enix owned Mario character puts him miles below Layton, in my opinion.

 

[Curious Villager]

Layton is definitely miles above Geno. If Square wanted a character of theirs in Smash, I'd bet they would rather have someone more relevant to their company than a character from an old Mario game.

 

[Gunla]

Layton's definitely above Geno. If Square wanted a character of theirs in Smash, I'd bet they would rather have someone more relevant to their company than a character from a Mario game.

Not just relevant, but recent as well. I'm pretty sure they'd try and shoehorn Lighting in.

 

[Morbi]

The fact that Geno's a Square-Enix owned Mario character puts him miles below Layton, in my opinion.

I agree with this to a significant extent. Honestly, Geno is one of the least likely 3rd party characters in general. He always was.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Sarcasm.

Oh well. Any better topics than third parties? Kind of null to begin with.

 

[Knight Dude]

Not just relevant, but recent as well. I'm pretty sure they'd try and shoehorn Lighting in.

Which would be lame. You'd be better off with the Black Mage. That guy is cool. And he fits in more visually compared to the others.

 

[Joe D.]

Sarcasm.

Oh well. Any better topics than third parties? Kind of null to begin with.

Mother? Has anyone ever thought about Claus?

 

[JamesDNaux]

Mother? Has anyone ever thought about Claus?

Another Mother character is extremely unlikely, it's surprising we even got Lucas in Brawl.

Though personally, I have to go with Ninten for the third Mother character.

 

[Morbi]

I would probably go for another antagonist like Porky. Ninten would just be redundant in my opinion.

 

[Deleted member]

Sarcasm.

Oh well. Any better topics than third parties? Kind of null to begin with.

Maybe a Pokemon newcomer that isn't Mewtwo (Although hes technically an oldcomer)? I can't think of too many on the top of my head but something like Genesect or Zoroark?

 

[Shorts]

As much as I hate to admit it. Layton's chances are pretty slim. :/ I wouldn't go as far as to call it impossible though...

Prior to last year's E3 Sonic, Snake, Megan, and Layton were the 3rd parties to be.

 

[Rockaphin]

Also, Waluigi isn't from the Wario series.

Yeah I goofed there

 

[Morbi]

Prior to last year's E3 Sonic, Snake, Megan, and Layton were the 3rd parties to be.

Yes, prior to learning that Namco would be co-developing the game.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Maybe a Pokemon newcomer that isn't Mewtwo (Although hes technically an oldcomer)? I can't think of too many on the top of my head but something like Genesect or Zoroark?

The majority here seem to be quite behind Brawl Pokemon reps + Mewtwo so I don't know how successful we'll be in that.

Personally I still want Meowth more than any other Pokemon, but am fully aware his prime time to be included has long gone, despite being one of the most memorable Pokemon currently not in Smash.

 

[Mdilly99]

Pokemon is randomly next to Zelda, where Metroid should be. Kid Icarus isn't beside Metroid, but under it instead. Other characters are randomly strewn about, particularly Layton, who is a third party and is by Zelda for some reason. That's just personal opinion however.



These two statements contradict each other.


It's almost the same as mine, just missing three characters.

Overall, I give it a 7/10 for the exclusion of Snake.


Miis on D Rank? Way too high.

Why "should" they be in that order? I really dont think it matters... Is that just your personal opinion?

 

[Shorts]

Yes, prior to learning that Namco would be co-developing the game.

Pretty much. The leak, that game that Namco-SEGA-Capcom did together and then released exclusively on the 3DS, and then the leak kind of killed most other third parties. Not outright, I suppose, but I don't see much being added besides them. Maybe Snake. Mehbeh

 

[Morbi]

Why "should" they be in that order? I really dont think it matters... Is that just your personal opinion?

He literally stated that it was his personal opinion.

 

[AEMehr]

Where's Midna and Vaati?

Spoiler

They were voted off the original charts. Midna I can understand but Vaati? There was no real harm in having him to begin with.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Why "should" they be in that order? I really dont think it matters... Is that just your personal opinion?

Err.

Pokemon is randomly next to Zelda, where Metroid should be. Kid Icarus isn't beside Metroid, but under it instead. Other characters are randomly strewn about, particularly Layton, who is a third party and is by Zelda for some reason. That's just personal opinion however.

Morbidly ninja'd.

It looks really odd compared to Brawl, Pokemon should at least start its own row.