Bust a Move/Puzzle Bobble Mafia..... GAME OVER!

[Jdietz43]

@BSP: for what it's worth I agreed with you on your Bardull case, the problem was you yourself were scummy enough that picking a side immediately was near impossible: I kept swinging from agreeing that one side was scummier and then the other until I was ultimately just killed. For what it's worth my vote was indeed on Bardull, but that doesn't mean mine held weight either.

 

[BSP]

My question is why didn't anyone back them up

 

[Jdietz43]

I voted with you, but past that it needed more credibility for others to see it. No doubt they thought they would feel dumb if they lynched Bardull as town and were just left in Lylo with a "maybe, maybe not" scum BSP.

EDIT: I guess what I'm saying is: it came down to the fact you didn't play townie enough for people to take what you say at face value.

 

[Jdietz43]

Vote: BSP

Let's do it.

Maaaan RR wut u do. Asdf...
I would have NEVER pegged you for someone to quickvote like this so far into a game.

 

[BSP]

All my reasoning, while entirely constructed, was pretty spotless and made sense. I honestly did think Riddle was playing better than BSP because his posts were constructed well with obvious intent, while BSP's style of play was sheepish and non-scum hunting in nature. Riddle may have seemed the same way, but he was still asking the right questions.

Asking questions and providing reasoning for your reads is half of it; Riddle never pushed anyone, and as I pointed out, only put out 1 unique stance by the time you had him as a town read. That's why your town read on him alerted me, and had I not been suspicious myself on D1, it would've led to your downfall.

I barely even feigned town-intent in my posts. My whole play revolved around getting Bardull thread control honestly.

I really should've settled on you, but I was just so worried about Bardull. I didn't want to give in to someone else's agenda this time.

I'm salty about this. I totally agree with this:

Town played awful. (Tako entirely inactive as a cleared mason, Vinyl lynching every town in sight for scum's benefit, Toaster inactive and then killed, I derped a herp D2)

In addition to that, I wasn't townie enough D1 to gain trust, and RR with that quickvote. We should not have lost that game.

 

[BarDulL]

Wow, ok I was on the fence for sure, but that looked awful for BSP town... I wouldn't mind being wrong and him simply being the choice tomorrow, not sure why RR is insisting Riddle first.


So yeah I was town.

This ended up giving me momentum to shoot for BSP without much difficulty. Not sure why you did this if you agreed with BSP that I was scum, JD.

 

[BarDulL]

Asking questions and providing reasoning is half of it; Riddle never pushed anyone, and as I pointed out, only put out 1 unique stance by the time you had him as a town read. That's why your town read on him alerted me, and had I not been suspicious myself on D1, it would've led to your downfall.



I really should've settled on you, but I was just so worried about Bardull. I didn't want to give in to someone else's agenda this time.

I'm salty about this. I totally agree with this:



In addition to that, I wasn't townie enough D1 to gain trust, and RR with that quickvote. We should not have lost that game.

Don't know why Riddle says he "barely feigned town intent" when he showed town intent in most of his posts, lol. Not sure if he's being silly or just trying to rub it in Town's faces, or if he isn't as good as I think he is.

He definitely pushed for Vinyl D1 iirc, and outed reads, and asked great questions. I can't remember his D2/D3 play, but there were some townish inklings. He completely disappeared on D4.

Scum reaped the benefits of Town's mistakes, that's how scum wins.

BSP, start putting a "" at the end of your posts.

Edit: I'm off for a bit, gonna get some exercise. Will post shouts to all slots later on.

 

[BSP]

And Bar ain't scum.

If you wouldn't have been so dead set on me with absolutely nothing to back it up, maybe you could've looked harder.

I'd have to go look at my notes BSP, but god there were a lot of them (except your read on Bardull, you're right, he's scum)

IDK if you were lying here, but:

D1, my vote was on 194 (scum)

I wasn't on the Orbo wagon and never voted him IIRC

I didn't quicklynch Rake

I voted for Jdietz D2 I believe, but then the census happened, and I didn't lynch him D4

I didn't trust Riddle (scum)

I didn't trust Bardull (scum)

I didn't interact with Kantrip enough, but I should've pressed him harder about his town read on you as well.

After RR actually got into the game, I didn't question him.

Vinyl, Joker, and Tako were confirmed for the most part.

And lo and behold, the only other person who gave Riddle a town read was also anti town(Indy), which is why I brought that up when Bardull gave you a town read.

Of course, it got misinterpreted.

I don't see how I was off.

 

[BarDulL]

Even if you actually had all those correct reads, you had nothing to show for it, and your credibility was shot to death because of how your slot was painted. You more or less sheeped the entire game and never scum hunted, and was only really ever participating when you got called scum. It very clearly looked like you were just omgus'ing me (99% certain you were) and called me scum because I wanted you dead after JD. Even if that isn't the truth, that's what it looked like.

 

[T-block]

actually, bardull mvp would be a good call imo. i thought the endgame play was a liiiittle sloppy, but it was actually exactly what it needed to be, nothing more, which is fine. in general, i thought he was beautifully manipulative throughout the game, keeping control over the flow, and i don't think there was any point where his team was in danger of losing. pretty sure i wouldn't have pinned bardull as scum if i were playing this game.

RR, did you REALLY think bardull wouldn't do the vig thing as town? i wrote that off as a null tell immediately. maybe bardull will tell me i'm wrong in that.

 

[BSP]

Even if you actually had all those correct reads, you had nothing to show for it, and your credibility was shot to death because of how your slot was painted. You more or less sheeped the entire game and never scum hunted, and was only really ever participating when you got called scum. It very clearly looked like you were just omgus'ing me (99% certain you were) and called me scum because I wanted you dead after JD. Even if that isn't the truth, that's what it looked like.

Yep, I screwed up D1. Not happening again.

 

[Jdietz43]

This ended up giving me momentum to shoot for BSP without much difficulty. Not sure why you did this if you agreed with BSP that I was scum, JD.

Because that last bit was legit bad on BSP's part lol. I agreed with him, then I died and he had that awful argument in twilight that made me rethink my fence stance on Bardull vs. BSP. In that last second he really taxed the remaining credibility I had for BSP being town.

I know it probably helped you a lot, but thems the breaks. I knew full well what I was handing to you, but I figured scum BSP was showing through and crumbling at the end and you should push him instead. The agreeing with his case was from earlier before twilight.

 

[Jdietz43]

actually, bardull mvp would be a good call imo. i thought the endgame play was a liiiittle sloppy, but it was actually exactly what it needed to be, nothing more, which is fine. in general, i thought he was beautifully manipulative throughout the game, keeping control over the flow, and i don't think there was any point where his team was in danger of losing. pretty sure i wouldn't have pinned bardull as scum if i were playing this game.

RR, did you REALLY think bardull wouldn't do the vig thing as town? i wrote that off as a null tell immediately. maybe bardull will tell me i'm wrong in that.

Bardull claiming dayvig was null, holding onto it and "not shooting" D1 without immediately dropping the claim D2 was a scum tell.

It's either No MVP or Badull MVP. Depends how much credit John is willing to give. I could see both ways going, Bardull played really well as scum, pretty much being the scum-team (no offense to 194 or Riddle), but on the other hand literally half of town helped him by either being entirely gone or herping it up and quickie myslynching (Rake, Me, and BSP all died from Vinyl/RR random votes). It was good play on Bardull, question is how much would have flown if the player list had actually brought anything to the table. Whether that's an argument or not IDK, I've been yelled at for giving away MVPs to scum in the past because "Town didn't show", but I like giving MVPs on principle. I'll let the people who've been around and know what an MVP is worth decide.

 

[Riddle]

Don't know why Riddle says he "barely feigned town intent" when he showed town intent in most of his posts, lol. Not sure if he's being silly or just trying to rub it in Town's faces, or if he isn't as good as I think he is.

Silliness mostly.

 

[BSP]

Err, never mind. Motives and ****.

 

[BarDulL]

Alright, so I'm actually going to start from scratch and try to be as unbiased as possible in my analysis of Riddle's play AND BSP's play, since the main goal here is to be as objective as possible in determining whether or not it was logical for me to have a have a consistent Town Riddle read throughout the game, or to at least have reasonable cause for wanting BSP dead before Riddle on D4/D5.

Lets gooooo

(confirming)

Nothing to say here, really.

@BarDull I used to be a DGames regular about a year and half ago. I'd say I've played in around 15 games and I have 0 clue what my record is.

This will help me read his slot. Glad he was willing to share this information, but not indicative of alignment. If anything, it should make me more careful before freely trusting his slot. My last sentence was needless banter, forget I said it.

Chatterbox sounds like an awful restriction/role. It's also pretty difficult to determine whether someone is a chatterbox at this point any because tons of people have that posting style.

At the time Riddle made this post, Sneaky Tako had made this huge schpeal about how he felt Rake was scum because of his posting style (Rake triple posts and sometimes quadruple posts at times), and that this posting style was indicative of Rake being a chatterbox role. Tako also thought, for some reason, that the chatterbox role was a scum role (probably because filling the thread with posts could be considered anti-town and distracting, or because Tako just arbitrarily perceived the role as scummy in nature, but who am I to say?) It was more or less ******** on Tako's part, good gorf. However, by this point in the game, Riddle should have started to be a bit more productive with his posts.

This post in particular is bad. It's undeniably fluff that doesn't really serve to push Town in the right direction. Like, if you read into his intent here, he's not really trying to accomplish anything with this post in particular aside from uselessly comment on the chatterbox predicament. If you read into the context of the situation, we had already established that the chatterbox role was very unlikely to be in the game in the first place, let alone be a scum role, so Riddle was just posting a blank after all was already said and done. I voted for him for doing this on the grounds that his contributions were lackluster, fluffy, and without town intent.

I was simply agreeing with you and Rake that Rake's posting style is not particularly indicative of any restriction, since that was practically the only topic of the Day. Adding to discussions, even if the input isn't new, helps town to see where people stand on issues and isn't anti-town in any way. Perhaps I'm just used to more inane conversation early on in Day 1.


Why are you so calm about potentially being shot? Do you believe that BarDulL has a gun? If so, how serious do you think he is about likely shooting you?

This post is ok. He agrees with me, explains himself, and says he did it to get his say in. This is the pro-town thing to do, because he is at least substantiating his approach to the game to let others potentially get a better read on him while giving me influence, someone who he feels is likely Town (revealed in the next post). Still, it really wasn't necessary on his part to post his thoughts w.r.t. the chatterbox predicament. Still don't really have a reason to trust him at this point, albeit his question is actually not bad because it looks like he is trying to get a read on Sneaky Tako, whom is the primary candidate for suspicion at this point in time. This is a plus in my book, but not a big one.

I hate this explanation, but it's a really risky one for scum to use, so I'm inclined to believe it. Still, what made you think that ending RVS quickly by getting a wagon started on yourself was better for town than just letting RVS end in its own time?


His claim seems weird; I can't figure out the motivation behind it for the life of me. Other than that, I like he way he thinks. He certainly has a very different style from me, but he seems to be actively scumhunting and playing with town's best interests at heart.


What (useful) information could you possibly be hoping to gather from the answer to this question?

This is a great post. I'm not all too fond of the wifomy argument he uses to agree with Kantrip's claim at first, but Riddle answers my uncertainty with his own sense of uncertainty by questioning Kantrip's rationale further. Riddle is trying to get a better read on Kantrip and is trying to find reason to trust him from what can be seen in this post. This is a legitimate question to be asking on Riddle's behalf, and makes me feel a lot better about the slot.

I don't like Riddle's question towards PBJ all too much primarily because there is nothing anything inherently wrong with PBJ's question. In fact, PBJ asking Kantrip why Kantrip feels that Rake/PBJ can't be scum together is actually a fair question because it forces Kantrip to out a read in order for PBJ to get off his back. However, it's possible that Riddle was just trying to feel out PBJ here, albeit he could have asked a better question here.

I wasn't sure if your question was asked in order to feel Kantrip out (as it seems to have been) or if there was a more specific reason for the query.

So, what were you hop-

This isn't that great of a reason to question PBJ's question unless Riddle was trying to get a feel for PBJ himself. Considering that he's asked 3 or 4 questions at this point, two of which didn't have great established intent, there is a pattern arising here and it's possible that Riddle is either noobTown or Noobscum. However, I'm not going to try and differentiate between the two yet because I don't feel that he has done enough to warrant being thrown in this category. Maybe if he sets off another flag.

Assuming tako is telling the truth about his role, what does this accomplish?

Excellent question to ask. Tako's role is pretty believable at this point in the game (Tako had just claimed one of the main characters in Puzzle Bobble and also claimed Mason with an unconfirmed player), so there really wasn't a compelling enough reason for Tako to out his mason partner yet. At this point, I like Riddle's line of thinking even if he is shaky in some areas because his thought process is not only matching my own roughly (Tako shouldn't out his partner), but he's also not missing any cues.

However, it's important to note that Riddle hasn't really thrown his vote around yet (this isn't necessarily indicative of alignment though, Riddle could just be passive aggressive in his questioning of other slots. Reminds me of Gova.) I'll keep it in mind for the time being and continue my read.

That doesn't make any sense. What reason would scum have to counter claim? They can just wait and then both masons are outed. Tako should breadcrumb some sort of code that is undecipherable and then tell his partner about it, so his partner can reveal the breadcrumb and clear himself at any point later in the game if/when Tako flips mason.

Generally helpful post that serves to help Town rather than deter them. The town intent here is great and obvious.

I read the same wiki and it clearly said that masons are occasionally mafia/town, although the official name is neighbors, so it seems fairly likely that your partner is town. Definitely ask John2k4 though.


Don't answer this tako.

This information is more useful for the mafia than it is for town if Tako really is a town mason, as there is only a fairly small group of people who could be construed as having defended him. A mafia mason would almost definitely defend his partner at least to some degree, because a town mason flip could pretty easily clear him in the minds of the town. This post is either scum-motivated or poorly thought out, I'm not sure which.

There isn't much to say here. Riddle is being assertive for the right reasons and it makes sense considering that he feels comfortable with Tako's claim (a pretty believable claim despite Tako's not-so-great early play.) I'm fine with this.

@Mod: To what extent does this rule prevent nearly impossible to discover breadcrumbing. Can you clarify it?

It was relevant at the time, so no harm in doing this. I'm not going to give him many points for it, but he's definitely trying to get more information out in the open to push Town forward w.r.t. Tako's mason claim.

Inactivity, maybe. Regardless, I see absolutely no reason for tako to answer the question you asked him, it's clearly anti-town to lessen the pool of potential mason partners for scum when a breadcrumb would work so much better.

This is fine. More assertion of his stance on things w.r.t. Tako's mason claim.

I read the rules as well, but I feel like there has to be some way to breadcrumb in a way that only the mason partner can reveal later on. It's kind of a vague rule. I'm not sure where the boundary between codes and legal breadcrumbs is.

This post isn't that great since he's not trying to go anywhere with it (except maybe to exemplify his confounded-ness w.r.t. John's rule.) Still, he seems pretty insistent that Tako shouldn't out his mason buddy and should instead crumb it somehow. Definitely not a scummy direction.

BarDulL going from this:

to this:

seems rather inconsistent to me.

@BarDulL: What happened to make your opinion of Kantrip's early game play change so drastically?

This is a fair question of my slot and makes me like Riddle more. Good scum hunting intent while also trying to get a feel for my slot.

The term "gambit" has become too vague for me to understand the previous post you made about gambiting Kantrip. Could you please clarify the method and purpose of said gambit?

Trying to understand my approach to Kantrip. This is fine.

Please don't answer questions specifically directed to other players. In this case it's mostly harmless, but it's certainly preferable to just allow the person questioned to respond in nearly every imaginable situation.

This is fine. I have a terrible problem of doing this myself, but I try not to do it in Mafia games when I want as much information out of every player as possible. Totally ok with this statement.

@BarDulL - Fair enough. Did you believe that you gained anything useful from this "gambit"?

Fair question, I like it. Town intent is there, is trying to understand my approach while possibly attempting to catch me slipping up.

What makes distancing yourself from a player that is confirmed town to you a good idea in any way? It just doesn't make any sense to me. There's absolutely no reason to do so.

This is fine. Tako/PJB's mason claim should have been enough to turn heads away from them, but in the context of this situation, it was a fair question to ask because Tako/PJB were still under some suspicion.

So you're saying that if it looked like tako were going to be lynched, you weren't planning on claiming to save him? You were just going to let him die and hope that scum didn't pull out a mason connection out of thin air?

See my above response to his last post.

There's a lot of play going on that doesn't make any sense to me at all. I can't come up with a reason for towntako OR scumtako to make the RVS play he did, and, similarly, I can't figure out why Joker wouldn't defend Tako at all. I think they're both probably town, but really only because of their claims. I just need to get in both of their heads more to figure out what they could possibly be thinking.

The tako stuff has dominated the day, but I have Kantrip as a town lean too. Scum can just be sitting back and not doing anything to call much attention to themselves in light of this conflict, and I'm sure that's what they're doing, so my guess is that mafia is composed of people like Red Ryu/194/BSP/Vinyl./etc.

I think town's best play is to pretty quickly figure out what we're going to do about tako/Joker and then if we decide not to lynch them, we should move on. If they're telling the truth and are both town masons, than this extreme focus on them is just making it too easy for scum to coast.

Perfectly good assessment of Tako/PJB. Really, their play wasn't that great at this point in the game, and their only real saving grace was that they were the main characters of Puzzle Bobble while also being masons together. Good read on Riddle's part.

Turning discussion towards Ryu/BSP/194/Vinyl was great and definitely Townie on Riddle's behalf. No point in talking ad nauseum about the masons, and his read on Kantrip was fine considering Kantrip has been reasonably protown thus far.

What are you even talking about?

Lol. HAHA. This was definitely warranted.

Vote: Vinyl.

I'm not liking either Vinyl or 194 right now. A lot of fluff, almost no useful information, and they both seem quite opportunistic as far as their reads go. I'd like to see a lot more content from both of them, and less complaints about how "out of it" they are.

Vinyl's discussion of BSP in particular doesn't sit particularly well with me, which is why I chose to vote him, but I would be fine with lynching either of them. They'd make good vigilante targets too (*cough*BarDulL*cough*).

This is Riddle's first real push in the game, and it's on Vinyl. At this point, his push is definitely warranted. I don't necessarily like the door he's leaving himself open to go right towards a 194 lynch if need be, however I don't have much reason to suspect him for this because truthfully, Vinyl and 194 really are in similar boats in terms of what they've done so far. Vinyl's pushing of BSP scum on an empty premise is bad, and it looks blatantly obvious that Vinyl is sheeping my reads. 194 has also been pretty bad as well in that he hasn't accomplished much in terms of scum hunting/questioning. Heck, 194 hasn't really done much at all in terms of activity, so the pressuring of the 194 slot is warranted. Pro-town on Riddle's behalf.

I feel like almost everything I've seen from you has been interactions regarding your masonry. Reads on a bunch of other players would be awesome.

Eh, this is ok. Even though PJB/Tako are clear, this is still information that Town can use. I'm ok with it.

We have a couple more days for discussion, but barring anything completely unexpected, I'm down with this course of action.

Setting himself up to go for 194, but there's nothing wrong with this because 194 is looking to be the lynch candidate and he has provided Town enough reasoning to lynch him.

I don't need a full list, but if that's the only time you give out town reads, then yeah do that.

"Eh, this is ok. Even though PJB/Tako are clear, this is still information that Town can use. I'm ok with it."

You are correct. You will have a hard time finding any accurate meta on me until I flip in Hunter x Hunter.


I don't want to wait until the deadline or anything like that, but I would certainly like to wait until people like Red Ryu/Toaster give us content/reads before going into Night.

This is the pro-town thing to do. More information before a lynch is always helpful and within Town's interests. Pro-town.

With BarDulL, Rake, Joker, BSP, and Kantrip already voting 194 and 7 needed to lynch, I believe 194 is actually at L-2.

Whatevz.

194's whole catch-up post was pretty terrible, but this in particular irritates me to end. Too-townie/too pro-town isn't a scumtell and it never will be, this really just strikes me as an OMGUS by pressured scum on a player that has played a very pro-town game. I'm going to switch my vote to 194 as soon as I make sure that it's not a hammer.

194 should claim.

Legitimate stance on 194's slot.

Unvote, Vote: 194

That's L-1

This switch is legit. 194 is definitely the play and Riddle has every reason to aim for 194 at this point.

I appreciate the caution, but you're over-thinking it. I just want to leave my vote on 194 before I go to sleep and I trust that town won't hammer until all of the loose ends are tied up.

This is fine.

Then 194 flips scum, and Riddle looks like pretty solid Town from that point forward considering his disconnections/pushing of the 194 slot.

If anyone feels differently or feels I'm not being fair in my analysis of Riddle's play thus far, let me know. I started getting pretty tired towards the end of Riddle's D1 play, so I may have gotten sloppy towards the end. Either way, I'm stopping here for the meantime and I'll continue working on this later.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

I read 80% of the post, skimmed the last 20% (Sworddancer? Moar like ADDdancer amirite?). I kid though. Even though I didn't read the post as thoroughly as I could, I feel like I got a good idea of it nevertheless.

I appreciate the effort that you went through Bardull to make your case, but I still feel like BSP is in the right here. Your thought process for reading into intention seems flawed to me. I'm having a hard time choosing my words to describe why I think you're wrong, so I'm just going to quickly list out the aspects of your reasoning that I find flawed:

-You give Riddle too much slack for not pushing anyone. You stated that you didn't find his lack of pushing necessarily scummy, because he could have been just been scumhunting "passive aggressively." However, that's just a baseless assumption that you're throwing in there to justify not finding his lack of pushing scummy. He's scumhunting, just passive aggressively? How do you know that? What evidence do you have to suggest that is the case? This is also compounded by what BSP pointed out wrt what you "found" to be scummy and it not lining up with what Riddle , plus the fact that Riddle constantly tried to make it seem like he was scumhunting, but wasn't.

-You're ignoring the fact that his pushes, when he did make them, were already common ones. This is something else that I believe BSP pointed out.

-You're not looking at Riddle from a holistic PoV. This is probably the biggest flaw in your case, because everything else wrong with your reasoning streams from this. What you have done is take every post and examine it them for their individual value. However, you didn't really look at the overall picture that they painted for Riddle. You didn't really take into consideration that all of his "good questions" weren't really leading anywhere.

-Finally, your thought process runs on the generic line of "Player X responded properly to situation Y, thus I find him to be townie." Anyone can ask questions bro. Anyone can be right about something, but that doesn't mean that they're necessarily interested in catching scum.

I'll leave you with this quote:

Be useful, not just right.

 

[BarDulL]

Sword, you're speaking too soon. You have yet to see BSP's play.

 

[BarDulL]

Or anyone else's, really.

Sword, did you read the entire thread before you posted that assessment?

 

[BarDulL]

And holy ****, why are there 18 guests in this thread?

 

[BarDulL]

Ahhhhhhh forget it, I can't be bothered to try and argue this and validate myself, would take too much time. I'm not trying to "be right for the sake of being right," so I don't know where you're trying to come off of by posting that quote, Sword.

Look, at the end of the day, I still feel Riddle's play was better than BSP's. Literally, like no matter what anyone says, that's how I feel about it. I feel BSP's play was worse. If I didn't feel that Riddle's play was better, then I would not have fought for him as much as I did, and probably would have sooner bussed him instead. I'm not trying to personally degrade BSP, but that's kinda how I feel about it.

Sorry if this seems like a cop out, but really, I've got better things to do. It would take HOURS and HOURS of my time to write up post after post correctly expressing why I feel Riddle's play stands above BSP's, but I just can't be bothered to do it, especially after the game is over.

Sorry BSP, I know you took a long time to write up that case and I ended up not giving you a full response, but despite what you've postulated in that case, I still think Riddle played the better game. That's all I can really say in that regard. I don't mean to be of offense to you by saying this, but that's my take.

This kinda puts me in a position of losing credibility, but I can't be bothered to fight for something when no one is going to read the thread, for one thing. I can't really blame them either. But not reading the thread and trying to assess BSP's post and my analysis of Riddle is just plain silly, because there are so many variables that you're missing out on that I couldn't possibly take and express verbally without losing my fingers from so much typing. Things like feels, thread control, being in the moment while everything was happening, all the interpersonal relations occurring, scum vibes and town vibes, process of elimination, the "big picture" of every player, and several more things that I can't possibly verbally express without taking days out of my time to do, all the while acknowledging that this is entirely subjective and relative to one's own perception of the facts.

Admittedly, I was pretty foolish to try and perform analysis on Riddle's slot when I can't possibly take EVERYTHING he did and express it. Bleagh. All I can tell you is that I feel pretty confident about this, and it's up to you whether or not you want to trust that confidence. Or just read the thread. I can't be bothered to beat a dead horse to death (lol) when I have no reason to. Sorry!

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

the real answer here is he was your scum mate so of course you'd have him as more townie then someone who wants to lynch him :3

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

You can say that you feel he was townier Bardull, but in the end most people and even myself, are gonna side that BSP did more.

 

[BarDulL]

RR, why did you agree to lynch him before Riddle, then?

 

[BarDulL]

Well, yeah, BSP did more, he has like double Riddle's posts.

Eh.

Dead horse. I'm beating. A dead horse. Blagh.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

only one way to solve this .
Rock paper scissors, BSP vs Riddle, whoever wins was more townie

 

[BarDulL]

YES. Except Riddle is always using dynamite.

>_>

 

[BarDulL]

Yeah, one could say that because he's my scum mate, I'm likely more biased in seeing his townie colors. However, I had no qualms bussing 194, so what is that an implication of?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

194 voted for a null read.

I'd call it smart play

Plus, he hadn't done anything. Like at all. I was going to vote him regardless because he was coasting hardbody on PJBscum and only came around to make a comment on the popular wagons , you just helped me get him ;

At least with riddle , you could make the reachy statement that he was trying to and in maybe one or two cases producing legit content, with 194, you saying that would have seen you gone as fast as he was I would think. Personally i woulda gunned for you had you called him town, same goes for anyone else

 

[BarDulL]

I almost want to say "I rest my case" in response to that because that's evidence of me being deliberately careful when trying to remain above arbitrary differentiation at the surface level, but maybe I'm just really in a perpetual state of denial and everything is an illusion and you're a part of my imagination and blagdaksdhkjahajkafasdadad and somehow, Riddle wasn't playing as Townie as BSP. But is that really the truth?

I'm not even going to bother answering this question anymore and eat breakfast.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

Or anyone else's, really.

Sword, did you read the entire thread before you posted that assessment?

Of course not. I did actually read the first 150ish post when the game just started, but nothing more. I don't like reading games that I'm not in.

You didn't post that analysis and expect people to read the thread before judging it, did you?

It's true that I don't know the context of the game, but I wasn't really asked to know this. BSP simply made a request for other Dgamers to judge his case, and that I did. Without knowing the context of the game, I can only judge what BSP presented in a vacuum. However, what I did see was not only something that made sense, but something that did a good job citing its sources. I feel as if BSP's case was thorough enough to the point that I can safely say that not only did he catch scum, but he caught scum for the right reasoning.

And holy ****, why are there 18 guests in this thread?

What can I say? When the Dancer speaks, the people listen.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

once again, whether you want to or not, first thing your gut does as scum when someone calls your bud scum is to chainsaw them. Which is what i would classify the large portion of your issues with BSP came from while the game was ongoing

I was actually quite suprised that BSP didnt' call you out on doing that when i had previously explained chainsawing in this thread lol.

Guess it was to much to hope it would come full circle

 

[BSP]

I still don't really understand chainsawing

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I'll use an example:

me + bardull are scum mates.
You call bardull scum.
I call you scum based off something else + the fact you called him scum, thereby discrediting your read on him and forcing people to look at you.

Or at least that is my understanding of it

 

[BarDulL]

once again, whether you want to or not, first thing your gut does as scum when someone calls your bud scum is to chainsaw them. Which is what i would classify the large portion of your issues with BSP came from while the game was ongoing

I was actually quite suprised that BSP didnt' call you out on doing that when i had previously explained chainsawing in this thread lol.

Guess it was to much to hope it would come full circle

Eh, I didn't chainsaw 194, so I'm not sure how I feel about your reasoning. I guess you could say I chainsawed for Riddle by attacking JD and BSP (this is actually partly true), but it was reinforced by the fact that I legit believed that Riddle played a better game, y'know what I mean?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

thats what i meant bardull, i meant you chainsawed for riddle on BSP / JD lol

 

[BarDulL]

Of course not. I did actually read the first 150ish post when the game just started, but nothing more. I don't like reading games that I'm not in.

You didn't post that analysis and expect people to read the thread before judging it, did you?

It's true that I don't know the context of the game, but I wasn't really asked to know this. BSP simply made a request for other Dgamers to judge his case, and that I did. Without knowing the context of the game, I can only judge what BSP presented in a vacuum. However, what I did see was not only something that made sense, but something that did a good job citing its sources. I feel as if BSP's case was thorough enough to the point that I can safely say that not only did he catch scum, but he caught scum for the right reasoning.




What can I say? When the Dancer speaks, the people listen.

I was actually hoping people would read along the thread while reading my analysis, yes, but I didn't "expect" them to per se because holy ****, that's a long *** read. However, I'd think that someone who is interested in trying to determine whether or not BSP or Riddle played a better game would at least:

1. Read the thread
2. Read all of my analysis

Before trying to critique my analysis and make a complete statement about BSP and Riddle's play, because otherwise, as you said, you're just viewing things in a vacuum and you're missing tons and tons of information that I can't possibly shorten for you.

Frankly, I had no intentions of telling the entire story to my audience because the story is right here in the thread. @_@.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

I almost never look for "chainsaws" because I think they're generally BSie tells. The only way I think someone could ever really call someone out on a chainsaw is if they're attacking someone who's attacking someone else who's obviously scummy, and even that's open to a lot of WIFOM.

Plus, I know a lot of players don't really think to chainsaw as scum. Look at J and Gheb, their first instinct is to bus their scum partners. Look at OS, he usually tries to set himself to die, but in exchange for leaving his scummates in a better position.

 

[#HBC | Dancer]

Bardull, would you at least concede then that, in a vacuum, BSP's case makes sense?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

RR, why did you agree to lynch him before Riddle, then?

Set-up analysis and thinking it would be easier to get to that point if I just got it down to their.