Brawl model extractor

[Pharrox]

What VILE said. I just haven't had much time to work lately because of a combination of school and work.

 

[_Vuze_]

No problem =)
What is "soon"? Or can't you tell atm?

 

[mariokart64n]

wondering, will we be able to use spec maps? I know captain falcon uses spec maps for his suit

being able to use reflections, spec and bump maps would kickass

 

[thanyou]

With this tool, can we make props?

 

[Viquey]

Ah good to see this thread back at the top-ish. :D

Might someone using Blender be able to give me some tips on how to import the .dae files? That or could someone make a list/explanation of the features/capabilities/etc. Brawl can handle? Like, as mariokart up there asked, bump/spec maps, and how the eyes track and the faces animate and the hair and capes flow out behind them or blow in the wind, etc.

Spoiler

Hopefully these are TOO awfully n00bish questions.

 

[Pharrox]

Material and texture properties are the only things I haven't figured out yet. Most Brawl models just use a standard lambert material with no special maps, so at least at first this is all it will support. As a result of this, I would recommend changing character eye yellow textures to match their regular eye. Otherwise they will look kinda glitchy.

If anyone wants to help make a list of models that have special properties it would be greatly appreciated. The only one I can think of off the top of my head is that I'm pretty sure Bowser's spikes use spec maps as well.

 

[mariokart64n]

are the materials specified all together in their own block, then indexed by the each element? or is it defined along with the model data?

if it was a separate block that be easy to compare between small items, or props as an example.. etc..

 

[DevilKiller]

I have no idea what spec maps are, but I get the impression that they have to do with unique models and how they react to the environment. Like shiny armour or hair. I hope shiny armour is a model thing and not texture.

Otherwise, allow this noob to ramble off his list of weird model properties. I have no idea if this is what you mean, but meh, I'll bring it up. If not, I can edit/delete this post:

Diddy Kong: Tail, seperate hat, and fur. (not as much as a problem as DK, probably)
Donkey Kong: Tie and fur.
Falco: Mechanical gadgets (Reflector, blaster)
Fox: View Falco, tail.
Ganondorf: Cape.
Ice Climbers: Parka fur, hammers?
Ike: Cape, hair (reacts to wind), shiny sword?
Jigglypuff: ??? (Eyes?)
King Dedede: Hammer
Kirby: LOL NOTHING...except for the 34 other hats.
Link: All availible weaponry, shield, hat, hair, tunic?
Lucario: Not much.
Lucas: Not much either. Hair?
Luigi: -
Mario: -
Marth: Good ol' cape and hair.
Meta Knight: Shiny armour, wings?
Mr. Game and Watch: -
Ness: -
Olimar: - (Pikmin count?)
Peach: Dress, reflective shoes?
Pikachu: -
Pit: -
Pokemon Trainer - I'm not gonna even try.
Samus: Shiny spec maps all over the place.
Snake: -
Sonic: Might have spec maps?
Toon Link: Weaponry.
Wario: Bike?

 

[stickman]

Ah good to see this thread back at the top-ish. :D

Might someone using Blender be able to give me some tips on how to import the .dae files? That or could someone make a list/explanation of the features/capabilities/etc. Brawl can handle? Like, as mariokart up there asked, bump/spec maps, and how the eyes track and the faces animate and the hair and capes flow out behind them or blow in the wind, etc.

Spoiler

Hopefully these are TOO awfully n00bish questions.

make sure you have the pythonpath set up and then in the COLLADA 1.4 plugin, make sure the settings look the same as in 0:29 of this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGtVsZdU6DQ

But I haven't been able to get a model from Pharrox's last converter to work with Blender (after opening it in MeshLab, it only has vertices)

 

[windwakr]

Sorry if this has been talked about before, but I'm not about to go through 97 pages to look for an answer. I'm trying to extract pits model out of fitpit00.pac. I got the model out and in dae format, but in blender it looks like a jumbled mess. What is wrong?

 

[Viquey]

@Stickman: ah thanks! Okay, so I DID get all that right. Still get an "importing failed; check console" kind of error. Console says, "ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: 'd'" :/ This is why I stick to the creative/artistic side of things.

 

[mariokart64n]

there's not much point in extracting player models.... especially with blender.. just not gonna happen

 

[Pharrox]

Coding sucks

 

[Viquey]

@mariokart64n: maybe, but I need to see the settings and such as translated into Blender. Like Zamus' hair and Marth's cape--what makes them blow out behind them when they run, or fly up when they're falling or standing over a vent a la PS2's wind transformation? That's the kinda thing I need to know.

@Pharrox: D:

 

[Finman702]

Coding sucks

You're my hero.

 

[E-Jolteon]

there's not much point in extracting player models.... especially with blender.. just not gonna happen

Actually, I'm using to make new CSPs for characters.

Also, long time no see, lol.

 

[HSX]

Sonic: Might have spec maps?

Would that pink glow be considered a Spec. map to you or is that just magic? >

Also you forgot his quills, and his spinball has a shine on it.

 

[_Vuze_]

@Pharrox: You are my hero as well! Don't give up!

 

[Pharrox]

I've put way too much time into this to give up at this point.

 

[_Vuze_]

Sure, sure. Just wanted to "encourage" you to continue your work lol ^^"

 

[E-Jolteon]

I've put way too much time into this to give up at this point.

I love your outlook on this and your commitment, seriously, man. But the real test is making a program stable enough for a release. Good luck.

 

[Deleted member]

With all this talk on importing our own models, has anyone thought about cracking the animations file format, so our imported models can move? Having your model look like something else won't be so special if the model stays in a T-pose the entire time.

 

[Shadic]

He's already mentioned that, actually. And he'll have it in sometime after the first release.

 

[Finman702]

With all this talk on importing our own models, has anyone thought about cracking the animations file format, so our imported models can move? Having your model look like something else won't be so special if the model stays in a T-pose the entire time.

If you were following the the thread, or maybe used the search funstion, you would know the answer...
In short you can rig a model to someone elses bones and they will have the characters animations that you replaced. I think Pharrox is going to work on animations a little later, someone correct me if I am mistaken on anything.

 

[mariokart64n]

@mariokart64n: maybe, but I need to see the settings and such as translated into Blender. Like Zamus' hair and Marth's cape--what makes them blow out behind them when they run, or fly up when they're falling or standing over a vent a la PS2's wind transformation? That's the kinda thing I need to know.

it's like opening pandora's box and finding a shiny rock.
..not much you can do with it until you have the tools to refine that rock into something useful. otherwise it's just a shiny paperweight

when you import a model, there are no settings. "you" have to make new settings to mimic or recreate "moving hair or cape"

but it's basics of 3d. you have the mesh and the skeleton, the mesh is then skinned to the skeleton. the skeleton is a matrix of simple nodes that can be easily recorded in series to form an animation sequence without consuming a mass of memory. when skin is active, the mesh follows the recorded movements of the skeleton.. and thus you have moving parts..

getting more complicated, you can involve physics in where you can have a second set of primitives assigned to your skeleton which will react to environment settings such as wind.. gravity.... etc.. there are many way to setup physics, and alot of ways people try to optimize it for various physics engines...but thats how the cape and hair would move.. environmental forces react to the collision model causing such effects.

 

[Red-Blue]

I remember the first time Pharrox posted that Black Pikachu image.


Memoriiiies.

 

[Deleted member]

If you were following the the thread, or maybe used the search funstion, you would know the answer...
In short you can rig a model to someone elses bones and they will have the characters animations that you replaced. I think Pharrox is going to work on animations a little later, someone correct me if I am mistaken on anything.

I see, I apologize for my ignorance. With that answered, I am looking forward to a bright future of new Smash Brothers characters. This is quite amazing. I don't think I've ever seen a console game get this much attention in hacking and modding.

 

[Awesome Turtwig]

So where are character's models located. They aren't those brres files I don't think. Those are trophies.

___________________
All my brawl hack videos: http://youtube.com/user/bleamix

 

[GadgetTR]

The character models are stored inside the .PAC files along with the textures (and yes, there's a separate model for every costume).

 

[DevilKiller]

getting more complicated, you can involve physics in where you can have a second set of primitives assigned to your skeleton which will react to environment settings such as wind.. gravity.... etc.. there are many way to setup physics, and alot of ways people try to optimize it for various physics engines...but thats how the cape and hair would move.. environmental forces react to the collision model causing such effects.

That's a good explanation, I'm starting to understand models in general.

Don't answer this question if it was a waste of time to you. Purely hypothetical.

Out of curiosity, can different model parts be moved around? (vague question, eh? I'll give an example)

Let's say a die-hard fan wants to create Sephiroth with a Marth base...but the hair. That long, shiny, physics-defying hair keeps getting in the way. And Sephiroth doesn't use a cape either.

Let's kill two birds with one stone. Can the cape be moved to a different place besides behind the neck? Attached to the arm? (looking glitchy of course) Maybe just attached three meters above his head? Or maybe even at his head?

Basically, I would move the cape up to the head, reduce the size, texture hack it to look like hair, and voila: long hair. But is that possible? To cape or not to cape, that is the question.

Another example: a character that uses a weapon. Can that weapon be moved out of the character's hand and made to float in front of them? It would follow the same animations still.

 

[DarkDragoon]

That's a good explanation, I'm starting to understand models in general.

Don't answer this question if it was a waste of time to you. Purely hypothetical.

Out of curiosity, can different model parts be moved around? (vague question, eh? I'll give an example)

Let's say a die-hard fan wants to create Sephiroth with a Marth base...but the hair. That long, shiny, physics-defying hair keeps getting in the way. And Sephiroth doesn't use a cape either.

Let's kill two birds with one stone. Can the cape be moved to a different place besides behind the neck? Attached to the arm? (looking glitchy of course) Maybe just attached three meters above his head? Or maybe even at his head?

Basically, I would move the cape up to the head, reduce the size, texture hack it to look like hair, and voila: long hair. But is that possible? To cape or not to cape, that is the question.

Another example: a character that uses a weapon. Can that weapon be moved out of the character's hand and made to float in front of them? It would follow the same animations still.

Probably not.
-DD

 

[...:::VILE:::...]

DD you are wrong, that is possible, but you still have to rig the character. Every model hack requires the character to be rigged.

 

[HSX]

Another example: a character that uses a weapon. Can that weapon be moved out of the character's hand and made to float in front of them? It would follow the same animations still.

*coughmewtwocough*

I just was playing Melee and was wondering if something like this is possible. Phantom Whings ought to know, though, considering he edited the MOVESET parts of Brawl...

EDIT: I'm talking about weapons you can grab.

 

[DevilKiller]

I should have said this eariler, but basically, do body parts/weapons/items have to be attached to the model? The few answers here seem to be yes, but this is hypothetical, and certainly not the main goal of Pharrox. Maybe for the Mewtwo thread, but not here. Thank you to the few people who have answered.

And HSX, you reminded me of a question I wanted to ask eariler. Is the model extractor solely characters, or are items, stage hazards, and SSE enemies fair game too?

 

[mariokart64n]

@DevilKiller i'm not sure of the status of animation extraction and injection. therefore it can be assumed that we are unable to adjust the animations of the characters. we must accept the fact that we cannot modify the character skeleton, or animations yet.

so when planning a mod we have to factor in that we must conform our model to a suitable brawl character with a reasonable skeleton structure and animations.
(rigging is important aswell, but an after fact when planning)

marth being seth for example. the long hair... you can't move the cape to his head, because the animations will force any skeleton changes back. so you'll have to compromise with things, and understand that perfect character replacement won't be possible..

..but you never know, maybe Pharrox will get the animation stuff programed into the program at one point. although this will likely be a while down the road.

 

[Viquey]

it's like opening pandora's box and finding a shiny rock.
..not much you can do with it until you have the tools to refine that rock into something useful. otherwise it's just a shiny paperweight

when you import a model, there are no settings. "you" have to make new settings to mimic or recreate "moving hair or cape"

but it's basics of 3d. you have the mesh and the skeleton, the mesh is then skinned to the skeleton. the skeleton is a matrix of simple nodes that can be easily recorded in series to form an animation sequence without consuming a mass of memory. when skin is active, the mesh follows the recorded movements of the skeleton.. and thus you have moving parts..

getting more complicated, you can involve physics in where you can have a second set of primitives assigned to your skeleton which will react to environment settings such as wind.. gravity.... etc.. there are many way to setup physics, and alot of ways people try to optimize it for various physics engines...but thats how the cape and hair would move.. environmental forces react to the collision model causing such effects.

Er, yes, I know all that. What I'm asking is how to setup the physics/optimize it for Brawl. But since I can't get any of the extracted models to import and thus look at the hair and capes to see if they have bones or some sort of modifier or something else entirely, I guess it'll just be some trial and error when the time comes.

But that'll be a while. I'm making my own animations and everything, so by the time I'm done with those Pharrox will probably have animations hacked as well (if what everyone's saying about that not being in the first release but probably soon thereafter is true).

 

[...:::VILE:::...]

Viquey, you will need the exact bone set brawl uses for each character.

 

[Tiberious]

Has there been any update on possibly updating the extractor only? I'd love to be able to add the missing three characters to my DAE collection.

 

[_Vuze_]

Now, as we are heading to page 100, is there any new news?

 

[Pharrox]

Not much.

Brawl formats have been converted. Debugging MDL0/PLT0/TEX0 output now.