Lavani
Indigo Destiny
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- Oct 24, 2014
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Jab 1 | 1f | 3-4f
Jab 2 | 13f | 18-21f
Last edited:
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Character Data Research Thread
- Thread starter Shaya
- Start date
Jab 1 | 1f | 3-4f
Jab 2 | 13f | 18-21f
gameprodigy12
Smash Apprentice
I main Samus, besides my other mains, and from what I'm seeing from you are pretty spot on with it. I might be a little off as well but that's the frames for her which is why jab 1 to grab or dtilt works for her.
Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
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- Aug 25, 2014
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****! I hate being sick! GREAT! MORE EDITING!!! I LOVE EDITING!!! DID I MENTION HOW I LOVE EDITING?!! I LOVE IT SO MU- *is dragged off to be sedated*
Edit: It was actually I typo: I have 17-20 for Jab 2.
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- Joined
- May 3, 2009
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okay so so far I've only seen unk_170(0x77, 0x2000, ) in Mega Man's Jab, FTilt, and NAir. Not sure if it means "allow transition to next lemon" or "allow transition to other lemon attack". It occurs after the bit calling lemons, which is on F2 of every lemon attack. Lemons are stored with all three of them in the same subaction. That is, despite them being three distinct objects/hitboxes, they are stored as different hitboxes of the same attack (which I guess is what they are).
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Ive decided that unk_170(0x77, 0x2000, ) allows movement transition during attack. So from standing > walking/jumping, walking > standing/jumping, and jumping > standing/walking
Now I've run across unk_170(0x4, 0x2000, ) in airshooter. Any ideas?!
Now I've run across unk_170(0x4, 0x2000, ) in airshooter. Any ideas?!
Code:
def game_00():
Hitbox_02B(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=3.000000, Angle=0x5C, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x46, BKB=0x0, Size=7.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, 0x2, 0x0, 0.200000, 0.700000, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x3, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3F, 0x0, 0xF, 0x0, 0x1, 0x1, 0x0, 0x3, 0x
0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=8.000000, )
Hitbox_02B(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=2.000000, Angle=0x5C, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x50, BKB=0x0, Size=8.500000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, 0x2, 0x0, 0.200000, 0.700000, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3, 0x3, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3F, 0x0, 0xF, 0x0, 0x1, 0x1, 0x0, 0x5, 0x
0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, )
unk_170(0x4, 0x2000, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=22.000000, )
Hitbox_02B(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=1.000000, Angle=0x5C, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x50, BKB=0x0, Size=10.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, 0x2, 0x0, 0.200000, 0.700000, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3, 0x3, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3F, 0x0, 0xF, 0x0, 0x1, 0x1, 0x0, 0x5, 0x
0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, )
unk_170(0x4, 0x2000, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=45.000000, )
Hitbox_02B(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=2.000000, Angle=0x5C, KBG=0x104, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x5, Size=9.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, 0x2, 0x0, 0.200000, 0.700000, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x2, 0x3, 0x3, 0x0, 0x0, 0x3F, 0x0, 0xF, 0x0, 0x1, 0x1, 0x0, 0x5, 0x
0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x0, )
unk_170(0x4, 0x2000, )
End_196()
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ParanoidDrone
Smash Master
A thought I had recently.
Does Mastercore contain data about absorption and similar hitboxes, like on Rosalina/Ness/G&W's down specials? Obviously they wouldn't do damage but surely there's something somewhere that specifies the area they affect and how fast it comes out.
Does Mastercore contain data about absorption and similar hitboxes, like on Rosalina/Ness/G&W's down specials? Obviously they wouldn't do damage but surely there's something somewhere that specifies the area they affect and how fast it comes out.
Question: Since the mastercore has special effects tables too, doesn't that mean we could technically track any data changes there and know each visual change that happened to 1.0.5 too?
Because Aside Zelda's pivot grab visual improvement, I'm certain there were more super subtle improvements to like, the magic effects on some of her moves.
Because Aside Zelda's pivot grab visual improvement, I'm certain there were more super subtle improvements to like, the magic effects on some of her moves.
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- May 3, 2009
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- 7,190
As far as I know, it doesn't contain data on those sorts of multipliers. I haven't found anything that looks like Pocket/Gravitational Pull multipliers in my database crawling.
Yes, though mastercore hasn't been updated with the v1.0.5 dumps yet.
Question on frame speed multipliers;
As I understand it, they are generally calculated by dividing 1 by the speed multiplier value, right? A frame speed multiplier of 0.5 means 4 frames are counted in 2 (1/0.5 = 2, 4/2 = 2).
Though I still don't understand how to apply that knowledge to figuring out when timer actions occur. For example, Shulk's UTilt
Code:
def game_5C():
FrameSpeedMultiplier_0DF(0.660000, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=15.000000, )
FrameSpeedMultiplier_0DF(1.000000, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x19, Damage=8.000000, Angle=0x55, KBG=0x5A, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x46, Size=5.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=7.500000, X=-1.000000, Element=0x2, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x3, 0x
3, 0x1, 0xA, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x1, GID=0x0, Bone=0x19, Damage=8.000000, Angle=0x55, KBG=0x5A, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x46, Size=5.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=2.000000, X=-1.000000, Element=0x2, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x3, 0x
3, 0x1, 0xA, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=17.000000, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x2, GID=0x0, Bone=0x19, Damage=7.000000, Angle=0x6C, KBG=0x55, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x41, Size=5.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=14.000000, X=-1.000000, Element=0x2, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x3, 0x
3, 0x1, 0xA, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x3, GID=0x0, Bone=0x19, Damage=7.000000, Angle=0x6C, KBG=0x55, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x41, Size=5.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=10.000000, X=-1.000000, Element=0x2, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x3, 0x
3, 0x1, 0xA, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=28.000000, )
RemoveAllHitboxes_014()
FrameSpeedMultiplier_0DF(0.800000, )
End_196()
I could be incorrect on some of these hopefully someone can correct me if I'm being a dunce
- As I understand it, they are generally calculated by dividing 1 by the speed multiplier value, right?
- The frame speed multiplier means that it counts to the first timer in approximately 10F (it's actually 9.9F). But... what does that mean?
Example : Imagine you are counting, and you are looking at a clock, you count one second per tick, now someone tells you to look away from the clock until you count to x number and you count at whatever rate (the rate doesn't matter so long as it's fixed for each second you count). Assuming you don't remember what the clock was before you turned away from it you will assume x seconds that you counted have passed. Then you continue counting like you never had counted the rate incorrectly before
- As soon as the first timer is reached the frame speed is reset back to one, so on what real frame do the actions on the second timer occur?
real time
frame 10 first hit boxes
frame 12 second hit boxes
frame 23 remove hit boxes
theoretical time
frame 9.9
frame 11.9
frame 22.9
what frame the game thinks
frame 15
frame 17
frame 28
at least this is how I see it, a frame by frame would probably be nice (and prove me right or wrong)
frame 10 first hit boxes
frame 12 second hit boxes
frame 23 remove hit boxes
theoretical time
frame 9.9
frame 11.9
frame 22.9
what frame the game thinks
frame 15
frame 17
frame 28
at least this is how I see it, a frame by frame would probably be nice (and prove me right or wrong)
Sausage Zeldas
Smash Apprentice
Not sure if you've got this already, but 01E seems to be late-hit damage change.
For example, Ganon's Nair calls it three times:
This changes the damage for hitboxes 0, 1, and 2 to 7% on frame 9.
If this is already somewhere, please point me in the right direction because I feel like I'm missing some stuff.
For example, Ganon's Nair calls it three times:
Code:
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=7.000000, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x9, Damage=12.000000, Angle=0x37, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x1E, Size=4.300000, Z=6.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x2, 0x3, 0x1, 0x6, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x1, GID=0x0, Bone=0x9, Damage=12.000000, Angle=0x3C, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x1E, Size=5.700000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x2, 0x3, 0x1, 0x6, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x2, GID=0x0, Bone=0x3, Damage=12.000000, Angle=0x41, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x0, BKB=0x1E, Size=6.200000, Z=0.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x1, 0x2, 0x3, 0x1, 0x6, )
SynchronousTimer_20B(Frame=2.000000, )
unk_01E(0x0, 7.000000, )
unk_01E(0x1, 7.000000, )
unk_01E(0x2, 7.000000, )If this is already somewhere, please point me in the right direction because I feel like I'm missing some stuff.
checking notes... well it's new to me.
I might test it later, but I really don't see how you could be wrong. I definitely have not seen 01E before though (I don't know where I would go looking for a 01E either only how I would test it) I'll add an edit to this post if I did a test
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- May 3, 2009
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Theory time theory time
The two unknowns after a hitbox's SDI modifier (parameter 16 and parameter 17, counting ID as parameter 0) are related to priority stuff. We already know that the first one dictates whether a hitbox has normal or transcendent priority, but the second parameter's function wasn't completely known, as far as I know.
I noticed that some moves, when clanked, have the character go into a "heavy recoil" animation (idk what to call it). Instead of the move being clanked and the animation ending rather quickly, they are stuck in hitlag for the duration of the clank bubble after which they literally recoil backwards in an animation that takes a considerable time to end.
I was testing jab stuff and input ZSS and Little Mac's jabs on the same frame using 1/4 speed (Hold L). When close enough to each other, the characters trade hits and both receive damage and knockback. However, when the have enough distance between them, the jabs clank.
Little Mac begins pulling his arm back as soon as the jabs collide, and is free to transition into jab 2 even while the clank bubble is still bright and "active".
ZSS, however, is stuck in hitlag while Little Mac is not, as long as the clank bubble is bright. When hitlag ends, she recoils backwards into heavy clank recoil.
This means that although both jabs are F1, 1F duration jabs that clank, Little Mac has frame advantage over ZSS, enough to hit her with jab 2.
However, holding shield has ZSS put up her shield sooner than Little Mac. ZSS still puts up her shield before Little Mac on whiff, but the time between their shield is considerably shorter. This means ZSS's jab 1 has an earlier FAF when heavy recoiled than when whiffed, even with the hitlag from clank.
So anyway where I was going with this is that I believe paramter 17 governs whether or not a move puts its character into heavy recoil when clanked. Compare the two jabs:
Little Mac jab 1
ZSS jab 1
For Little Mac, parameter 17 = 0, and he does not experience heavy recoil. For ZSS, parameter 17 = 1, and she experiences heavy recoil.
I'll do more extensive testing with more moves when I get back home from work.
The two unknowns after a hitbox's SDI modifier (parameter 16 and parameter 17, counting ID as parameter 0) are related to priority stuff. We already know that the first one dictates whether a hitbox has normal or transcendent priority, but the second parameter's function wasn't completely known, as far as I know.
I noticed that some moves, when clanked, have the character go into a "heavy recoil" animation (idk what to call it). Instead of the move being clanked and the animation ending rather quickly, they are stuck in hitlag for the duration of the clank bubble after which they literally recoil backwards in an animation that takes a considerable time to end.
I was testing jab stuff and input ZSS and Little Mac's jabs on the same frame using 1/4 speed (Hold L). When close enough to each other, the characters trade hits and both receive damage and knockback. However, when the have enough distance between them, the jabs clank.
Little Mac begins pulling his arm back as soon as the jabs collide, and is free to transition into jab 2 even while the clank bubble is still bright and "active".
ZSS, however, is stuck in hitlag while Little Mac is not, as long as the clank bubble is bright. When hitlag ends, she recoils backwards into heavy clank recoil.
This means that although both jabs are F1, 1F duration jabs that clank, Little Mac has frame advantage over ZSS, enough to hit her with jab 2.
However, holding shield has ZSS put up her shield sooner than Little Mac. ZSS still puts up her shield before Little Mac on whiff, but the time between their shield is considerably shorter. This means ZSS's jab 1 has an earlier FAF when heavy recoiled than when whiffed, even with the hitlag from clank.
So anyway where I was going with this is that I believe paramter 17 governs whether or not a move puts its character into heavy recoil when clanked. Compare the two jabs:
Little Mac jab 1
Code:
def game_50():
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=1.000000, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x10, Damage=2.000000, Angle=0x55, KBG=0x50, WKB=0x0, BKB=0xA, Size=4.500000, Z=3.000000, Y=0.000000, X=0.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x0, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x3,
0x1, 0x4, )
Hitbox_029(ID=0x1, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=2.000000, Angle=0x55, KBG=0x50, WKB=0x0, BKB=0xA, Size=2.500000, Z=0.000000, Y=11.000000, X=8.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x0, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x3,
0x1, 0x4, 0x40400000, 11.000000, 4.000000, )
SynchronousTimer_20B(Frame=1.000000, )
RemoveAllHitboxes_014()
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=7.000000, )
unk_170(0xD, 0x2100, )
unk_170(0x13, 0x2100, )
End_196()
Code:
def game_50():
Hitbox_026(ID=0x0, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=1.500000, Angle=0x5C, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x17, BKB=0x0, Size=3.000000, Z=0.000000, Y=12.000000, X=13.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x
3, 0x1, 0x4, )
Hitbox_026(ID=0x1, GID=0x0, Bone=0x0, Damage=1.500000, Angle=0x3D, KBG=0x64, WKB=0x2D, BKB=0x0, Size=3.800000, Z=0.000000, Y=11.000000, X=9.000000, Element=0x0, Tripping=0x0, Hitlag=1.000000, SDI=1.000000, unk_=0x1, unk_=0x1, ShieldDamage=0x0, 0x0, 0x1, 0x3
, 0x1, 0x4, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=2.000000, )
RemoveAllHitboxes_014()
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=8.000000, )
unk_170(0x13, 0x2100, )
AsynchronousTimer_0D0(Frame=11.000000, )
unk_170(0xD, 0x2100, )
End_196()I'll do more extensive testing with more moves when I get back home from work.
Lavani
Indigo Destiny
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- Oct 24, 2014
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- Joined
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Whoops! That's good to know though. Also that means I don't have to sift through data looking for stuff
Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2014
- Messages
- 14,629
Luma's Jab combo is synced to Rosalina's, right? So, it should come after Rosalina's, right? So, if Rosie's Jab 1 is frame 8-10, then what would Luma's be? The issue is that I want to combine the Jabs into consecutive frames rather having them separate.
Move Hit Frames|
|
Jab|2-4, 10-12, 18-22, 23-27, 28-32, 33-37, (infinite), 42-43|8-10, 21-23, 32-34 (GentleRosie)|4-5, 6-7, 9-13 (GentleLuma)
Dash Attack|8-11 or 12-17|6-9, 17-19|6-9
Ftilt|6-8|7-9|8-11
Utilt|5-9, 12-16|9-17|3-3 or 4-5 or 6-10
Dtilt|7-9|5-8|8-13
Side Smash|17-19 or 20|16-18|17-18
Up Smash|8-12, 14-19|8-16|10-12 or 13-17
Down Smash|7-9|6-7 or 17-18|7-8 or 19-20
Nair|3-5, 6-9, 14-17, 21-23|9-34 or 35-46|3-6 or 26-29
Fair|12-17, 18-23, 24-29, 30-34, 35-36|11-25, 27-28|11-15
Bair|4-5 or 7-11|9-11|11-16
Uair|10-14|8-18 or 11-21 or 22-29|3-9
Dair|16-18 or 19-31|17-17 or 18-22, or 23-25 or 26-32|8-13
Sluigi123
R64/Brawl- Dev; AI Coder; Balancer
Wouldn't 0x0D7 be the grab-box data?
Would all the specials be in a completely different section/folder inside the game then, since I don't see them in the character files?
If that is the case, then the characters are broken into two parts/folders then (Non-Specials and Specials)?
Would all the specials be in a completely different section/folder inside the game then, since I don't see them in the character files?
If that is the case, then the characters are broken into two parts/folders then (Non-Specials and Specials)?
- Joined
- May 3, 2009
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- 7,190
Non-article specials are contained within the same fighter file, but since specials are all different subactions across the cast, theyre not labelled. For example, Super Dedede Jump is contained within Dedede's file, but Gordos are in dedede_gordo. And while Dedede Jump may be subaction-243 or whatever, Zamus's Boost Kick can be an entirely different one.
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ParanoidDrone
Smash Master
I think Luma's jab is a smidge faster than Rosalina, actually. I can't find the frame data right now but broadly, although it's true that Luma's animation for any given attack starts a frame after Rosalina, Luma's attacks do NOT have the same frame data.
Given that Luma can be almost literally anywhere onstage, I'm not sure whether combining the active frames would serve much of a purpose, but that's your perogative.
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Lavani
Indigo Destiny
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2014
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- 7,256
Luma starts his actions 1 frame after Rosalina starts hers, not after she finishes. When you press A, Luma hits frame 4 and Rosalina hits frame 8.
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What is even Lumas gender, I think thats something we should research which mastercore does not provide an answer for
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Sammi Husky
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 13, 2014
- Messages
- 88
Without knowing what subactions pertain to what animations, after a while it becomes apparent that there is somewhat of a pattern to them. For example:
![]()
As shown in the image, most characters have a large gap of empty subaction (around 0x1B7 - 0x20E, roughly). These are where the specials start. They are always grouped in groups of 3, with an empty entry separating them. The first group is normally the neutral special. In this screenshot, im using captain falcon. The 3 subactions that comprise the group are in this order:
![]()
![]()
![]()
As you can see, the three subactions that were grouped together do represent the custom variations of the same move. Alrighty, thats helpful. But now we make the assumption that the next group will be the next special. However, that isn't correct. We would be forgetting the grounded reversal, air, and aerial reversal variations of the move. So, the next groups subactions follow the same pattern we have seen so far (default, custom 1, custom 2) but for one of those variants. After all the variants, then comes the next special.
Mind you, these patterns may differ slightly between chars (but not by much). I believe the gap between the groups was likely an empty space for a fourth custom, but since most were unfinished, they were left blank.
EDIT: The location of the "large gap" is what changes between chars for the most part, though it's not very difficult to spot anyways
As shown in the image, most characters have a large gap of empty subaction (around 0x1B7 - 0x20E, roughly). These are where the specials start. They are always grouped in groups of 3, with an empty entry separating them. The first group is normally the neutral special. In this screenshot, im using captain falcon. The 3 subactions that comprise the group are in this order:
- Special 1, grounded, non custom.
- Special 1, grounded, custom 1.
- Special 1, grounded, custom 2.
As you can see, the three subactions that were grouped together do represent the custom variations of the same move. Alrighty, thats helpful. But now we make the assumption that the next group will be the next special. However, that isn't correct. We would be forgetting the grounded reversal, air, and aerial reversal variations of the move. So, the next groups subactions follow the same pattern we have seen so far (default, custom 1, custom 2) but for one of those variants. After all the variants, then comes the next special.
Mind you, these patterns may differ slightly between chars (but not by much). I believe the gap between the groups was likely an empty space for a fourth custom, but since most were unfinished, they were left blank.
EDIT: The location of the "large gap" is what changes between chars for the most part, though it's not very difficult to spot anyways
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Sausage Zeldas
Smash Apprentice
Based on the above, I decided to root through ROB's specials.
They did indeed start on 20E, and followed Neutral, Side, Up, Down like in the custom menu. Within those they had chunks of customs 1/2/3, and also there was a copy (or slightly changed copy) for the aerial version of each. Interestingly, his Side (Arm Rotor, 216-22C) was split up into startup, main attack, and endlag. Down (Gyro, 242-270) was split into a bunch of stuff; as far as I could tell, it was startup, failed start, charge, launch, endlag, and then something else that only uses sound and expression.
Another curiosity was that there were 13 empty subactions between the last subaction of Up (234) and the first subaction of Down (242) instead of just one. Even weirder was that the 10th (23E) wasn't actually empty—there was a single line in the gfx part. Note that 13 spaces is room for 3 more groups of subactions, with the 10th slot starting the last group. If that makes sense.
Incidentally, from what I'm seeing here, it looks like event 06A is a graphics call to add an effect to something, since it appears wherever the Fire Gyro pops up (24B, 24F, 253) and also in Robo Rocket (22F) when the flames come out. It's not in the normal Robo Burner (22E) or High-Speed Burner (230), though, but I'm guessing those can access some aspect of his burners that Robo Rocket can't (maybe that's what event 150 does?? None of Usmash, Nair, Bair, or Dair use it or even event 06A though).
Anyway, I don't know how much all that rambling helps, but there it is.
They did indeed start on 20E, and followed Neutral, Side, Up, Down like in the custom menu. Within those they had chunks of customs 1/2/3, and also there was a copy (or slightly changed copy) for the aerial version of each. Interestingly, his Side (Arm Rotor, 216-22C) was split up into startup, main attack, and endlag. Down (Gyro, 242-270) was split into a bunch of stuff; as far as I could tell, it was startup, failed start, charge, launch, endlag, and then something else that only uses sound and expression.
Robo Beam
Wide-Angle Beam
Infinite Robo Beam
'' (air)
Arm Rotor startup
Reflector Arm startup
Backward Arm Rotor startup
'' [attack]
'' end
'' startup (air)
'' (air)
'' end (air)
Robo Burner
Robo Rocket
High-Speed Burner
'' (air)
Gyro startup
Fire Gyro startup
Slip Gyro startup
'' fail
'' charge
'' launch
'' end
'' ??
'' startup (air)
'' fail (air)
'' charge (air)
'' launch (air)
'' end (air)
'' ?? (air)
Wide-Angle Beam
Infinite Robo Beam
'' (air)
Arm Rotor startup
Reflector Arm startup
Backward Arm Rotor startup
'' [attack]
'' end
'' startup (air)
'' (air)
'' end (air)
Robo Burner
Robo Rocket
High-Speed Burner
'' (air)
Gyro startup
Fire Gyro startup
Slip Gyro startup
'' fail
'' charge
'' launch
'' end
'' ??
'' startup (air)
'' fail (air)
'' charge (air)
'' launch (air)
'' end (air)
'' ?? (air)
Another curiosity was that there were 13 empty subactions between the last subaction of Up (234) and the first subaction of Down (242) instead of just one. Even weirder was that the 10th (23E) wasn't actually empty—there was a single line in the gfx part. Note that 13 spaces is room for 3 more groups of subactions, with the 10th slot starting the last group. If that makes sense.
Incidentally, from what I'm seeing here, it looks like event 06A is a graphics call to add an effect to something, since it appears wherever the Fire Gyro pops up (24B, 24F, 253) and also in Robo Rocket (22F) when the flames come out. It's not in the normal Robo Burner (22E) or High-Speed Burner (230), though, but I'm guessing those can access some aspect of his burners that Robo Rocket can't (maybe that's what event 150 does?? None of Usmash, Nair, Bair, or Dair use it or even event 06A though).
Anyway, I don't know how much all that rambling helps, but there it is.
Sammi Husky
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 13, 2014
- Messages
- 88
From what i can tell from comparing it to a few other gfx calls i know of, 06A is used specifically for calling graphics from the common gfx pool. It's counterpart (from what i can tell) is 06F, which always uses the characters own effect file ID. The ID used in 06A matches the common file though, which is why i think it's used predominantly for common gfx. Though it could be different in other ways as well. I wouldn't know until i could test in game.
In regards to the spacing of subactions, I'm almost certain that they're arbitrary. It just so happens that the majority of the cast have similar patterns in the way their files were compiled, and so makes finding things a bit easier until i can pair subactions with their animations. The flags could possibly contain information for the animations in bit-fields, including animation index or something of the sort. But that's all speculation really.
Sausage Zeldas
Smash Apprentice
06F certainly lines up with the normal attacks. I just noticed, though, that the Burners only use 150 on the ground; the air versions just pass on gfx. I'm guessing it's got something to do with the smoke cloud that appears at the start. Weird, though, that there's nothing on graphics there; maybe the burner flames are handled somewhere else.
It's also weird that those rocket flames are in the common pool, since they're by no means generic. The only other possible spot I can think that it'd be used is... Samus' Melee Charge Shot. Wouldn't that be funny.
What stood out to me there was that everything else was neatly spaced and in an entirely sensible order. I could make a wild guess that the stuff that happens while turning the burners on and off while staying in the "burner state" was handled in the extra 12 spots at some point in development, but that's really neither useful nor provable. But I agree that it's arbitrary, since everything is just called by number.
But for now it's time for bed. I get too rambly when I'm tired.
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felt like it was worth mentioning that not all specials use only one file locationWithout knowing what subactions pertain to what animations, after a while it becomes apparent that there is somewhat of a pattern to them. For example:
![]()
As shown in the image, most characters have a large gap of empty subaction (around 0x1B7 - 0x20E, roughly). These are where the specials start. They are always grouped in groups of 3, with an empty entry separating them. The first group is normally the neutral special. In this screenshot, im using captain falcon. The 3 subactions that comprise the group are in this order:
Following this logic, we can confirm this by looking at these screenshots and comparing the damage to what the known specials + custom specials damage outputs are.
- Special 1, grounded, non custom.
- Special 1, grounded, custom 1.
- Special 1, grounded, custom 2.
![]()
![]()
![]()
As you can see, the three subactions that were grouped together do represent the custom variations of the same move. Alrighty, thats helpful. But now we make the assumption that the next group will be the next special. However, that isn't correct. We would be forgetting the grounded reversal, air, and aerial reversal variations of the move. So, the next groups subactions follow the same pattern we have seen so far (default, custom 1, custom 2) but for one of those variants. After all the variants, then comes the next special.
Mind you, these patterns may differ slightly between chars (but not by much). I believe the gap between the groups was likely an empty space for a fourth custom, but since most were unfinished, they were left blank.
EDIT: The location of the "large gap" is what changes between chars for the most part, though it's not very difficult to spot anyways
example: Pit's Fspecial is broken into two parts
Part 1:
Part 2:
it goes with out saying that knowledge of the move needs to be more complete
Luckily Pit's Fspecial is a rather easy case to distinguish because I know that the move has both super armor (in part 1) and an upward angle hitbox (in part 2)
Similar to how they appear, they also appear in order.
Going custom 1, 2, 3, unknown file, repeat (the repeat has to be the second part of the move if there is one), it can even be split into 3 parts as far as I've seen
Sausage Zeldas
Smash Apprentice
That's what I was saying with ROB's specials, with the Side being split into 3 parts, and Down into 6.
lol I've seen 3+ haven't seen 6
and sorry I didn't read your post I'm a little behind things thanks to semester ending
Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2014
- Messages
- 14,629
Without the ability to record internally, like not through a camera or phone, looking for landing lag, IASA, end lag, or startup for certain moves like Fox Illusion or Falco Phantasm will be slightly inaccurate, right? I kind of want to find those for Falco, but I don't think I have the tools or know how to do that.
Fox is next on my frame data list 
Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2014
- Messages
- 14,629
@Fox is next on my frame data list
Zelkam
already did it: http://smashboards.com/threads/lylat-datalink-fox-guide-and-information-thread.377121/. Would you like to misuse your powers?
I don't trust anyone but myself.
I see.I place my trust in @Thinkaman.
So, how do you test end lag and such? As in what are the procedures, steps, the instructions to testing landing lag, ending lag, and IASA?
Zelkam
Resident Wizard
The frame data found in my Fox guide is actually mostly Thinkaman's. Much like Aerodrome, I only trust myself so I did double check what he had myself, and then added what he didn't. Granted, the only way I can test frame data is by recording Fox's entire moveset at 60 fps and then counting frames which isn't the best method. I'd be more than happy to have someone double check Fox's data to be 100% certain it's correct.
I like you already.
Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2014
- Messages
- 14,629
This should go here too, right?
Does anyone know how to convert this into a trip fraction or whatever? It's Ike's Dtilt.
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Ffamran
The Smooth Devil Mod
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2014
- Messages
- 14,629
How do you read super armor? Yes, double post, but whatever. So, if this is Ike's Unyielding Blade... unk_16E(0x1, 0x0, ) is the super armor parameter, right?
Edit 2: Edit Harder: Never mind. I figured it out.
Edit: Shouldn't this thread be stickied somewhere?
Edit 2: Edit Harder: Never mind. I figured it out.
Last edited:
- Joined
- May 3, 2009
- Messages
- 7,190
Oh good! This thread is here, and stickied, as it rightfully should be.
I have a question/some notes about one of the parameters in (all) hit-boxes.
There's a parameter (Parameter 20 in hit-boxes 26 and 29. It's the one right after shield damage. Off the top of my head I don't know if it's moved in other hit-box types, but I'd bet it's right after shield damage in all hit-box types.) I was noticing a sort of pattern in its numbering between the moves.
It seems to be higher as an attack is 'stronger' but not directly in a pattern related to other data; for example, on Zelda's moveset, it ranges from being "0x0" to being "0x3" being lower for weaker hit-boxes, and higher for her more powerful hit-boxes, such as being "0x0" on her sourspot LKs, and "0x3" for the sweetspots.
It was a while ago but I'm pretty sure the numbers for that parameter fluctuated the same for other characters I checked. I couldn't find any at the time that were higher than 0x3. I was wondering if anyone had ever figured out what that parameter was connected to, I guess.
Here's a table representing the comparisons of this parameter between each of Zelda's normals:
Move|Number
Jab (hits 1-2)|0x0
Jab (hit 3)|0x0
Dash Attack (sweet-spot)|0x2
Dash Attack (sour-spots)|0x1
Ftilt (tipper)|0x2
Ftilt (outer sour-spot)|0x2
Ftilt (inner sour-spot)|0x1
Utilt|0x1
Dtilt|0x1
Fsmash (hits 1-4)|0x0
Fsmash (hit 5)|0x2
Usmash (hits 1-7)|0x0
Usmash (hit 8)|0x2
Dsmash|0x1
NAir (hits 1-4)|0x0
NAir (hit 5)|0x1
FAir/BAir (sweet-spot)|0x3
FAir/BAir (sour-spots)|0x0
UAir|0x2
DAir (sweet-spot)|0x3
DAir (sour-spots)|0x0
If I had to guess what it was related to it'd definitely be the moves' strength, or...At least that the moves' strength is involved in the number being what it is.
I have a question/some notes about one of the parameters in (all) hit-boxes.
There's a parameter (Parameter 20 in hit-boxes 26 and 29. It's the one right after shield damage. Off the top of my head I don't know if it's moved in other hit-box types, but I'd bet it's right after shield damage in all hit-box types.) I was noticing a sort of pattern in its numbering between the moves.
It seems to be higher as an attack is 'stronger' but not directly in a pattern related to other data; for example, on Zelda's moveset, it ranges from being "0x0" to being "0x3" being lower for weaker hit-boxes, and higher for her more powerful hit-boxes, such as being "0x0" on her sourspot LKs, and "0x3" for the sweetspots.
It was a while ago but I'm pretty sure the numbers for that parameter fluctuated the same for other characters I checked. I couldn't find any at the time that were higher than 0x3. I was wondering if anyone had ever figured out what that parameter was connected to, I guess.
Here's a table representing the comparisons of this parameter between each of Zelda's normals:
Jab (hits 1-2)|0x0
Jab (hit 3)|0x0
Dash Attack (sweet-spot)|0x2
Dash Attack (sour-spots)|0x1
Ftilt (tipper)|0x2
Ftilt (outer sour-spot)|0x2
Ftilt (inner sour-spot)|0x1
Utilt|0x1
Dtilt|0x1
Fsmash (hits 1-4)|0x0
Fsmash (hit 5)|0x2
Usmash (hits 1-7)|0x0
Usmash (hit 8)|0x2
Dsmash|0x1
NAir (hits 1-4)|0x0
NAir (hit 5)|0x1
FAir/BAir (sweet-spot)|0x3
FAir/BAir (sour-spots)|0x0
UAir|0x2
DAir (sweet-spot)|0x3
DAir (sour-spots)|0x0