Character Discussion Thread

[TheNerdyOne_]

All Star leaked the all star image and Spainkiller was right about the models of Ridley and Mewtwo (leaving Dixie and CK). On top of that, the person that leaked the 3DS footage mentioned MORE characters on the way and had a very specific name related to Rhythm heaven.
Funny thing is All Star was rather specific about Ridley and K.Rool not being playable after mentioning the remaining characters to be a Pokemon, a DK character and a new series character.

I don't think it's a coincidence, but eh.

I'm not sure which "all star" leak you're referring to (perhaps we call it by a different name over in the leaks group), but the one that comes to mind got the picture from a friend (who got it from the ESRB leak, prior to that particular image going public) and has been caught lying about content beyond that multiple times.

Spainkiller's source easily could have seen their trophies, considering they thought Ridley's model was high-quality when in reality it was just ripped from Other M and really isn't all that good. There's also the AT possibility, considering we have no idea what the Wii U ATs will be (though Doc Louis is looking really likely).

Nobody who leaked 3DS footage knows anything beyond what is seen in the footage, they got it from a friend who knows someone that worked at ESRB, and know nothing beyond that. There were multiple people involved in the leak trying to take advantage of their situation to spread false info. Don't trust any of them, they don't know anything beyond what we know at this point.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I'm not sure which "all star" leak you're referring to (perhaps we call it by a different name over in the leaks group), but the one that comes to mind got the picture from a friend (who got it from the ESRB leak, prior to that particular image going public) and has been caught lying about content beyond that multiple times.

Spainkiller's source easily could have seen their trophies, considering they thought Ridley's model was high-quality when in reality it was just ripped from Other M and really isn't all that good. There's also the AT possibility, considering we have no idea what the Wii U ATs will be (though Doc Louis is looking really likely).

Nobody who leaked 3DS footage knows anything beyond what is seen in the footage, they got it from a friend who knows someone that worked at ESRB, and know nothing beyond that. There were multiple people involved in the leak trying to take advantage of their situation to spread false info. Don't trust any of them, they don't know anything beyond what we know at this point.

I mean, after all, its not like people lie on the internet...

I swear, every time someone tries to make claims about a leak online and acting like its 100% legit, I'm GOING to post this video.

 

[mark welford]

Assist Trophies are staying as Assist Trophies, so Saki and Magnus aren't happening. Bandana Dee would be a pretty lame choice and has no moveset potential, and Geno will, fortunately, NEVER be playable.

that is not cool to shoot down someone's dream like that it is just like saying krystal fortunately is not playing which is totally not cool to do.

 

[domokl]

lol people saying bandana dee has no moveset potential

 

[Roy-Kun]

All these leaks are to be taken with a grain of salt, specially since Mewtwo is in early development, and so far the only confirmed DLC character, and considering the nature of it, DLC could be kept as top secret until the developers themselves see it plausible to reveal information themselves.

That being said, I have hopes for one character that most of you likely didn't even consider.

 

[Zhadgon]

My dream...

.n_n.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Assist Trophies are staying as Assist Trophies, so Saki and Magnus aren't happening. Bandana Dee would be a pretty lame choice and has no moveset potential, and Geno will, fortunately, NEVER be playable.

Bandana Dee HAS moveset potential. I don't think he's nearly as likely a pick as everyone states, he's basically a filler character in Return to Dream Land so they could have four-player coop. But he DOES have moveset potential.

 

[Kenith]

Since speculation is back I've been inclined to make a legitimate moveset for Mach Rider. I'm really proud of it so far, it's true to his game while also has a bit of creativity.

 

[domokl]

Bandana Dee HAS moveset potential. I don't think he's nearly as likely a pick as everyone states, he's basically a filler character in Return to Dream Land so they could have four-player coop. But he DOES have moveset potential.

if he was just filler he wouldnt have made mutiple appearances in merchandise. appeared as a big help in triple deluke and he most definetly has a major role in rainbow curse and if he was just filler why would he have that?

 

[BluePikmin11]

lol people saying bandana dee has no moveset potential

He does moveset potential, but there's something lacking that would make him stand-out from the rest of the character, and not just the pointy spear can really help his inclusion IMO.

 

[Substitution]

He does moveset potential, but there's something lacking that would make him stand-out from the rest of the character, and not just the pointy spear can really help his inclusion IMO.

And said quality he lacks is?...

 

[BluePikmin11]

And said quality he lacks is?...

I'm not sure how describe it, I think it needs more (mphh) more variety and (like I said) not just the spear done in an unique manner.

 

[Substitution]

I'm not sure how describe it, I think it needs more (mphh) more variety and (like I said) not just the spear done in an unique manner.

So essentially you want more from him rather than just the spear. Basically uniqueness.
Well, I can't say I'm a huge expert when to comes to the Dee folk, but if I had to bring an idea. There is more than one Waddle Dee correct? Well, maybe that could come into play. Such as his Side Special being King Dedede's Waddle Dee toss minus the Gordo. Or his Smashes having multiple Dees attacking using teamwork.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

Just a spear would be fine for Waddle Dee. Just make the spear essentially act like an item, it can be thrown and will stick into the ground/walls until it is retrieved. Without his spear, Bandanna Dee is much less powerful. It can respawn if it falls off the stage or is destroyed in some other way.

Sounds unique enough to me. Smash doesn't have a spear character yet, it would be nice to get one.

 

[BluePikmin11]

So essentially you want more from him rather than just the spear. Basically uniqueness.
Well, I can't say I'm a huge expert when to comes to the Dee folk, but if I had to bring an idea. There is more than one Waddle Dee correct? Well, maybe that could come into play. Such as his Side Special being King Dedede's Waddle Dee toss minus the Gordo. Or his Smashes having multiple Dees attacking using teamwork.

That honestly would look weird for Dee's moveset. It could work, but I doubt Sakurai would come up with that idea, and that fits more for Dedede than Bandanna Dee.

Just a spear would be fine for Waddle Dee. Just make the spear essentially act like an item, it can be thrown and will stick into the ground/walls until it is retrieved. Without his spear, Bandanna Dee is much less powerful. It can respawn if it falls off the stage or is destroyed in some other way.

Sounds unique enough to me. Smash doesn't have a spear character yet, it would be nice to get one.

Still wouldn't attract my attention, especially when you go specific to the point where "spear user" is suppose to sell a regular person into maining him.

 

[Substitution]

That honestly would look weird for Dee's moveset. It could work, but I doubt Sakurai would come up with that idea, and that fits more for Dedede than Bandanna Dee.

Well that's about it really.
Bandanna Dee for the most part is in the same level as Little Mac. Perhaps going mostly Spear is the way to go, as that does make up the majority of his arsenal.
Sure, it's not exactly "mind blowing" by any means, but other than that and the aforementioned Waddle Dees, what else is there?

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

Still wouldn't attract my attention, especially when you go specific to the point where "spear user" is suppose to sell a regular person into maining him.

The point isn't really to "sell" anyone into maining him, it's to provide a unique character that adds something to the game. A spear user like Bandanna Dee is something that hasn't yet been done in Smash and would provide a very unique playstyle, as well as adding something to the game.

Not all newcomers have to be overly unique. Just look at Greninja, he's very similar to Shiek in terms of style, much more so than Bandanna Dee would be to anyone else.

 

[The Light Music Club]

If Sakurai can provide Ice Climbers and Wolf, I'd be fine. Those are the only two I really need at this point. King K would be a bonus of course, but still.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Well that's about it really.
Bandanna Dee for the most part is in the same level as Little Mac. Perhaps going mostly Spear is the way to go, as that does make up the majority of his arsenal.
Sure, it's not exactly "mind blowing" by any means, but other than that and the aforementioned Waddle Dees, what else is there?

Then what kind of playstyle would Dee have? Mac has excellent ground game while he sucks at air, what would Dee excel on?

The point isn't really to "sell" anyone into maining him, it's to provide a unique character that adds something to the game. A spear user like Bandanna Dee is something that hasn't yet been done in Smash and would provide a very unique playstyle, as well as adding something to the game.

Not all newcomers have to be overly unique. Just look at Greninja, he's very similar to Shiek in terms of style, much more so than Bandanna Dee would be to anyone else.

Very unique playstyle is going a little too far for just a spear user, don't you think? Like I said to @ Substitution , what's the unique playstyle you are talking about.

 

[Substitution]

Then what kind of playstyle would Dee have? Mac has excellent ground game while he sucks at air, what would Dee excel on?

Well judging how he has the power of the pointy stick, I would assume range would be a decent bet: being able to poke in and out as he can. Top that with a projectile (specifically the Javelin Toss-esque attack the Spear form has) and you have at least a start in his moveset.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

Very unique playstyle is going a little too far for just a spear user, don't you think? Like I said to @ Substitution , what's the unique playstyle you are talking about.

Considering there's nobody else that uses a similar playstyle, I would say very unique is accurate. Even something simple like a spear is enough to make a character unique, uniqueness isn't measured in the complexity of their gimmick.

 

[Autumn ♫]

My dream...

.n_n.

Needs more Vaati

 

[Jason the Yoshi]

Needs more Dixie Kong, Wolf, Krystal, and Sceptile

Fixed.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Considering there's nobody else that uses a similar playstyle, I would say very unique is accurate. Even something simple like a spear is enough to make a character unique, uniqueness isn't measured in the complexity of their gimmick.

OK tell me the play style in specifics. You still haven't shown it to me.

Well judging how he has the power of the pointy stick, I would assume range would be a decent bet: being able to poke in and out as he can. Top that with a projectile (specifically the Javelin Toss-esque attack the Spear form has) and you have at least a start in his moveset.

So its basically a riskier Marth with Shulk melee range and a projectile?
Then it could work I guess. I might make a move set based on it for fun soon actually. Unless Dee is going to be a marketed Nintendo character, I doubt Sakurai would be willing to make him with his full creativity if he ever looked at him at a general point of view.

 

[Substitution]

So its basically a riskier Marth with Shulk melee range and a projectile?
Then it could work I guess. I might make a move set based on it for fun soon actually. Unless Dee is going to be a marketed Nintendo character, I doubt Sakurai would be willing to make him with his full creativity if he ever looked at him at a general point of view.

Pretty much.
And In terms of Sakurai making a moveset, let me put it this way. This is the man that brought us Mr. G&W; if he is able to make something as far off as him, I don't think Bandanna Dee will be that big of a problem.

 

[GunGunW]

I guess the ones I want to see the most are:
1. Impa
2. Krystal
The rest in an order I don't Know:
Sceptile, Captain Toad, K.K. Slider, Wolf, King K. Rool.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

OK tell me the play style in specifics. You still haven't shown it to me.

The specifics of the play style aren't important to my point, which is that Bandanna Dee can be quite unique simply with the spear. The important part there is the overall gimmick, which I already explained; MrVideoGaming has the more specifics of the play style and moveset covered.

Smash doesn't have a character with a retrievable projectile like a spear as their main weapon, that alone is enough to make Bandanna Dee just as unique as a number of the other Sm4sh newcomers.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Pretty much.
And In terms of Sakurai making a moveset, let me put it this way. This is the man that brought us Mr. G&W; if he is able to make something as far off as him, I don't think Bandanna Dee will be that big of a problem.

That's because G&W had so many resources he could use in his moveset, mainly from the old G&W games.

The specifics of the play style aren't important to my point, which is that Bandanna Dee can be quite unique simply with the spear. The important part there is the overall gimmick, which I already explained; MrVideoGaming has the more specifics of the play style and moveset covered.

Smash doesn't have a character with a retrievable projectile like a spear as their main weapon, that alone is enough to make Bandanna Dee just as unique as a number of the other Sm4sh newcomers.

Just as unique as a puppeteer and a mode changer, okay then. I still think you're ovrrerjustifying Dee's uniqueness.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly, I don't care too much who gets in as DLC (unless King K. Rool becomes one of them, who is the only character I care about now). Sakurai can do whatever he wants as far as I'm concerned.

Regarding DLC speculation, I don't intend on participating in it. The only things I will say in this regards is...
1. Character that appear as palette swaps, bosses, ATs, and anything above a trophy but less than a playable character probably won't be DLC.

2. The only newcomer I expect at this point is Dixie Kong and that's only because of the NeoGAF leak saying she had moving models (and I think this means she's a playable DLC character). Everyone else is 50/50.

3. Chances are we will get most of our guesses wrong. Just look at the initial roster additions for Smash 3DS & Wii U (not counting DLC); the only highly expected characters on it were Pac-Man, Little Mac, Palutena, and Shulk. Saying that DLC will contain most, if not all, of what we expect, is a very bold statement. Don't underestimate the casual Smash fans; they will buy any Smash DLC characters in droves.

4. We got lucky with Mewtwo's return. Sakurai could have easily picked a 3rd gen Pokemon to promote OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire and call it a day. The fact that Sakurai is even bringing back Mewtwo is incredibly significant; not only did the most wanted character return, but it shows that fan demand still has a role in inclusions. Whenever or not more characters are added due to fan demand via DLC remains to be seen, but a general guideline to go by is that if a character's demand is around the same level as Mewtwo, Mega Man, or pre-Brawl characters who were extremely highly demanded, they could get in by fan demand (or at least partially). So far, Lucas, Wolf and King K. Rool seems to fit this. Maybe Ice Climbers, Isaac, and Snake, but they are dependent on certain events happening for them to get in.

5. An updated version of Smash 3DS & Wii U should not be discounted as a possibility. Sakurai clearly wanted Ice Climbers and Chorus Men in and it doesn't look like they'll work on the old 3DS. To get around this, they will have to update to a new version of Smash for the New 3DS and a second version on the Wii U a la Street Fighter IV > Super Street Fighter IV. If this happens, I expect both Ice Climbers and Chorus Men to return. If not, then I am confident that they will not be added in any playable form until Smash 6. I do think an updated version is very plausible, though. I have a feeling we won't see anymore DLC characters until well into 2015.

So these are my expectations:
- Mewtwo (confirmed)
- Dixie Kong
- Ice Climbers (if SSFIV-style update happens)
- Chorus Men (if SSFIV-style update happens)

Everyone else that's not above a trophy is fair game. With that said, have fun discussing DLC prospects; meanwhile I'll be looking forward to getting the Wii U version when it comes out.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

Just as unique as a puppeteer and a mode changer, okay then. I still think you're ovrrerjustifying Dee's uniqueness.

"A number of other Sm4sh newcomers" doesn't mean you can just take the most unique ones and compare him to those. You're ignoring the not-so-unique fighters like Little Mac or Greninja. Sure, they have unique things about them, but they're no puppeteer. I'm saying that Bandanna Dee is on the same tier as those characters.

 

[Kenith]

Here's a template base roster in case anyone wants to use it. If you don't like the layout be sure to strangle me.
Was going to add the DLC "Next page" icon, but I couldn't find one, and the Wii U CSS might not have it anyway.

----
I'd say it's safe to add Mewtwo, Wolf, Lucas, and Dixie Kong to this.

 

[BluePikmin11]

"A number of other Sm4sh newcomers" doesn't mean you can just take the most unique ones and compare him to those. You're ignoring the not-so-unique fighters like Little Mac or Greninja. Sure, they have unique things about them, but they're no puppeteer. I'm saying that Bandanna Dee is on the same tier as those characters.

Alright, but in my opinion, Sakurai would probably think he's not worth the inclusion with just the spear if he's not going to be marketing the Kirby franchise hardcore.

 

[mahnamahna]

DLC

10 characters

1. Mewtwo
2. Ice Climbers
3. Wolf
4. Lucas
5. Chorus Men
6. Dixie Kong
7. King K. Rool
8. Impa
9. Captain Toad
10. Bandana Dee

Inkling seems like something for Smash 5/6. Krystal's something for Smash 5/6. Ivysaur and Squirtle along with Snake have no chance of returning.

I'm indifferent to other forms of DLC

 

[Broodlaw]

As far as potential DLC goes I think we'll get 2 more newcomers, and in addition to Mewtwo we'll get 2 returning characters. For the returning characters I suspect Wolf is high on that list and then followed by Ice Climbers, hopefully Sakurai can find a way to make them work on both versions. Though for newcomers that is tricky, I think having Impa and Dixie would address both franchises in LoZ and DK that should get an additional character, DK for sure needs another one.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I'm a big fan of DLC. I think there are some character choices that are great ideas. However, I have to say a few things about it. Some of them are going to be similar to what @鉄腕アトム said in his post on this page.

1) DLC choices will most likely not be obscure characters like a lot that have support threads on this site. You can support who you want for whatever reason. I won't stop anybody from doing that, mainly because I can't. But there are absolutely threads out there for characters who have no chance whatsoever.

2) Characters who are AT's, Stage Bosses, or anything that would require extensive coding will likely not be DLC. This means Dillon (god bless him. He would have been cool), Ridley, or any other assist trophy or Stage Boss WILL PROBABLY NOT become DLC. Trophies, however are fair game based on Mewtwo becoming DLC, and the fact that there are many characters who became trophies with popularity.

3) DLC slots will probably be numbered. We aren't going to get an extensive amount based on the fact that it's DLC. SO, I would say something like 4-5 is a good bet. 8 is a max if they try something like Season Passes.

4) Mewtwo is already in, which is fantastic. This to me should pretty much say that it's HIGHLY UNLIKELY we'd get another Pokemon character as DLC. This extends to other series as well. I would not expect more than one character per series with DLC based on how limited the slots will be.

5) A few characters that I think have a great chance are Inklings and Isaac. Inklings because of the hype train that is Splatoon ( I doubt they would wait however long until Smash 5 if DLC is an option) and Isaac seems like he's got a solid chance based on us knowing nothing of his Assist Trophy, or Golden Sun representation in general.

Those are my preliminary thoughts on DLC. I think some people are getting a little carried away with their choices. This isn't going to be like regular speculation.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

1) DLC choices will most likely not be obscure characters like a lot that have support threads on this site. You can support who you want for whatever reason. I won't stop anybody from doing that, mainly because I can't. But there are absolutely threads out there for characters who have no chance whatsoever.

I can see a few potential clone characters that were low on fan requests being added as part of a pack along with some majorly heavily requested characters. For example, I can see a pack that contains Wolf, Lucas and clone extra. That is one way in which characters with low requests can still happen.

 

[BluePikmin11]

It's better to say "minimal chance" to say absolutely no chance, that can hurt certain people's feelings here.

 

[Wintropy]

Those are my preliminary thoughts on DLC. I think some people are getting a little carried away with their choices. This isn't going to be like regular speculation.

Oh, undoubtedly, but it's fun to speculate nevertheless! ;P

 

[Joe D.]

I apologize for my pessimism, but...

Who's to say we're getting anything more than Mewtwo?

If Mewtwo is an indincation of anything, it would be that he was simply a fanservice due to extreme popularity. However, the implication that characters, "take a lot of hard work," is giving me the impression that we wouldn't go anywhere beyond Mewtwo.

They would've had to have planned out DLC from the get-go, which wasn't the case.

I just think that DLC characters wpuld take too much time, and I think it's a bit too optimistic to say that Mewtwo is an indicator of any more characters.

Regardless, I hope I'm wrong.

 

[The Light Music Club]

I apologize for my pessimism, but...

Who's to say we're getting anything more than Mewtwo?

If Mewtwo is an indincation of anything, it would be that he was simply a fanservice due to extreme popularity. However, the implication that characters, "take a lot of hard work," is giving me the impression that we wouldn't go anywhere beyond Mewtwo.

They would've had to have planned out DLC from the get-go, which wasn't the case.

I just think that DLC characters wpuld take too much time, and I think it's a bit too optimistic to say that Mewtwo is an indicator of any more characters.

Regardless, I hope I'm wrong.

That's why Ice Climbers and Wolf are the only other two I see happening. If they like the idea, a Donkey Kong rep as well.