Social Bubble Man's Jacuzzi (Mega Man Social Thread)

[Mythzotick]

The thing about Smash 4 that I like is that unlike Melee or Brawl, the worst characters are still capable of winning. Maybe not at high level, but Jigglypuff in this game is more capable of winning than she was in Brawl. I'm not saying Smash 4's super balanced, because there's still plenty of crazy stuff, but compared to past Smash games, Smash 4 is incredibly balanced. Then again, no fighting game is truly balanced. The day that happens, it'll be a sight to behold.

Mythzotick Pikachu's a character that has a lot going for him, but I'm not sure why people sleep on him. Is he hard to use? Personally, I can't use Pikachu for ****, but that could be just because he doesn't suit my play style, lol.

I also feel that people are sleeping on , like a lot. Now this could be my Kirby fanboy raging here, but he can be a strong counter pick character depending on the situation. With characters like , , , and , Kirby can be surprisingly effective against them. I'm not saying he wins these MUs, but compared to a lot of characters, Kirby does decently against them. I mean, being able to DI out of Mario's BnB D-Throw to U-Tilt combo is a big plus if you ask me. Copy Abilities can also change the tide of battle, mainly in 's, and 's cases. I can agree that Kirby isn't that good of a solo choice, but he's better than 41st. :/

On Ryu, it can be argued that beats him, and she's at 44th place.

I would probably say that Pikachu is up there among the hardest characters to use on a high level (at least top 10 hardest). It's mainly why he gets a lot of inconsistent results. But if someone like ESAM is in the zone with Pikachu, then good luck.

Not just Kirby, but a lot of low-mid/low tier characters I feel are kind of getting slept on just because of where they're at on the tier list such as (not so much now after 2-0ing ZeRo). Unfortunately though, someone's got to be on the lower half. I actually think it's possible that could wind up being better than at some point in the future.

It really baffles me that there are people out there that still think that is the best character in the game when he has a lot of losing match ups even to those that are in mid or low tier. I guess they love drinking a lot of potentialrade or something.

Also, ZeRo is currently working on a new tier list and he's starting at the bottom this time as opposed to the top. As always, I'm curious on where he'll put at on the list if he even makes a top tier and high tier part or not since his previous 1.1.6 tier list didn't finish. Please Nintendo! If you plan on patching Smash 4, do it after ZeRo finishes his new tier list! Thank you.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Mythzotick In Ryu's defense, I think the reason why so many still see Ryu as a top contender is because of the potential he has. True Shoryuken is one of the best kill confirms in the game, and the fact that it can kill extremely early shows the potential Ryu has. However, I feel like this is a similar case to Roy, but not to the same extent. Yes, I think we all overestimated Ryu, but unlike Roy, a lot of people see the potential Ryu has, myself included. I wouldn't say Ryu is better than Mega Man even taking the True Shoryuken into mind, but not by much. I'm not saying Mega Man should take Ryu's spot, but I do think that Ryu should have been ranked below Top 10. Hell, Mewtwo's better than Ryu yet he's ranked lower.

The thing with Cloud's poor grab game is that he has more than enough strengths to negate his lack of a solid grab game. Solid damage output, disjointed hitboxes that help him combo (do I even need to mention how good his U-Air is), and of course, the Limit mechanic. Sure, Finishing Touch is really awkward to hit with and Limit Blade Beam isn't that big of a deal, but Limit Climbhazzard and of course, Limit Cross Slash more than make up some of Cloud's faults, especially his grab game. Granted, I don't think Cloud is Top 5, but he is Top 10 at least at the moment.

 

[Azazel]

Spoiler

It's been while but I've come back with a new zero to death infinte
Metalblade doesn't disappear because it doesn't the ground and it should have less variance depending (so you dont have to account for varying footstool animations and etc)

It's fairly simple

sh > Zdrop > bair spike

The break down

Short hop

> (while acsending) Z-drop metal blade inside opponent (1)

> Metablade hits twice (2)

> Fast fall Bair (3) and catch metalblade (4) at the same time at apex of jump

> repeat until death percent (5)

1. (a must!! or else it's not fast enough to be an infinite. short characters are immune i suppose)
2. (a must!! so SDI and mis spacing the metablade will break combo)
   
3. (only first hit should connect resulting in a spike)
4. (If you do this the Metalblade never touches the ground and therefore never has a chance to disappear.)
5. (it works from 0 to 50 -100% Depending on character, Metalblade begins to have to much knockback to be able to spike with bair. the infinite breaks a little after kill percent so just kill them as soon as possible)

I just found it so Ill grind it until i can save a replay of me doing it.

TL;dr I found a new infinite for megaman hopefully it's more consistent than the old one.

Just asking for people to try it and share thoughts on it while I'll grind it and hopefully put out a video soon

 

[Mythzotick]

Okay @mattyg , okay. If you're serious and not just talking for the lolz, then you're officially on my radar. I'm looking forward to the future.

https://twitter.com/SSB_MattyG/status/767830463750737920

If it does happen, this tweet must be remembered.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Okay @mattyg , okay. If you're serious and not just talking for the lolz, then you're officially on my radar. I'm looking forward to the future.

https://twitter.com/SSB_MattyG/status/767830463750737920

If it does happen, this tweet must be remembered.

That's an extremely bold claim, especially considering that the fact that nobody knows where the meta is headed. Still, we must savor this, or slaughter it, either or.

EDIT:
Christ. Jhett's a ****ing monster!

 

[Mythzotick]

That's an extremely bold claim, especially considering that the fact that nobody knows where the meta is headed. Still, we must savor this, or slaughter it, either or.

EDIT:
Christ. Jhett's a ****ing monster!

I can see where he is coming from since he makes those insane combos look easy to pull off, but like you said. It's really bold of him to make a statement like that. I wonder if he knows something that we don't know. We're aware of his footstool combos, footstool kill confirms, and footstool infinites that are extremely hard to pull off and is luck based because our metal blade will disappear whenever it feels like it. Or maybe it's us getting better and more consistent at pulling off the footstool combo.

 

[Mega-Spider]

I can see where he is coming from since he makes those insane combos look easy to pull off, but like you said. It's really bold of him to make a statement like that. I wonder if he knows something that we don't know. We're aware of his footstool combos, footstool kill confirms, and footstool infinites that are extremely hard to pull off and is luck based because our metal blade will disappear whenever it feels like it. Or maybe it's us getting better and more consistent at pulling off the footstool combo.

I would feel bad about having to use footstools to get ahead in life, but since it's a mechanic that's in the game, I find it to be fine. It's like ledge hogging in Melee. I hate seeing people use it to win matches, but it's not against the game's mechanics or rules so I can't really complain about it. Besides, I think it was stated that footstools beat grabs OOS, so it's a precise, but very rewarding payoff.

EDIT: I think it's because we've been learning a bunch of new things with Megs lately, we're using that in practice.

For some hilarity...

 

[SimonBarSinister]

For some hilarity...

Smash 4 is just stupid at times.

 

[Mythzotick]

What in the **** did I just watch? More standard StylesX2 jank content, that's what.

 

[SporadicCaos]

Guys, I thought I knew Mega Man... but last night...that changed. I know Sonic has a bad match-up against MM and stuff, but this guy made me see EXACTLY why. Losing the first stock almost meant losing the match and it's like all the projectiles just... merged into this defensive barrier I could NOT get through. I felt ashamed MM's my secondary.

TWO time-outs last night (we each won one). So guys, is aggro false and is super defensive Mega Man the truth?

 

[Knight Dude]

Which Mega Man game do you think has the weakest weapons? From the ones I've played, I think 5's weapons left a little to be desired. Though the levels themselves were good.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Which Mega Man game do you think has the weakest weapons? From the ones I've played, I think 5's weapons left a little to be desired. Though the levels themselves were good.

The funny thing about 5's weapon system is that despite how lackluster they are compared to previous and some later entries in the series, I felt more inclined to actually test them out. I often like to switch between Buster and weapon play, and that's where I found some uses for 5's weapons. I use Water Wave for grounded enemies, Star Crash during the falling crystal sections of Crystal Man's stage, Napalm Bomb can alternate with Water Wave, Charge Kick can get past some weaker enemies, and Gravity Hold can get rid of all low level threats. Gyro Attack is a little awkward for my liking, Crystal Eye isn't too useful for a multiple projectile attack, and Power Stone is straight up garbage. MM5 is a middle of the road entry in the series for me, and the lackluster weapon system is a reason why, though I still got use from the system as a whole.

Personally, I think 10 has the weakest weapons in the Classic series. Triple Blade is fairly good for damage and coverage, Water Shield is useful for Strike Man's sub boss, and Solar Blaze is okay for the most part, but I don't like the others. I hate the fact that the Commando Bomb doesn't make you stand still when firing it (something I didn't like about the Remote Bomb from Mega Man and Bass), making it awkward to hit with. Chill Spike isn't that bad, but I find it to be a pace killer because it slows the game down just to freeze an enemy and open fire on them when I could have just open fired on them in the first place. Rebound Striker is just another Gemini Laser and I didn't care much for that weapon in MM3, though both do good damage. Wheel Cutter has a neat function with it climbing up the wall, but it's not the best for an attack because of its slow start up, and Thunder Wool is one of the worst weapons in the series due to its pathetically short range.

I'm sure most of you will disagree with me, but I just find the weapons in 10 to be the weakest as a whole. Then again, I'm sure we all have our own weakest and best weapon systems. It's gonna be interesting to see what you guys think.

 

[Knight Dude]

The funny thing about 5's weapon system is that despite how lackluster they are compared to previous and some later entries in the series, I felt more inclined to actually test them out. I often like to switch between Buster and weapon play, and that's where I found some uses for 5's weapons. I use Water Wave for grounded enemies, Star Crash during the falling crystal sections of Crystal Man's stage, Napalm Bomb can alternate with Water Wave, Charge Kick can get past some weaker enemies, and Gravity Hold can get rid of all low level threats. Gyro Attack is a little awkward for my liking, Crystal Eye isn't too useful for a multiple projectile attack, and Power Stone is straight up garbage. MM5 is a middle of the road entry in the series for me, and the lackluster weapon system is a reason why, though I still got use from the system as a whole.

Personally, I think 10 has the weakest weapons in the Classic series. Triple Blade is fairly good for damage and coverage, Water Shield is useful for Strike Man's sub boss, and Solar Blaze is okay for the most part, but I don't like the others. I hate the fact that the Commando Bomb doesn't make you stand still when firing it (something I didn't like about the Remote Bomb from Mega Man and Bass), making it awkward to hit with. Chill Spike isn't that bad, but I find it to be a pace killer because it slows the game down just to freeze an enemy and open fire on them when I could have just open fired on them in the first place. Rebound Striker is just another Gemini Laser and I didn't care much for that weapon in MM3, though both do good damage. Wheel Cutter has a neat function with it climbing up the wall, but it's not the best for an attack because of its slow start up, and Thunder Wool is one of the worst weapons in the series due to its pathetically short range.

I'm sure most of you will disagree with me, but I just find the weapons in 10 to be the weakest as a whole. Then again, I'm sure we all have our own weakest and best weapon systems. It's gonna be interesting to see what you guys think.

Yeah, I found Star Crash and Gravity Hold to be pretty good. Charge Kick was okay on occasion. But the rest didn't serve me too well outside of Bosses.

Mega Man 2 actually has a really strong set of weapons, but most weapons are outclassed by Metal Blade. But Leaf Shield and Air Shooter especially put in a lot of work.

With MM3, Shadow Blade, Magnet Missile, and Needle were all pretty strong. Top Spin was good for a couple bosses, but is only good for screwing around.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

Which Mega Man game do you think has the weakest weapons? From the ones I've played, I think 5's weapons left a little to be desired. Though the levels themselves were good.

I'd have to agree on MM 5's special weapons being underwhelming, though the Crystal eye was pretty cool. Napalm Bomb would be much better if it was launched instead of just dropped. Everything else was just very situational.

Personally, I think 10 has the weakest weapons in the Classic series. Triple Blade is fairly good for damage and coverage, Water Shield is useful for Strike Man's sub boss, and Solar Blaze is okay for the most part, but I don't like the others. I hate the fact that the Commando Bomb doesn't make you stand still when firing it (something I didn't like about the Remote Bomb from Mega Man and Bass), making it awkward to hit with. Chill Spike isn't that bad, but I find it to be a pace killer because it slows the game down just to freeze an enemy and open fire on them when I could have just open fired on them in the first place. Rebound Striker is just another Gemini Laser and I didn't care much for that weapon in MM3, though both do good damage. Wheel Cutter has a neat function with it climbing up the wall, but it's not the best for an attack because of its slow start up, and Thunder Wool is one of the worst weapons in the series due to its pathetically short range.

I'm sure most of you will disagree with me, but I just find the weapons in 10 to be the weakest as a whole. Then again, I'm sure we all have our own weakest and best weapon systems. It's gonna be interesting to see what you guys think.

Really? I think MM 10 has some of the more interesting weapons in the series, except for Thunder Wool, that is. That one was just PATHETIC. Triple Blade is easily one of the most useful weapons in the game due to its firing pattern and overall specs. You can easily down quite a few big targets with this thing, and is useful as a backup weapon in case your primary is out of energy. Water Shield is the next best shield-type weapon after Jewel Satellite in my opinion, just that it has more offensive capabilities than defensive. Commando Bomb is quite situational, you won't be doing much with it outside of breaking walls, so I can understand the lack of popularity on that. If it could explode on contact with an enemy rather than just on surfaces it might've been viewed in a more favorable light. Chill Spike is actually a lot of fun to me. Fast movers are no match for it because they're either gonna be frozen or spiked. Generally being able to freeze almost anything out there (including Nitro Man) is a plus for me. Rebound Striker is an okay weapon, but it's best used in more confined areas to maximize the amount of bounces before it hits the target. And it feels like it runs out of energy too quickly. Wheel Cutter is my favorite weapon in the game. Good strength, high spammability and with energy to spare, you can launch a crapton of blades (which also climb up walls like the Plug Ball increasing its versatility) at your targets, not unlike the Metal Blade. Seriously, it's like the Metal Blade and the Plug Ball had a baby and the Wheel Cutter was the result. Riding up walls is extremely useful if you lose your footing during platforming challenges, so that's a bonus. It also has a sweet color scheme. Solar Blaze seems like an otherwise average weapon, but it can hit targets in front and behind, so that's something I guess.

I generally favor the weapons in later games, especially MM 8, 9 and 10.

 

[Mythzotick]

At this point, I'm debating on which game has the better weapons between Mega Man 2 and Mega Man 9.

MM2 has the more op weapons such as metal blade that can just tear through most enemies with little ammo and can be fired in 8 different directions, air shooter that provides a lot of long range coverage diagonally upwards and can kill most enemies in 1-2 hits, leaf shield which never disappears after touching small enemies and doesn't use ammo until you throw it once you move, and quick boomerang that has rapid fire, the highest ammo capacity in any Mega Man game iifc, and is a total boss killer; similar to metal blade.

MM9 on the other hand has the more complete and versatile weapon lineup with each weapon being more unique from on to another. You have weapons such as tornado blow that acts like a screen nuke that also lifts up platforms, black hole bomb that sucks up enemies that aren't bosses, laser trident that has rapid fire and can pierce through shields, plug ball that travels along the terrain, jewel satellite that doesn't disappear after hitting small to medium sized enemies and can reflect some projectiles, and hornet chaser that hunts down anything that's on the screen including items.

 

[Mega-Spider]

As for my personal favorite weapon system in the series, I'm stuck between Mega Man 4 and Mega Man 9.

Mega Man 4 is the first game in the series that didn't have a weapon that made me say "Wow, this isn't very good." As much as I love Mega Man 3, Spark Shock and Gemini Laser aren't very practical and while Laser may be good for damage, Spark Shock isn't good for anything. Still don't get the extreme hate for Top Spin, but I digress. Mega Man 4's weapons pack a lot of punch and have a lot of utility, with my personal favorites being Flash Stopper, Rain Flush, Pharaoh Shot, and my favorite, the Drill Bomb for its extreme power. Dust Crush is fairly good for literally being compacted trash, Skull Barrier is fairly useful for smaller enemies that die in one hit, Ring Boomerang is fast and can do some good damage, and Dive Missile... okay, this is the closest weapon in 4 to where I don't think it's that great because it can swerve between multiple targets, but it still works when applied correctly.

As for Mega Man 9's weapons, I think in terms of objectivity, this is the best weapon system in the series, because not only are the weapons extremely useful, but are also stylish without having to sacrifice practicality. The Jewel Satellite is without a doubt the best shield weapon in the series for its durability and being allowed to throw the shield on your own, which is something that I wish Leaf Shield would have had. The Laser Trident is fast and does a good amount of damage, Magma Bazooka covers a good amount of ground, Tornado Blow is a solid screen nuke that can help elevate you in the air, Plug Ball is a good floor option for those jumping spiders, Black Hole Bomb is good getting rid of enemies in tight areas, and the Concrete Shot is useful for those fire traps in Magma Man's stage and Wily Stage 1. But of course, there's the Hornet Chaser, my favorite weapon in the Classic series. Not only do they give me items, but they can kill enemies, and give me the items they drop. You don't know how awesome that is.

So... yeah. I love 4 and 9's weapons. Go figure.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

Mega Man 4 is the first game in the series that didn't have a weapon that made me say "Wow, this isn't very good." As much as I love Mega Man 3, Spark Shock and Gemini Laser aren't very practical and while Laser may be good for damage, Spark Shock isn't good for anything. Still don't get the extreme hate for Top Spin, but I digress. Mega Man 4's weapons pack a lot of punch and have a lot of utility, with my personal favorites being Flash Stopper, Rain Flush, Pharaoh Shot, and my favorite, the Drill Bomb for its extreme power. Dust Crush is fairly good for literally being compacted trash, Skull Barrier is fairly useful for smaller enemies that die in one hit, Ring Boomerang is fast and can do some good damage, and Dive Missile... okay, this is the closest weapon in 4 to where I don't think it's that great because it can swerve between multiple targets, but it still works when applied correctly.

MM 4's weapons are pretty good, with Dust Crusher and Drill Bomb at the top of my list. Though I don't spend a lot of time with area wide attacks like Rain Flush, since I tend to gravitate toward weapons with higher energy levels (though I do like MM 8's Astro Crush). Neither do I use a lot of "Time Stop" moves, pretty much only when necessary.

As for Mega Man 9's weapons, I think in terms of objectivity, this is the best weapon system in the series, because not only are the weapons extremely useful, but are also stylish without having to sacrifice practicality. The Jewel Satellite is without a doubt the best shield weapon in the series for its durability and being allowed to throw the shield on your own, which is something that I wish Leaf Shield would have had. The Laser Trident is fast and does a good amount of damage, Magma Bazooka covers a good amount of ground, Tornado Blow is a solid screen nuke that can help elevate you in the air, Plug Ball is a good floor option for those jumping spiders, Black Hole Bomb is good getting rid of enemies in tight areas, and the Concrete Shot is useful for those fire traps in Magma Man's stage and Wily Stage 1. But of course, there's the Hornet Chaser, my favorite weapon in the Classic series. Not only do they give me items, but they can kill enemies, and give me the items they drop. You don't know how awesome that is.

This is probably the game where every weapon had a lot of thought put into them in terms of how useful they could be (some more than others but still). By far my favorite special weapon in all of Classic Mega Man is the Laser Trident (Flash Bomb is a very close second). It has everything going for it, lots of energy, good strength, high spammability and most importantly, it goes through EVERYTHING, including enemy shields damaging them in the process. And just about every other weapon is top notch.

 

[Mythzotick]

 

[GrandTale]

I still think people are over reacting about placing Mega Man high because of his placing at Evo. I've been playing him since the beginning and I still think he's mid at best. From my experience I find "low tier" match ups harder then "high tier" match ups. Characters like Wario and ROB are harder to me then Sheik and Cloud. Plus when their only reasoning is footstool I just can't take them seriously.

 

[Mega-Spider]

I still think people are over reacting about placing Mega Man high because of his placing at Evo. I've been playing him since the beginning and I still think he's mid at best. From my experience I find "low tier" match ups harder then "high tier" match ups. Characters like Wario and ROB are harder to me then Sheik and Cloud. Plus when their only reasoning is footstool I just can't take them seriously.

That probably has to do with Cloud and Sheik players being much more common than ROB and Wario players. Because you see them so much, you're more adjusted to fighting them than you would be when it comes to an obscure character.

If the results didn't speak for themselves, then I'd agree with you on people overreacting to Megs's high placement. But as players like Kameme and ScAtt have shown us, Megs has a lot of potential and has a lot of positive traits going for him. I'm not saying he's top tier, but he's high tier at the very most and mid tier at the very least.

Want someone to give you reasons why Megs is high tier beyond footstools?

1. Megs has an incredible neutral when he's in control of the stage. Pellets are great at controlling the speed and pace of a match, and can stop characters who struggle at approaching, such as Ness.

2. Even though his damage output isn't the highest, Megs is great at racking up damage. Most of his moves are multi-hit attacks, meaning that the damage will build up over time. Despite pellets being weak as far as an attack goes, the amount of pellets hitting the opponent will build up over time, and with moves like Air Shooter, you'd be surprised how much damage they already have.

3. Megs also has a pretty solid MU spread. He does have some notable advantages against some of the top tiers, namely Diddy Kong, Sonic, Cloud, Ryu, and even goes even with Rosalina. Yes, he doesn't do very well against Mario, Fox, Sheik, and I can add that he struggles against Mewtwo, Captain Falcon, and Wario, but if a low tier like Kirby can go even with Fox and maybe Sheik, then Megs can have some tough low tier MUs. Not to mention, he does even with a lot of characters.

4. Megs also has one of the best item plays in the game. Metal Blade has a lot of uses (no, not just for the footstool), Crash Bomber can be used for mind games, and Leaf Shield stops people from getting too close as well as nullify some projectiles like Pikachu's Neutral B. Air Shooter is amazing for racking up damage and juggling, and pellets can control the match under the right direction.

5. Solid KO options. Now, I'm not saying Megs is great at killing because he isn't. Then again, the same thing can be said for Sheik, who can struggle at killing if you don't get the right confirms. When you're inexperienced, Megs can struggle with killing. If you aren't, Megs has some solid KO options. Slash Claw is by far his best option since it's one of the fastest B-airs in the game, and the third hit does so much knockback. U-tilt is a fantastic OOS option, and knowing how much knockback that move has, it's great at netting early KOs. B-Throw is pretty good. It's not Ness's B-Throw, but it's still pretty good at the edge of the stage. Because Megs can survive for a while, he benefits a good amount from rage, especially the U-tilt OOS.

Alright, I think that does it for my reasoning. I'm sure you don't agree with these, but you said you wanted someone to give you more reasons than just the footstool, so here you go.

One more thing before I end this post: I recommend you go to the Mega Man Discord community. There are a lot of knowledgeable Mega Mains over there, and they can give you some very useful tips for MUs, stage recommendations, etc. It'll help give you insight as to why a lot of people see Megs as a high tier character. Nobody knows where the meta is going, so maybe Megs will go back to being mid tier at one point, but for now, he's regarded as high tier.

 

[Mythzotick]

Mid Tier characters just don't make top 8 at stacked tournaments consistently solo by more than 1 player; let alone 2nd at the biggest tournament in Smash 4 history as of now. Sure. You could make the argument that Kameme wouldn't have gotten as far at EVO if it wasn't for 2 of the best Shieks in the world SD'ing and EVO itself was probably the most mismanaged Smash 4 tournament ever as so many players that made it to Day 2 got no sleep because the scheduling was atrocious. Even so, he had to play with the same circumstances as everybody else did and the SD's weren't exactly free tickets to advance on in winners. He still had to earn his wins even with the unfortunate SD's that ended up benefiting him a lot. Even if we were to dismiss EVO, ScAtt finished 5th at the 3rd biggest Smash tournament up to date in Super Smash Con and Mr. R had a rematch with Kameme back at Umebura S.A.T. with more Mega Man match up experience on his side this time and he still got 2-0'd by Kameme WITHOUT SD'ing; that same tournament that Kameme could of taken.

Now as far as people overreacting to Mega Man's placement or overrating him, I can't help but notice that more people are either still saying that Mega Man is overrated/too high, Mega Man only gets the level and amount of success that he does because no one knows the match up, or are in denial that Mega Man is indeed a good character and is still low tier trash compared to those having a knee-jerk reaction just because he got 2nd at EVO. Sooner or later, people WILL KNOW the match up and it will no longer be an excuse if Mega Man continues to have success on an extremely high level.

As I've stated before on the future on Mega Man's status, I strongly believe that either Mega Man "could" some day in a couple years or more from now become a top 10 character, or he'll become irrelevant because of the low rep he has, the amount of effort and dedication it takes to play him, and the match up knowledge could wind up being extremely detrimental. Who knows how different the meta will be like in a year or two from now. It could very well not change at all. Only time knows how good Mega Man truly is compared to the rest of the cast and neither I or anyone else should give the blue bomber an entitled spot as a Top or High Tier character without having the toolkit, match up spread, and results to back it up. The character can't just have one fantastic month or year and call it a day. He has to evolve over the course of time and adapt to the meta. All I know and believe is that I look at what the character has to offer and what I see is a very complex puzzle that once is completed, it reveals something that you had no idea that something this powerful had ever existed.

Speaking of which, Mew2King tweeted out just a couple days ago that Mega Man could be top 10, but he said the same thing almost two years ago so it's hard to say if you can take his opinion seriously or not.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Mid Tier characters just don't make top 8 at stacked tournaments consistently solo by more than 1 player; let alone 2nd at the biggest tournament in Smash 4 history as of now. Sure. You could make the argument that Kameme wouldn't have gotten as far at EVO if it wasn't for 2 of the best Shieks in the world SD'ing and EVO itself was probably the most mismanaged Smash 4 tournament ever as so many players that made it to Day 2 got no sleep because the scheduling was atrocious. Even so, he had to play with the same circumstances as everybody else did and the SD's weren't exactly free tickets to advance on in winners. He still had to earn his wins even with the unfortunate SD's that ended up benefiting him a lot. Even if we were to dismiss EVO, ScAtt finished 5th at the 3rd biggest Smash tournament up to date in Super Smash Con and Mr. R had a rematch with Kameme back at Umebura S.A.T. with more Mega Man match up experience on his side this time and he still got 2-0'd by Kameme WITHOUT SD'ing; that same tournament that Kameme could of taken.

Now as far as people overreacting to Mega Man's placement or overrating him, I can't help but notice that more people are either still saying that Mega Man is overrated/too high, Mega Man only gets the level and amount of success that he does because no one knows the match up, or are in denial that Mega Man is indeed a good character and is still low tier trash compared to those having a knee-jerk reaction just because he got 2nd at EVO. Sooner or later, people WILL KNOW the match up and it will no longer be an excuse if Mega Man continues to have success on an extremely high level.

As I've stated before on the future on Mega Man's status, I strongly believe that either Mega Man "could" some day in a couple years or more from now become a top 10 character, or he'll become irrelevant because of the low rep he has, the amount of effort and dedication it takes to play him, and the match up knowledge could wind up being extremely detrimental. Who knows how different the meta will be like in a year or two from now. It could very well not change at all. Only time knows how good Mega Man truly is compared to the rest of the cast and neither I or anyone else should give the blue bomber an entitled spot as a Top or High Tier character without having the toolkit, match up spread, and results to back it up. The character can't just have one fantastic month or year and call it a day. He has to evolve over the course of time and adapt to the meta. All I know and believe is that I look at what the character has to offer and what I see is a very complex puzzle that once is completed, it reveals something that you had no idea that something this powerful had ever existed.

Speaking of which, Mew2King tweeted out just a couple days ago that Mega Man could be top 10, but he said the same thing almost two years ago so it's hard to say if you can take his opinion seriously or not.

People not knowing the MU can only get a character so far. With the explosion of popularity Megs got, people are going to learn the MU overtime. Now I don't know if that will hinder Megs, but I feel that if the top Megs reps and Megs players in general take the time to discover new things and learn him, then people knowing the MU won't be that big of a deal. Megs has a lot going for him, and one or two flaws that aren't to be taken lightly. Even if Megs becomes irrelevant, I'll still play him. I don't know, I just find not playing the character from my favorite video game franchise to be a personal betrayal, no matter where he is on the list.

Like all of us, Mew2King doesn't know where Smash 4 is headed. The meta in general saw a huge shift in the meta this summer, with the current meta preferring rushdown characters and zoners. While Megs may not be in the rushdown side, he is a zoner, and one of, if not the best in that category. While the meta may be like this now, who knows what it could be in the next month, 6 months, year, even 2 years? All I know is that no matter how the meta changes, we have to change with it. Like I said several months ago, we either adapt with the meta, or we fall.

 

[Megamang]

Beating Sonic and Diddy (or barely losing if you are extremely pessimistic) will make him relevant at any level. Even top level players of top tiers have secondaries now, i cant think of anyone that only plays one character.


Megaman has very powerful tools. Even if he ends up struggling in some MUs, he will always have competitive merit for the above mentioned matchups. Moving down to high tier, he still has some great coverage. Villlager and Ness hate him pretty badly.


In my opinion, he also beats Cloud, which is very nice. (If smashers had solid ground games theyd realize Cloud isnt a top tier, but meh).

Optimized sonic looks extremely problematic for a huge chunk of the cast. Not for mega. That alone makes him a worthy tool in a multiple character meta.


Oh, and he blows Ryu up, like, really badly.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Beating Sonic and Diddy (or barely losing if you are extremely pessimistic) will make him relevant at any level. Even top level players of top tiers have secondaries now, i cant think of anyone that only plays one character.


Megaman has very powerful tools. Even if he ends up struggling in some MUs, he will always have competitive merit for the above mentioned matchups. Moving down to high tier, he still has some great coverage. Villlager and Ness hate him pretty badly.


In my opinion, he also beats Cloud, which is very nice. (If smashers had solid ground games theyd realize Cloud isnt a top tier, but meh).

Optimized sonic looks extremely problematic for a huge chunk of the cast. Not for mega. That alone makes him a worthy tool in a multiple character meta.


Oh, and he blows Ryu up, like, really badly.

At this point, I'm starting to think Ryu's going through a falling out, minor or major I'm not quite sure. His results don't really speak for his position on the current tier list, and while he has a lot of potential, I'm seeing people question whether or not Ryu's going through the same fate as Roy. Remember when people thought Roy was really good? It didn't take long before people changed their minds about him. We could have been wrong about Ryu being a really amazing character, or maybe he has some hidden power we're just not seeing yet. Whatever the reason, Ryu's not getting the results he needs for his position on the tier list.

 

[Megamang]

Yea, Ryu's nuetral and disadvantage arent good enough for a top tier.

 

[Mythzotick]

Unless people discover new tech that allows Ryu to keep up in the cat & mouse game whenever he is not in the lead, gives him more range, makes his grab game threatening, or a recovery that's harder to exploit, he's going to continue to have some major hiccups. As of right now, he's not a top tier when his neutral and results at the highest level are underwhelming compared to the characters around his current official position.

Cloud is another character I could see maybe dropping even further as time goes by; even possibly fall out of top 10 because he has 2 or 3 big holes in his game plan that can easily be taken advantaged of (his ground game, grab game, and recovery). I'm not saying he will fall that low, but I do think it's fair to attach a ? on if he can maintain his status compared to Diddy or Shiek who will more than likely stay where they're at unless balance patches were to strike again.

 

[Megamang]

Yea. Diddy is always a hard MU because that grab is so damn good. Cloud MU would be easy, except landing vs the guy is ridiculous.


I got 4th at a local, only losing to the 1 seed! Double eliminated, but i took a game each time! Got lots of love for my megaman game, and a tiny bit of salt. Not relevant for big results, but i wanted to share my little victory. He played diddy and chu vs me, i was all mega the whole tournament (but im learning m2 for fox/mario/shiek)

 

[Knight Dude]

Anyone got a particular fan game they like? I heard good stuff about MM4 BCAS. Obviously the same goes for Mega Man Unlimited, which is apparently hard as hell.

 

[Tino]

I download the Mega Man Legacy Collection on my PS4 last night but I only played like 20 minutes of MM1 because I had to go to work. Definitely gonna replay that one and Mega Man 2 while also looking into Mega Man 3 through 6 soon after. And since I now have a Vita, I also plan to play the two Mega Man Legends games once I get the chance (I heard there was gonna be a third Legends game until it was ultimately cancelled). The Mega Man X games are also on my wishlist, which I plan to get the GameCube version of the X Collection, which is gonna prove to be a challenge since they're so hard to find, even on eBay.

With all that aside, I still got a long ways to go before I can consider myself worthy of playing as Mega Man again.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Anyone got a particular fan game they like? I heard good stuff about MM4 BCAS. Obviously the same goes for Mega Man Unlimited, which is apparently hard as hell.

Unlimited's pretty good for the most part. I'm not fond of some of the stage designs in the game (Trinitro Man and Jet Man in particular), but it's a really solid game. Thank god the check point system was fixed because that old check point system was just brutal.

I have two fan games I want to give some attention: Mega Man Rock Force and Mega Man: Super Fighting Robot.

Rock Force is a game that heavily benefitted from having an update. The original version suffered from not having your team members (the Rock Force) play a part in the game, times where sprites felt out of place, and the most poorly worded ending I've seen in a fan game. One update gave the Rock Force stuff to do in the levels, and the sprite art was fixed, but the poorly worded ending (along with the unnecessary dark tone) was still there. The second update came and fixed not only the ending, but added tons of new stuff. You can play as each member of the Rock Force after rescuing them. Do you know how much fun it is to wreck **** up as Elec Man or try to speed run a level with Nitro Man? It's pretty awesome.

Rock Force also implements a concept Mega Man 3 tried to do but didn't completely succeed at, and that's having extra stages to go through after beating the Robot Masters. Depending on who your last Robot Master is, you'll get one of two groups. You don't get any extra weapons, but it is pretty awesome to go through unique stages instead of harder variations of previous stages. I still like the Doc Robots BTW, lol.

As for Super Fighting Robot (and yes, that is what the game is called), it too is a really solid game. It hasn't gotten a major update yet, and probably won't, but it's a very good game regardless. One aspect I really like is that the game allows you to buy upgrades for Megs, kinda like the X series. Here though, they're optional, so you don't have to beat the game with them. What's the point of getting these? Well, what if I told you that Megs won't die from spikes in one hit? How about Megs being able to have stronger single shots and can slightly aim them? How about having very little knockback? Even better, but getting all the parts, how about not dying from bottomless pits? If you thought the Metal Blade was OP, check this stuff out.

If anyone has the time, check these games out. They're great, and shows how passionate the Mega Man fanbase is. They're so good that I consider them unofficial main games.

 

[Mythzotick]

I'm still hoping that Nintendo and Capcom will release the Mega Man Star Force series and the Mega Man ZX series on the virtual console, but I doubt either will happen. The Wii U virtual console feels really underwhelming to me since it hardly has any N64 games on it, no gamecube games (Twilight Princess does not count), and still no Square Enix NES or SNES rpg game except for Super Mario RPG. It's frustrating because you have 50+ games on the virtual console that no one cares about and yet you don't have the games that people want such as Final Fantasy 4, Final Fantasy 6, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Mario Kart 64, Super Smash Bros, Mario Party 1-3, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Star Fox SNES, Star Fox 64, etc.

Mega-Spider Well, since Capcom isn't doing anything video game related with the blue bomber that's actually NEW, I'll have to remember to check out some of the fan made games that you brought up whenever I get a new dedicated gaming pc since they do sound promising. It still makes me feel proud as a fellow fan of the series knowing that there are passionate and dedicated Mega Man fans out there that they themselves will go out there and make their own Mega Man game and will even spend as long as 5 years just to make a polished and well designed 8-bit Mega Man game that will probably take less than 2 hours to beat if you're good. Sometimes in the video game industry, fans>developers.

IIFC, wasn't Mega Man 3 suppose to have Rush transform into Rush Drill from Marvel vs Capcom, but they dropped the idea beacuse they thought that this would be extremely broken? Maybe one of the fan games that you mentioned can add that in a future update if they don't have that yet except maybe not make it broken; just make it a little op.

 

[CopShowGuy]

Anyone got a particular fan game they like? I heard good stuff about MM4 BCAS. Obviously the same goes for Mega Man Unlimited, which is apparently hard as hell.

Mega Man 8-Bit Deathmatch!

 

[Knight Dude]

Unlimited's pretty good for the most part. I'm not fond of some of the stage designs in the game (Trinitro Man and Jet Man in particular), but it's a really solid game. Thank god the check point system was fixed because that old check point system was just brutal.

I have two fan games I want to give some attention: Mega Man Rock Force and Mega Man: Super Fighting Robot.

Rock Force is a game that heavily benefitted from having an update. The original version suffered from not having your team members (the Rock Force) play a part in the game, times where sprites felt out of place, and the most poorly worded ending I've seen in a fan game. One update gave the Rock Force stuff to do in the levels, and the sprite art was fixed, but the poorly worded ending (along with the unnecessary dark tone) was still there. The second update came and fixed not only the ending, but added tons of new stuff. You can play as each member of the Rock Force after rescuing them. Do you know how much fun it is to wreck **** up as Elec Man or try to speed run a level with Nitro Man? It's pretty awesome.

Rock Force also implements a concept Mega Man 3 tried to do but didn't completely succeed at, and that's having extra stages to go through after beating the Robot Masters. Depending on who your last Robot Master is, you'll get one of two groups. You don't get any extra weapons, but it is pretty awesome to go through unique stages instead of harder variations of previous stages. I still like the Doc Robots BTW, lol.

As for Super Fighting Robot (and yes, that is what the game is called), it too is a really solid game. It hasn't gotten a major update yet, and probably won't, but it's a very good game regardless. One aspect I really like is that the game allows you to buy upgrades for Megs, kinda like the X series. Here though, they're optional, so you don't have to beat the game with them. What's the point of getting these? Well, what if I told you that Megs won't die from spikes in one hit? How about Megs being able to have stronger single shots and can slightly aim them? How about having very little knockback? Even better, but getting all the parts, how about not dying from bottomless pits? If you thought the Metal Blade was OP, check this stuff out.

If anyone has the time, check these games out. They're great, and shows how passionate the Mega Man fanbase is. They're so good that I consider them unofficial main games.

Ah, I heard good things about Super Fighting Robot. It had some good music too. Leaf Man in particular pops in mind. Though I didn't know it had that many cool upgrades. I'll try to keep that one in mind.

I'm still hoping that Nintendo and Capcom will release the Mega Man Star Force series and the Mega Man ZX series on the virtual console, but I doubt either will happen. The Wii U virtual console feels really underwhelming to me since it hardly has any N64 games on it, no gamecube games (Twilight Princess does not count), and still no Square Enix NES or SNES rpg game except for Super Mario RPG. It's frustrating because you have 50+ games on the virtual console that no one cares about and yet you don't have the games that people want such as Final Fantasy 4, Final Fantasy 6, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Mario Kart 64, Super Smash Bros, Mario Party 1-3, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Star Fox SNES, Star Fox 64, etc.

Mega-Spider Well, since Capcom isn't doing anything video game related with the blue bomber that's actually NEW, I'll have to remember to check out some of the fan made games that you brought up whenever I get a new dedicated gaming pc since they do sound promising. It still makes me feel proud as a fellow fan of the series knowing that there are passionate and dedicated Mega Man fans out there that they themselves will go out there and make their own Mega Man game and will even spend as long as 5 years just to make a polished and well designed 8-bit Mega Man game that will probably take less than 2 hours to beat if you're good. Sometimes in the video game industry, fans>developers.

IIFC, wasn't Mega Man 3 suppose to have Rush transform into Rush Drill from Marvel vs Capcom, but they dropped the idea beacuse they thought that this would be extremely broken? Maybe one of the fan games that you mentioned can add that in a future update if they don't have that yet except maybe not make it broken; just make it a little op.

I still think a Battle Network Collection is in order. It's the only other series that I think warrants a full collection like Classic, MMX and Zero. The other series don't have all that many games, so they might get looked over.

Not to mention, it should be on 3DS. Seeing as none of the MMBN games are on 3DS Virtual console. While the Zero collection and MM Legacy collection can be played on the 3DS.

Mario Party 1 isn't going to be on there because of the complains of damaging your hands during stick rotation games.

There should be a way to play ZX and Starforce as well.

By the way, do you know if there's a particular reason why Mega Man X4 and Mega Man Legends are only on PSN? Or why MMX1-MMX3 are only/mostly on Nintendo systems(to my knowledge)? X4-X6 had a Gamecube version, so shouldn't they be able to be ported over to multiple systems?

 

[Mega-Spider]

Knight Dude I'd love to see a Battle Network collection. It's my third favorite Mega Man series, with the Classic and Zero sections being my favorites. Battle Network 6 is in my Top 10 favorite Mega Man games for a reason. That game is amazing, if a little easy for being the final game in the series.

ZX and Star Force are pretty decent too. It's a damn shame that ZX Advent didn't get a sequel since I felt that the story was really going somewhere at the end with Master Thomas saying that the world has to be "reset" or something. Some say that the Star Force series should have continued, but I felt the third game was a serviceable finale to the series.

 

[Knight Dude]

Another fan game I've heard good things about is Mega Man Revenge of the Fallen. It has some crazy fight with Bass in it. Though you mostly fight a collection of Robot Masters already in the series. Some weapons are made more usable, like the Power Stone.

 

[Mega-Spider]

I'm still hoping that Nintendo and Capcom will release the Mega Man Star Force series and the Mega Man ZX series on the virtual console, but I doubt either will happen. The Wii U virtual console feels really underwhelming to me since it hardly has any N64 games on it, no gamecube games (Twilight Princess does not count), and still no Square Enix NES or SNES rpg game except for Super Mario RPG. It's frustrating because you have 50+ games on the virtual console that no one cares about and yet you don't have the games that people want such as Final Fantasy 4, Final Fantasy 6, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Mario Kart 64, Super Smash Bros, Mario Party 1-3, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Star Fox SNES, Star Fox 64, etc.

Mega-Spider Well, since Capcom isn't doing anything video game related with the blue bomber that's actually NEW, I'll have to remember to check out some of the fan made games that you brought up whenever I get a new dedicated gaming pc since they do sound promising. It still makes me feel proud as a fellow fan of the series knowing that there are passionate and dedicated Mega Man fans out there that they themselves will go out there and make their own Mega Man game and will even spend as long as 5 years just to make a polished and well designed 8-bit Mega Man game that will probably take less than 2 hours to beat if you're good. Sometimes in the video game industry, fans>developers.

IIFC, wasn't Mega Man 3 suppose to have Rush transform into Rush Drill from Marvel vs Capcom, but they dropped the idea beacuse they thought that this would be extremely broken? Maybe one of the fan games that you mentioned can add that in a future update if they don't have that yet except maybe not make it broken; just make it a little op.

Yet Rush Jet in MM3 was really easy to break. Funny how they tried to avoid making an OP Rush form, yet they made an OP Rush form anyway, lol.

When it comes to industry vs fans, the Mega Man series has shown to have seriously dedicated fans. I would love if Capcom did what SEGA's doing with Sonic Mania and allowing fans to make the game. So far, Sonic Mania looks amazing, and it's because these fans worked on the excellent remasters for Sonic 1, 2, and CD. Imagine how awesome it would be to have a version of Mega Man 2 where you could have the option to unlock the slide or Mega Buster charge shots after beating the game? Or even better, a version of Mega Man 6 that fixes the jump to slide hiccup. I wouldn't mind fans taking a shot at Mega Man games, especially since there have been a number of cases where the fans made a good game.

 

[Knight Dude]

Yet Rush Jet in MM3 was really easy to break. Funny how they tried to avoid making an OP Rush form, yet they made an OP Rush form anyway, lol.

When it comes to industry vs fans, the Mega Man series has shown to have seriously dedicated fans. I would love if Capcom did what SEGA's doing with Sonic Mania and allowing fans to make the game. So far, Sonic Mania looks amazing, and it's because these fans worked on the excellent remasters for Sonic 1, 2, and CD. Imagine how awesome it would be to have a version of Mega Man 2 where you could have the option to unlock the slide or Mega Buster charge shots after beating the game? Or even better, a version of Mega Man 6 that fixes the jump to slide hiccup. I wouldn't mind fans taking a shot at Mega Man games, especially since there have been a number of cases where the fans made a good game.

The closest we got with Mega Man was that MMxSF kind of "officially" released by Capcom. Which served an anniversary for both titles. But I get what you mean. It would be cool if something like that happened. Especially since fans had input on robot master designs.

 

[Mythzotick]

The closest we got with Mega Man was that MMxSF kind of "officially" released by Capcom. Which served an anniversary for both titles. But I get what you mean. It would be cool if something like that happened. Especially since fans had input on robot master designs.

Like Knight Man and Wind Man who are both from Mega Man 6.

 

[Mythzotick]

Words can not describe how salty I am after watching game 4 and 5 between Kameme and Salem. I am going to pretend that what just happened did not happen; particularly the later of the two.

It doesn't help either that Abadango pulled out a pocket Mega Man against ZeRo's Diddy Kong and got 3-0'd when he should of had game 1.

Sorry for double posting here, but I felt like I needed to get this off my chest.

Today has not been a good day at all for the blue bomber. ****ing needs an E-Tank or two.

 

[Mega-Spider]

Words can not describe how salty I am after watching game 4 and 5 between Kameme and Salem. I am going to pretend that what just happened did not happen; particularly the later of the two.

It doesn't help either that Abadango pulled out a pocket Mega Man against ZeRo's Diddy Kong and got 3-0'd when he should of had game 1.

Sorry for double posting here, but I felt like I needed to get this off my chest.

Today has not been a good day at all for the blue bomber. ****ing needs an E-Tank or two.

Such is the sad thing about fighting games. Sometimes your character gets the spotlight, sometimes they don't. Still, 13th place out of 777 people is still a good result, just not Kameme good. It happens to the best of us. I wouldn't get too hung up over it. There's still plenty of tournaments Kameme will participate in, and maybe he'll do better at this. Chin up.