Brawl Bowser or Melee Bowser?

[TakDragon7]

Which one do you think is the better Bowser? Brawl or Melee Bowser? It's kinda hard for me to choose because Bowser in melee was pretty good. Yeah, he can get hit a lot and whatnot but you make a comeback. =D

Brawl Bowser has some good moves and has improved. Still wish that he had his Koopa Klaw but his new side-B is fun to use.

 

[superman969]

I dunno, I never really mained either but I'm starting to get good with Brawl Bowser. Melee Bowser seems like he was better in the air, and Gimpy's already established (and I agree) that Brawl Bowser's better on the ground.

 

[isidro]

i'd have to say brawl bowser, i like his firebreath also side B comes in handy sometimes when both players have 1 life left and you are at higher damage just grab them and jump off lol

 

[KevinM]

The level of stupidity in this thread can keep going it amuses me

Melee Bowser > Brawl Bowser but both of them are bad.

 

[cHooKay]

The level of stupidity in this thread can keep going it amuses me

Melee Bowser > Brawl Bowser but both of them are bad.

Okay, so maybe this thread might be completely stupid, and I'm not stating that it is. But that statement you made about bowser has got to be the most stupidest remark I've ever read in my life. Where is your relevance to your statement, you need to support your facts, especially if your user name has the word "DEBATE" below it. Don't contradict yourself..


Anyways, brawl bowser is more versatile than he was in melee. And the fact that he is more adapt to fight on the ground makes him better because it gives him more opportunities to either break combos or counter attacks effectively. Melee bowser was definitely better in the air though, especially with L-canceling his fair attack. Loved pissing off people with his old fair

 

[St. Viers]

yo Kev, wanna explain that? I agree that neither are good characters, but I feel that brawl's bowser has a greater chance of winning...

 

[KevinM]

Okay, so may this thread may be completely stupid, and I'm not stating that it is. But that statement you made about bowser has got to be the most stupidest remark I've ever read in my life. Where is your relevance to your statement, you need to support your facts, especially if your user name has the word "DEBATE" below it. Don't contradict yourself..


Anyways, brawl bowser is more versatile than he was in melee. And the fact that he is more adapt to fight on the ground makes him better because it gives him more opportunities to either break combos or counter attacks effectively. Melee bowser was definitely better in the air though, especially with L-canceling his fair attack. Loved pissing off people with his old fair

Who the hell are you to come at me like that? I guess I'll respond to your entire post just because you're an idiot.

Point One, using the fact that i'm a member of the debate hall to say i should post facts behind a Brawl Bowser post shows your ignorance to the boards, I don't have to adhere to the highest quality standards of posting every time my fingers hit the keyboard. Sorry you're offended that I know more about Bowser and as such laughed that the original poster would say Bowser was anything more then absolute garbage in Melee. Unfortunately for him, with the new game being based on stuff you can do out of your shield, he's even worse in brawl.

By taking what little combo ability and air spacing Bowser had in Melee and eliminating in with the new physics engine in Brawl, you limit his approaching options. Sure Bowser's new Side B is cool, but it doesn't have the priority to compete with the higher tier characters now.

Basically Bowser what from Useless to Useless, but i'd prefer in melee where he could win a match occasionally against a competent player. I haven't lost to a bowser player yet going Snake/Meta/D3 and i never plan on it. I am willing to put any money out on the table for those of you that think he can compete on a competitive level in brawl.

As for you Chookay, a little respect would be nice, since i've earned my respect in this community and frankly i've never heard of you.

 

[Pustulio]

Guys you need to respect the more experienced members. KevinM has been around here a long time and I have to say he knows Bowser inside and out and truth be told, in all actuality the top tier characters happen to be the ones that are gonna' win on the extremely competitive circuit. As much as I love Bowser I don't think we'll see many Bowsers in the MLG finals. It's gonna' be the characters like Marth, Fox, Wolf and I'm thinking G&W is pretty awesome in Brawl too.

 

[Gimpyfish62]

Who the hell are you to come at me like that?

As for you Chookay, a little respect would be nice, since i've earned my respect in this community and frankly i've never heard of you.

cccccccccccaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ddddddddddddddooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

and hi bowser boards, i play bowser again.

 

[cHooKay]

The level of stupidity in this thread can keep going it amuses me

Melee Bowser > Brawl Bowser but both of them are bad.

What you've typed pretty much sums it up right here.

Dude you've insulted this thread as well as the members who contributed to it, and yet you ask for respect?

I've wouldn't even consider typing what I did if you've at least didn't do that, or supported your previous statement, you can't ask for respect or expect to be respected if you don't give it back, what I typed was just your regular humanily reaction since I don't know you, and that post that I quoted within this one is the very first post I've read from you. I mean I don't know how you play, you could be "god like" for all I know in smash, but that doesn't excuse you for comming off rude... Also, that comment was extremely blunt, the only thing you've stated about bowser is that melee bowser > brawl bowser, there was no facts within that post..

With that stated, I've never been within smashboards before, the main reason as to why I joined is because of brawls wifi; battling people online exchanging friend codes was my main goal, while getting the perks of discussing smash at the same time. I'm no noob in terms of smash, don't let the fact that I've never been in smashboards before confuse anyone of you guys. In addition, I know I'm not the greatest player, so I do respect players that are better than me, as well as the ones that I know I'm better than. What breaks that respect are the things people do, like when other people insult others without an intregal excuse to insult others.

Lastly, I am sorry if my post came off a bit harsh within my post, and I do appreciate the fact that you've backed up your accusation with facts (a little harsh on the eyes though). Just calm down a little bro (thanks for trying Gimpyfish), didn't mean to insult your credibility as a smash pro. I should've typed a more friendly post to avoid this confrontation over the net, my post was rude, two wrongs don't make a right. I mean, even though your post was a bit rude too ("The level of stupidity in this thread can keep going it amuses me"- KevM) I didn't have to do the same thing. Sorry...

 

[Dan_X]

My take on bowser..

What you've typed pretty much sums it up right here.

Dude you've insulted this thread as well as the members who contributed to it, and yet you ask for respect?

I've wouldn't even consider typing what I did if you've at least didn't do that, or supported your previous statement, you can't ask for respect or expect to be respected if you don't give it back, what I typed was just your regular humanily reaction since the first post you've typed was the post that I quoted within this current one. I mean I don't know how you play, you could be "god like" for all I know in smash, but that doesn't excuse you for comming off rude... Also, that comment was extremely blunt, the only thing you've stated about bowser is that melee bowser > brawl bowser, there was no facts within that post..

With that stated, I've never been within smashboards before, the main reason as to why I joined is because of brawls wifi; battling people online exchanging friend codes was my main goal, while getting the perks of discussing smash at the same time. I'm no noob in terms of smash, don't let the fact that I've never been in smashboards before confuse anyone of you guys. In addition, I know I'm not the greatest player, so I do respect players that are better than me, as well as the ones that I know I'm better than. What breaks that respect are the things people do, like when other people insult others without an intregal excuse to insult others.

Lastly, I am sorry if my post came off a bit harsh within my post, and I do appreciate the fact that you've backed up your accusation with facts (a little harsh on the eyes though). Just calm down a little bro (thanks for trying Gimphyfish), didn't mean to insult your credibility as a smash pro. I should've typed a more friendly post to avoid this confrontation over the net, my post was rude, two wrongs don't make a right. I mean, even though your post was a bit rude too ("The level of stupidity in this thread can keep going it amuses me"- KevM) I didn't have to do the same thing. Sorry...

Well put.

Getting back to the topic, I'm honestly not sure what I think. All in all, I'd have to say Melee Bowser, though not because of the character, because of the engine. L canceling made an otherwise laggy character quick, and deadly at that. People like Gimpyfish have fronted that. I do however think he is a better character in Brawl, more interesting, and maybe even more versatile. His side b was awesome in Melee, but his new Boswerside in Brawl is actually quite interesting. Once you get good with Bowser, you can get really good at pulling this move off, and as such, you can gimp your enemy when you're a life ahead. In addition, I'd have to say that claw-hopping is pretty nice, as it adds to his versatility... it makes him a smidgen less predictable. It also acts as a great way to follow up with a Bowesercide.

Beyond that however, I can't deny the truth. I've never been an utterly experienced Bowser player. I don't truly know if his new iteration is better or not than his old. I guess I'd have to say people like Gimpy would have to be the judge of that.

Sorry I brought up your name so often Gimp, but I don't know any other iconic players who play Bowser aside from you :D

 

[-Kagato-]

Why the hell are people arguing like this? Ugh....

Brawl Bowser vs Melee Bowser? It all depends on the player. Some people prefer melee Bowser, some people prefer Brawl Bowser. I prefer Brawl Bowser, myself. He flows a little better for me and I've trained him to be a much more competitive Bowser than I ever thought possible. The beauty of it is, he's getting better. I feel sorry that many people believe the Brawl Bowser isn't good, but everyone has their own opinions. There are lots of characters in this game that I think are terrible that the majority of people think are great.

It's far too early to rule anyone out right now, so I'll wait a few more months before I pass judgement on any character. Especially my competitive main: Bowser.

and hi bowser boards, i play bowser again.

Oh. How nice of you to return.

 

[cHooKay]

Why the hell are people arguing like this? Ugh....

Brawl Bowser vs Melee Bowser? It all depends on the player. Some people prefer melee Bowser, some people prefer Brawl Bowser. I prefer Brawl Bowser, myself. He flows a little better for me and I've trained him to be a much more competitive Bowser than I ever thought possible. The beauty of it is, he's getting better. I feel sorry that many people believe the Brawl Bowser isn't good, but everyone has their own opinions. There are lots of characters in this game that I think are terrible that the majority of people think are great.

It's far too early to rule anyone out right now, so I'll wait a few more months before I pass judgement on any character. Especially my competitive main: Bowser.



Oh. How nice of you to return.

Dude calm down, besides what happened with me and KevinM, every is mellow here. Its just a safe thread for a safe discussion of a safe comparison between both bowsers. Don't blow a fuse bro, this thread was probably made to acquire opinions as to what people think of bowser as of right now, nothing wrong with that....

 

[apmpnmdslkbk]

Actually there is way to much wrong with that. Make money not war.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Bleh, I don't believe some of this stuff yet.

By taking what little combo ability and air spacing Bowser had in Melee and eliminating in with the new physics engine in Brawl, you limit his approaching options. Sure Bowser's new Side B is cool, but it doesn't have the priority to compete with the higher tier characters now.

WTF at this, because most characters can't combo reliably at all thanks to the new air dodge and hitstun system. Getting the most out of one hit matters more.

The thing about the Side B is that you use it to punish shielding, and it does this better than ever because it is so lagless. The infinite midair jump glitch gives Bowser the ability to retreat effectively if he misses. Okay seriously, let's look at this. Bowser is a character that can grab from the air, and have great mobility options while he's grabbing.

His ground based attacks also generally have too much range for him to be punished out of shield easily (unless that's Marth's Up-B. D=).

Yeah the guys on top are seriously getting broken. What is everyone else supposed to do about them that Bowser can't? Most characters don't have the grab and spacing options Bowser has, and in case anyone forgot, Bowser can still reliably fortressshield, which gives him more viable out of shield options than a lot of characters.

Basically Bowser what from Useless to Useless, but i'd prefer in melee where he could win a match occasionally against a competent player. I haven't lost to a bowser player yet going Snake/Meta/D3 and i never plan on it. I am willing to put any money out on the table for those of you that think he can compete on a competitive level in brawl.

I'm not gonna argue that Bowser probably isn't good enough to beat out Snake and Metaknight. D3 I don't trust that yet, but can't exactly argue right now. But seriously where is the incredible flaw in Bowser? I largely disagree that Bowser's approach options are horrible, and that the lack of combos on Bowser kills his previously horrible metagame when it doesn't take into account how so many characters lost out much more due to the physics engine.

 

[TakDragon7]

Bowser isn't really that perfect, I know that. Like Lord Kagoto said, he's getting better. Just takes time and patience while using Bowser.

Weba, Gimpy! =D

 

[KevinM]

A2 you proved my point, what is bowser supposed to do against the top tiers you ask?

Lose, hence I like Melee Bowser better.

It's really not that hard of a decision for me.

 

[platomaker]

i play and like bowser in brawl better, in melee you had to l-cancel and wavedash to play the "RIGHT" way. In brawl its a little more free so long you're not fighting against spammers. besides he's good for counter picks.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I completely respect your decision to prefer Melee Bowser over Brawl Bowser, but that wasn't exactly what I was getting at.

As far as I'm concerned KevinM, all this proves is that Bowser has bad matchups against the top tiers and gets particularly countered by them. I am not seeing this take into account the efficiency of other characters if the final judgment is that you're going to say Bowser is simply worse. Not saying this is exactly the case, but what if Bowser actually squares off close to evenly with great characters on the high tier?

What also must be decided is how overall good characters like Snake, Metaknight, G&W, Marth, etc are. Do other lower tier characters truly get better matchups than Bowser, or do they simply just get flat out destroyed because those characters are just stupidly good (and at this point, I'm seeing a lot of the latter).

 

[Roller]

Brawl bowser FTW!

 

[Pustulio]

I prefer Brawl Bowser to Melee Bowser but that's because I didn't use Melee Bowser.

It's not that he's entirely useless it's just that he will be lower tier. If you have to people of equal skill, one uses oh let's say Marth who will likely be top tier and the other uses Bowser, who wins? Answer: Marth player.

I agree with Kevin but I'm not gonna' bash him I mean I like using him, he isn't my main anymore but I do like using him.

 

[St. Viers]

PEOPLE:

KevinM > than all of you. He's also probably a better brawl bowser than all of you. He's entitled to his opinion, which is based on his reaction towards certain facts about brawl. It's true that Bowser's hard matchups are even harder to win than they were in melee.

Ao chill, and hive him respect. He's earned it, even if he;s being mean and hurting your booser pride. Suck it up and stop being stupid !

 

[Grandeza]

I like brawl bowser more just because I never played melee bowser. I respect kevinM's opinion just because he's proved his worth way more than I have and is probably 30x better than me at brawl bowser.

 

[Okesoke]

KevinM kicked my Luigi's butt in SSBM when i was fairly new with him :/ Kevin lets play Brawl next thursday! this time i swear i wont rely on stoners 2 get the pizza lol

 

[MiraiGen]

In both games he was more fun than competition worthy.

I prefer Brawl. The new Koopa Klaw does more damage and the mechanics work better. He's still pretty bad though.

 

[Silfa]

PEOPLE:

KevinM > than all of you. He's also probably a better brawl bowser than all of you. He's entitled to his opinion, which is based on his reaction towards certain facts about brawl. It's true that Bowser's hard matchups are even harder to win than they were in melee.

Ao chill, and hive him respect. He's earned it, even if he;s being mean and hurting your booser pride. Suck it up and stop being stupid !

He's entitled to his opinion, sure, but if he says something that offends another member, they're entitled to theirs too.

 

[MiraiGen]

I think you can pretty much throw his "You need to respect me" out the window after he basically insults the entire thread, everyone who posts in it, provides no reason why he thinks it's all stupid, acts 'above it all' by saying it 'amuses' him, and then completely and utterly ignores any attempt to call out his needlessly inflammatory comments. I mean it's one thing to basically say "Both suck, but new Bowser sucks less." It's quite another to say "The stupidity of this thread amuses me", which is exactly what he said without any cause or reason. Also, seriously, post count, signup date, and whatever color his name is (Except mods and such) doesn't matter for beans once he comes out flinging insults left and right.

But, anyway.

Brawl Bowser isn't that much different from Melee Bowser - really the removal of SHFFLing was what killed him. Bowser's Fair tossed out nice and fast with little lag made him at least competent. Nowadays he can't do it since he receives out-and-out lag for everything, and nothing he has really justifies the kind of lag he's got.

Well cept for the Fsmash. But good luck hitting with it.

 

[Mike35]

I prefer Brawl Bowser. I love the new Koopa Claw, and I think the new Brawl mechanics suit him better. I've had more success with him in Brawl than I did in Melee from what I've played so far.

Anyway, about this "respect" debate. IMO the way to get people to respect you is to act respectful to begin with. If you start insulting and disrespecting others, people will turn around and treat you the same way. It seems completely pointless to insult the people in this thread for giving their opinions, and then be all surprised that someone would show you the same level of respect you showed others in return.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Unlike in Melee, I don't do a lot of smash attacks with Brawl Bowser. In fact, most of the moves that I use with him are tilts and his Flying Slam.

 

[Dizzynecro]

i prefer mario kart 64 bowser

 

[TakDragon7]

PEOPLE:

KevinM > than all of you. He's also probably a better brawl bowser than all of you. He's entitled to his opinion, which is based on his reaction towards certain facts about brawl. It's true that Bowser's hard matchups are even harder to win than they were in melee.

Ao chill, and hive him respect. He's earned it, even if he;s being mean and hurting your booser pride. Suck it up and stop being stupid !

What are you nubz talking about? You guys act like KevinM is a god but he isn't. He's an average normal human being like us. You are the one who's getting hurt, not us. We tend to ignore nubz like you. Enough said...

 

[Kewkky]

I havent played much against brawl's bowser... So much less that I can't remember how his side-B works like. So, I'm gonna go with melee. I met someone in a tournament who used to use him, Mewtwo and G&W back in the Melee days, and he was very, very good.

 

[MiraiGen]

You know how Koopa Klaw (Side B) used to slash the air and if it didn't grab, it would hit? They took that out but made the grab aspect way better by making it a different grab that does like 15% and up.

Problem is they shortened the range. Instead of "At best, grab, at worst, hit" it become "At best grab, at worst miss and get hit."

 

[Gimpyfish62]

klaw is tooooo fast to get punished for hahaha

i miss my old klaw, and my old bowser, but i'll make due i guess...

 

[Fatalized]

Brawl bowser is fun to use with his Foward B in the air.
When someone is in the air gimping is the way to go. lol Suicidle tho

 

[Roller]

Brawl bowser makes me happy

 

[chili]

Brawl bowser, without a doubt.

Although I do like the melee fortress much better than the brawl version.

 

[KevinM]

Thanks Viers but its true i'm a **** *shrugs*

I mean well though so get over it guys

I love my Bowser bros <3

Oke, i'd definitely like to come by but can we play Melee too <_< hah

 

[Roller]

This is stupid...Brawl is obv better, what is the point in this...

 

[KevinM]

See it's dumb people like you that make me hate brawl.