Character Discussion Thread

[Fire Emblemier]

Sakurai has stated that the newcomer trailers will be available to watch in game... If there are secret newcomers in the game, do you think they will have trailers, also?

 

[JamesDNaux]

Sonic is a little (a lot) closer to Nintendo than Mega Man and Pac-Man are.

Nintendo and Sega are companies, they aren't two people who hang out like good buddies. There is no "close."

 

[Morbi]

While it is almost certain that Pokemon Trainer is cut, we are not confirmed at this moment. Let us not speak in absolutes, particularly if we are going by empirical data for Squirtle and Ivysaur, which as I have stated before, is in their favor- it is merely our aesthetic of 'too many Pokemon' which leads us to think they are cut.

Ah, yes, I remember the theory that Pokemon Trainer returns to battle WITH a vengeance... but WITHOUT his Pokemon ! He uses his own items, like the Pokeflute, he could probably bludgeon someone with a thunder stone as it is wasted on Pikachu.

Yeah, you lost me at "great and deserving."


But not close enough.

Good thing those were the last words.

Hell no. Gotta have the Zero and Ms. Pac-Man hype. Get out of my face son.

I was literally thinking the same thing. Mrs. Pac-Man should have been included over Pac-Man if you ask me. At least she offers her gender!

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

So. Monita. How bout it!

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

On paper, he would be the cloniest of clones to ever clone with different abilities.

In that event; Dark Pit is even easier to develop than characters that require different models, I would probably proclaim that that is a positive as it saves resources for such a great and deserving character!

A regular Hades' Advocate...

 

[MagnesD3]

angst: a feeling of deep anxiety or dread, typically an unfocused one about the human condition or the state of the world in general.

Aka, not Shadow. And by extension, not Dark Pit.

Sry I should have said teenagery instead of angsty. I associate angst with teenagers.

 

[CJ Falcon]

Though to be fair, I never said Pac-Man and Mega Man didn't deserve more than one anyway.

As it has been previously stated, they are all guest characters and do not deserve to have their buddies brought into the mix. If you get invited to a fancy party, you don't try to sneak in your ugly brother with you, hopefully.

 

[ihskeyp]

Sakurai has stated that the newcomer trailers will be available to watch in game... If there are secret newcomers in the game, do you think they will have trailers, also?

I really, really hope so. Secret trailers would be a super cool surprise.

 

[GunGunW]

Nintendo and Sega are companies, they aren't two people who hang out like good buddies. There is no "close."

I would agree with that if it wasn't for the fact that Sonic gets new games published on Nintendo more often than the other consoles.

 

[Knight Dude]

On paper, he would be the cloniest of clones to ever clone with different abilities.

In that event; Dark Pit is even easier to develop than characters that require different models, I would probably proclaim that that is a positive as it saves resources for such a great and deserving character!

That could be a point in his favor. I can't help but have my doubts. He COULD have different weapons. But there's also a chance he's purposely kept similar to Pit to establish their connection or something. I don't know.

Sonic is a little (a lot) closer to Nintendo than Mega Man and Pac-Man are.

I don't know, Megaman is pretty closely tied to Nintendo. Even more so in the early days. Pac-Man's the OG, so he's some respect there.

 

[Weeman]

Sakurai has stated that the newcomer trailers will be available to watch in game... If there are secret newcomers in the game, do you think they will have trailers, also?

Maybe, though since they don't have to publicly advertise the game i'm guessing they would be more like Jigglypuff, Wolf and Toon Link's videos in Brawl, but longer.

 

[GunGunW]

I would agree with that if it wasn't for the fact that Sonic gets new games published on Nintendo more often than the other consoles.

As it has been previously stated, they are all guest characters and do not deserve to have their buddies brought into the mix. If you get invited to a fancy party, you don't try to sneak in your ugly brother with you, hopefully.

I just don't know if I can agree with that.

 

[Pizzanigs]

Sakurai has stated that the newcomer trailers will be available to watch in game... If there are secret newcomers in the game, do you think they will have trailers, also?

I sure hope so. It'd be a shame if K. Rool didn't get his own trailer.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

A regular Hades' Advocate...

You know nothing!

 

[Knight Dude]

I really, really hope so. Secret trailers would be a super cool surprise.

Even better if they play right before you fight them.

 

[ihskeyp]

Even better if they play right before you fight them.

This would be so amazing.

 

[JamesDNaux]

I would agree with that if it wasn't for the fact that Sonic gets new games published on Nintendo more often than the other consoles.

Because Nintendo and Sega have a business deal, three Sonic games exclusive to Nintendo consoles.

You can be damn sure that Sonic will return to other consoles afterwards.

Example:
Insomniac always made games for Sony consoles, particularly the notable Ratchet and Clank franchise, and previously Spyro.

Hello, XBone exclusive Insomniac title "Sunset Overdrive."

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Maybe, though since they don't have to publicy advertise the game i'm guessing they would be more like Jigglypuff, Wolf and Toon Link's videos in Brawl, but longer.

Those were considered videos?

 

[pupNapoleon]

Ah, yes, I remember the theory that Pokemon Trainer returns to battle WITH a vengeance... but WITHOUT his Pokemon ! He uses his own items, like the Pokeflute, he could probably bludgeon someone with a thunder stone as it is wasted on Pikachu.

Hmm... I think trying to predict a move set is ridiculous. How many of us came up with half of what we have seen? I had accurately guessed the characters we have had, quite well. I saw Wii Fit Trainer, but not Greninja, sure. Maybe that would have changed if Transformation cuts were announced first...
Any who- there are other theories on Pokemon Trainer's possibilities, yet the biggest point is that he is important to the series, more so than any other character, and that his switching mechanic could be utilized in a different way; why could it not be switched? No need to be so cynical on his return simply because you limit yourself to a ridiculous idea of fan speculation on items.

Spoiler

he would have to be completely remade.
I'd LOVE for him to. I think it would be incredibly shocking, and actually be one of the best things Sakurai could do for Pokemon in Smash. There is not much going for him.
But I am here to advocate for him. As my avatar shows, I am an amazing fan. If you want part of the story as to why, go to my profile page here, or my twitter, @ pupNapoleon

We do have some things in his favor.
Pokemon Trainer is the original Avatar character. We currently have Robin, Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, and the Miis. All of them can be male or female, and they were all ushered in by none other than PT himself. He may just leave his legacy behind, or perhaps he will remain to share in his ability, this time as male or female.

Sakurai stated he wanted to do no cuts. He planned none, because of fans. It may be improbable that Squirtle and Ivysaur are back *though, I'd love it*, but perhaps the best way he could appease fans would be to put them as summons of some sort to Pokemon Trainer. (Y'know, with puff...). It would be a not-full-demotion.

On Sakurai's logic, he has said.

From standards to specials, grabs to throws, all aspects of his moveset just fell into place. Not only did he possess characteristics unlike other fighters, but he also captured the essence of the Fire Emblem series. It was perfect!”

This was in relation to Chrom. It gives me hope that he is aware Pokemon is not truly represented just by pieced-together favorite Pokemon alone, given the variety of the series.

“But it’s not just that – going back to just what we talked about, what’s unique about them? Where do they fit in with the rest of everything else? What do they have? It’s a combination of those things.”

That makes it apparent to me that we are quite likely to get at least something which is surprising and fitting. So far the Pokemon line up is incredibly lacking, and adding in Jigglypuff is even more off kilter. Even adding in Mewtwo to that only corrects it some. We've never gotten just one Pokemon Newcomer in a game (we had two in N64, two in Melee, 4 in Brawl). Pokemon is just as popular as ever (well, not counting 98-00), it will get as many reps as always, I feel. Though a revamped Mewtwo and Pokemon Trainer would be considered new, as well.

“For example, X and Y are coming out – of course, we haven’t done any market research because they’re not out yet, but we look at the animated series or movies and anything like that and again, find out which ones are going to be central to any of conversations in Pokemon going forward.

Pokemon Trainer will always be relevant in the movies and anime. Always. While we got a lot more from the original game from the anime (Goldeen and other Pokeball pokemon functions, Pikachu's summoning sky thunder...), and the recent ones take more from the games, we have a lot of anime to work with now! Mewtwo has returned, Sceptile is a big guy, Origins is around-- who knows!

“What’s the hot Pokémon? What Pokémon are in the movies right now? And really do a lot of research on that front.

This just makes me laugh because people think Sakurai knew nothing about ORAS. My point here is that trainer connection to all the Mega Evolution's may or may not be pertinent.

*I believed there was a statement Sakurai made about how pleased he was with Pokemon Trainer, how he fit in on his own as a unique character, offered something others couldn't... now I cannot*

 

[Kenith]

Sakurai has stated that the newcomer trailers will be available to watch in game... If there are secret newcomers in the game, do you think they will have trailers, also?

I have considered this prospect, as well.
What I think would be cool is if when you fight the character to unlock them, it would show the video afterwards.

 

[GunGunW]

Because Nintendo and Sega have a business deal, three Sonic games exclusive to Nintendo consoles.

You can be damn sure that Sonic will return to other consoles afterwards.

Example:
Insomniac always made games for Sony consoles, particularly the notable Ratchet and Clank franchise, and previously Spyro.

Hello, XBone exclusive Insomniac title "Sunset Overdrive."

It's just almost every sonic game made since the Dreamcast went down has been on some sort of Nintendo system; even in the case of Sonic 06 they made sure to make a game just for the Wii, and Generations, there was a 3DS version.

 

[Knight Dude]

Ah, yes, I remember the theory that Pokemon Trainer returns to battle WITH a vengeance... but WITHOUT his Pokemon ! He uses his own items, like the Pokeflute, he could probably bludgeon someone with a thunder stone as it is wasted on Pikachu.


Good thing those were the last words.


I was literally thinking the same thing. Mrs. Pac-Man should have been included over Pac-Man if you ask me. At least she offers her gender!

See if we get both of them, we'll have those Husband/Wife Wombo Combos. They'll make everyone else look like jokes.

And Zero, well, Megaman is already hype. But Megaman and Zero in Smash would be the greatest pipe dream to ever exist.

Those were considered videos?

I think so. But they only used in game models, so it might not count.

 

[JamesDNaux]

It's just almost every sonic game made since the Dreamcast went down has been on some sort of Nintendo system; even in the case of Sonic 06 they made sure to make a game just for the Wii, and Generations, there was a 3DS version.

Sonic sells well on Nintendo consoles.

Sonic sells well on Nintendo.

Sonic sells well.

Sells.


Again, there are no "relationships" between corporate entities, everything they do is for the green stuff.

 

[GunGunW]

Sonic sells well on Nintendo consoles.

Sonic sells well on Nintendo.

Sonic sells well.

Sells.


Again, there are no "relationships" between corporate entities, everything they do is for the green stuff.

Mario and Sonic went to the Olympics together so they're basically buddies as well.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Sonic sells well on Nintendo consoles.

Sonic sells well on Nintendo.

Sonic sells well.

Sells.


Again, there are no "relationships" between corporate entities, everything they do is for the green stuff.

Come on, really? Sega must be buddies with Nintendo. They just have to be!
Olympics?!? Remember!

 

[JamesDNaux]

Mario and Sonic went to the Olympics together so they're basically buddies as well.

What sells more than Mario and Sonic going to the Olympics?


Oh right, Mario and Sonic beating the ever loving (expletive) out of each other with Mega Man and Pac-Man joining in.
Mo-mo-mo-moneeeeeeeyyy~

 

[Kenith]

Again, there are no "relationships" between corporate entities, everything they do is for the green stuff.

With one very solid exception.

 

[ThePsychoWolf]

Nintendo and Sega are Superfriends now. If you had told me in the 90's that Mario and Sonic would one day be starring in each other's games, I'd have punched you in your face.

 

[GunGunW]

What sells more than Mario and Sonic going to the Olympics?


Oh right, Mario and Sonic beating the ever loving (expletive) out of each other with Mega Man and Pac-Man joining in.
Mo-mo-mo-moneeeeeeeyyy~

All I can really say is that at this point Sonic is more associated with Nintendo than he is with the other systems combined. Sure, Mega Man is too, I guess.

But yeah it makes more sense to make a game a platform exclusive instead of making it multiplatform and opening it up to more sales.

 

[JamesDNaux]

With one very solid exception.

You're so punny.

Snake is an exception, though Sakurai and Kojima are not Nintendo and Konami. They both did have to go through quite some trouble to get Snake in, but of course once everything went right, both Konami and Nintendo profited from the partnership.


All the more reason for Snake to return, really.

 

[ThePsychoWolf]

Nothing against Snake, but I still feel Dracula would make for a better Konami rep.

 

[Morbi]

Nothing against Snake, but I still feel Dracula would make for a better Konami rep.

I say this as a Snake supporter: everything against Snake, but I definitely feel that Dracula would make for a (much) better Konami representative.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Nothing against Snake, but I still feel Dracula would make for a better Konami rep.

Screw dat mang, gimme Simon Belmont and Bomberman.




No one can ever replace Snake.

 

[Kenith]

Nothing against Snake, but I still feel Dracula would make for a better Konami rep.

Ten years ago, I might have said the same thing.
Sort of like how Alex Kidd obviously would have been a better Sega rep in the 80's.

Castlevania pales in significance to Metal Gear for Konami.

Of course, unless you are referring to relevance to Nintendo, in which, yes, a Castlevania character does represent Nintendo somewhat better.

 

[ThePsychoWolf]

Ten years ago, I might have said the same thing.
Sort of like how Alex Kidd obviously would have been a better Sega rep in the 80's.

Castlevania pales in significance to Metal Gear for Konami.

Of course, unless you are referring to relevance to Nintendo, in which, yes, a Castlevania character does represent Nintendo somewhat better.

There's been at least one Castlevania game on every Nintendo system save for the Wii U. Dracula would also just be really fun to play as, and would likely have a pretty sweet moveset.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Ten years ago, I might have said the same thing.
Sort of like how Alex Kidd obviously would have been a better Sega rep in the 80's.

Castlevania pales in significance to Metal Gear for Konami.

This. This so much.

As much as everyone tries to deny it, none of the third parties in Smash are there because of association with Nintendo. Sakurai doesn't sit around looking at non-Nintendo characters asking himself "which one has appeared on more Nintendo consoles?"

Sonic is a Sega character. Mega Man is a Capcom character. Pac-Man is a Namco character. Snake is a Konami character.

It's a combination of a character's importance to their own company, and fans who bring them to attention to Sakurai. We're not going to have Billy Hatcher, Phoenix Wright, Klonoa, or Bomberman no matter how much a small group cries for them. There's a reason Sakurai calls them "guest characters." This isn't Nintendo and close friends, this is Nintendo and big named associates.

 

[Kenith]

There's been at least one Castlevania game on every Nintendo system save for the Wii U. Dracula would also just be really fun to play as, and would likely have a pretty sweet moveset.

I'm not arguing that, but Metal Gear is more prominent overall, especially for Konami.

 

[pupNapoleon]

What sells more than Mario and Sonic going to the Olympics?


Oh right, Mario and Sonic beating the ever loving (expletive) out of each other with Mega Man and Pac-Man joining in.
Mo-mo-mo-moneeeeeeeyyy~

With one very solid exception.

I would contest that theory with a MIND EXPLOSION

 

[GunGunW]

I think it's ironic that Kamek would be a Yoshi character if he was playable, yet he was deconfirmed from being a hazard on a Mario stage.

 

[ThePsychoWolf]

This. This so much.

As much as everyone tries to deny it, none of the third parties in Smash are there because of association with Nintendo. Sakurai doesn't sit around looking at non-Nintendo characters asking himself "which one has appeared on more Nintendo consoles?"

Sonic is a Sega character. Mega Man is a Capcom character. Pac-Man is a Namco character. Snake is a Konami character.

It's a combination of a character's importance to their own company, and fans who bring them to attention to Sakurai. We're not going to have Billy Hatcher, Phoenix Wright, Klonoa, or Bomberman no matter how much a small group cries for them. There's a reason Sakurai calls them "guest characters." This isn't Nintendo and close friends, this is Nintendo and big named associates.

I dunno, I find it unlikely that he would put in a character that had never appeared on a Nintendo system. Not saying that that's the only criteria he looks at for third parties, but you know he has to take it into consideration. He doesn't want to advertise too much for his competitors.