Character Discussion Thread

[FalcoPaunch!121]

why is falco dlc

Cuz Wolf is a Villain.

@ FalcoPaunch!121
Ignorning DLCx20 despite my loving bias for Sceptile & Yarn Yoshi plus the other obvious DLC:

My rating of your typed roster:

Why would that be?

 

[ihskeyp]

Cuz Wolf is a Villain.

Why would they cut Falco and then put him in as dlc? He's a clone character that doesn't take much development time, it'd be strange to cut him in the first place.

 

[Masonomace]

@ FalcoPaunch!121
Sorry it was meanto be 7 Falcons & not just 6. Didn't count the Mii classes, & when I did, it brought up the 18+ brand newcomer critique on how I rate rosters to a bare 7. 7 Is a fairly good score

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Why would they cut Falco and then put him in as dlc? He's a clone character that doesn't take much development time, it'd be strange to cut him in the first place.

Most people cut Wolf...and Krystal is unique.

@ FalcoPaunch!121
Sorry it was meanto be 7 Falcons & not just 6. Didn't count the Mii classes, & when I did, it brought up the 18+ brand newcomer critique on how I rate rosters to a bare 7. 7 Is a fairly good score

Yay!

 

[NeonBurrito]

there is no reason for 4 kirby reps and bd sounds boring to me marshal give me a intersting moveset for him sounds like a game and watch clone we already have 6 pokemon reps no need for skeptial

If you think Marshall is a Game & Watch clone, you must have never touched a Rhythm Heaven game. The moveset potential is incredible considering how unique the Rhythm Heaven games are.

 

[Arcadenik]

We haven't seen a single heavyweight or villain newcomer yet. Doesn't anybody else find this suspicious?

Ridley and Bowser Jr. (in the Koopa Clown Car) could qualify as heavyweight villains.

Duck Hunt Dog and Dark Pit could qualify as villains as well.

Oh, and we already have Villager.

 

[ihskeyp]

Most people cut Wolf...and Krystal is unique.

Yay!

Why does one of them have to be cut? And I didn't say anything about Krystal, I know she's unique.

 

[skylanders fan]

duck hunt dog could use the ducks as weapons and have a final smash where he shoots similar to duck hunt the game and attack useing other attacks from nes
ridley has been teased if he is a boss they why not just show him and he jumps bosses dont jump and i belive mewtwo has just as much of a chance as jigglypuff

 

[Masonomace]

To me having another lizard that roars, grabs people, and shoots fire seems moot when we have could be boring. (And yes, Yoshi does shoot fire in his Final Smash)

Aww man. . c'mon! Yoshi FS?!

That's suffering. Yarn Yoshi for Sm4sh to debunk your lizard statement.
Edit: I forgot Yoshi is a dinosaur/dragon. Our points are both derp & slurp.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Why does one of them have to be cut? And I didn't say anything about Krystal, I know she's unique.

Yes, but Star Fox will have a new game after the game is released. not before. 4 characters can happen in smash5.

 

[ihskeyp]

Yes, but Star Fox will have a new game after the game is released. not before. 4 characters can happen in smash5.

I don't think that matters. I don't think wolf or falco will be cut just because Star Fox hasn't had a game in a while. That'd be pretty dumb.

 

[CodeBlue_]

Now I must address one final point I think you may have misunderstood from the start. One of the reasons I hate what they did to Pally is that I feel she deserved more than what she got. She's an important character to her series, and clearly well liked by those that care about her, but instead o f being made unique like all the other newcomers, which this time around are as unique as sakurai has gone, she's just sort of there as the girl with a bunch of moves. From a smash perspective, I'd have liked that she got the same treatment as the others, and since she clearly has a lot to work with, focus on what she does bring to the table, and leave out this amalgam nonsense. Her unqiue moves are actually dope, heavenly light is crazy different than anything we have and I love that, then I saw her big bag of cloney tricks and I was like "well those aren't nearly as awesome or unique as this other stuff she does" and because they spent so much time on those, her moveset comes across as a lot more shallow looking. And that time could have been spent making one other clone's entire moveset, the specials of Issac another unique character. My point is she still could have been an awesome unique character, and they could have added other unique awesome characters, but instead they chose to spend time taking an already awesome character and trying to make her even more awesome without really adding any substance. It's like taking a shiny new car, and immediately washing it, it didn't need the extra coat of wax, it was already new and shiny as it was.

Ok I get where you are coming from then.

But there is really no way to prove that other characters could have been developed in the same time it took to make the special moves you find to be bland. That argument is strictly theoretical and is an excuse to spite something you cannot appreciate.

I think you should keep an open mind towards the moves you find bland. They should have different usage than the moves you find they emulate. Reflect Barrier, for example, will function as a wall that can not only Reflect projectiles but allow Palutena to move freely. It also has a lot more range than other Reflectors, allowing her to deal with most projectile camping. I personally love Reflect Barrier, probably because I used the move in Uprising and really like the concept of it. It is literally an anti-camp move.

I think it's not healthy to dismiss a custom move simply because it looks similar to another character's move. I see people freaking out over the Mii Fighters for this reason (apparently it is blasphemy for the Swordsman to mimic Ike's down throw or use a ninja star that looks like Water Shuriken). I don't really buy the bland vs. unique argument you guys on Smashboards try to make to dismiss or promote a character. It just is insensitive to those who like the notion or character and comes off as selfish and self-entitled.

One other thing, these custom moves do not define her character, they simply allow her to expand on her character design. I find her as a slow defensive character that has a lot of options (projectiles, counters, possible offensive moves, a teleport). Her custom moves function similarly to other custom moves; to expand her playstyle.

I have nothing else to say, so I guess we can move on to other speculation. The character is already in the game, and there is nothing we can do about it. I apologize for dragging this out, but I found it necessary to vent on this subject.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

I don't think that matters. I don't think wolf or falco will be cut just because Star Fox hasn't had a game in a while. That'd be pretty dumb.

Do you want Krystal?

Oh yeah, and does anyone want Monita as DLC?

 

[ihskeyp]

Do you want Krystal?

Sure. But even if they add Krystal they don't NEED to cut another character. It's not an obligation.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Sure. But even if they add Krystal they don't NEED to cut another character. It's not an obligation.

Then some other vets would get cut. maybe?

 

[CodeBlue_]

Can anyone explain why @ FalcoPaunch!121 got a warning?

 

[ihskeyp]

Then some other vets would get cut. maybe?

Why? They don't need to cut a veteran every time they add a newcomer... Why would someone have to be cut for Krystal?

 

[Masonomace]

Then some other vets would get cut. maybe?

Retros to Sakurai appear more safe & sound, & Wario has no solid reason behind to cut him. Lucas is that most likely character to cut imo.
Edit; apparently this was about cutting one for adding one. Count me out on that.

 

[ihskeyp]

Can anyone explain why @ FalcoPaunch!121 got a warning?

He double posted, a mod edited the two posts into one.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Can anyone explain why @ FalcoPaunch!121 got a warning?

Mod said Double Post.

Why? They don't need to cut a veteran every time they add a newcomer... Why would someone have to be cut for Krystal?

Roster size.

 

[CodeBlue_]

He double posted, a mod edited the two posts into one.

Huh. Usually it shows Double Post instead of Warning Received.

 

[ihskeyp]

Mod said Double Post.

Roster size.

There is no limit on the roster size, it will be as big as the developers want/have time for

 

[Burruni]

duck hunt dog could use the ducks as weapons and have a final smash where he shoots similar to duck hunt the game and attack useing other attacks from nes
ridley has been teased if he is a boss they why not just show him and he jumps bosses dont jump and i belive mewtwo has just as much of a chance as jigglypuff

1) That isn't a moveset, that's a concept. The difference is that a concept is what a moveset is about, and not what it IS.
For example...

Spoiler

Stats
Height: Small (Mr. G&W)
Weight: Featherweight (Pikachu)
Walk Speed: Average (Mario)
Run Speed: Slow (Ice Climbers)
Fall Speed: Floaty (Zelda)
Air Speed: Quick (Marth)

Basic Animations
Walk: Ribbon in RH:Fever (Night Walk)
Run: Cam in RH:Fever (Night Walk)
Jump: ...Normal Jump (Night Walk)
Back Jump: Backflip (See-Saw)
Shield: Crouch and cover head (Generic, not from a mini-game)
Grab: Two hand grab (Packing Pests)
Pummel: Headbutt (Donk Donk)
U-Throw: Elbow Flex toss (Ringside)
F/B-Throw: Volleyball Bump (Bossa Nova, B-Throw spins before the throw)
D-Throw: Riverstomp, akin to Kirby's (Tap Troupe)
Forward/Back Roll: Flipper Roll (Flipper Flop)
SideStep: ...Step away (Mr. Upbeat)
Air Dodge: Ditzy Down (Space Dance)
Crouch: Squat (Monkey's pose in Tambourine)
Flinch/Hurt: Eyes white, mouth open (Glee Club)
Up-Taunt: Holds up a sign and spins it around, the face showing "3, 2, 1, Go!" (Rhythm Test)
Taunt: Cycles through the Wrestler poses for the fans (Ringside)
Down-Taunt: Guitar Jump (Big Rock Finish).

A-Moves
Jab Combo: Left-Left-Right punch combo, Go Go Go! (Figure fighter)
Dash Attack: Crouched roll combo + punch finish (works like Luigi's, Night Walk).
U-Tilt: Kick (Double Date)
F-Tilt: Bat (Exhibition Match)
D-Tilt: Leg Sweep (Karate Man)
[Smashes have 4 levels of power, at each half-second (a beat), and will auto-use at 2 seconds of charge (full 4/4 measure)]
U-Smash: Book Spin & Open, Okay It's On! (Cheer Readers)
F-Smash: Katana flurry, Green-eyed Demons (Samurai Slice)
D-Smash: Spin & Stomp to finish (Board Meeting)
U-Air: Air-Swim to headbutt higher (Micro Row)
B-Air: Flings back out, A-B-C! (Shrimp Shuffle)
N-Air: Posed Spin "Alley-Oop" (Splashdown)
F-Air: Tambourine clap (Tambourine)
D-Air: Paintbrush (Power Calligraphy)
Ledge-Attack: Spring up from the edge (Flock Step)

Special Moves
Neutral B (Glee Club): Charged, releasable on each half-second interval up to 5 seconds for a proper "beat." Releasing on an off-beat causes a squeak to come out of Marshal and holding for longer than 5 seconds causes Marshal to just cough [making the Excalibur face that Rhythm Monkey does in Tambourine for extra detail]. The overcharge functions like Luigi's Side B overcharge in Sm4sh. On a "beat" hit, Marshal lets out a scream of a note that causes a small shockwave in a circle around him that doesn't cover his entire body at Stage 1, but scales in range, damage, and knockback to a properly-timed hit of Donkey Konga at Stage 10. This is by far the most complex, but most crucial and iconic part of Marshall's moveset.
Up B (Night Walk): 1.5 seconds of fairly-fast free ranged movement like Balloon Fighter or Pit's Old (or maybe it is still current, I haven't seen it in action) recovery moves. Solely for recovery, Has 3 balloons with one popping on each half-second beat.
Side B (Air Rally): Pulls out a racket and hits a shuttlecock projectile for a fairly weak hit with a fairly high arc (about 1.5x the height of a normal yoshi toss) but if B is pressed again right before the swing, it is almost horizontal and had stronger damage. Either way it is minimal knockback, but a possible strong harass move.
Down B (Munchy Monk): Like Mr.G&W's bucket, Marshal stands in place with his mouth held wide open. If attacked in front by a projectile, he will eat it and swallow to restore a small percentage of damage. If struck by a barrage of projectiles (for example, Fox blaster spam, or Mii Gunner's side smash) he will inhale them all with his head growing larger, leading to a larger gulp which takes more tame but restore more percentage.

Final Smash (Showtime!): About three character lengths from Marshal, the two other Chorus Kids (alternatively Ribbon and Cam) pop up from the ground (taking up the space 2 to 4 character lengths away from Marshall) and knock any opponents in the unfortunate space into a short Cinematic of a Karate Joe stage, ending with a combo that the opponents are thrown into. High vertical knockback.

is a fairly detailed and quite full moveset for Marshal.
2) Ridley was shown IN FLIGHT, not jumping. The time of which spanned about 10 seconds which would be extreme if it was his up special... disregarding all estimates of the character size in the footage and the implications of it being shown during "Bosses appear on other stages too."
3) Bosses CAN jump, if Brawl tells us anything: Galleom, Porky/Pokey, Duon, and Petey Prihanna ALL jumped. They make up 4 of the 10 bosses of that game, when two of theother 6 were the old Hand duo.
4) For what reason do you believe Mewtwo is as likely as Jigglypuff. If you are going to make an argument such as that, you better be ready to defend it.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

There is no limit on the roster size, it will be as big as the developers want/have time for

Only so much a 3DS can fit into.

 

[ihskeyp]

Only so much a 3DS can fit into.

The 3ds can handle way more than you think.

 

[Masonomace]

For the comment of 3DS, see Monster Hunter. 3DS got this

Edit: Taking a good break, seeya in 1+ hour(s).

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

Smash Run and the Modes take up estimately 3/4 of the space, same as brawl. stages and items and wi-fi are included, along with that wierd wii u mode.

 

[skylanders fan]

1) That isn't a moveset, that's a concept. The difference is that a concept is what a moveset is about, and not what it IS.
For example...

Spoiler

Stats
Height: Small (Mr. G&W)
Weight: Featherweight (Pikachu)
Walk Speed: Average (Mario)
Run Speed: Slow (Ice Climbers)
Fall Speed: Floaty (Zelda)
Air Speed: Quick (Marth)

Basic Animations
Walk: Ribbon in RH:Fever (Night Walk)
Run: Cam in RH:Fever (Night Walk)
Jump: ...Normal Jump (Night Walk)
Back Jump: Backflip (See-Saw)
Shield: Crouch and cover head (Generic, not from a mini-game)
Grab: Two hand grab (Packing Pests)
Pummel: Headbutt (Donk Donk)
U-Throw: Elbow Flex toss (Ringside)
F/B-Throw: Volleyball Bump (Bossa Nova, B-Throw spins before the throw)
D-Throw: Riverstomp, akin to Kirby's (Tap Troupe)
Forward/Back Roll: Flipper Roll (Flipper Flop)
SideStep: ...Step away (Mr. Upbeat)
Air Dodge: Ditzy Down (Space Dance)
Crouch: Squat (Monkey's pose in Tambourine)
Flinch/Hurt: Eyes white, mouth open (Glee Club)
Up-Taunt: Holds up a sign and spins it around, the face showing "3, 2, 1, Go!" (Rhythm Test)
Taunt: Cycles through the Wrestler poses for the fans (Ringside)
Down-Taunt: Guitar Jump (Big Rock Finish).

A-Moves
Jab Combo: Left-Left-Right punch combo, Go Go Go! (Figure fighter)
Dash Attack: Crouched roll combo + punch finish (works like Luigi's, Night Walk).
U-Tilt: Kick (Double Date)
F-Tilt: Bat (Exhibition Match)
D-Tilt: Leg Sweep (Karate Man)
[Smashes have 4 levels of power, at each half-second (a beat), and will auto-use at 2 seconds of charge (full 4/4 measure)]
U-Smash: Book Spin & Open, Okay It's On! (Cheer Readers)
F-Smash: Katana flurry, Green-eyed Demons (Samurai Slice)
D-Smash: Spin & Stomp to finish (Board Meeting)
U-Air: Air-Swim to headbutt higher (Micro Row)
B-Air: Flings back out, A-B-C! (Shrimp Shuffle)
N-Air: Posed Spin "Alley-Oop" (Splashdown)
F-Air: Tambourine clap (Tambourine)
D-Air: Paintbrush (Power Calligraphy)
Ledge-Attack: Spring up from the edge (Flock Step)

Special Moves
Neutral B (Glee Club): Charged, releasable on each half-second interval up to 5 seconds for a proper "beat." Releasing on an off-beat causes a squeak to come out of Marshal and holding for longer than 5 seconds causes Marshal to just cough [making the Excalibur face that Rhythm Monkey does in Tambourine for extra detail]. The overcharge functions like Luigi's Side B overcharge in Sm4sh. On a "beat" hit, Marshal lets out a scream of a note that causes a small shockwave in a circle around him that doesn't cover his entire body at Stage 1, but scales in range, damage, and knockback to a properly-timed hit of Donkey Konga at Stage 10. This is by far the most complex, but most crucial and iconic part of Marshall's moveset.
Up B (Night Walk): 1.5 seconds of fairly-fast free ranged movement like Balloon Fighter or Pit's Old (or maybe it is still current, I haven't seen it in action) recovery moves. Solely for recovery, Has 3 balloons with one popping on each half-second beat.
Side B (Air Rally): Pulls out a racket and hits a shuttlecock projectile for a fairly weak hit with a fairly high arc (about 1.5x the height of a normal yoshi toss) but if B is pressed again right before the swing, it is almost horizontal and had stronger damage. Either way it is minimal knockback, but a possible strong harass move.
Down B (Munchy Monk): Like Mr.G&W's bucket, Marshal stands in place with his mouth held wide open. If attacked in front by a projectile, he will eat it and swallow to restore a small percentage of damage. If struck by a barrage of projectiles (for example, Fox blaster spam, or Mii Gunner's side smash) he will inhale them all with his head growing larger, leading to a larger gulp which takes more tame but restore more percentage.

Final Smash (Showtime!): About three character lengths from Marshal, the two other Chorus Kids (alternatively Ribbon and Cam) pop up from the ground (taking up the space 2 to 4 character lengths away from Marshall) and knock any opponents in the unfortunate space into a short Cinematic of a Karate Joe stage, ending with a combo that the opponents are thrown into. High vertical knockback.

is a fairly detailed and quite full moveset for Marshal.
2) Ridley was shown IN FLIGHT, not jumping. The time of which spanned about 10 seconds which would be extreme if it was his up special... disregarding all estimates of the character size in the footage and the implications of it being shown during "Bosses appear on other stages too."
3) Bosses CAN jump, if Brawl tells us anything: Galleom, Porky/Pokey, Duon, and Petey Prihanna ALL jumped. They make up 4 of the 10 bosses of that game, when two of theother 6 were the old Hand duo.
4) For what reason do you believe Mewtwo is as likely as Jigglypuff. If you are going to make an argument such as that, you better be ready to defend it.

orginal 12 can be cut see lucas and ness greninja trailer mewtwo popularity relvance and being more relavent the jigglypuff however i really dont wanna spam the board with this but i belive there are 6 pokemon reps so jiggly and mewtwo make it in

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

orginal 12 can be cut see lucas and ness greninja trailer mewtwo popularity relvance and being more relavent the jigglypuff however i really dont wanna spam the board with this but i belive there are 6 pokemon reps so jiggly and mewtwo make it in

Look, even my roster has the 12. And my roster is extremely biased.

 

[skylanders fan]

Look, even my roster has the 12. And my roster is extremely biased.

no i know and in belive they will be back its just they arent eternal beings that have to come back becuse they are original 12

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

no i know and in belive they will be back its just they arent eternal beings that have to come back becuse they are original 12

Yeah, actually.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Smash Run and the Modes take up estimately 3/4 of the space

I'd love to see some evidence for that.

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

I'd love to see some evidence for that.

Dont have any, just an estimate.

 

[skylanders fan]

Yeah, your right actually.

fixed it

 

[Burruni]

orginal 12 can be cut see lucas and ness greninja trailer mewtwo popularity relvance and being more relavent the jigglypuff however i really dont wanna spam the board with this but i belive there are 6 pokemon reps so jiggly and mewtwo make it in

1) There is one factor of the Lucas vs Ness that really doesn't apply to Jiggly: Lucas was going to replace Ness as they both, in terms of their games, are virtually identical for gameplay (at the time of Earthbound 64). Lucas likely would've been Melee Ness but with a different model, no difference in the moveset. In that case,one of the original 12 was replaced by someone whose gameplay would be identical, based on what was known about Earthbound 64. No Pokemon is going to replace Jigglypuff.
2) Greninja trailer doesn't give evidence to Mewtwo being playable. He was given some love in Gen 6. I will not argue that. However, between the two Megas as final smashes, 2 stages, 1 newcomer, and a number of Pokeball Pokemon, we may have plenty of Gen 6 representation.
3) I will place money on there being at least 5 Pokemon reps, but Mewtwo doesn't have much in-game evidence that can point to him being playable this time around as opposed to Sceptile.
Let that be the end of this sub-argument.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Dont have any, just an estimate.

Then you have no basis for that claim. You don't know.

And characters are not cut for other characters (the only real exception was Young Link --> Toon Link). They are added on their own.

 

[skylanders fan]

1) There is one factor of the Lucas vs Ness that really doesn't apply to Jiggly: Lucas was going to replace Ness as they both, in terms of their games, are virtually identical for gameplay (at the time of Earthbound 64). Lucas likely would've been Melee Ness but with a different model, no difference in the moveset. In that case,one of the original 12 was replaced by someone whose gameplay would be identical, based on what was known about Earthbound 64. No Pokemon is going to replace Jigglypuff.
2) Greninja trailer doesn't give evidence to Mewtwo being playable. He was given some love in Gen 6. I will not argue that. However, between the two Megas as final smashes, 2 stages, 1 newcomer, and a number of Pokeball Pokemon, we may have plenty of Gen 6 representation.
3) I will place money on there being at least 5 Pokemon reps, but Mewtwo doesn't have much in-game evidence that can point to him being playable this time around as opposed to Sceptile.
Let that be the end of this sub-argument.

agree to disagree

 

[FalcoPaunch!121]

cant fix it

Exactly.

Then you have no basis for that claim. You don't know.

And characters are not cut for other characters (the only real exception was Young Link --> Toon Link). They are added on their own.

Lucario and Mewtwo?

 

[MagnesD3]

Yes, but Star Fox will have a new game after the game is released. not before. 4 characters can happen in smash5.

Star fox can have 4 characters now actually. Nobody will be getting cut on this crew.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Lucario and Mewtwo?

Mewtwo was cut late in development while both were being developed. So, Lucario did not "replace" him, contrary to popular belief. So don't even try to use that one. I suggest doing some research before you try to invalidate my points.