Social C. Falcon Social

[Sol0ke]

Hey guys, I like to learn more about Falcon, any general advice?

 

[The Shadow]

Some tidbits, and info on this very thread itself.

However look at the 20GX Facebook Group, and Youtube channel: Captain Falcon

Also look below at the main forum and some new info is starting to come out.

Now onto your question... Get your SHFFL aerials going w/spacing. Dash Dancing distances, Pivots, and Out of shield options. Focus on the latter later.

 

[Mr Postman]

Hi Falcon boys n girls! Me vs Puff crouching under FoD platforms or just crouching in general. What are my options and what are hers in this situation? What do you guys think are some good options to counter this? ThnGX

 

[bertbusdriver]

Hi Falcon boys n girls! Me vs Puff crouching under FoD platforms or just crouching in general. What are my options and what are hers in this situation? What do you guys think are some good options to counter this? ThnGX

Camp top plat

 

[Mr Postman]

Camp top plat

Haha I like it! Yeah I think that the conclusion Ive come to is to just not deal with it. Top platform sounds real good.

 

[gapw]

Are these good things to focus on learning as a rather new Falcon:

>late aerials on shield and being able to follow up aerials on shield with gentleman, grab, and dashes away
>being able to punish tech rolls, tech in place, and missed techs if I read them, and knowing which aerials could lead to a regrab even if I miss the read
>being more comfortable with the hitboxes- as in, knowing when my nair will hit them behind me and when it will hit them in front of me, being able to get weak and strong knees on command, when an uair hits forward and when it hits backwards, reverse bairs as well as weak/strong back, etc
>knowing basic percentages like when I should upthrow Marth and juggle with uairs, when I should downthrow, when the enemy will be knee-able from a downthrow, etc
>being able to 'air wobble' by carrying CPUs across the stage with nairs and uairs
>basic movement like dash dancing, wavedashing. ledgedashing, wavelanding, dash into wavedash, etc
>being able to space moves better by applying drift and jumping slightly versus jumping long distances, hitting enemies with the tip of the nair instead of just throwing it out and getting CCed or shield grabbed

 

[Gnarsty]

i've been playing CF for a while now, but i always get stuffed super hard in neutral. Does anyone have any tips/tricks that could get me rolling?

 

[dinn3rr]

i've been playing CF for a while now, but i always get stuffed super hard in neutral. Does anyone have any tips/tricks that could get me rolling?

What I would do is focus on spacing your SHFFL nairs and your movement. Falcon has some of he best movement in the game, and you need to use that to your advantage.

 

[Sirocco]

Anyone finding themselves getting real demoralized as of late? Even with our new technology, it just feels like we flat out lose no matter what just because how innately good the top four characters are, not to mention how much better they are going to get as their metagames develop. I still try to hold on to some hope that something with change or someone will appear and show us what to do, but then I realize Falcon's aerials will always be slow, his out of shield options will always be sub-par and his tech and recovery options will always be extremely easy to react to. I really hope I'm just being overly cynical about it. We probably don't have it as bad as other characters do, like Peach for example. But even then, things just seem really hopeless. This is a really lame post and I apologize for feeling inclined enough to post it. I guess I just wanted some input on what you guys think about the circumstances for Falcon and the metagame.

 

[Sempai]

Anyone finding themselves getting real demoralized as of late? Even with our new technology, it just feels like we flat out lose no matter what just because how innately good the top four characters are, not to mention how much better they are going to get as their metagames develop. I still try to hold on to some hope that something with change or someone will appear and show us what to do, but then I realize Falcon's aerials will always be slow, his out of shield options will always be sub-par and his tech and recovery options will always be extremely easy to react to. I really hope I'm just being overly cynical about it. We probably don't have it as bad as other characters do, like Peach for example. But even then, things just seem really hopeless. This is a really lame post and I apologize for feeling inclined enough to post it. I guess I just wanted some input on what you guys think about the circumstances for Falcon and the metagame.

This is why going for hard reads is/are? sooooo terrible in 2015.

The tech chasing has to count and be on point.

 

[Spak]

This is why going for hard reads is/are? sooooo terrible in 2015.

Is, and agreed, unless the opponent is being VERY predictable.

 

[FalconCrunch]

Does anyone use "empty pivoting" and gravy's pivoting technique constantly? Im just curios as to what is the advantage to using that tech over just influencing your jump in jump squat so that you can nair (or any other aerial) in a direction. (even out of dash dance you can get that instant "stop" effect by inputting backwards during your jump squat and then performing an aerial).

Having a hard time understanding the tech in general (use as well as how to input)

 

[タオー]

I use empty pivots mainly for spacing/quick turn around gentleman's or tilts. You can also empty pivot to a retreating nair. I think it's very useful for improving your grounded movement. Another utility is turn around bair's during tech chases to cover tech away and being positioned for the regrab for all the other options. I don't use use gravy's pivoting technique since I get consistent results from the old "flick the stick" method, but I intend to get the muscle memory down as I can see how having that reaction would be useful (namely for CCing on reaction).

 

[FalconCrunch]

Sure, that makes sense. Probably one of the hardest tech skills for me so far, but sounds like its worth it.

 

[ᴠanilla]

I was at the ASU weekly last Friday and I had to play an incredibly patient Peach. He would stay put most of the time and either shield or spot-dodge when I tried to come in. If I was caught in shield things would get bad really quickly, as I would slow down. I ended up eating more dash attacks than I'd ever like to in one set.

Should I have been baiting out more attacks by dash-dancing out of range? More spaced back-airs? Taking him somewhere I could rely on platforms more? This guy was incredibly good at keeping me with less effective space to move and shut me down without much use of turnips unless I was really far away for him to pull one.

 

[strongboy]

I was at the ASU weekly last Friday and I had to play an incredibly patient Peach. He would stay put most of the time and either shield or spot-dodge when I tried to come in. If I was caught in shield things would get bad really quickly, as I would slow down. I ended up eating more dash attacks than I'd ever like to in one set.

Should I have been baiting out more attacks by dash-dancing out of range? More spaced back-airs? Taking him somewhere I could rely on platforms more? This guy was incredibly good at keeping me with less effective space to move and shut me down without much use of turnips unless I was really far away for him to pull one.

Bait with dash dance & grab when he commits to something.

 

[winrus]

Hey falcon dudes, this may sound dumb but I need to beat a zelda player. What are some general things to keep in mind so the zelda feels the most pain possible?

 

[Twinkles]

Zelda has a very hard time getting down after you throw her up. Uair for days and don't let her play the game.

Watch out for fair/bair, there's a very specific spacing she'll do when she starts fishing for it. Her dash attack too, it's not good but it works for her. Her dsmash is the fastest in the game, but it also has 0 range. Shielding seems pretty safe against Zelda since her grab is very trash.

 

[Boss N]

Out of Curiosity, who here has ACTUALLY played F-Zero? (any of them)

 

[タオー]

I played a little of GX. Got introduced to Falcon from F-Zero X.

 

[kyaputenfarukon07]

I played all of them including climax which was emulated, love these games mechanically and the difficulty it presents.

 

[Iffy]

Played GX all the time as a kid. I sucked at it.

Never got passed Michael Chain. :/

 

[Arcturian]

The only F-Zero game I don't really enjoy is Maximum Velocity. It feels very off, something about the physics don't seem right.

Also, for anyone with a Wii U, be on the lookout for Fast Racing Neo. It's like F-Zero/Wipeout. No release date yet but probably late 2015 early ish 2016.

All the footage I can find is of the Subsonic League, which is the slowest of the three leagues: the other two being Supersonic and Hypersonic.

 

[knees]

My two buddies that I play the most with happen to main Shiek and Falco, but also do play Fox or Marth from time to time. I find Shiek and Falco much more frustrating to play against, and I have to remind myself to avoid the usual routine of out-manuevering and dash-dancing unless they are really favorable at a certain point on the game, both are able to interrupt that (crucial) aspect of his neutral game. Am I wrong in thinking this? Or are there better ways to still bring that option to the table while avoiding the laser/needle disruption?

 

[strongboy]

what......

 

[Talls8]

One of my friends said playing falcon is like a flow chart. Kinda like you down air then knee. What are your thoughts on this? Is this true or is there more to the flow chart?

 

[Twinkles]

Flowcharts are good for every character, otherwise you're just spamming random **** with no direction.
Every top tier has really good identifiable flow charts. There's also swag when you can mix in other options with the flow chart.

You don't swag until you learn the flow chart though, gotta learn the rules before you start breaking the rules.

 

[Talls8]

So what exactly does Falcons look like? Was it the one i said or is it something more?

 

[Twinkles]

A lot more.
Some things I could think of for the Fox MU alone:
dair -> knee
dair -> regrab
dair -> jab reset -> regrab
dair -> jab reset -> knee
dair -> any aerial -> knee
dair -> dair -> jab reset -> knee
dair -> dair -> tech-chase regrab
dair -> dair -> tech-chase knee
grab -> uthrow -> knee
grab -> dthrow -> dropzone knee
grab -> uthrow/dthrow -> regrab tech-chase
grab -> tech-chase knee
grab -> tech-chase dair -> any option mentioned above from dair
knee -> knee
...

Melee is a very situation dependent game, everything I just listed can very on DI, %, and stage/platform layout. There's also even more of these types of combinations than I listed for Fox alone, let alone every other character in the game. When you start out playing, you'll free-style for a bit and figure out what choices suit you best, but there is an incredible variety in the amount of choices you have in playing the game and still having it work out, which is one of the more unique/interesting aspects of the game IMO.

 

[タオー]

It took me a while before I was able to even begin capitalizing off of these types of punishes. Knowing them is not enough, Falcon has very strict timings with a lot of his moves and follow ups. A lot of people tend to like to point fingers at flow charts and call them lame. I think that (like Twinkles said) learning the flow charts is the best way to start learning how to get the most out of your character. From there, you can learn to work outside of it.
It's the same concept behind why it's typical for musicians to figure out fundamentals before they ever delve into the intricacies of jazz. Without structure, it's difficult to get your bearings on this game and it's mechanics. After you've established a intimate familiarity with them, then I'd say it's time to mix things up, or be like M2K and just flow from one string to the next.

 

[Talls8]

Alright thanks. Also is there any videos online that show things specifically for Falcon. Like his wave dash or L-canceling. I'm new so I don't fully see what the difference is. Like i can see the one with link but i can't tell for falcon. But that also might be because I need a CRT TV.

 

[タオー]

Having a CRT is pretty important, one development that I went through while picking up this game is internalizing Falcon's animations, and being able to recognize and distinguish between input lag (from button press to animation) and lag from messing up tech skill.
If you can get the 20XX Training Pack, the color overlays for 'states' is super useful, as it shows you when you enter different animations that you can then practice acting immediately out of. It also has a red flash for when you fail your l cancels, which is particularly useful.
For visual cues, it's pretty obvious when you mess up an l cancel, as Falcon will remain "crouched" for a little longer, from the landing impact (you are not in the crouch animation). Also, practice WDing in place first to really get a feel for the timing. Do it in place, and also practice Wavelanding in place on platforms. From there, then start to implement angles. One important note when practicing tech skill is to practice each part of a new tech in pieces, so you can improve all parts of the maneuver as fast as possible. With some tech, like WDing, you need to be frame perfect to get the desired effect. A more extreme version of this kind of rigor in tech training is very apparent when practicing hax dashing, and on as smaller scale, pivots.

 

[Nixon Corral]

Man, I feel like my Falcon's been stagnating for a long time and it's super frustrating, but as always, reading around here has given me some new stuff to practice. <3 SmashBoards.Thanks to everyone that's helpful around here.

Out of Curiosity, who here has ACTUALLY played F-Zero? (any of them)

This:

I played all of them including climax which was emulated, love these games mechanically and the difficulty it presents.

Except I imported Climax. I actually own the whole series complete in box (except the 64DD expansion kit, which is currently prohibitively expensive and hard to find). Can't get enough, and I can't wait for a new one.

 

[Dnae]

Any tips against floaties?

 

[Dnae]

Zelda has a very hard time getting down after you throw her up. Uair for days and don't let her play the game.

Watch out for fair/bair, there's a very specific spacing she'll do when she starts fishing for it. Her dash attack too, it's not good but it works for her. Her dsmash is the fastest in the game, but it also has 0 range. Shielding seems pretty safe against Zelda since her grab is very trash.

Theres a pretty good zelda in my region that wrecks people. Its embarrassing haha, also im terrible at the floatie MU. This is helpful

 

[タオー]

Against most floaties, learn how to space instant and late uair as a poke. It really depends on what floaties we're talking about, but usually trying to replace nair in neutral with well spaced uair's works wonders. Once you have them above you, just keep uairing.

The floaties match up is where a Falcon's patience is tried and tested. Just spend most of the match out maneuvering and styling on them with your fancy footwork until you get an opening, and be able to capitalize on each time you win neutral, bearing in mind you shouldn't be too eager to go in as much as you would on a character with guaranteed follow ups.

Some floaties have those combos at certain percents, but for the most part you're going to be using your vastly superior movement to control the stage. IMO this is why the Luigi MU can be difficult, because you're both able to cover a ton of ground and force your opponent into disadvantageous positions; but just remember that against almost all of the cast, a well spaced uair can beat out most moves that will stuff your approaches, lead to more uair's, and then death via one of the various explosive hitboxes that Falcon can throw out.

Falcon is an amazing character, but he demands greatness from those who wield him.

 

[Cav]

Any tips for dash surfing/wave surfing/whatever its called? I wanna get better movement and i see wizzrobe and slox do this and pivot all over the place but im kinda confused on how to do it.

 

[タオー]

Any tips for dash surfing/wave surfing/whatever its called? I wanna get better movement and i see wizzrobe and slox do this and pivot all over the place but im kinda confused on how to do it.

The motion is Dash->WD. To practice this, work on WDing immediately after you enter your Dash animation. This movement is also part of Gravy's "Optimal Tech Chase", and it's super useful. It's basically just using WD to extend your Dash length, and you can mix it in with DD to vary your DD lengths.

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

I wanna know everything about Falcon vs the rest of the top 8 matchups, what should I look out for? and how I should play against each top tier character

 

[sam:)]

I wanna know everything about Falcon vs the rest of the top 8 matchups, what should I look out for? and how I should play against each top tier character

falcon gets bodied by the top 3, does p good against the rest