Captain Falcon Social Thread

[WhiteLightnin]

Eh, I understand people without other players in their region only really have netplay, but besides that one instance netplay really isn't a good playing/ learning environment, and I don't think players should be using it if they want to improve.

Oh I agree. What I posted above is something different from net play that is for people who are interested in continuing to play PM on Wifi only it will be with dedicated servers. Just thought I'd put the info out there for those it pertains to.

 

[-Fatality-]

I'm going to Cute Cats 7 this Saturday, a Melee/PM tourney that's looking to be a pretty stacked event. I'm also going to be a part of a 100$ PM crew battle Money Match. I'll record as much as I can, and do what I can to instill fear of the flashy captain in them, and reclaim my crown as best player in Georgia, wish me luck!

 

[ShadowGanon]

This might be old news, but has anyone noticed that Falcon can ledge hop -> U-air and grab the ledge without using any specials?

 

[-Fatality-]

This might be old news, but has anyone noticed that Falcon can ledge hop -> U-air and grab the ledge without using any specials?

Yes, you can also ledge hop Bair into ledge regrab without using a special. I use both quite often since they're really useful for relatively safe off-stage edgeguarding.

 

[-Fatality-]

I'm going to Smash Carolina IV tomorrow, a South Carolina tournament featuring over 70 RSVPs, PM Singles and Doubles, ALL of SC's best players, KO-Kingpin, and potentially other high-quality OOS players.
It will all be live-streamed by Clockwork Studios, going to be really hype guys. PM Doubles starts at 1 PM, PM Singles starts at 2 PM. I'll be super try-hard in both events, check it out!
Stream Link: http://www.twitch.tv/clockworkstudios

 

[ShadowGanon]

I'll try to watch some of it, but I can't guarantee anything. I'm going to be kind of busy tomorrow.

 

[-Fatality-]

I won Smash Carolina IV. Results, and videos from the event will be shared here as soon as they're ready.

 

[TheKmanOfSmash]

Eh, I understand people without other players in their region only really have netplay, but besides that one instance netplay really isn't a good playing/ learning environment, and I don't think players should be using it if they want to improve.

I am mainly a wi-fi P:M player and that got me 65th out of 400 at Apex 2014, getting 3rd in my pool (only top 2 made it into bracket). Emukiller is mainly a Netplay player and he won SKTAR 3 for P:M last weekend. Almost everything I have ever learned about Smash I have practiced over wi-fi and have applied well offline. Despite the frame delay and lag spikes, I find wi-fi/netplay to be a great learning environment, even IF you have people around you to play with, and find a lot of disingenuousness in this comment.

 

[GeZ]

Exception doesn't prove the rule Kman. I'm happy for you and Emukiller, but netplay is not usually conducive to developing good habits.

 

[Player -0]

I won Smash Carolina IV. Results, and videos from the event will be shared here as soon as they're ready.

The result thread is up and the videos are on twitch, you gon' have to look for the videos though. The easiest way to find the results thread is going to Protoman's profile and hitting recent activity.


That being said Fatality seems pretty solid from me playing him (I don't have much experience playing people/MU experience on any characters though, including Falcon), his footstool usage to gimp opponents while staying (somewhat) safe was pretty cool if you weren't expecting it.

 

[TheKmanOfSmash]

Exception doesn't prove the rule Kman. I'm happy for you and Emukiller, but netplay is not usually conducive to developing good habits.

This is somewhat true, as many people tend to abuse things that usually just work online. But you can end up getting really good at adapting and punishing those options which many low/mid level players do offline as well. However, just because some scrubs only want to win using wi-fi tactics instead of learning how to play the game, does not mean that wi-if/Netplay has no significant utility for the majority who choose to use it. Many of Brawl's greatest players came from an online background like Salem, Ally, ADHD, Anti, Denti, etc. and they were just like anyone else when they started wi-fi. The reason they got good wasn't just because they were inherent talented (if they even were at all). It was also because they, along other good wi-fi players like them, utilized the best things about wi-fi: Playing multiple people of various skill levels around the world, seeing various different styles of play, and they were able to play anyone almost on demand. Something not many can do offline with their limited local scenes with mostly mediocre players (with the possible top player in the region) who probably have day jobs, and with the occasional regional/national tournament where they only get to experience high level play for that weekend only and have to wait until the next paycheck comes to experience it again in 2 months.

Though you may not find much interest in wi-fi/Netplay, you cannot tell me that it can lead to no benefit for anyone who uses it, given all the inherent advantages it gives someone over just playing offline in a limited scene without many top players nearby (which is a common situation for most smashers/potential smashers in the scene).

Obviously, adjusting to the change in frame delay from offline to online and visa versa is a skill on its own and is what detracts a lot of people from using wi-fi and makes them rely on their local scene instead. Also, playing on wi-fi better benefits one's predictions skills by rewarding capitalization of bad habits (which you said that wi-fi promotes, and I agree) as opposed to pure reaction time, which is an advantage offline has. But once that transitioning skill is mastered and when your predicting skills are polished, then I can't empirically see how wi-fi can't be used as an effective tool for enhancing one's overall skill in the game.

Please help me understand how wi-fi is a deterrent of overall improvement in the game. I would agree that to succeed offline, you can't strictly just play online and expect to bop people. You have to practice the transition from online to offline, practice reaction time, and adapt to the habits that offline players do. But for most online players who actually practiced their fundamentals instead of relying on dumb wi-fi strats, that transition does not usually take a long time to master and then they start doing well in offline tournaments. Just because people have gotten good by playing offline historically, I don't see why online play doesn't get the same opportunity to be used as a beneficial tool for improvement.

 

[GeZ]

Online is just never as beneficial. You can become better by playing online, but that doesn't mean you won't get better faster by just playing offline against players of similar skill level to the ones you'd play online.

That's how it works for every fighting game. That's why the term online warrior has been around since games had online capabilities.

 

[TheKmanOfSmash]

Online is just never as beneficial. You can become better by playing online, but that doesn't mean you won't get better faster by just playing offline against players of similar skill level to the ones you'd play online.

That's how it works for every fighting game. That's why the term online warrior has been around since games had online capabilities.

Sure, it's not as beneficial and is most likely not even necessary, assuming you have all the resources available to you (healthy scene, many regional/national tourneys nearby, etc). But for the guy living in the middle of Nowhere, Kansas, zip code 21337, area code 666, where the population is 69, what is he supposed to do if he can only afford to travel out of state to tourneys a few times a month?

But at least we can establish that it can add some benefit, however large or small it is, and is usually not the ideal compared to a perfect offline environment.

 

[GeZ]

Yeah, meeting in the middle seems to be the way.

 

[onehunna]

Anyone have any advice for the Lucario match-up? I can't seem to convert much off my throw opportunities on him, and any time I get hit once it leads to a 5 hit combo, me off-stage.

 

[Alfonzo Bagpipez]

Am I the only one who thinks Falcon should get his 64 FSmash?
Look at dis beauty:

Spoiler

I think it'd give him a better killing and edge-guarding option than People's Elbow.
(though he may not exactly NEED it)
The only real con of dropping People's Elbow is just the sweg factor that goes with it.
But I guess that could be too much to lose for all the Melee Falcons out there.
Even then, this move just oozes swegger.
OOZES it.

(could be awkward to animate, though)

 

[ShadowGanon]

Lol. You mains would be proud of me. I just played a guy online with my Captain Falcon. He played M2 and we went to FD. Half way through the match, it was clear that I was dominating him, so every time I went near the ledge, I'd taunt cancel the "SHOW YA MOVES" taunt, turn around, and knee him in the face. It was wonderful.

 

[0mart]

Falcon is a beast

 

[Spralwers]

I went to Show Me your Moves 15 yesterday and almost took a set off DarkAtma in bracket. Beat his Pit (think I two stocked it actually) with the good Captain. Almost beat his Fox game 2, then flubbed game 3 with a few SDs. I need to work on my spacie edgeguarding game.

 

[-Fatality-]

I'm going to Tipped Off 10 this Saturday and Sunday, a national featuring Mew2king, HBox, Wizzrobe and the rest of Florida's best players, Axe, D1, and many more! Check it out! Everything until top 4 of Singles and Doubles will be streamed on Versus Gaming Center starting around 2 PM: http://www.twitch.tv/vsgc
Top 4 of Singles and Doubles will be streamed on Smash Studios around 11 AM: http://www.twitch.tv/smashstudios
I'm hoping this will be a breakout performance for me, as I've not been to any tournaments that got much publicity before.

 

[-Fatality-]

They just released the Tipped Off 10 Round Robin Pools (which will also factor in at-door registrants), Top 4 make it out into bracket. Here's my pool.
Me (Falcon)
Master Raven (Mewtwo)
Ninkendo64 (Kirby, Mario)
Crizor (Charizard)
Veishi (Lucas, Kirby)
Miki (?)
Ploo(?)
Chaos Dunk (?)

I have no clue who the last three are, but I know that Master Raven is one of the world's best Mewtwos, and Ninkendo64 is one of Alabama's best players, Crizor is a good Charizard, and Veishi is another Georgia player. If you guys have any advice for me for this, I'd be happy to hear it.

 

[1FD]

Don't get hit?

 

[-Fatality-]

Tipped Off 10 was totally awesome, and I did really well for my first national tournament, especially since this event was RIDICULOUSLY stacked. There were a good number of high level players who didn't even make it out of 9-10 man RR pools where top 4 make it out, that's how stacked it was.
I ended up in a completely different pool from the one posted above since so many unaccounted for people registered at the door. Beat some good players who's tags I don't remember, and I won my pool when I beat Prof's Mewtwo in an intense comeback win, had to learn that matchup really fast to adapt in time.

48 Man Bracket starts: I get a bye because of my 1 seeding from pools, round 2 I dominate Koozy K's Squirtle, round 3 I pretty convincingly beat MVD's Snake and Mario, round 4 Winner's Quarters I had a good set with Wizzrobe and lost. We were going back in forth in the neutral game a lot, but his superior punish game made the set look a lot less close than it really was. Round 5 I narrowly beat Player-3's extremely good ZSS, he's a very talented GA player on the rise. Round 6 I have to fight ESAM, he goes Samus G1 on PS2 and the first stock is pretty back and forth, but then he starts missle camping me really well with Ice missiles (which can't be clanked, they explode when hit), and he uses the missiles to control space, I don't have a good answer, and he dominates the rest of G1, G2 I counterpick him to GHZ, and he switches to Pikachu, this game was much closer and he narrowly wins on his last stock, and I'm out of Singles, but got top 8!

Doubles only had like 18 teams, but it was pretty stacked too. I teamed with EX Star Lord (SC's best player) who used MK and a little bit of Pikachu. We dominate some random team Round 1, convincingly beat Flamin' Roy and Nicaboy Round 2, and we took M2K and Hbox to a close G3. We beat some random but pretty solid team Round 4 (can't remember their tags), and Round 5 we narrowly lost to ESAM and MVD. Considering our losses were to much higher ranked teams who both regularly team with each other while my partner and I were teaming for the first time, we did really good.

I had some friendlies with Hungrybox, dunno how hard he was trying, but I comfortably beat his puff on my last stock, felt in control most of the time, and then 2-stocked his mario. I also had a 2$ MM with EX Star Lord and VS Master Raven. I double 2-stocked EX Star Lord's Falco, and then 3-stocked his MK. I narrowly lost the MM against Master Raven's Mewtwo 3-1, our games were like as close as his games were with M2K in Loser's Finals, so I'm pretty happy that I was able to keep up and threaten him to that degree. I already feel like I've learned a ton from this, and that I'm going to be able to walk away from this a stronger player. The whole thing was streamed on Versus Gaming Center's Twitch channel, all the archives are there, and all of my important sets were on stream so hopefully they'll all be on Youtube soon, and I'll share them all in the Show Me Your Moves Thread here.

There were around 100 entrants for PM Singles, and here's the final placings for Singles Bracket:
Supreme Champion:CT | Wizzrobe
Worthy Adversary:VS | MasterRaven
Maybe Next Time P4K EMP | Mew2King
4th place Plup
5th place tie:
CT| Esam
AO|CT| MVD
7th place tie:
SS | Colbol
Fatality
9th place tie
Porkchops
CRS | HungryBox
GK Gahtzu
Player-3
13th place tie:
Iori
Mr. Pickle
Prof
Articanus
17th place tie:
VS | Nick Riddle
Scatt
Ninkendo64
EX | Star Lord
Kip
SS| PB&J
Serin
Searing Sorrow
25th place tie:
Player-1
GK Dark Sonic
Absolute Zero
Ploo
Dingo
Crizor
Spade
GK| Harriet
33rd place tie:
KrunkVillian
DRy
Mahgnittoc
Anime
BigLou
Moogle
Kudrah
Scatz
Een!
Koozy K
Gadiel_VaStar
Kazuya
Karma
SDS
Jnta beast
SpinJump

 

[GeZ]

Now that you've got mad good results, start calling people out lol

 

[-Fatality-]

Now that you've got mad good results, start calling people out lol

I'm tired of not getting more publicity, so I'm going to share my vids with that awful yet popular best players for each character thread. My vids from Tipped Off 10 are now in the Falcon video thread!

 

[-Fatality-]

I'm going to Smash Carolina V this Saturday, a regional PM/Melee/Smash 4 tournament featuring ESAM, SC's best, and many other good players, with Singles and Doubles for all 3 games. I'm entering all 6 events. It will be streamed here: http://www.twitch.tv/holyflame
Check it out!

 

[-Fatality-]

Smash Carolina V went really well for me, won PM Doubles against ESAM and Pdude in the Finals, and took 2nd in Singles, barely losing in game 5 of an epicly close set against ESAM. The tourney was running really late, so we agreed to have whoever won Winner's Finals automatically get 1st place, and then Loser's Bracket would finish everything else up, so we only played in Winner's Finals. And I won Loser's Finals against North Carolina's best PM player Stingers, who plays Charizard and ZSS.
Videos from the event will be up soon!

 

[ConeZ]

I can vouch for the hype. xD

ANYWAYS, is there a specifically good place to go for Falcon information, tips and/or tricks?
I have been playing him more lately, and I'd really like to show my moves... in a more effective manner xD

 

[-Fatality-]

I can vouch for the hype. xD

ANYWAYS, is there a specifically good place to go for Falcon information, tips and/or tricks?
I have been playing him more lately, and I'd really like to show my moves... in a more effective manner xD

The Melee Falcon boards are a good place to go, a lot of the people in the PM Falcon boards are too busy thinking of weird and unnecessary buffs instead of actually becoming better at the game, you can also just ask me stuff since nobody is as well-versed with PM Falcon as I am.

 

[ConeZ]

The Melee Falcon boards are a good place to go, a lot of the people in the PM Falcon boards are too busy thinking of weird and unnecessary buffs instead of actually becoming better at the game, you can also just ask me stuff since nobody is as well-versed with PM Falcon as I am.

Okay, so I mean, I learn a lot about Falcon from watching your play/ having experienced it myself, but there are a few things that trip me up specifically:
For some reason I can't time his jumps effectively sometimes, so I end up dash attacking or something when I mean to short hop.
I don't know too many viable followups for d-throw.
I think the biggest problem I have is actually controlling him what with the fast/ incredibly fast-fally nature of Falcon. His feel is vastly different than Wario, though both of them tend to a more bait and punish playstyle.

Guess I'll check out the Melee Falcon boards for some more insight on the character. It makes me sad I can't do the same thing for Wario because his boards on PM are dead as **** >.>

Edit: ALSO are there any major differences between PM Falcon and Melee Falcon aside from the side-B grabbing ledge and Falcon Kick being better?

 

[Player -0]

Just play the character more, you'll get a better feel of him. Followups will come naturally. Become manly.

Some differences:
- Can Turn-Around B Falcon Kick. Important vs. moves like Peach's D-Smash so you can Falcon kick towards the stage (because Peach's D-Smash makes you look at blastzone because Peach hits you from opposite direction. It makes sense, think harder.)
- Can hit people with Side B and get forward momentum + actually grab ledge.
- Hold Up-Taunt while Knee'ing people for maximum Falcon.
- Can taunt cancel like 64 so be even more epic while dropzoning. (This can actually be used to stop some momentum before falling off edges I think.)
- I think Up-Smash links more reliably but it's still situational + won't hit ever.
- Footstools
- B-Reverses, which adds wavebounces. (Turnaround B was in Melee and 64 already).
- Can turn around Falcon Punch a lolzy amount of times (like 6 or so).
- Might be some more.

 

[-Fatality-]

Okay, so I mean, I learn a lot about Falcon from watching your play/ having experienced it myself, but there are a few things that trip me up specifically:
For some reason I can't time his jumps effectively sometimes, so I end up dash attacking or something when I mean to short hop.
I don't know too many viable followups for d-throw.
I think the biggest problem I have is actually controlling him what with the fast/ incredibly fast-fally nature of Falcon. His feel is vastly different than Wario, though both of them tend to a more bait and punish playstyle.

Guess I'll check out the Melee Falcon boards for some more insight on the character. It makes me sad I can't do the same thing for Wario because his boards on PM are dead as **** >.>

Edit: ALSO are there any major differences between PM Falcon and Melee Falcon aside from the side-B grabbing ledge and Falcon Kick being better?

Instead of trying to do lots of aerials, focus instead on doing lots of empty hops while also Dash-Dancing around the stage, this helps a lot with getting a feel for the characters movement since your neutral game in actual tournament matches is usually pretty similar feeling to that. This will naturally also help you learn to efficiently use quick aerials.

Regarding D-Throw, it's only sometimes a combo throw, outside of some extreme corner cases, you pretty much always want to U-Throw or D-Throw someone you grab and which you do is generally matchup/di/damage specific. You should spend a lot of time experimenting with both. You can also watch vids of me playing people since I know which throws to use on which characters in what situations, there are even a fair amount of times where you use both on the same character!

Some other notable differences from Melee Falcon include Gentleman being much easier to execute (just press A 3 times), Gentleman has less ending lag so you can actually combo out of it, Up-B has a higher ledge-grab sweetspot in PM, and Falcon kick has a small quake hitbox when landing with it from the air that pops them up and you can combo someone with it; this is notable because you can use it to beat fast moving grounded hitboxes like Sonic's spin dash really well, and you can also use footstool-falcon kick to beat shields/CC'ing opponents from above, if they try to CC it, then they eat the quake hitbox, if they don't CC, they get sent far away except at low percents.

 

[ConeZ]

Thanks for the advice man

 

[Deleted member]

Also, I'd work on spacing, tech reads, and stage control.

Most of my matches were lost because I've been punished very badly, I didn't claim the stage, and I poorly spaced my aerials. You could also punish your opponent badly with sweetspot knee if they fail to tech from a nair.

One of my most recent matches:

http://youtu.be/vNTGFfgXZk4

 

[MrButterFuzz]

Is Haxdash possible in PM? Y'all know what I'm talking about where Hax does his cool waveland back to the ledge. In melee CliffCatch is 30 frames? and PM (brawl) its 21 frames? With the research Ive seen, melee Falcon uses all 29 frames of invincibility to perform the famous Haxdash. Can we or can we not do it in PM because of brawl? -_-



btw @snotch love your sig of tloc. Makes me happy. :]

 

[-Fatality-]

Is Haxdash possible in PM? Y'all know what I'm talking about where Hax does his cool waveland back to the ledge. In melee CliffCatch is 30 frames? and PM (brawl) its 21 frames? With the research Ive seen, melee Falcon uses all 29 frames of invincibility to perform the famous Haxdash. Can we or can we not do it in PM because of brawl? -_-



btw @snotch love your sig of tloc. Makes me happy. :]

I think it can still be done, but I haven't researched it enough to know for sure, at the very least, you can get pretty close as I use nearly perfect hax dashing often.
In other news, I've decided to solo main Falcon in literally every smash game, the moment I made the decision, I grew a full beard, got a 6-pack, and now stand a few inches taller.

 

[Player -0]

Other random news is at the next tournament Fatality and I go to we're Falcon dittoing for lolz. Will try to make it on stream for max exposure of me if possible.

Also I'm pretty sure even if you're missing a frame or 2 of invincibility it won't be that bad because not many moves poke safely to hit Falcon from the ledge. Also moves have a startup time before the hitbox comes out so it's ppprrrreeeeetttyyy hard to hit on a one frame window. I haven't tested it but from logic and theory crafting I think it wouldn't be that big of a deal.

In other words I think you're fine, you can test with the 3.5 debug menu anyway lol.

 

[BananaBolts]

I'm really enjoying ledgehop -> side-B for getting back on stage. I like that if you use it lower to the ground you can get the uppercut even if you started the move offstage.

Also, I've been playing 64 falcon for some time now and a ledgehop in 64 is: drop off ledge -> instant double jump. In PM, is it the same thing? And is it a ledge jump when you push X or Y while hanging onto the ledge? I'm just trying to straighten out some terminology.

 

[Player -0]

Yeah. A ledgejump is when you press jump while on the ledge.They sound the same-ish.

 

[RedGamer]

I've decided to sole-main falcon in P:M and smash 4. I mained falco/falcon in melee for a couple of years and P:M falcon is just WAYYY more fun. To the point that I don't use falcon in melee anymore.

@ -Fatality- do you use footstools often? any ideas about how footstools can be used efficiently? I've done footstool -> falcon punch offstage. it was kind of awesome.

I've found that aerial weak hit falcon kicks can be used for combos into up air.
Grounded falcon kick -> offstage knee works sorta kinda sometimes.