Social Banjo-Kazooie Social Thread - Project Dream Come True!

[TheAnvil]

Honestly, I do know how they work. The sleep deprivation must've taken over.

Either way, using Duck Hunt as a base is speculative because, unlike Smash for, there's no real reason to believe that these characters aren't built from the ground up, as t least as far as I'm aware. Was there anything that suggested Joker was built off of someone else?

Joker looks like an amalgamation of sorts. They've yeeted animations from a bunch of characters for him. But PP was built from Bowser Jr.

 

[Xevious 1]

...but Minecraft is immensely 'bigger' than Halo in just about every way the phrase can be said...

In sales yes. It is also bigger than Zelda, Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, and Street Fighter but I'd also say those franshies are more important and have had a bigger impact on gaming than minecraft. Halo was massively important for console FPS and online gaming, it has a really expansive lore, was an event when a new game came out (pre 4), and Master Chief is the face of the Xbox. If Chief was revealed to be playable in Ultimate, that would probably be the biggest character reveal ever given that he is a mascot of a rival console. Don't get me wrong, Minecraft is massivley big, just not in every way.

 

[TheAnvil]

So Arsene has a codename in the code "Doyle".

This kills the theory that they selected codenames with the first letter in mind. However is also seems unlikely that Brave would be Erdrick as Brave is literally his name translated, Doyle and Jack are only loosely related to Arsene and Joker.

 

[SuperiorYoshi87]

So Arsene has a codename in the code "Doyle".

This kills the theory that they selected codenames with the first letter in mind. However is also seems unlikely that Brave would be Erdrick as Brave is literally his name translated, Doyle and Jack are only loosely related to Arsene and Joker.

I got it they're naming them after NFL players Jack Doyle plays on the Colts! Who knew Sakurai and his team were into American Football like that

 

[TheAnvil]

I got it they're naming them after NFL players Jack Doyle plays on the Colts! Who knew Sakurai and his team were into American Football like that

People believe that Doyle relates to Arsene as they're both Sherlock Holmes related
Joker and Jack are both cards in a standard deck

Brave is another famous Bear

 

[Lycan Rex]

Gonna play devil's advocate for a bit... why do you guys think banjo will be an e3 reveal?

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Yeah, a standing Duck Hunt is a perfect start for Banjo and Kazooie

 

[Nartic]

So Arsene has a codename in the code "Doyle".

This kills the theory that they selected codenames with the first letter in mind. However is also seems unlikely that Brave would be Erdrick as Brave is literally his name translated, Doyle and Jack are only loosely related to Arsene and Joker.

Yes. If Brave is referring to the DQ protagonist(勇者, Yuusha), It's not a codename, it's like exposing the character's name openly.

 

[N3ON]

So Arsene has a codename in the code "Doyle".

This kills the theory that they selected codenames with the first letter in mind. However is also seems unlikely that Brave would be Erdrick as Brave is literally his name translated, Doyle and Jack are only loosely related to Arsene and Joker.

Yes. If Brave is referring to the DQ protagonist(勇者, Yuusha), It's not a codename, it's like exposing the character's name openly.

His western name is Erdrick, his Japanese name is Loto. Brave is a literal translation of the class Yūsha, in English localizations the class is called Hero.

No one is actually named nor referred to as "Brave".

 

[Nartic]

His western name is Erdrick, his Japanese name is Loto. Brave is a literal translation of the class Yūsha, in English localizations the class is called Hero.

No one is actually named nor referred to as "Brave".

Loto/Erdrick is not the name of the character. It's just a title given to legendary heroes.

And... Yes, Brave is a literal translation of Yuusha.

Spoiler: Brave

 

[N3ON]

Loto/Erdrick is not the name of the character. It is a title given to legendary heroes.

Give it a few months.

 

[Fakol]

I think it's a 50/50 situation, it migiht as well be in the cases of some characters that some of those miis will come back. If anything I think the one company i'm certain we will get a new rep from is Namco and have Lloyd mii back at least. Everyone else could be different companies and have nothing to do with it, having the remaining mii costumes just be randomly placed in the next dlcs. A pattern really isn'tt a pattern with only one ocassion, we have to see how and which miis are coming in 2nd pack before we consider this theory possible as a pattern, and even then Sakurai doesn't stick with patterns for long, hence why every year we fail to predict what he does. I do strongly believe Namco has to have someone coming tho, personally I think a Tales of rep is a must, it's like their FF and we don't even have spirits from that franchise, AT ALL. Anyways. this is derailing from Banjo, lol.

For Namco, characters from Tekken is more interesting.

 

[TheAnvil]

Tekken is the only franchise from Namco I could see getting in. Sakurai specifically considered Heihachi for Smash For and hinted at him in Ryu's DLC trailer.

What's more, is Tekken is a really successful IP (more successful than Street Fighter in fact). Tekken is to 3D fighting games what Street Fighter was to 2D fighting games.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Namco rep ?... Uh this is completely biased and has like , almost no chance of happening , but I would be the most happy man on earth if Klonoa make it in lol.
But I understand that Heihachi and Lloyd/Yuri is more likely , even Don-Chan has a better shot that the little dream traveller.

And as to what Brave mean... Well I'm more on the side of "Brave Bear and Bird". But still , it's a codename , codenames sometimes only have a very small connection with the character.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Tekken is the only franchise from Namco I could see getting in. Sakurai specifically considered Heihachi for Smash For and hinted at him in Ryu's DLC trailer.

What's more, is Tekken is a really successful IP (more successful than Street Fighter in fact). Tekken is to 3D fighting games what Street Fighter was to 2D fighting games.

The downside is, Heihachi's VA died shortly after doing Incineroar, so I honestly don't think they'd feel ready to find a successor just yet.

Plus from what I understand, Tekken's gameplay style is difficult to adapt for Smash, according to Sakurai himself, so we probably won't see Heihachi any time soon.

Namco rep ?... Uh this is completely biased and has like , almost no chance of happening , but I would be the most happy man on earth if Klonoa make it in lol.
But I understand that Heihachi and Lloyd/Yuri is more likely , even Don-Chan has a better shot that the little dream traveller.

And as to what Brave mean... Well I'm more on the side of "Brave Bear and Bird". But still , it's a codename , codenames sometimes only have a very small connection with the character.

In regards to third parties, a big name being next is not necessarily a given. I mean, was succeeded by and , for Pete's sake.

Speaking of codenames, I wonder if "Jane" wasn't simply just a way to hide the variant for Joker's school uniform.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Makes more sense than an awkward blocky Steve trying to run around the stage

Have you seen Minecraft? They have actual animated cut scenes. The characters look fine.

In sales yes. It is also bigger than Zelda, Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, and Street Fighter but I'd also say those franshies are more important and have had a bigger impact on gaming than minecraft. Halo was massively important for console FPS and online gaming, it has a really expansive lore, was an event when a new game came out (pre 4), and Master Chief is the face of the Xbox. If Chief was revealed to be playable in Ultimate, that would probably be the biggest character reveal ever given that he is a mascot of a rival console. Don't get me wrong, Minecraft is massivley big, just not in every way.

In terms of sales, in terms of introducing a new genre, in terms of notoriety outside of the gaming community. minecraft.
I think the only way Halo is bigger is with a specific character, which granted, is important in smash.
That said, it's a character that certainly feels past his prime.

Anyway, back to Banjo.

 

[Loliko YnT]

The downside is, Heihachi's VA died shortly after doing Incineroar, so I honestly don't think they'd feel ready to find a successor just yet.

Plus from what I understand, Tekken's gameplay style is difficult to adapt for Smash, according to Sakurai himself, so we probably won't see Heihachi any time soon.



In regards to third parties, a big name being next is not necessarily a given. I mean, was succeeded by and , for Pete's sake.

Well , the thing about Bayo is that she got votes on the ballot and that Bayo 2 was a Wii U exclusive... For Joker , he came from a massively popular game of 2018/2017 (I can't remember...).
So yeah , beeing a "big name"doesn't mean you're a lock for Smash.

However , while I don't think Klonoa is dead (a new game can happen and have good sales with good marketing please) , I don't see him as viable for the Fighter Pass since his last game was 10 years ago and that Namco didn't do much references to Klonoa since...

Also yeah , Tails , Knux , Shadow or Dr.Eggman should be a playable fighter already. Blame SEGA weird decisions or Sakurai lack of interest/priority I guess.

 

[TheAnvil]

The downside is, Heihachi's VA died shortly after doing Incineroar, so I honestly don't think they'd feel ready to find a successor just yet.

Plus from what I understand, Tekken's gameplay style is difficult to adapt for Smash, according to Sakurai himself, so we probably won't see Heihachi any time soon.

Or they could just reuse his old voice clips...

 

[Deleted member]

People believe that Doyle relates to Arsene as they're both Sherlock Holmes related
Joker and Jack are both cards in a standard deck

Brave is another famous Bear

If i remember correctly, Aresene was written by Maurice Leblanc, while Sherlock Holmes was made by Conan Doyle.

Although, there was a story where Lupin meet Sherlock, but due to legal objectios of Conan his name was changed Herlock Sholmes.

 

[SKX31]

The downside is, Heihachi's VA died shortly after doing Incineroar, so I honestly don't think they'd feel ready to find a successor just yet.

Plus from what I understand, Tekken's gameplay style is difficult to adapt for Smash, according to Sakurai himself, so we probably won't see Heihachi any time soon.

Heihachi's VA dying is a major issue, indeed. To use a non-related example, Kojima did retire Roy Cambell when his Japanese VA died out of respect for said VA. Heihachi's a much more famous character though.

However, Heihachi does have two* 2D games under his belt. SFxT and PlayStation AllStars. I don't think Sakurai has played either of these (SFxT maaaybe?), so I don't blame him if he's unsure about Heihachi. Movesetwise I'd kinda prefer Kazuya or Jin if you're going with a Mishima because they have the Devil Gene and thus an easier Up B (not to mention, laser mixups and other stuff the Devil Gene gives) - Heihachi's the face of Tekken though.

(*Made a major mistake last time I pointed this out)

 

[Mr. Stagg]

Namco rep ?... Uh this is completely biased and has like , almost no chance of happening , but I would be the most happy man on earth if Klonoa make it in lol.
But I understand that Heihachi and Lloyd/Yuri is more likely , even Don-Chan has a better shot that the little dream traveller.

And as to what Brave mean... Well I'm more on the side of "Brave Bear and Bird". But still , it's a codename , codenames sometimes only have a very small connection with the character.

I see you are also a well refined man/lady of fine culture who's pulling for Klonoa. Poor guy needs some fame.

 

[fleshdude.gov]

Hmm, lets see. Been labbing Joker a lot today so off the top of my head and using SSBWiki to compare Joker and Sword. Also, I'm going with normal Joker and not Arsene (with one exception):

Two disclaimers are neccessary: I might be mistaken here on several fronts, since I don't have all characters in my head's database, but still. Also, I'm doing this without knowing from any datamine, so any raw data could null my guesses.

Jab attacks: Most similar to Mii Swordfighter. Replaces Sword's Upward (which is third and last) stab with a backhander, and the backhander comes second.

F-tilt: Joker's reminds me some of Snake's, being a double hitter. Sword's is decently similar to Link's.
U-tilt: Robin's, maybe. Animation's somewhat different between the two. Sword's similar to Link's again.
D-tilt: Cloud, being a slide and all. Sword's D-tilt is similar to Marth's.

Dash attack: Running version of Zero Suit's F-Smash kinda. Sword's a slide and a outward swipe.

F-Smash: I could see the similarity between Joker and Sword, but SSBWiki points out that Joker's is similar to Falco. Joker doesn't swing inwards while Sword does.
U-Smash: Another tough one, but Ryu's uppercut with a knife, maybe? Sword's a two-slash and jump, rather similar to Link's again.
D-Smash: There are tons of sweeping in front and behind. Joker and Sword do this, but so do Mario, Link, Marth, Rosalina... yeah. Inconclusice I'd say.

Nair: Joker and Sword both do corkscrews. The thing is, corkscrews are also ridicoulsly common. Even Bowser does it nowadays! Everything is truly better with spinning.
Fair: Joker does "A hook kick, followed by a roundhouse kick." Zero Suit does the exact same thing. Sword meanwhile stabs forward three times.
Bair: Joker does an upward swipe here. I'm gonna hazard a really wild guess here, but perhaps a upward version of Cloud's? Sword spins before doing his backward slash. Cloud "merely" turns around. This is a vague case, could be most similar to Sword but I'll not push any definitive judgement here.
Uair: Joker's borrowing from Sheik here. Sword spins here again.
Dair: Joker clearly recorded Marth's infamous downair. Sword's reminds me of Corrin's.

Grab: Both Joker and Sword reach out with one hand. The thing is, it's really common. Pass.
Pummel: Both Joker and Sword knees the victim. Not sure if this is as common as the grab though, but Captain Falcon's the progenitor of this.
F-throw: Now we're getting into different territory. Joker does a forward toss, Sword kicks the victim.
B-throw: Joker does Marth's b-throw. Sword roundhouse kicks.
U-throw: Joker throws directly upwards, kinda like (Dr.) Mario's. Sword thinks just tossing is for wimps and follows up with a midair spinning slash. Told ya spinning makes everything better.
D-throw: Both Joker and Sword slam the opponent off the ground. Joker, however, adds some flourish to it all too. Before we rush into any conclusions, it's kinda common since characters like Palutena, K. Rool and Lucas do this too.

Floor attacks (front, back, trip): Passing on this one too. Swinging back-and-forth's pretty damn common when rising up.

Edge attack: Joker's reminds me of Cloud's, being a slash, while Sword stabs akin to Link.

Specials: Hoo boy now we're getting complicated, since the Mii's have three different choices for their Specials:

B: Joker's Gun seems like the lovechild of Falco's and Bayonetta's. Falco's due to the animation while normally shooting, Bayo's because Joker can pull off similar gun stunts. Sword has the tornado, the shuriken or multi-hit stabs as choices here.
Side B: Joker's Eiha is a variant of Robin's Arc Fire in how it travels, with extra poison. Sword has the spinning charge, charged multi-stab and the chakram.
Up B: Joker's Grappling hook is a tether and upward version of Isabelle's rod. Sword has a sword version of Brawler's "Rise up, crash down", a series of sword strikes dashing in a straight line (which can be angled), and Link's Spin as choices.
Down B: Joker's Rebel's Guard reminds me of Incineroar's Revenge, only combined an expanded version of Cloud's limit mechanic. Here I'll make the exception since Arsene gives Joker a version of Palutena's counter - reflecting both melee and ranged attacks. Sword has a counter here too, true, but it works more like Marth's. The other Down Bs are a slash working like Mario's Cape and a dash forward similar to Falcon's / Ganon's but with a sword.

TL:DR:

I could see similarities in 4 or so moves between Joker and Sword - the thing is, the eyetest doesn't really work when a lot of the similar attacks are common with the cast (corkscrewing Nairs and one handed grabs). Given that disclaimer, other characters Joker appears to have borrowed from are Marth, Zero Suit and surprisingly enough Falco. Meanwhile, Sword shares some stuff with Link, and looks decently similar to Toon Link.

For the most part, this sounds like it pretty much confirms the theory I've been playing with in my head for a while - namely, that Joker did not use a set base character to begin with, and instead was created mostly from scratch.

 

[Nazyrus]

Plus from what I understand, Tekken's gameplay style is difficult to adapt for Smash, according to Sakurai himself, so we probably won't see Heihachi any time soon..

Yep he said that, precisely why I doubt him entirely. He was reduced to a pac-man taunt instead. If he was already in plans to be made playable in ultimate i doubt they would've done that to him.

 

[Loliko YnT]

I see you are also a well refined man/lady of fine culture who's pulling for Klonoa. Poor guy needs some fame.

Thanks , and I'm a man. (Sorry , I'm not the cute girl in my profile pic)
It would be nice if Namco at least released Door to Phantomile on the eshop.

For the most part, this sounds like it pretty much confirms the theory I've been playing with in my head for a while - namely, that Joker did not use a set base character to begin with, and instead was created mostly from scratch.

But still , I found it weird that Joker is the same height as mii swordfighter. I was sure that Joker was going to be around Cloud's size , but he's a small boy.

 

[TheAnvil]

Yep he said that, precisely why I doubt him entirely. He was reduced to a pac-man taunt instead. If he was already in plans to be made playable in ultimate i doubt they would've done that to him.

He worked perfectly fine in Street Fighter x Tekken.

 

[MissingGlitch]

So Arsene has a codename in the code "Doyle".

This kills the theory that they selected codenames with the first letter in mind. However is also seems unlikely that Brave would be Erdrick as Brave is literally his name translated, Doyle and Jack are only loosely related to Arsene and Joker.

Wait catch me up. What did I miss? Was a new codename found?

Oh Arsene is the name of the persona who had their own character file lol I'm dumb.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Hey , I just wanted to share this with you all :

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Hey , I just wanted to share this with you all :

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Perfectly sums up the state of this thread, honestly.

 

[Deleted member]

Perfectly sums up the state of this thread, honestly.

I'm lost.

What happened with Banjo on this thread?

 

[MissingGlitch]

I'm lost.

What happened with Banjo on this thread?

I think there was a thing going around for awhile that the Microsoft character was gonna be the VGA reveal. Since Joker is a thief people have been making jokes that Joker stole Banjo's invite.

 

[Deleted member]

I think there was a thing going around for awhile that the Microsoft character was gonna be the VGA reveal. Since Joker is a thief people have been making jokes that Joker stole Banjo's invite.

Oh, ok then.
Though that there was trouble some minutes ago or something.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Oh, ok then.
Though that there was trouble some minutes ago or something.

I meant more specifically that it basically stopped being a Banjo thread.

 

[MissingGlitch]

I meant more specifically that it basically stopped being a Banjo thread.

Banjo is just getting his revenge ready. Give him time.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Banjo is just getting his revenge ready. Give him time.

That's what I'm bankin' on. Hope my gut feeling doesn't prove me wrong like everything else. In the meantime, time's for relaxin' before E3 comes.

 

[JonSmash]

GOD ! I would love if they actually incorperate Joker into Banjo's reveil & play it off that he stole banjo & kazooie's invite LOL I maen banjo & kazooie are known for 4th wall humor PLUS joker had to of stolen SOMEONE's invite right ? would make even more sense since the VGA's was the release of ultimate & BK's anniversary in japan the perfect time for banjo !

 

[AugustusB]

GOD ! I would love if they actually incorperate Joker into Banjo's reveil & play it off that he stole banjo & kazooie's invite LOL I maen banjo & kazooie are known for 4th wall humor PLUS joker had to of stolen SOMEONE's invite right ? would make even more sense since the VGA's was the release of ultimate & BK's anniversary in japan the perfect time for banjo !

That would be poetry in motion if that happened!

Also, are people still data mining or do we have everything already? Was it just Arsene's code name?

 

[JonSmash]

I hope we fine more clues in the data mine (but not outright spoilers )

 

[Deleted member]

Okay so i had this idea for Banjo's Final Smash. It's dumb but hear me out. Instead of the Jinjonator, it's:

Spoiler

After Banjo goes right into his enemies upon activating his Final Smash (ala K.Rool, Yoshi and others) a cutscene starts up. A light highlighs the character waking up (using the normal get up animation), and they react in shock as they see Conker with a Chainsaw, ready to attack. A reference to the Conker's Bad Fur Day logo intro:

Obviously we can't show the likes of Mario and Bayo beign cut in half. Instead when Conker attacks the opponents with his chansaw, a cloud of smoke appears (similar to the Prince Sable Assist Trophy when he comes to contact with an opponent or Wario's Final Smash in Ultimate) and we only hear the Chainsaw, cutting sound effects and maybe some grunts to represent the characters beign attacked.

I should also mention that the player will not see the aftermath of the Final Smash unlike in the two videos shown. As soon as it ends (meaning the FS will just cut abruptly), the opponent will start flying high after recieving the attack, but if the oppontent as 100% or higher, it will be automatically KO'ed.

I imagined this Final Smash because Rareware used to love to put cameos and crossovers of their characters in their games (Conker and Banjo beign playable in DKR, Banjo making a cameo in Conker's Bad Fur Day, Berri's original design appering in a Level of Banjo Kazooie, the KI logo appearing in a racetrack of DKR, etc)

 

[Deleted member]

So um what’s this Doyle codename? What did I miss?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

So um what’s this Doyle codename? What did I miss?

Long story short, Arsène's presence is accounted for in the datamined character files under that codename.