Character Discussion Thread

[YoshiandToad]

i wonder how everyone would react if we did get a 5th FE rep....

judging by this forum I would say not great...

Depends on what it was. If we had one of the species that transformed as our 5th rep, I think it'd be different enough to keep people's interest. Another Marth-esque swordsman probably wouldn't go down great.

 

[ZeldaMaster]

I don't think Fire Emblem will be getting 5 reps in Smash 5... I think that it'll stay four. In both Melee and Brawl, there were only two FE chars. In Smash 4, there were 4, due to the drastic increase in popularity of Awakening. I don't think the FE series will grow enough to warrant another slot between now and Smash 5. I think in Smash 6 we might see an increase in roster slots... but I'm really just talking out of my ass really. It's Mashedpotato Soccerguy, anything can happen.

 

[Deathlightning21]

I don't think Fire Emblem will be getting 5 reps in Smash 5... I think that it'll stay four. In both Melee and Brawl, there were only two FE chars. In Smash 4, there were 4, due to the drastic increase in popularity of Awakening. I don't think the FE series will grow enough to warrant another slot between now and Smash 5. I think in Smash 6 we might see an increase in roster slots... but I'm really just talking out of my *** really. It's Mashedpotato Soccerguy, anything can happen.

I like your honesty kid, your gonna go places.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I like Fire Emblem....but I do think the series having more than 4 reps would be punching above their weight.

You have to remember most people thought Fire Emblem would have 2-3 reps this time around. As a franchise in smash it's already exceeded our expectations.

 

[pupNapoleon]

To add to that, looking at how Nintendo has handled DLC, they've always bundled their content under the same thematic. For instance, when we got DLC for Hyrule Warriors, they released Twili Midna alongside Zelda's Dominion Rod and the Twilight map rather then having them split up and putting her in the Master Quest pack. Similarly, Link was released with the Hyrule track for the first set of DLC, and the Animal Crossing characters were released together for the second set.

So with that in mind, I think if DLC is done with multiple characters/stages/etc. from the same series, they'll likely be bundled together rather then split up.

The major difference is that in both of those series, the series themselves... didn't actually affect... anything.
In Hyrule Warriors, the content was about what we were getting, be it a new map, new characters, new weapons- the themes were moreso to group it together at all.

In Mario Kart, the themes are not even present at all except with Isabelle and Villager, and even then they don't affect gameplay at all, the stages do, and we can see that the stages are from MANY universes from each pack therein.

In terms of Smash Bros, the characters are everything, which makes it immediately a different ball game than a series that is not an amalgamation, such as Hyrule Warriors. Even where Mario Kart is attempting it, the packages actually do have many courses from a few different games all at once, aiding the idea that the newcomers would not be all from a single universe.

If anyone is buying the content specifically because they are the fan of a single universe, I think the general rule of thumb would be to split it up across multiple buying opportunities. The ones who would not buy it if it is split up are not the hardcore enough of the fans to even target with a package of a series.

You have a good point, yet there are a few fallacious issues I wish to address. It is unfathomable to add another FE character to a roster of this size? You are aware the Pokemon franchise has 5 representatives in a series spanning 6 generations? Mario franchise has 7 reps, not counting DK or Yoshi?

IN addition, you say that veterans have a lesser chance of making it. What about Mewtwo then? He is a veteran and Nintendo decided to bring him back for Smash.

Mario and Pokemon have had tremendous impacts not just on Nintendo, and not just on Video Games, but on the face of pop culture.
I've expressed in great length just what Pokemon did in 1999-2001, something which is an actual study in economics and is labeled as a flat out consumer PHENOMENON, branching into every medium imaginable.

To Say Fire Emblem has had even a Tremendous impact on NINTENDO, much less video games, pop culture, or the economy, is .... daft, to say the least. There is, quite literally, not a comparison to be drawn between the two.

As for Mewtwo being a veteran, he is referred to as New character in the 50-fact-extravaganza. My hunch is that he is a returning IP (Intellectual Property), but will have a much different move set potentially, to reflect all the changes that have happened to his character, the Pokemon metagame, the anime, and his SSB fan base since the last game he was requested to be removed from.
Even veterans like Charizard, significantly reworked, were not called New Characters in this game.

 

[Xinc]

The major difference is that in both of those series, the series themselves... didn't actually affect... anything.
In Hyrule Warriors, the content was about what we were getting, be it a new map, new characters, new weapons- the themes were moreso to group it together at all.

In Mario Kart, the themes are not even present at all except with Isabelle and Villager, and even then they don't affect gameplay at all, the stages do, and we can see that the stages are from MANY universes from each pack therein.

In terms of Smash Bros, the characters are everything, which makes it immediately a different ball game than a series that is not an amalgamation, such as Hyrule Warriors. Even where Mario Kart is attempting it, the packages actually do have many courses from a few different games all at once, aiding the idea that the newcomers would not be all from a single universe.

If anyone is buying the content specifically because they are the fan of a single universe, I think the general rule of thumb would be to split it up across multiple buying opportunities. The ones who would not buy it if it is split up are not the hardcore enough of the fans to even target with a package of a series.


Mario and Pokemon have had tremendous impacts not just on Nintendo, and not just on Video Games, but on the face of pop culture.
I've expressed in great length just what Pokemon did in 1999-2001, something which is an actual study in economics and is labeled as a flat out consumer PHENOMENON, branching into every medium imaginable.

To Say Fire Emblem has had even a Tremendous impact on NINTENDO, much less video games, pop culture, or the economy, is .... daft, to say the least. There is, quite literally, not a comparison to be drawn between the two.

As for Mewtwo being a veteran, he is referred to as New character in the 50-fact-extravaganza. My hunch is that he is a returning IP (Intellectual Property), but will have a much different move set potentially, to reflect all the changes that have happened to his character, the Pokemon metagame, the anime, and his SSB fan base since the last game he was requested to be removed from.
Even veterans like Charizard, significantly reworked, were not called New Characters in this game.

I'm not saying FE had a tremendous impact on Nintendo or pop culture. I clearly said it was a niche market, targeting specific kinds of gamers who like strategy.

But honestly, we all know Mario and Pokemon are big franchises. But don't you also believe 8 of a franchise is a bit overwhelming; Especially making it a little over 16% of the roster selection?

Mewtwo is referred to as a New character? All I remember hearing was "Mewtwo is on the way."

 

[Deleted member]

I don't think Mewtwo being called a "new fighter" was meant literally as if he was brand new to the series.

I think it's referring to Mewtwo being not in the main release.

EDIT: Or just the fact he's a fighter that wasn't previously announced.
Marvel vs. Capcom 3 for example had trailers for every character reveal that started with "Here Comes a New Challenger!" regardless of whether they were literally new to the series (i.e. Haggar, Taskmaster, Hsien-Ko, etc.) or not (i.e. Sentinel, Akuma, Spider-Man, etc.).

 

[Deathlightning21]

Sure, mewtwo will be reworked and such....but to call him a "New Fighter" is not 100% fair to say

I mean, Bowser was really reworked in this game but he is not a new fighter, just a reworked veteran

 

[N3ON]

Either way is correct really. He's not new in that he's been in Smash before but he is new in that he'll be newer to Smash 4 than the currently existing characters.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I don't think it matters that Mewtwo is a veteran or not, or whether he's considered to be a "new fighter." Duke Napolean's comment still stands, because Mewtwo WAS NOT IN BRAWL. And he's a totally different character from Wolf and Lucas. YES, Wolf and Lucas are more different from their origin characters. But it'd basically be like adding Chrom to Fire Emblem. In fact, Wolf and Lucas perfectly align with what Chrom would have likely ended up as if he was playable.


Ice Climbers were planned to be playable, and cut due to hardware limitations on 3DS.


As for Fire Emblem, we'll be lucky to get 4 FE characters in the next game. The only thing I think might happen is Lucina gets decloned. I really would like to see that maybe, the new Lucina is the main character of the next FE game, and she could potentially have been raised to fight more with lances than swords. That's honestly the one thing I hope will happen. She does unlock the ability to use Lances in Awakening...

If Lucina is not in the next main FE, I don't think she'll be playable in the next Smash either.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Yes, the announcer refers to Mewtwo as "New character," it is around the 34th minute mark in the video, but the whole Mewtwo segment is only about 90 seconds long and doesn't take too long to listen to.

How far that extends, we will see, but I think getting fully new specials would classify him as a new fighter, something Bowser's rework, and even Pit's major reworking, would not have in common. He would, by all intent, be a different character.

 

[Deathlightning21]

I still don't follow the logic of that.

Its like saying if Guile from street fighter took a breather for two Street Fighter games but then was coming back in the next one as DLC. You wouldn't call him a new character to Street Fighter, he would till be Guile the long standing Street Fighter character veteran

 

[pupNapoleon]

I still don't follow the logic of that.

Its like saying if Guile from street fighter took a breather for two Street Fighter games but then was coming back in the next one as DLC. You wouldn't call him a new character to Street Fighter, he would till be Guile the long standing Street Fighter character veteran

If it is a new character in concept, who just happens to have the same IP as Mewtwo, I absolutely would understand it.
No other character has ever been reworked to that extent, and portraying them as a 'new character' not only more properly conveys the work and ideas put into the new entity, but makes it more enticing to fans from an advertising perspective.
Calling it by a previous name may be de facto correct in its home series- yes, it is still based on the psychic cat-like clone from Pokemon, but the execution of its Smash iteration would differ so greatly from its previous, that it may not be comparable to refer to it as a veteran.

That is just one example.

 

[Deathlightning21]

If it is a new character in concept, who just happens to have the same IP as Mewtwo, I absolutely would understand it.
No other character has ever been reworked to that extent, and portraying them as a 'new character' not only more properly conveys the work and ideas put into the new entity, but makes it more enticing to fans from an advertising perspective.
Calling it by a previous name may be de facto correct in its home series- yes, it is still based on the psychic cat-like clone from Pokemon, but the execution of its Smash iteration would differ so greatly from its previous, that it may not be comparable to refer to it as a veteran.

That is just one example.

Still not following ya here

 

[Ivander]

Looks like I missed the Fire Emblem talk. I don't see the FE roster getting much bigger, but at the same time, I guess it also depends on what they do next with Fire Emblem. Like whether they do a new game or a remake, if the Avatar will come back and if they'll still be a Tactician, etc. And if a new Tactician character does appear in the next Fire Emblem, they could replace Robin with that new Tactician, but still keep Robin as an Alt. I mean, all they would need to do is use Robin's model and skeleton for the new character then just update Robin and add him/her as an Alt alongside that new character.

[collapse=Fire Emblem stuff]That being said, I always keep saying that some characters would be nice Alph alts for the current characters. I think that would be a nice idea for Fire Emblem characters since a good amount of the characters from the games share similar concepts(is that the word I'm looking for?). At the same time, it would allow some of the lesser known/lesser chance characters to have a glimpse in the spotlight and give a bit more exposure to players who don't know much about Fire Emblem while giving a bit more chance for some players to have their favorite character appear.

I mean, Eliwood and Eirika would be great for Marth, Priam for Ike, especially since Lucina, Marth's descendant, almost was an Alt for Marth, FE7 Mark, the Origin of the Tactician class(somewhat), and Morgan for Robin and Seliph would fit rather perfectly with Lucina, especially since Falchion's newer design is also rather similar to Tyrfing's Awakening design. And if Anna, a Trickster with access to a magic sword and staff, were to become playable, they could use the "Sage Lord" Leif as an Alt for her since Awakening Leif was also a Trickster and his main weapon is the Light Sword which functions the same way as the Levin Sword does FE gameplay-wise.[/collapse]

That being said, I'm not expecting Fire Emblem to be getting any major treatment in later series. I mean, even Lucina barely made it in as a playable character. Will there be 5 reps for Smash 5? Who knows. I guess it's up to what Nintendo is doing with Fire Emblem's currently and what they do with the next Fire Emblem.

 

[Deathlightning21]

Looks like I missed the Fire Emblem talk. I don't see the FE roster getting much bigger, but at the same time, I guess it also depends on what they do next with Fire Emblem. Like whether they do a new game or a remake, if the Avatar will come back and if they'll still be a Tactician, etc. And if a new Tactician character does appear in the next Fire Emblem, they could replace Robin with that new Tactician, but still keep Robin as an Alt. I mean, all they would need to do is use Robin's model and skeleton for the new character then just update Robin and add him/her as an Alt alongside that new character.

[collapse=Fire Emblem stuff]That being said, I always keep saying that some characters would be nice Alph alts for the current characters. I think that would be a nice idea for Fire Emblem characters since a good amount of the characters from the games share similar concepts(is that the word I'm looking for?). At the same time, it would allow some of the lesser known/lesser chance characters to have a glimpse in the spotlight and give a bit more exposure to players who don't know much about Fire Emblem while giving a bit more chance for some players to have their favorite character appear.

I mean, Eliwood and Eirika would be great for Marth, Priam for Ike, especially since Lucina, Marth's descendant, almost was an Alt for Marth, FE7 Mark, the Origin of the Tactician class(somewhat), and Morgan for Robin and Seliph would fit rather perfectly with Lucina, especially since Falchion's newer design is also rather similar to Tyrfing's Awakening design. And if Anna, a Trickster with access to a magic sword and staff, were to become playable, they could use the "Sage Lord" Leif as an Alt for her since Awakening Leif was also a Trickster and his main weapon is the Light Sword which functions the same way as the Levin Sword does FE gameplay-wise.[/collapse]

That being said, I'm not expecting Fire Emblem to be getting any major treatment in later series. I mean, even Lucina barely made it in as a playable character. Will there be 5 reps for Smash 5? Who knows. I guess it's up to what Nintendo is doing with Fire Emblem's currently and what they do with the next Fire Emblem.

I think Nintendo, as of right now, is really banking on the increase of Fire Emblem's current popularity...but that dose not really mean a new character per say but Remakes and other such things are not out of the realm of possibility for this new founded fame and recent love for the franchise.

I still personaly think you need a GBA fire emblem rep because those are the best of the best fire emblem games (myopinion) and they themselves have huge fanbases to capitalize on (likeme:3)

EDIT: by the By, you bring up many good points in your post. GOLD STAR 4 U! *ding sound effect*

 

[Ivander]

I think Nintendo, as of right now, is really banking on the increase of Fire Emblem's current popularity...but that dose not really mean a new character per say but Remakes and other such things are not out of the realm of possibility for this new founded fame and recent love for the franchise.

I still personaly think you need a GBA fire emblem rep because those are the best of the best fire emblem games (myopinion) and they themselves have huge fanbases to capitalize on (likeme:3)

Well, if we look at the FE representing after Melee, there always seems to be at least one new rep and usually it's from the latest game at the time of development, like Ike for Path of Radiance and Robin & Lucina for Awakening. Heck, even looking at Melee, Roy appeared and he was the character to appear in the upcoming FE game during that time. And despite Smash 4 getting 2 new reps, Lucina only barely made it in, meaning even if she wasn't in, there still would've been a new rep that is still from the latest Fire Emblem game. So regardless on whether or not the game is new or a remake, it wouldn't be surprising if Smash 5 got a new FE rep from the newest FE since, so far, Smash has been getting at least one new FE rep from the newest FE per game. Whether or not all of the past reps come back is a different story.

The best chance for the GBA games would be to do a remake of the Elibe series(a bit more on that later). That would not only give Roy and Lyn a much better second chance, but they could use Mark as the new Robin character while still keeping Robin in as an Alt. And they could even add Eliwood as an Alt for Marth. Hector could fill in for Mark's Final Smash or a new Assist trophy.

[collapse=Remake talk]As for current Fire Emblem, it wouldn't be surprising if the next Fire Emblem game continued on some of the things that Awakening did, like the Avatar system and the Children system. Heck, Intelligent Systems already has the materials for continuing the trend. Namely the Jugdral series(Genealogy and Thracia) and the Elibe series(Binding and Blazing Sword). If Nintendo wants to keep that trend of having the player be their own character and being able to romance with another character, Genealogy of the Holy War and Blazing Sword to Binding Blade would be pretty likely to be remade, although Genealogy would be a bit harder to implement it without changing quite a few big plot points, like Sigurd & Deirdre's forced marriage.

So if they want to avoid doing such big changes, a remake of Binding Blade and Blazing Sword would be easy for them to remake, since the only major changes to the games would be putting in skills(if they wanted skills to be in), putting in the children system, like siblings and new children for some characters like Lyn and changing stuff about the Tactician, like being able to customize Mark, to allow Mark to fight and change classes like Robin and adding backstory to Mark.
They wouldn't need to change the story too much, since Mark didn't do much in the story besides inspiring Lyn to travel with him(ultimately resulting in her going to Caelin and also potentially marrying her to Eliwood or Hector) and being the one to name Roy and Lilina. However, they would have to change a bit of Binding Blade's story to add in characters and references from FE7, especially Mark if they make him aid Roy. [/collapse]

 

[Deathlightning21]

Well, if we look at the FE representing after Melee, there always seems to be at least one new rep and usually it's from the latest game at the time of development, like Ike for Path of Radiance and Robin & Lucina for Awakening. Heck, even looking at Melee, Roy appeared and he was the character to appear in the upcoming FE game during that time. And despite Smash 4 getting 2 new reps, Lucina only barely made it in, meaning even if she wasn't in, there still would've been a new rep that is still from the latest Fire Emblem game. So regardless on whether or not the game is new or a remake, it wouldn't be surprising if Smash 5 got a new FE rep from the newest FE since, so far, Smash has been getting at least one new FE rep from the newest FE per game. Whether or not all of the past reps come back is a different story.

The best chance for the GBA games would be to do a remake of the Elibe series(a bit more on that later). That would not only give Roy and Lyn a much better second chance, but they could use Mark as the new Robin character while still keeping Robin in as an Alt. And they could even add Eliwood as an Alt for Marth. Hector could fill in for Mark's Final Smash or a new Assist trophy.

[collapse=Remake talk]As for current Fire Emblem, it wouldn't be surprising if the next Fire Emblem game continued on some of the things that Awakening did, like the Avatar system and the Children system. Heck, Intelligent Systems already has the materials for continuing the trend. Namely the Jugdral series(Genealogy and Thracia) and the Elibe series(Binding and Blazing Sword). If Nintendo wants to keep that trend of having the player be their own character and being able to romance with another character, Genealogy of the Holy War and Blazing Sword to Binding Blade would be pretty likely to be remade, although Genealogy would be a bit harder to implement it without changing quite a few big plot points, like Sigurd & Deirdre's forced marriage.

So if they want to avoid doing such big changes, a remake of Binding Blade and Blazing Sword would be easy for them to remake, since the only major changes to the games would be putting in skills(if they wanted skills to be in), putting in the children system, like siblings and new children for some characters like Lyn and changing stuff about the Tactician, like being able to customize Mark, to allow Mark to fight and change classes like Robin and adding backstory to Mark.
They wouldn't need to change the story too much, since Mark didn't do much in the story besides inspiring Lyn to travel with him(ultimately resulting in her going to Caelin and also potentially marrying her to Eliwood or Hector) and being the one to name Roy and Lilina. However, they would have to change a bit of Binding Blade's story to add in characters and references from FE7, especially Mark if they make him aid Roy. [/collapse]

Well, seeing that both Roy and Lyn (also the other Elibe characters) will be in SMT x FE that already seems to be a good spring board into DLC hood...but not enough I think. Sure they are about to pierce into the heavens of fandom hype BUT they still need the big last push to really seal the deal. And don;t forget that they did port FE7 to the WIIU so Nintendo knows how much fans love that game.

the question is "Where do they from here"

and dear geezus gosh I would LOVE a remake of FE7 and 6 and a playable Mark. speaking of which I think Mark could be the alt for Robin instead (And is Girl Mark still called Mark? if so...thats cool)

 

[Ivander]

Well, seeing that both Roy and Lyn (also the other Elibe characters) will be in SMT x FE that already seems to be a good spring board into DLC hood...but not enough I think. Sure they are about to pierce into the heavens of fandom hype BUT they still need the big last push to really seal the deal. And don;t forget that they did port FE7 to the WIIU so Nintendo knows how much fans love that game.

the question is "Where do they go from here"

and dear geezus gosh I would LOVE a remake of FE7 and 6 and a playable Mark. speaking of which I think Mark could be the alt for Robin instead (And is Girl Mark still called Mark? if so...thats cool)

Has there been any recent info on SMT x FE, besides those rumors of cancellation? Been trying to keep my ear out for info, but conversation about it tends to be pretty quiet.

And yeah, Girl Mark is still referred to as Mark. Heck, in Awakening, Morgan's name in JP is Marc and even Female Morgan is still called Marc. That being said,

Spoiler

If the Elibe games were remade and done in the same idea as Awakening, I can imagine some of the old players getting Mark to marry Lyn "as it should have been in the original game." (and then witness the "waifu wars" between the ones married to Lucina and the ones married to Lyn.)

I'd be fine with Mark as an Alt as well. I'm just looking in a perspective to that of what Nintendo would do and if they were to focus on the latest FE, it would be likely they would have the new Tactician be the main look with Robin as the Alt.

 

[Deathlightning21]

Has there been any recent info on SMT x FE, besides those rumors of cancellation? Been trying to keep my ear out for info, but conversation about it tends to be pretty quiet.

And yeah, Girl Mark is still referred to as Mark. Heck, in Awakening, Morgan's name in JP is Marc and even Female Morgan is still called Marc. That being said,

Spoiler

If the Elibe games were remade and done in the same idea as Awakening, I can imagine some of the old players getting Mark to marry Lyn "as it should have been in the original game." (and then witness the "waifu wars" between the ones married to Lucina and the ones married to Lyn.)

I'd be fine with Mark as an Alt as well. I'm just looking in a perspective to that of what Nintendo would do and if they were to focus on the latest FE, it would be likely they would have the new Tactician be the main look with Robin as the Alt.

SMT X FE news: Besides it taking place in modern times and some devs saying that its "Going on as planned" there isn't much to talk about it.

Well one thing they would need to settle is how they would make Mark different from Robin and also vis versa. To be honest I've always seen Mark as the cocky/brash type of character and it would work to contrast Robin's stoic based personality.

And ya...the waifu war will come in strong so prepare your butt for that one cause its going to be a long and bloody one.

 

[Ivander]

SMT X FE news: Besides it taking place in modern times and some devs saying that its "Going on as planned" there isn't much to talk about it.

Well one thing they would need to settle is how they would make Mark different from Robin and also vis versa. To be honest I've always seen Mark as the cocky/brash type of character and it would work to contrast Robin's stoic based personality.

I do hope there's some info on it soon. It's been far too long since 2013.

I could imagine Mark being alot more outgoing than Robin. I can't quite see him at the level of cocky or brash, especially since he is a Tactician after all. That being said, I hope he gets a trait that is more human than being amazingly good at war strategies. Something like the Avatar from Fire Emblem 12 and their horrible "taste-like-steel" cooking, despite the fact that he/she has the item called "Kris' Confect"(or Home Made Sweets in JP) in Awakening that increases HP, Defense and Resistance.

 

[Deathlightning21]

I do hope there's some info on it soon. It's been far too long since 2013.

I could imagine Mark being alot more outgoing than Robin. I can't quite see him at the level of cocky or brash, especially since he is a Tactician after all. That being said, I hope he gets a trait that is more human than being amazingly good at war strategies. Something like the Avatar from Fire Emblem 12 and their horrible "taste-like-steel" cooking, despite the fact that he/she has the item called "Kris' Confect"(or Home Made Sweets in JP) in Awakening that increases HP, Defense and Resistance.

It be hard press to find anyone who was REALLY good at cooking in the FE universe...then again the series characters are mostly made up of teenagers/young adults so who can blame them?

And I think a good trait to have on Mark would be that he makes too many jokes sometimes. Good example of this is when most of the characters are talking to him its either serious bizz or friendly banter.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Maybe the case of Mewtwo being called new is similar to when Gamefreak create a new form for an old legendary and call it a "new Pokémon".

It's just them using the fact that Mewtwo was missing from Brawl as an excuse to call him " new" now. Plus if he actually has a revamped moveset that would be another excuse for them to brush over his veteran status.

 

[Kenith]

It's just them using the fact that Mewtwo was missing from Brawl as an excuse to call him " new" now. Plus if he actually has a revamped moveset that would be another excuse for them to brush over his veteran status.

If he's got a new moveset he's not really a veteran anyway. Same goes for Ganondorf.

Also, on the topic of a new Fire Emblem, I would like, if we were to get a new one as DLC, that's it either Tiki or a mounted character.
Tiki because she can turn into a dragon, which could carry a moveset on it's own, and a mounted character because it would kick so much ass to see a spear-using cavalier in Smash. Obviously, my vote goes to Frederick as I don't know any other mounted characters at the moment.

 

[Deleted member]

New fighting styles don't magically make a character lose their veteran status.

Pit has had the most changes among the veterans, with only one Special Move from Brawl being retained and most of his regular attacks.
He's still listed as a veteran.

And no, Mewtwo being left out of Brawl is not going to affect his status as a veteran either. Dr. Mario isn't labeled as a newcomer despite missing out on Brawl just like Mewtwo.
And no, Dr. Mario being a clone doesn't mean anything in regards to that.

 

[Arcanir]

The major difference is that in both of those series, the series themselves... didn't actually affect... anything.
In Hyrule Warriors, the content was about what we were getting, be it a new map, new characters, new weapons- the themes were moreso to group it together at all.

In Mario Kart, the themes are not even present at all except with Isabelle and Villager, and even then they don't affect gameplay at all, the stages do, and we can see that the stages are from MANY universes from each pack therein.

In terms of Smash Bros, the characters are everything, which makes it immediately a different ball game than a series that is not an amalgamation, such as Hyrule Warriors. Even where Mario Kart is attempting it, the packages actually do have many courses from a few different games all at once, aiding the idea that the newcomers would not be all from a single universe.

If anyone is buying the content specifically because they are the fan of a single universe, I think the general rule of thumb would be to split it up across multiple buying opportunities. The ones who would not buy it if it is split up are not the hardcore enough of the fans to even target with a package of a series.

And where are you getting this "general rule of thumb?" Firstly, at this point, we don't have any examples of Nintendo doing that with their DLC, and we don't have any examples from Smash Bros. to make that inference yet, so it's not so much a "rule of thumb" as it is a theory based on assumptions (which granted, all of us are doing at this point). Secondly, you're making the assumption about the fans in question. As @ Kenith has said earlier, while some may be won over with just that one piece of content, others may take a look at the full set and decide that it's not worth it to get the whole thing for just one thing they want, particularly if they don't care for or outright dislike what is being offered alongside it. It doesn't make them not "hardcore" because they decided against it, they just decided that what was being offered was not worth the price of the additional content.

As for your Mario Kart example, while it is true that there is content from multiple sources, note that where there was multiple pieces of content from the same source, they were sold together. Again, Link wasn't split up from the Hyrule Track, they were sold together in the first pack. Same with the Animal Crossing characters, they weren't sold separately from each other, they remained together and are being offered in the second pack. If Nintendo was going by the model that you're presenting, they could've easily split either (or both) of those two up, but they opted not to, and kept them as a full set rather then pieces scattered across the DLC.

 

[Substitution]

Does it really matter if he's a newcomer or a veteran? He's in the game. And really, isn't that what's important in the end?

 

[Deathlightning21]

Does it really matter if he's a newcomer or a veteran? He's in the game. And really, isn't that what's important in the end?

I'm not sure why we even had this debate in the first place...

 

[RobinOnDrugs]

To contribute to the FE discussion, I see Lucina being demoted to an alt. for Marth if she ever appears in Smash 5. That or she would be cut out entirely or at least get her moveset reworked somehow (which is less likely to happen IMO).

 

[Deleted member]

I would see Lucina to get the "Falco treatment", as to know she'd still look similar to Marth but with some different attacks, like that spin air attack she used in the CGI sequence where she fights Chrom in Awakening.

 

[Deathlightning21]

I can see her getting the Falco treatment as well.

Though, that being said I would like to see other clones (not dark pit and Dr Mario) to get the falco treatment as well

 

[Xinc]

Please let Lucina get the Brawl PSA moveset. Please, please, please.

 

[Deathlightning21]

Please let Lucina get the Brawl PSA moveset. Please, please, please.

Brawl PSA moveset?

 

[Ivander]

I think Lucina could be Luigi/Falco-fied. Despite people saying she should be faster than Marth, when I watch her battle in Awakening, she seems a bit more focused on power than Marth. Maybe Marth and Lucina can still be the same speed walk/run-wise, but Marth is a bit more faster on the attacking side and Lucina is a bit more focused on power.

Like, Aether could be Lucina's Side-B which works somewhat like Falcon's Raptor Boost, but when the attack hits, the button can be pressed again to have Lucina do the Luna effect of Aether. Up-B can be Galeforce, which works like Shulk's Air Slash, but the second part of the attack can only be used if an opponent is hit. And for her A attacks, she could use attack animations that were used by her, Chrom and Mercenaries in Awakening. Her idle pose can be the one she's uses in Awakening before starting an attack.

 

[Deathlightning21]

I think Lucina could be Luigi/Falco-fied. Despite people saying she should be faster than Marth, when I watch her battle in Awakening, she seems a bit more focused on power than Marth. Maybe Marth and Lucina can still be the same speed walk/run-wise, but Marth is a bit more faster on the attacking side and Lucina is a bit more focused on power.

Like, Aether could be Lucina's Side-B which works somewhat like Falcon's Raptor Boost, but when the attack hits, the button can be pressed again to have Lucina do the Luna effect of Aether. Up-B can be Galeforce, which works like Shulk's Air Slash, but the second part of the attack can only be used if an opponent is hit. And for her A attacks, she could use attack animations that were used by her, Chrom and Mercenaries in Awakening. Her idle pose can be the one she's uses in Awakening before starting an attack.

I just chuckled at the idea of Lucina bouncing into the air shouting "GALEFORCE!"

 

[AEMehr]

I am pretty sure them referring to Mewtwo as a "new fighter" is in regards to him being another character being added to the game that is currently not playable.

 

[RobinOnDrugs]

Brawl PSA moveset?

He's referring to a Brawl mod that allows you to play as Lucina as a full fledged character with a complete moveset. It's pretty awesome even though it looks a little OP:

 

[Xinc]

Brawl PSA moveset?

Yeah, made by some guy... I think his name was master crazy hand or something

 

[BluePikmin11]

That moveset is very unlikely to happen. Even if she came back, she would probably have the same moveset again for novice Marth players to play as.

 

[Deathlightning21]

He's referring to a Brawl mod that allows you to play as Lucina as a full fledged character with a complete moveset. It's pretty awesome even though it looks a little OP:

Huh....looks fun