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Bingo Mafia - THE END!

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
Joined
Jun 12, 2010
Messages
3,739
Also I don't think we should assume that Rake wasn't the doc. I'm assuming none of us know what exactly the number sensor does and I don't see why rake would lie about his role after he was lynched
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
You're reaching hard if you're saying those are "fabricated interactions"

Hell, you're also reaching hard if you think it was scummy of kantrip to suspect the guy who lead one of the worst wagons I have ever seen. Especially cosidering that he gives reasoning for why Adumb's push was bad, which makes your point that "he could target anyone" ridiculous

You're also reaching hard with 621, which seems to fail to mention the fact that EVERYONE at that point in the game was talking about mechanics, AND misses **** like 446, which was a large part of his adum push.

This push is terrible

Vote: Garg

Also chaco isn't scummy because he chose to oppose one of the grimiest wagons I've ever seen.
Oh boy, did you even read the things I quoted from Kantrip?

Tell me how his posts were solid and reasoned.

and reaching hard?
so chaco is ruy scum?
battle of the quick hammerers

GO
Huh?

A dead thing?
People should read more :p
Explain these amazingly valuable posts.
(that's sarcasm, these posts didn't go anywhere and hold no value)

And how come you didn't oppose that wagon if it was so grimy? You didnt seem to try at all
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
Joined
Jun 12, 2010
Messages
3,739
Oh boy, did you even read the things I quoted from Kantrip?

Tell me how his posts were solid and reasoned.

and reaching hard?

Explain these amazingly valuable posts.
(that's sarcasm, these posts didn't go anywhere and hold no value)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_(fallacy)
You're neglecting his posts of actual content in that time to make it seem like he posted nothing but these posts, when I pointed out that that was not the case

And how come you didn't oppose that wagon if it was so grimy? You didnt seem to try at all
I thought I did a good job making it abundantley clear that I thought the wagon was terrible but hey I guess not. Stopping a wagon is also very difficult when you have the two loudest players in the game leading it.
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
Yes, just skimmed D1 again, you didn't do anything besides vote JeXs and say "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherry_picking_(fallacy)
You're neglecting his posts of actual content in that time to make it seem like he posted nothing but these posts, when I pointed out that that was not the case
I thought I did a good job making it abundantley clear that I thought the wagon was terrible but hey I guess not. Stopping a wagon is also very difficult when you have the two loudest players in the game leading it.
If i'm neglecting it, then the value must clearly be there. Show it to me.

And if you thought the wagon was SO grimy, you could've been louder yourself. All you did was vote JeXs and say "jump on the JeXs" wagon without any backing or explanation as to why you thought the Rake wagon was so bad
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
Joined
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Messages
3,739
If i'm neglecting it, then the value must clearly be there. Show it to me.
444, 446, 447, 448, 450, 452. All of these posts are posts with content that you conveniently skipped over.

And if you thought the wagon was SO grimy, you could've been louder yourself. All you did was vote JeXs and say "jump on the JeXs" wagon without any backing or explanation as to why you thought the Rake wagon was so bad
You mean my initial vote and the subsequent shennanigans? Should have jumped on the rapidly ascending wagon that was based on an null tell?

I tried to convince people like yo, because posting stuff in allcaps, bold and font size seven will only serve to be ignored by the million sheeps on the wagon. Of course, that didn't work out
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
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Messages
1,026
If you think the posts of Kantrip that I mentioned are valuable, please explain.
444, 446, 447, 448, 450, 452. All of these posts are posts with content that you conveniently skipped over.


You mean my initial vote and the subsequent shennanigans? Should have jumped on the rapidly ascending wagon that was based on an null tell?

I tried to convince people like yo, because posting stuff in allcaps, bold and font size seven will only serve to be ignored by the million sheeps on the wagon. Of course, that didn't work out
I'm not talking about any other posts from Kantrip other than those I mentioned. Explain the ones I mentioned only. I'm aware he pushed, I noted that already. If you can't explain the value of the specific posts I mentioned, then Kantrip was clearly fabricating those interactions.

Oh boy, capslock, really playing for the team there.
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
Joined
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Messages
3,739
There are many posts like the ones that you quoted in this thread, made by a lot of different players. What makes kantrip's so special?

That was rhetorical, but the way. The answer is nothing. There are ****tons of fluff posts in mafia, and the fact that you are focusing on kantrips and making the ridiculous logical leap that these he is scum from these attests to your reaching
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
There are many posts like the ones that you quoted in this thread, made by a lot of different players. What makes kantrip's so special?

That was rhetorical, but the way. The answer is nothing. There are ****tons of fluff posts in mafia, and the fact that you are focusing on kantrips and making the ridiculous logical leap that these he is scum from these attests to your reaching
They're special because they're consistent.

You're dodging my question really hard.
 

Sarki Soliloquy

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 8, 2013
Messages
2,793
Location
Andover, MA, USA
Hotcakes' Current Scum Suspcisions (I'm not going over everything that has been said as it would be super monotonous and too long)

-Mafia must be silent/semi-active to appear casual
-Mafia making little to no leads, their own or not, on who to frame as scum
-Mafia are doing these two things in conjunction to have low lynch priority thus far


DAY 2 RECAP

Page 7:
-ts;dr D1 fallout. Nothing to see here.

Page 8:
-Chaco and Adumb going back and forth
-Red Ryu consulting Gorf to vote Chaco
-Kantrip being all admonitory and shiz about scumreading
-Adumb insists he didn't want to lynch Rake yet, wagon at L-1 so momentum. (I recall Red Ryu's passive Rake stance, opportunistic quickhammer?)
-Joey votes Adumb, thought Adumb was using bad defenses to push wagon
-Question spinning by Red Ryu
-Red Ryu explains that he didn't agree with Rake's Hotcakes push because it wasn't threatening enough to be
believable
-Gorf basically :132:'s
-More Chaco and Adumb going back and forth

Page 9:
-Chaco notes people were trigger-happy for wagon, Adumb tried to avoid D1 quickhammer last minute in an attempt to remove blame from his case
-Red Ryu basically quickhammered to mercy kill raging Rake
-Mac trying to catch up on thread
-Hotcakes had no problem lynching Rake, yet shows regret for his actions. Wants to target silent players.
-Mac thinks Hotcakes response to Rake after D1 lynch was decided is scummy
-Dark Horse doesn't like Chaco's push, doesn't like Gorf's Rake scum reasoning and asks people to consider voting him
-Adumb notes Red Ryu's actions being a result of his impulsive playstyle
-JeXs thinks Gorf is town, not providing reasons


Page 10:
-Mac points out Kantrip left preemptive Rake vote w/o explaining anything behind it. Should be noted that when he posted his vote, there was no reasoning or pressure on Rake to make it seem valid
-JeXs doesn't agree with Rake quickhammer. Blames Rake's bad plays for accentuating scumleans on him.
-Bingo mechanics & strategies talk

Page 11:
-More mechanics & strategies talk
-Kantrip votes Adumb, doesn't like his push on Chaco
-Moar on mechanics
-Orbo's strategy with 8-Ball is to give it towards people who will last long (not NK or lynch targets)

Page 12:
-Dark Horse thinks scum didn't kill Marshy because he's too vocal and would be hard controlling the game with him still around.
-Kantrip reads begin from D1.
-Red Ryu was first to vote Rake. Comes off jesty.
-Kantrip, Marshy, Gorf, & JeXs votes on Rake follow.
-Orbo tries to tell people to stop the votes.
-Hotcakes has defensive reaction to Rake's question before the game. Notably puts Rake at L-1. Misinterpretation of Rake's intent?
-JeXs jumps wagon. Some claim his suspicion on Rake was still sustained at this point and he saw the benefit of reducing suspicion on him from it.
-Adumb puts Rake at L-1, defines push as being for early game pressure
-Notes Hotcakes exhibits a "hardbody mentality" for being a new player backing a D1 wagon.
-Adumb pushing Rake on the basis that explaining his own reads makes him scum. Adumb thinks Rake's responses thereafter are him rushing desperate content.
-Everyone on Rake's wagon had scummy justifications for voting.
-Kantrip notes unease from Marshy's actions at that state in the game. Marshy's signalboosting on Adumb's pressue made him seem like a threat. Sounds pretty opinionated considering he already flipped town.
-Dark Horse votes Adumb
-Orbo would only lynch Rake if it was the deadline
-Orbo votes Adumb
-JeXs abstains vote on Adumb for fear of quicklynch
-Kantrip thinks Hotcakes could be scum due to wagon hopping and following vocal player's moves. Might just be a newbie playing very badly on Rake.
-Kantrip insists this would apply if Adumb scumflipped
-Hotcakes confirms he was playing bad on Rake and following vocal players. Insists he perceived Rake's RVS question as a joke and made a non-serious, yet facetious response. Defensive misinterpretation of Rake's intent?
-Hotcakes votes Adumb, puts him @ L-1
-Chaco votes Adumb, brings lynch and didn't realize Hotcakes :4greninja:'d him with a vote.

Page 13:
-Hotcakes reads Chaco's reaction as an insult
-JeXs confused if Hotcakes is opportunistic newbscum or newbtown
-Hotcakes desperately unvotes Adumb, has no effect
-Hotcakes trying to use a guilt trick for innocence, seems angry from results of D2 and how people think of him

Page 14:
-Mac thinks Adumb's lynch was stupid
-Adumb thinks Hotcakes has too many pure towntells, Orbo, Joey, mac leaning closer to scum
-Gorf basically :132:'s
-Adumb reiterates that he thinks Chaco is lying in his arguments and was scummy for defending Rake
-Red Ryu swears vengeance on Chaco for quickhammer
-Mac said dark Horse said Chaco was being set up by scum which was why he wasn't killed on D1

Page 15:
-Chaco and Kantrip sound apologetic on Adumb quickhammer, yet insist his bad plays made him deserve death.
-Dark Horse notes Red Ryu getting mad a Chaco for hammer is hilarious (ironic for him?)
-ADUMB LYNCH CONFIRMED!
-Adumb notes Red Ryu's stubborn, implusive, easy to get under skin. Thinks Chaco's ninja was not believable over how conscientious he was leading up to his vote.
-MAC NIGHTKILLED!
-Cream Team votes Joey
-Red Ryu votes Chaco. Mentions how he accidentally quickhammered and made bad defenses for Rake.
-Orbo questions Red Ryu why his Rake defense wasn't bad as in Chaco's
-Red Ryu claims he was aiming for town cred instead of reading wagon for observation

Page 16:
-Chaco notes that Red Ryu's quickhammer on D1 was disgusting, not in line with Red Ryu's previous regrets over Rake wagon. Also suspicious of Hotcakes.
-Gargoline votes Kantrip; using Rake flip to push Adumb because he went after a townie & contributing irrelevant mechanics what-ifs.
-Gargoline thinks Orbo is suspicious because his posts seem prancy and speculative
-Dark Horse votes Gargoline; he used mechanics talk to make him appear like he's trying to derail lynch decisions and gives reasoning to why he opposed Adumb's push. Think Chaco is town because he opposed Rake's wagon.

Current FoS: Kantrip, Red Ryu, Joey, Orbo
 

Chaco

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I see where you're coming from: you didn't want a quicklynch. Alleviating pressure from the wagon defeats the purpose of the wagon though, and I agree with you, JeXs is playing ****ty, but it honestly reads as noob for me at the moment, and I think lynching Kantplay will reveal the most info.

Where's your head at? what's your scumpool?

I'm assuming JeXs, adumb, and Ryu?

Also, what's up with the ISO?
Right now I'm getting a bad vibe from you really. I can see where DarkHorse is coming from on the cherry picking... And after ISOing Kant's town, methinks.

Suspected scumpool is Ryu, Garg, and ???. Last is undetermined at this time..

So guys, who do we want today Ryu or Garg?

I'm saying Garg since Ryu appears town to some people somehow...I'll have to build a case on the two of you once I get home!

Until then....

Vote: Garg
 

JeXs

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 3, 2013
Messages
2,597
I hope we don't quick lynch today. Have not checked kantrip's posts but garg is at L-3. If you want to vote make damn sure you're not gonna put it to L-1.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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For people saying I shut down discussion, no I did it because Rake told me to hammer him and he was flailing to the point keeping him around wasn't worth it.

He played scummy and died for it.
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
Right now I'm getting a bad vibe from you really. I can see where DarkHorse is coming from on the cherry picking... And after ISOing Kant's town, methinks.

Suspected scumpool is Ryu, Garg, and ???. Last is undetermined at this time..

So guys, who do we want today Ryu or Garg?

I'm saying Garg since Ryu appears town to some people somehow...I'll have to build a case on the two of you once I get home!

Until then....
Vote: Garg
This is so OMGUS it hurts...


"oh but it's not because you're voting kantrip and not me!" Doesnt apply because you know you're very much in my scumpool and one of my main targets
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
@ Chaco Chaco

It's really convenient that you formulated your ISO and voted me right after Dark Horse.

Some might call it opportunistically scummy on top of it being OMGUS
 

Chaco

Never Logs In
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12,136
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NC
@ Chaco Chaco

It's really convenient that you formulated your ISO and voted me right after Dark Horse.

Some might call it opportunistically scummy on top of it being OMGUS
Strawman. There is no OMGUS considering you're not even on me at all. Learn2scum better Garg
 

Chaco

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This is so OMGUS it hurts...


"oh but it's not because you're voting kantrip and not me!" Doesnt apply because you know you're very much in my scumpool and one of my main targets
But not really at all, you only make that convenient for yourself. OMGUS doesn't apply here at all. Literally ********.

He's the play for sure. He OMGUS's by claiming I am, lol. ****in irony to the max.
 

Orboknown

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 3, 2011
Messages
5,097
Location
SatShelter
First off im out of data so I can only post when I maoe it to the iet for wifi.
By the way, I just want to note Orbo's AWFUL play on this page. I mean, it's DUMBFOUNDINGLY bad.

But what's also important is Kantrip's stupid response to it as well, which I find grimy.

I'm really set on killing Kantrip and Orbo. Preferrably Kantrip today, since I think it will provide more info, since he interacted more.
You're ********. That post was made straight off of memory, and was more for reorientating myself after almost 2 weeks of not being in this game. Those are nowhere near my final thoughts
Just did a reread of the game and well.... I don't know who the **** is scum. I find it odd that orbo keeps harping on ryu town solely off of this post which I don't understand how it is apparently super townie from orbo's pov.
because I don't see ryu making that post and being so upfront about it that early on as scum. Ryu just isnt that kind of player to tell people they shouldnt be townreading him when scum
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
But not really at all, you only make that convenient for yourself. OMGUS doesn't apply here at all. Literally ********.

He's the play for sure. He OMGUS's by claiming I am, lol. ****in irony to the max.
... I stated that you are one of my main targets far before you showed any distaste towards my slot whatsoever.

Therefore it's actually impossible to label my actions as OMGUS.

You're flailing at this point
 

Gargaglione

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
1,026
First off im out of data so I can only post when I maoe it to the iet for wifi.You're ********. That post was made straight off of memory, and was more for reorientating myself after almost 2 weeks of not being in this game. Those are nowhere near my final thoughts
because I don't see ryu making that post and being so upfront about it that early on as scum. Ryu just isnt that kind of player to tell people they shouldnt be townreading him when scum
Why post incomplete, incoherent thoughts that dont contribute anything whatsoever?

Protip: think a full thought before you post
 

Chaco

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... I stated that you are one of my main targets far before you showed any distaste towards my slot whatsoever.

Therefore it's actually impossible to label my actions as OMGUS.

You're flailing at this point
Lol. I'm not even gonna continue this with you, did you not read I'd have a case on you later. I've been busy. And I'm saying OMGUS stands for oh my god you suck, which is what you're acting like for me voting you. It's hilarious. No one uses OMGUS to scumhunt because only newbies do it. Nor have I heard OMGUS mentioned in a loooong damn time. It's just...nothing. Considering I said I'd add more once I wrote up a case on you. Which I haven't had time to yet, nor still do just yet.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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Milwaukee, Wisconsin
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RedRyu_Smash
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Uhhh no, all you are doing is taking words from Adum's dead mouth now. You literally mirror your stance to whoever seems like the strongest presence to you. Y'know, this would be different too if you came up with any reasoning on your own, rather than relying on someone else's reads. It frustrates me because I've already responded to all these points. Give me something to work with so I can defend myself so we don't drive this game into the ground. It's D3 NO scum have died. We're losing this game faster than we can substantiate anything. Expand your mind and reevaluate reads, Scum just set up a three way swing on Bingos. If you lunch me today, and they kill one of the other slot, Double ****in bingo. We don't have a doc anymore, hey thanks D1... OTHERWISE we could have protected against this. LOOK at how this is being arranged, we're dealing with smart scum here, and a town who is disheveled every which a way.

Can we bring this together please and try to get something informative and adequately done?
I share the same sentiments with him on this.

You're defense of Rake reeked of you not understanding why he was being lynched. I'm not mirroring other players, I am making decisions based on what I see and what I agree with. I voted Rake very early on because I hated his early posts only for him to flail and demand I lynch him. So I did.

If you really think you're defense was warrented then tell me why Rake didn't deserve to die at that time.

BUT HE FLIPPED TOWN!!!!!

Doesn't matter, we didn't know that at the time. Tell me your mindset then.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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By the way, I just want to note Orbo's AWFUL play on this page. I mean, it's DUMBFOUNDINGLY bad.

But what's also important is Kantrip's stupid response to it as well, which I find grimy.

I'm really set on killing Kantrip and Orbo. Preferrably Kantrip today, since I think it will provide more info, since he interacted more.
You don't think Orbo is bad over scummy?

I think Orbo is fine right now, nothing strikes me as scum so far from what I reread.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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hey guys! I caught up

Vote: Kantrip

He was fairly absent in the beginning, but present enough to get away with it. Enough for scumlean? Not yet, he had reasons. His return on page 11 is scummy though.

He comes back with this:


He votes adumb. Adumb's target on Rake and Chaco were very reasonable. As my predecessor, Gorf said, Rake merited the lynch, and I believe Chaco's defense of Rake was an attempt to seem as if he formulated his own original opinion to appear as town, but going against the grain seemed very forced and not well-reasoned.
next is:


Using Rake's flip as town to argue that adumb is scum?
Hindsight is 20/20; with this logic, it would be easy to dog anyone that was on the Rake wagon.
This post is easy and dumb.

Then we get:

This is stupid what-ifs that don't really contribute much and it's under this false casual guise (although the "KKK" joke IS funny)

THEN:


This is ********. Thanks for elaborating on a mechanic. You're REALLY a team player!

Lastly, let me acknowledge the dumb chart about adumb being stupid that he posted on page 12. It's silly namecalling and does nothing for anyone.

Kantrip's scum.
Eh I don't agree with points early on with the activity, day 1 ended fast.

It has merit as I read on the fluff parts.
 

#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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You're reaching hard if you're saying those are "fabricated interactions"

Hell, you're also reaching hard if you think it was scummy of kantrip to suspect the guy who lead one of the worst wagons I have ever seen. Especially cosidering that he gives reasoning for why Adumb's push was bad, which makes your point that "he could target anyone" ridiculous

You're also reaching hard with 621, which seems to fail to mention the fact that EVERYONE at that point in the game was talking about mechanics, AND misses **** like 446, which was a large part of his adum push.

This push is terrible

Vote: Garg

Also chaco isn't scummy because he chose to oppose one of the grimiest wagons I've ever seen.
I agree I don't like Orbo scum but this vote isn't really jiving with me.
 

Cream Team

Gargaglione|Gorf
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Dec 30, 2013
Messages
301
cream team is a go

can't post now cuz i'mma be goin to work soon but dh you're an idiot who's got jank ass tunnel vision, and chaco you've either completely lost your sense of how to actually deal with someone who clearly has little experience with mafia lingo, or you're scum.

(hint: you're scum)
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
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3,739
Uggggh

I really dislike like chaco's leap on to garg. \

I also see where Gaarg is coming from with Kantrip's current fluff

Ugggggh
 

Kantrip

Kantplay
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Jul 11, 2010
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Still haven't read Garg's stuff on me.

I think Chaco's hammer is way grimier than Ruy's was when he tried to both blame ninja and also spout self scum meta.

I'm disappointed I was wrong on adumb. I never go that hard on campaigning reads. Worth looking into how that wagon developed again.

Honestly the Night phases have been so long I forget everything between em. Need a proper reread before I can choose a direction.
 

Kantrip

Kantplay
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Alright hunkering down for some reading.

To people thinking I'm scum, I'm hoping I can convince you otherwise without having to respond to a big case: When I posted this speculation near the beginning of D1, it's pretty clear I was not aware of the fact that mafia already knew where everyone was placed and who they would need to kill for a bingo:

I am opposed to actively trying to make a row out of confirmed player numbers. We have no reason to believe doing so carries a mechanical benefit for us, and historically mafia has gotten a bonus from killing everyone in a straight line. Letting them know who that is benefits mafia.
Then again, I suppose I could have faked that as mafia.
 

Kantrip

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~DAY ONE~
*please note that this post will only cover D1 and do not represent my final thoughts

EVENTS

Rake wagon

Red Ryu – first vote on, partially weighted RVS vote.

Potassium – second vote on, purely RVS pressure.

Yo! Hardbody the Show! – third vote on, partially weighted RVS vote.

Gorf – fourth vote on, no reasoning given, assumed RVS vote.

JeXs – fifth vote, I want to assume pressure on this one.

Orboknown – tells people to stop voting for Rake. Shutting down the reasonless RVS wagon but not necessarily defending Rake.

Captain Hotcakes – misunderstands the intent and implications of Rake's standard RVS question and votes him. Seems fully invested in Rake being scum in the most newbtown way.

JeXs – unvotes Rake due to him being put at L-1. Gives credit to the assumption that JeXs was voting for pressure.

Yo! Hardbody the Show! – Makes it known that he intends to hardbody Rake.

Adumbrodeus – joins the wagon, putting Rake back at L-1.

Red Ryu – unvotes, not wanting a quicklynch but makes it clear he agrees with the wagon itself.

JeXs – puts Rake back at L-1 once again despite not wanting him there before.

Dark Horse – comes in with a vote on JeXs, fails to comment on the Rake wagon at all.

Joey – comes in with a vote on Red Ryu, fails to comment on the Rake wagon at all.

Orboknown – defends Rake from allegations made by Hotcakes.

Red Ryu – says Rake has gotten better.

Gorf – tells Rake to claim and makes it pretty clear he's aligned with those wanting to lynch him.

Dark Horse – explains his JeXs vote and it relates to how JeXs handled the wagon.

Adumbrodeus – lays down some reasoning for Rake scum, being the first person to do so.

Chaco – hard defends Rake and asserts that there are scum pushing for him.

Yo! Hardbody the Show! – calls Chaco scum for his defense of Rake, especially on a Rake townflip.

Chaco – provides a bunch more defense of Rake and his reactions to the pressure. For example: “Rake keeps saying the same thing in defense, which is a towntell.”

Red Ryu – says he would be voting Rake because of his interactions with Hotcakes.

Orboknown – explains his rationale wrt Rake upon request. Says that he is townreading him because of things he'd expect Rake to do as scum that he didn't.

Dark Horse – calls the wagon **** but likes adum for being the only one to actually lay out reasoning.

Adumbrodeus – asserts that Rake is not to be lynched yet and that there are other avenues to pursue.

Red Ryu – doesn't listen to this and hammers Rake.

RAKE FLIPS TOWN

Interest in Chaco

Yo! Hardbody the Show! – calls Chaco out on his defense of Rake, saying it is scummy, especially if Rake is town.

Adumbrodeus – says that he cannot see the possible intent for the way Chaco is defending Rake. Proposes a switch to Chaco instead.

JeXs – says he is okay with switching to Chaco as he thinks Chaco's reasons for scumreading him are bad.

Red Ryu – puts Chaco in his scumlean pile as his only other scumread besides Rake.

Orboknown – agrees with Chaco and likes his openness with his stance on Rake, but disagrees with the JeXs wagon.

Dark Horse – says he likes Chaco for actually laying out his thought processes and looking generally townie. Calls his tiff with adum misguided.

PLAYERS

@ #HBC | Dark Horse #HBC | Dark Horse

Opposed the Rake wagon right away, instead voting for JeXs due to inconsistencies in his approach to the wagon. Likes adumb for actually laying out his reasoning and Chaco for being open about his discontent with the wagon.

@#HBC | Gorf

Joined the Rake wagon among the ranks of the people who wanted to push it through from the start #HBC style. Dedicates most of his time to looking for marshy's approval as someone with balls and trying to join the buddy crew of Yo! Hardbody the Show! and adum. When he's not doing that he's telling Rake to die.

@ Orboknown Orboknown

Tries to put brakes on the Rake wagon early when it picks up steam in RVS. Calmly opposes it for its duration, pointing out why he thinks Rake would play different if he were scum. Likes Chaco for his stance on Rake but disagrees with Chaco's scumread on JeXs.

@ Sarki Soliloquy Sarki Soliloquy

Jumps on the Rake wagon due to not liking Rake's question towards him and remains unwavering on Rake's death most of the Day. Doesn't do much other than letting everyone know how much he wants Rake dead.

@ #HBC | Red Ryu #HBC | Red Ryu

Initially starts the Rake wagon, then jumps off when it picks up too much steam. Changes his stance on Rake for a bit, saying his play has improved. Then later, he suddenly switches back to scumreading him for his early interaction with Hotcakes and even quickhammers the wagon out. Spends some time asking people questions and gives things like JeXsscum consideration. Also dislikes Chaco.

@ JeXs JeXs

Adds pressure to the Rake wagon initially. Got off when the wagon got to L-1, but then put the wagon at L-1 again himself after a post from adum explaining why that wasn't such a bad thing. Later on he says he is okay with lynching Chaco because Chaco's reasons for scumreading him are bad.

@ Chaco Chaco

Fervently calls the Rake wagon terrible and defends Rake. Attempts to shut the wagon down and explain why Rake is actually town. This included reasons such as "Rake is saying the same thing over and over in defense, which is a towntell." Tries to instead get a JeXs wagon going for the following reasons:
"-Wishy washy jumping of wagon.
-Called out, Re-L1's and CLAIMS IT SO NO ONE ACCIDENTALLY QUICKHAMMERS. (OBV, OBV, OBV D1 mafia, point out the obvious to not do to appear town. You think it's dumb, but I swear to god that's the easiest noob scum read to tell.)
-He's playing much like he was in Xat's on-going game, where he was fireblasted as scum D1.
-Sheeping soooo hard
-Fluffy posts"

@ Kantrip Kantrip

Hops on the Rake wagon in RVS and doesn't exist for the rest of the Day.

@#HBC | Joey

Makes a post to vote for Red Ryu and ask him why he said something. Him, along with Mac, are the only players to completely neglect commenting on the Rake wagon. The two of them + Potassium are the three slots with one post each in D1, lacking any real presence whatsoever.

THOUGHTS

I don't like that the Rake lynch happened at all, but I don't know that anyone really expected it to go through. There could be scum on it, there could be scum against it, and there could be scum both on it and against it.

I actually think that JeXs unvoting and then revoting shortly after is a townie move. He put his vote back on because adum convinced him that there was no harm in doing so. He unvoted in the first place because he was nervous having a wagon at L-1 so early. Changing that stance so fast because of what adum said actually show a player who is willing to listen to other people and change their opinions based off of that. He did make it very clear that he had put his vote back on, so there was no ill-intent that he could have possibly intended from such an action. It's null at worst. Town lean.

I don't like how Ruy said that he actually thought Rake was playing better, and then later ended up scumreading him and even hammering him for stuff that happened before Ruy said he was improving! To my knowledge, nothing happened after Ruy said Rake was playing better that made Ruy dislike him, so the change of opinion back to Rake scum is really strange. The quickhammer after adum (the one spearheading the wagon with actual reasoning) said not to was also gross, provoked or not. The only thing that holds me back from calling this really scummy is the fact that I could see Ruy flopping his read back based on previous impressions and getting an itchy trigger finger when provoked to hammer by Rake himself. Ruy also has some redeeming qualities in his willingness to consider other avenues such as JeXs and Chaco and the questions he asked (indicative of townRuy). Town lean.

I really hate Joey for jumping in with an irrelevant question and vote for Ruy and then not existing again. Can't blame him too much because I'm guilty of only posting once too and the Day was ridiculously short, I just don't like that he posted after a bunch of **** with Rake was going down and he didn't even seem to make notice of it. Null but someone I want dead.

I think Orbo had legitimate reasons for disagreeing with the Rake wagon. He calmly explained why he thought the wagon was unfounded and what he thought Rake would be doing as scum in the situation. His conclusion of liking Dark Horse for his JeXs scumread but disagreeing with the read itself is something I feel as well, so I like that our thoughts line up in that regard. If there's anything I don't like about Orbo D1, it's that he was pretty passive in his defense of Rake. To be fair, he said his piece and I'm sure he didn't expect the wagon to end how it did. Town.

I like that Dark Horse came in analyzing the Rake wagon and found JeXs scummy in all of it. What he pointed out about JeXs makes sense, but like Orbo I disagree with the conclusion. Regardless, I think Dark Horse was justified in thinking the Rake wagon had no backing and trying to find scum within it. Town.

Chaco is a different case. Looking back at it, Chaco looks much more concerned with defending Rake than trying to find scum. He doesn't look at the wagon to see who is scum on it until later on, although he does exclaim wildly that there is scum on it for sure. He gets angry and up in arms about how townie Rake is and how stupid everyone is being, but his reasoning for Rake being town isn't very solid either. The stance I've referenced twice already which I think is absurd is that "Rake is repeatedly saying the same thing to defend himself." How Chaco thinks this is a towntell I'll never know. Chaco eventually tries to get a JeXs wagon going, but I think he vastly oversells his points. Dark Horse found an inconsistency in JeXs's play but didn't have much else. This is fair. Chaco tries to fluff up his points with stuff that is null, generalized points, and stuff that JeXs does all the time. Wishy washiness? Sheeping? Fluffy posts? It really looks like Chaco opposed the Rake wagon for townpoints and tried to make a case for someone else, but his reasons for doing both of these things are really weak and I can't see him actually buying them. Scum.

I don't like how Gorf spent more time trying to buddy marshy/Gheb and adum than anything else. It really looked like he was trying to lump himself in with those slots moreso than finding scum or even getting the Rake lynch he seemed to want so much. In retrospect I really can't remember him doing anything else. Yo! Hardbody the Show! and adumb at least looked at other avenues whilst hardbodying Rake. In fact, their suspicions of Chaco for his defense of Rake were legit and, while I hate their hardbody mentality, I can see now that they weren't closing their mind to the rest of the game. Gorf, on the other hand, did just that. Scum lean.

Captain Hotcakes misunderstood the intentions of Rake's question and thought that Rake was trying to get him modkilled for revealing his role. From that point onwards he tunneled Rake for a variety of reasons. He reads as newbtown but is not a slot I want getting to LyLo by any means. It would be really easy to tunnel on Rake the way he did as either alignment and have it written off as newbtown either way. Null-town.

READS

Orbo
Dark Horse
Red Ryu

JeXs
Captain Hotcakes
Joey
Gorf
Chaco
 

Kantrip

Kantplay
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
10,188
Location
B.C. Canada
honestly I know I still have all of D2 and what's happened of D3 yet to read, but I need a break and I think this is a great place to put my vote.

Vote: Chaco

I've covered why he's scummy D1. Then marshy/Gheb die N1, and let me just point out (WIFOM alert) that they didn't like Chaco and were poised to dive his *** should Rake flip town, which he did. Knowing the negative perception that seemed to be heading his way, I could totally see Chaco self hammering. I personally don't believe the ninja story, and how he played it off (both regretting and justifying it, and then using self meta to defend himself) was really gross.
 
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