Social Bowser's Castle

[Trieste SP]

Went Bowser on FG the other day but my goodness he gets comboed for days. I haven't played Bowser in a while so maybe it's just because I'm rusty but he really struggles in some matchups.

I'm not saying Bowser is a bad character. It's just difficult to win in certain matchups.

 

[Cassius.]

That's what happens when you're not playing the best character(s) in the game.

 

[S_B]

Was playing a Link player in FG yesterday and something awesome happened...

He had pulled out a bomb when I caught him with grounded fortress. It launched him high in the air. That's when the bomb exploded and screen KOed him off the top of the screen.

 

[B!squick]

I didn't play FG yesterday. It was a good day.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Went Bowser on FG the other day but my goodness he gets comboed for days. I haven't played Bowser in a while so maybe it's just because I'm rusty but he really struggles in some matchups.

I'm not saying Bowser is a bad character. It's just difficult to win in certain matchups.

Bowser is one of those characters that demands patience. Sometimes it'll pay off, sometimes it won't.

That time I mentioned playing locally with a friend against his Fox, that was an MU to be really patient in. Still won, though.

 

[Shök]

Bowser is one of those characters that demands patience. Sometimes it'll pay off, sometimes it won't.

That time I mentioned playing locally with a friend against his Fox, that was an MU to be really patient in. Still won, though.

Reminds me of the Falcon MU.

 

[S_B]

I didn't play FG yesterday. It was a good day.

FG's fine, so long as you don't come up against any giant a-holes (which I've never had happen).

For many, FG is the only 1v1 practice they're going to get due to isolation. And let's not forget that wifi on the Wii us what brought Salem into the tournament scene so it's definitely possible to get good on FG.

 

[Cassius.]

Well, the issue with that argument is that Brawl WiFi actually gave you a choice in who you added. You had active control in the type of players you played against, whereas For Glory now is just a random match-making system.

I would say it's obviously possible to get good through Smash 4 WiFi, but if you're constantly playing ONLY on For Glory, I wouldn't make that same statement. The caliber of players is too much of a coin toss between hit/miss for things to be consistent. I would be better off just going to a Smash site like here or NintendoDojo or something like that for consistent mid-high level online practice.

 

[S_B]

Well, the issue with that argument is that Brawl WiFi actually gave you a choice in who you added. You had active control in the type of players you played against, whereas For Glory now is just a random match-making system.

I would say it's obviously possible to get good through Smash 4 WiFi, but if you're constantly playing ONLY on For Glory, I wouldn't make that same statement. The caliber of players is too much of a coin toss between hit/miss for things to be consistent. I would be better off just going to a Smash site like here or NintendoDojo or something like that for consistent mid-high level online practice.

It helps to play FG then send friend requests to people who challenge you. Think of it like speed dating.

I've found some great sports who are likewise awesome at the game that way.

 

[Zigsta]

Shameless plug, fellas: DreamWorks Animation's latest film, Home, is out today in the US. My name's deep in the credits under post production.

 

[Jerodak]

@ Zigsta Congratulations!

 

[LIQUID12A]

Shameless plug, fellas: DreamWorks Animation's latest film, Home, is out today in the US. My name's deep in the credits under post production.

You serious?

 

[S_B]

Shameless plug, fellas: DreamWorks Animation's latest film, Home, is out today in the US. My name's deep in the credits under post production.

Grats again, man.

This is normally the part when I'd tease you about "maybe one day working at a decent studio like Pixar" but DW's stuff has been way better than Pixar's as of late...

 

[Zigsta]

You serious?

Yep! I've worked on all their films since Rise of the Guardians.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Yep! I've worked on all their films since Rise of the Guardians.

Well, that's quite an achievement. Good on you.

 

[S_B]

BTW, I'm fighting the good fight in this thread: http://smashboards.com/threads/bowser-and-the-suicide-clause.392566/page-6

 

[JapanGuy]

This is why you want to consistently practice each match up with Bowser if you want to be good with him. In time you won't feel like he has a bad match up because you will know what to do when facing each fighter.

 

[B!squick]

Any Bowsers going to EVO? MrEh maybe if you'll allow me to dream?

 

[MrEh]

A handful of Hawaii players will be going to EVO guaranteed. For me, I got into some car troubles recently because of a hit and run, so my finances are in a bit of a rough state. Right now, it's leaning more towards a a no. I'll be rooting for all of our Bowser bros heading down though.


We just had our biggest tournament of the year over here in Hawaii. Almost 100 entrants. I didn't enter though, since I was helping another event. (this was at an anime convention, hehe) We invited a few very VERY good players to compete at our tournament, so there was some serious competition here. inb4 "lol just another Hawaii local."

We initially thought that the tournament would be a clean sweep for our guests, but that wasn't the case. LethalTrilogy, who hasn't even been considered to be the best Hawaii player in years, took 2nd at this event, losing to Larry in grand finals. I'm extremely proud of him, and all the other Hawaii bros that did well this tournament.

I know a lot of people will and always will think of Hawaii as a weak region since we're so isolated, but this tournament in particular reaffirmed my belief that Hawaii does have a talented pool of players that can potentially succeed in national tournaments given enough practice and experience.


I however, am playing a lot less nowadays. Playing with all the out-of-state guests also reaffirmed my belief that Bowser will have an extremely rough time placing in nationals. It will probably be impossible, considering the character's weaknesses. His top-tier matchup spread is atrocious, with his best being Rosa, being 40-60 at best. If there's a Bowser player who takes the character to the next level, it probably won't be me. I'm not that talented. lol

At this point, I'm really just a supporting member of my communities: Hawaii and Bowser. When I was younger, I was happy to win with Bowser and dunk on the competition. Now that I'm older, it makes me even happier to build a strong community as a whole. Even if I don't place or compete as often, I'll always be here.


TL:DR
-I'm free
-Jab and pivot grab are your best moves

 

[UltimaLuminaire]

@ MrEh Ooph. Best wishes to you after the hit and run. I hope you aren't injured, and if you are, that you recover swiftly.

 

[MrEh]

Nah I'm fine. My car ended up on the curb with no door though. No way to fix that.

 

[Brinzy]

Look on the bright side: we can lose random Heroes of the Storm games with each other!

 

[MrEh]

You know it.

 

[Corgian]

DASH SLAM IS GODLIKE. Between the custom matches I've played today, I think I used it more than any other move. The increase in range surprises so many characters that it's hilarious.

Just gushing.

I tend to switch it up. Both Dash Slash and Dash Slam are good moves, and I do feel that Dash Slash is quite a bit better. That being said, some matchups really don't like fighting the command grab, like Little Mac, Ganondorf, Shulk, and a few other more obscure match-ups. That being said, I feel that some of Bowser's worse matchups get incrementally easier thanks to Dash Slash, such as Sonic, Fox, Diddy, Sheik, and Pikachu. That being said, we are still really negative in these matchups, even with dash slash.

I know a lot of people will and always will think of Hawaii as a weak region since we're so isolated, but this tournament in particular reaffirmed my belief that Hawaii does have a talented pool of players that can potentially succeed in national tournaments given enough practice and experience.

I know that there are some really good Hawaii players out there. One of the best Yoshis in the US, Dren, lives out there, and he's frightening to watch. I definitely don't underestimate Hawaii players.

 

[Zigsta]

Any Bowsers going to EVO? MrEh maybe if you'll allow me to dream?

I was originally planning on it since Vegas isn't far from me, but I didn't want to take off work for another tournament--especially after Apex. :/

@ MrEh I'm sorry to hear about your car. Hope you enjoyed the tournament! I'm looking forward to hearing all about it from Larry.

 

[Kuraudo]

@ MrEh I miss you guys. If you do go to EVO, it'll be great to see you and the rest of Hawaii again. It's been so long!

 

[MrEh]

Always a pleasure to hear from you too.

 

[UltimaLuminaire]

Yooooooo. We b-ballin' now, boi! I like where this day is going.

 

[Hitman JT]

So that title under Ziggy's name is the real deal after all...

Also Jero got the best avy dammit. I'm jelly

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

So Shaq has a wall jump, letting him go out of bounds, up a wall, and dunk the hoop from behind it. Tell me, how should Bowser deal with this on the court?

Maybe the trick to this MU is Dash Slam Jam...

 

[Cassius.]

bruh...LMAO

 

[Jerodak]

So Shaq has a wall jump, letting him go out of bounds, up a wall, and dunk the hoop from behind it. Tell me, how should Bowser deal with this on the court?

Maybe the trick to this MU is Dash Slam Jam...

Since he's behind the post you can probably just jump and do an airdodge near the hoop for the item grab, then try to book it to the other side of the court before Shaq can recover. Might take a few tries to get it right, hope this helps!

 

[LIQUID12A]

My tourney on Saturday has a suicide clause; if both players have one stock and either performs a suicide attack, the one who executed it wins.

@ Zigsta , how was it that the clause screwed you over at Apex again? Because it wasn't listed, or what?

 

[Cassius.]

A TO told him if he did Klaw and a suicide happened he would win, when that actually wasn't the case and was the complete opposite.

The logistics of "suicide initiator winning/losing" aside, that in itself is ****ed up

 

[Zigsta]

My tourney on Saturday has a suicide clause; if both players have one stock and either performs a suicide attack, the one who executed it wins.

@ Zigsta , how was it that the clause screwed you over at Apex again? Because it wasn't listed, or what?

I was told it counted as a win for me prior to Apex by a TO, but then it wasn't in the written ruleset. So I lost.

Oh well, here's to Klaw getting fixed this month.

 

[Cassius.]

One can only hope & pray.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

You know, I was just about to ask what people want for Bowser in the next gameplay update. Fixing Bowsercide would be great, but their first attempt at fixing it obviously failed, and not in a way that's beneficial to us. I wouldn't be so angry at the idea of opponents surviving Bowsercide if it wasn't based on a factor like stage selection. But I get the feeling that the dev team didn't want to nerf Bowsercide at all. They just wanted to fix the glitch.

There's only one move of Bowsers that I feel comes up short, and that's Nair. It comes out slow and has a harsh autocancel window. And as far as I can tell, it's the second hitbox alone that hits under Bowser. When his arms swing out under him. There's so many issues with this move that I'm not sure how you could change it to suddenly be good.

 

[MrEh]

The issue with Nair is that it is a multihit move, so it's hard to get a favorable hit during neutral, even if you bait an airdodge. Compare it to Villager's Nair for example. Bowser's Nair is utter trash in comparison because of this.

If they made Bowser' Nair a single hit move with a sour hit near the end for balance, the move would be aaaaamazing. So many uses.


Here's a list of changes I would want for Bowser. Most of these changes are small things because I assume the top tiers are gonna get nerfed as well. Most of these aren't buffs so much as they are just fixes really.

-Fix Jab1 so that the knockback angle always allows it to combo into Jab2. Consistency.
-Fix Utilt so it actually hits in front of Bowser's face. The animation covers Bowser's front, so why not?
-Fix Bowser Bomb so that the rising hit will always combo into the falling hit. Just for consistency.
-Fix grounded Fortress so that you cannot slide off platforms or ledges when hit by wind.
-If the above change isn't possible, then allow us to slide off ledges and platforms again with Fortress. It's just so inconsistent. Do you want Fortress to slide off platforms or not? Pick one and stick with it Nintendo.


Although if you want Bowser to be GOOD in this game, here are some actual buffs.

-Fortress now invincible from frames 1-5.
-Air Klaw active frames increased from 1 to 3. Hitbox expanded forward and downward.
-Ftilt now has IASA frames.
-Nair now single hit, with a sourspot for balance.
-Fair knockback increased slightly.
-Adjust autoguard so that it comes out on Usmash release.
-Make hit2 of Usmash ground opponents. If someone gets hit by that, they deserve to die.

 

[Xuan Wu]

I just thought it would be nice if his Fire Breath behaved more like Charizard's Flamethrower, where the flames cause flinching from any distance. It's not likely to happen though as it's probably intentional design meant to distinguish the two.

His zoning and edge-guarding game would improve considerably, if this happens. ^-^

 

[S_B]

I was told it counted as a win for me prior to Apex by a TO, but then it wasn't in the written ruleset. So I lost.

Oh well, here's to Klaw getting fixed this month.

For what it's worth, I basically crushed all arguments in the thread on the competitive forums.

Also, where was the update announced? I can't find news of it anywhere...