yea I've looked up videos but also have read that asdi with the cstick is less powerful than regular sdi. Which is your go to method that you feel is more effective? Quarter circle di seems hard to implement at first while csticking seems easy yet less effective
Sometimes I mash control stick one direction while holding C stick for ASDI, and sometimes I quarter circle with control stick while holding C stick for ASDI. I don't always SDI some hits during combos though.
Returned from my Evo trip and got the much-needed friendlies grind I've sorely needed. I really felt like I leveled up pretty hard with all the things I've learned so far, so I'll see how I can put that to the test soon. Got some questions though.
I had an enormous privilege to play friendlies with M2K's Marth as he tweeted about wanting Marth practice in his hotel room. I found my way in and...there are many situations I'm not really sure how to handle correctly.
Is it ever worth it to approach M2K in the corner? Just experiencing it firsthand made me realize just how dangerous it is tread the ledge against M2K, and he made me pay when I was a little bit off. M2K knew plenty of mixups by the ledge, as he would invincible ledgedash roll (so I have to respect him), waveland down (pushes me trying to respect him), jump fair (so I can't spam moves by the ledge), and the patented m2k ledge stall (to deplete my spawn invincibility) to really make it seem like cornering him wasn't worth it. It's either I might get him, or he gets me and kills me, completely violating the typical convention of corner = my favor in many matchups. It really didn't feel that way vs. m2k, and one might even go as far saying it's an advantage...
Speaking of cornering, I feel somewhat lost trying to apply effective corner pressure. I understand that having center is an inherent advantage because you have additional options like dash back. Somehow though when I dashed back, M2K would just somehow get close enough to land DA on me. When I tried dtilt in place to cutoff his DA, he would do a slight dash back to dash in DA to beat that option. Sometimes I would try to jump fair as that should beat his options, right? M2K would then just stand there and fsmash on reaction to my jump. Then I got lost in how to use my center stage to make it my advantage vs him, when things like DA/fsmash/aerial has such a high reward even in the corner.
Speaking more about jump fair vs. cornered opponents, I understand that it supposedly beats many options as the opponent has no room to dash back to cleanly beat fair. And it's even better when the opponent is shielding since they can't do much vs. fair. However if the opponent isn't shielding and is just standing there instead, suddenly, it feels like jump fair is a huge commitment since they can retaliate on reaction. How can I better corner my opponent that isn't shielding in the corner?
I had the privilege to fight Plup in my pool. Though I brought him down to two stocks per game, it really felt like he outplayed me many times and glad that I fought him. He said that one thing to improve my play is to have a better gameplan when my opponent is at high percent and is sitting on shield at fsmash kill percent. Of course I notice that when I WD in, my opponent will shield in preparation for fsmash, which logically I can grab to mixup. However, do you think that's necessarily the best course of action? Grab is low reward, and if I do it too much then they can start reading that and get a huge reward off of like spotdodge/roll compared to me just getting them offstage and hopefully I kill them. Perhaps WD in and wait as they sit in shield?
Regarding juggling, surprisingly I have most trouble trying to juggle Samus as she tries to drift in FF dair/nair on the way down and I don't know why. I think it's because I have the notion that since Samus is slow, I should be able to shark her indefinitely so I get stubborn and try to outspace her with juggling aerials like fair/bair/uair, but usually I just get hit instead and get retaliated hard. Should I instead handle juggling Samus with the typical jump FF dash fair/WD fsmash?
Also, what do I do when Samus missile --> jump dair? When I jab missile then dtilt, that option tends to beat that. I'm starting to think FH over missile is just the best option at this point.
When Peach has a turnip at hand and Marth is within DA range, what are options typically decent to default to? I don't like jabbing/shielding the turnips because they can pull another turnip or regrab the turnip and maintain pressure. FH can be good but it can get called out pretty hard if the Peach reads it. I talked to Bladewise a bit about it in our friendlies session and he says that it's the one thing that makes the mu bearable, and thinks that the only consistent pull I can combat this is either be right at her face (since throwing the turnip somehow dodges Marth at point blank) or just simply dash back and reset neutral. Thoughts?
I'm confused about how to utilize my ground game when the Falcon is dash dancing me back for whiff punish. In the Fox mu if the Fox is dash dancing waiting to whiff punish me, I can at least gradually take space since Marth has the longer dash dance to push my advantage. In the Falcon mu, Falcon has the longer dash dance and I find myself getting crept to the corner. How can I out-ground game Falcon in this scenario since I don't have this advantage for longer dash dances?
I asked someone to record my set vs Vinodh, a puff player, and he said he will record and upload it on Youtube but it hasn't been done yet. -_- I will have questions on that soon whenever that happens.
I also fought a kirby for the first time in tournament and got back thrown suicided. That was cool.
That's the thoughts I have for now. I hope to make bigger waves in the next major I attend sometime!
I'm skimming the post and notice you got Bthrow killed by Kirby. SHAAAAMEEEEE
Jk and I'm glad you leveled up. Let's get to it.
M2K has been forced to learn the corner extremely well. It's valuable to be so good there because of how you can reversal people there and just in general make a bad position a good one. One good thing to do is just sit at the edge and hold down outside of Fair range. You can Dtilt a couple different things there, and if he WLs down onto the edge then you can shield Fsmash on reaction or dash back or whatever. Can you hit him when you respawn on FD? Probably not, but you can get a mixup on YS if you want. Not saying you even should, but it's possible to play it.
I don't think he could accurately predict you using all of these counters, so I'm wondering if you showed your hand too early and went into counters before he could act or if he gave you a little bait of movement. This would allow him to see what you're doing and punish correctly every time. Ah which reminds me, sometimes just waiting it out can work pretty well against opponents like this. Your options are good, but if you just throw them out in a punishable way hoping they act at the same time you can lose. M2K in particular will often lunge at you if you just wait a little bit, so maybe explicitly saying this will help you there more with the timing.
Dtilt is often safer to use when cornering, but late Fair can be the best as it also hits jumps. So you can drift in with Fair or fake that. Drifting in without FF'ing will also help you avoid getting Fsmashed so easily iirc. But yeah anyway, there are different ways to play the corner imo. Marth is amazing vs cornered opponents since they can no longer use dash back well vs his moves which is their best answer to them as he outranges and disjoints them normally. But if they can dash back at all it can still be an issue as you've noticed. So you can either come forward slightly and force them to move back more, choking out their space. You can lunge and take the space all at once and make sure they can't get away. You can fake either of these and move into defense, or use defense primarily and let the pressure get to them eventually. You can combine these options and get more complex as well. My guess is you may be too stationary when cornering someone, allowing them to retain mobility over you using the bit of stage they have. Does this seem accurate/helpful?
Yes you don't need to grab. Grab is still okay as it's free damage that dislodges their position and makes Utilt/Fsmash/edgeguards more likely. Still there's no reason you HAVE to attack since their shield whittles down quickly and you can poke it or their OOS action anyway. You can also just Dtilt for pressure or to hit them if they don't shield and set up a pseudo combo/edgeguard.
Yeah if you just sit on the ground Samus can definitely reliably Dair you. You need to use jumps to juggle her as you said.
This whole missile thing is so weird to me. I've meant to test it but for missile to Dair, I would think you could react to Samus jumping and just Fair her instead of going for instant Dtilt. You could also crouch under some missiles and Dtilt approach or just Fair after it passes you instead I suppose. Platforms and FH are an option too, but I'm not sure if they're always the best to recommend. You can test what you think is best and go for it though.
Running away lets Peach push in with retained turnip control, so I don't like it. I like rushing her down. I also like Nair'ing through turnip so first hit hits turnip and second hit hits her. Doesn't always work but can be effective vs some throws. If you jab the turnip you can run under it as well but I forget how it all plays out. Peach doesn't get a free pull for a jab I remember working that out a few years ago. Anyway I like platforms, FH, run in vs Peach turnip. If it's not Armada who will hold the turnip and wait a while, you can use some DD and fakes and the Peach may throw it early which makes things easier.
No point in hiding this Falcon thing I remembered a bit ago since I've seen M2K use it vs Wizzy now. There's a dash in Nair in place option you can use that will beat Falcon's aerials and more or less be safe from grab. You mix this with running Dtilt and it forms a good threat. Dtilt sparingly, Nair more frequently, do nothing most frequently. I prefer to push in with my ground movement because Falcon can't ground hit me with anything quick like Fox can with running shine or whatever. Falcon can grab but if I stay around that range or go into it then right back out he's not going to land it. This can also help me get under his aerials if he tries to overshoot. I think you can at least somewhat bully Falcon this way. I'd play around with the Nair.
Okay just link me.
Good luck with your training.
