Social Banjo-Kazooie Social Thread - Project Dream Come True!

[TheCJBrine]

Mii Costume Theory may end up true, but they could just release the costumes without being tied to a specific company's character.

 

[Dinoman96]

If that's the case, I guess we're not getting those Virtua Fighter costumes back.

Honestly I kinda partially expect there to be a Tekken rep, probably Heihachi, and they'll re-release the Virtua Fighter costumes with him as they're fellow fighting games.

Remember that the Tekken and Virtua Fighter outfits came with Ryu back in Smash 4.

 

[N3ON]

Sorry to say this but I don’t believe in that theory

Yeah, neither do I.

 

[Guynamednelson]

We did get Akira upgraded as a assist trophy so there's Virtua Fighter in smash.

The Sonic Mii costumes came back, but not the VF costumes.
Akira is an assist, but Jacky is nowhere to be seen.
Sakurai might think Akira's too complex, as he's meant to be.

Jacky is 100% confirmed, trust me, I am Uncle Nintendo himself.

 

[Mr. Stagg]

I have good news.

Joker is jack but their stats were changed a bit like being heavier

But according to polarpanda the height is the same

So I don’t think brave is gonna hit a growth spurt and eddy would most likely be his tall adult form with the female alt.

Biggest thing to look for is if Joker's model and animations were based from Mii Swordfighter. If we can find this out, Banjo-kazooie will look way more likely.

Third-person is a feature in standard gameplay, no mods required. It's done by either pressing F5 or pressing the thumbstick/whatever control it's set to. It can be annoying for gameplay, though, as the camera gets pushed close to you if obstructed by blocks, but otherwise it's fine (I mainly just use it for some screenshots tbh, rarely for gameplay). I don't really see why it being first-person matters, though.

I feel like it does in regards to the animations, or lack there of. If 3rd person hampers gameplay then it is purely a cosmetic function as you said yourself with it being used for screenshots. Even though it seems unlikely, I'd still be hype for Chief because he has more unique animations and the halo series has an abundance of well 3rd person animations to reference from. Plus his guns are more sci-fi based as opposed to heavy ballistic based, which can also work for Doomguy, though to a lesser extent.

 

[Mikegamer0608]

Yeah, neither do I.

Glad you don't believe it, but it makes me little worried that could be a possible practice for Nintendo & the other companies to resell these costumes but also have a character attached to them from their company.

 

[Lycan Rex]

Remind me again how the mii swordfighter stuff increases our chances

 

[TheAnvil]

If that's the case, I guess we're not getting those Virtua Fighter costumes back.

If that theory rang true they could just release them alongside Heihachi (the only viable Namco rep) as they're fighting game characters.

 

[N3ON]

If that theory rang true they could just release them alongside Heihachi (the only viable Namco rep) as they're fighting game characters.

But the theory is based on division by company, not genre. It'd be Namco content releasing alongside Heihachi. Who, btw, is not the only viable Namco rep given Tales representation is plausible.

Remind me again how the mii swordfighter stuff increases our chances

It doesn't.

Glad you don't believe it, but it makes me little worried that could be a possible practice for Nintendo & the other companies to resell these costumes but also have a character attached to them from their company.

Well a lot of the costumes are going to be re-sold anyway.

 

[Llort A. Ton]

But the theory is based on division by company, not genre. It'd be Namco content releasing alongside Heihachi. Who, btw, is not the only viable Namco rep given Tales representation is plausible.

If they want to get creative they could pull Dig Dug, Katamari Prince, Digimon or even a Soul Calubur character. Heihachi has the edge of being considered before though.

 

[Organization XIII]

I would love Kilik to join Smash.

 

[Mikegamer0608]

Well a lot of the costumes are going to be re-sold anyway.

But will the characters just be from Square, Capcom, & Bandai that's what I've been thinking and worried that they might do that.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

Remind me again how the mii swordfighter stuff increases our chances

Because that means Joker is using Mii Swordfighter as his base, which would mean the theory about Duck Hunt and Mii Sword crashing the game due to them being DLC bases is true

And ergo, Duck Hunt = Banjo Kazooie's base character

 

[SKX31]

Biggest thing to look for is if Joker's model and animations were based from Mii Swordfighter. If we can find this out, Banjo-kazooie will look way more likely.

Hmm, lets see. Been labbing Joker a lot today so off the top of my head and using SSBWiki to compare Joker and Sword. Also, I'm going with normal Joker and not Arsene (with one exception):

Two disclaimers are neccessary: I might be mistaken here on several fronts, since I don't have all characters in my head's database, but still. Also, I'm doing this without knowing from any datamine, so any raw data could null my guesses.

Jab attacks: Most similar to Mii Swordfighter. Replaces Sword's Upward (which is third and last) stab with a backhander, and the backhander comes second.

F-tilt: Joker's reminds me some of Snake's, being a double hitter. Sword's is decently similar to Link's.
U-tilt: Robin's, maybe. Animation's somewhat different between the two. Sword's similar to Link's again.
D-tilt: Cloud, being a slide and all. Sword's D-tilt is similar to Marth's.

Dash attack: Running version of Zero Suit's F-Smash kinda. Sword's a slide and a outward swipe.

F-Smash: I could see the similarity between Joker and Sword, but SSBWiki points out that Joker's is similar to Falco. Joker doesn't swing inwards while Sword does.
U-Smash: Another tough one, but Ryu's uppercut with a knife, maybe? Sword's a two-slash and jump, rather similar to Link's again.
D-Smash: There are tons of sweeping in front and behind. Joker and Sword do this, but so do Mario, Link, Marth, Rosalina... yeah. Inconclusice I'd say.

Nair: Joker and Sword both do corkscrews. The thing is, corkscrews are also ridicoulsly common. Even Bowser does it nowadays! Everything is truly better with spinning.
Fair: Joker does "A hook kick, followed by a roundhouse kick." Zero Suit does the exact same thing. Sword meanwhile stabs forward three times.
Bair: Joker does an upward swipe here. I'm gonna hazard a really wild guess here, but perhaps a upward version of Cloud's? Sword spins before doing his backward slash. Cloud "merely" turns around. This is a vague case, could be most similar to Sword but I'll not push any definitive judgement here.
Uair: Joker's borrowing from Sheik here. Sword spins here again.
Dair: Joker clearly recorded Marth's infamous downair. Sword's reminds me of Corrin's.

Grab: Both Joker and Sword reach out with one hand. The thing is, it's really common. Pass.
Pummel: Both Joker and Sword knees the victim. Not sure if this is as common as the grab though, but Captain Falcon's the progenitor of this.
F-throw: Now we're getting into different territory. Joker does a forward toss, Sword kicks the victim.
B-throw: Joker does Marth's b-throw. Sword roundhouse kicks.
U-throw: Joker throws directly upwards, kinda like (Dr.) Mario's. Sword thinks just tossing is for wimps and follows up with a midair spinning slash. Told ya spinning makes everything better.
D-throw: Both Joker and Sword slam the opponent off the ground. Joker, however, adds some flourish to it all too. Before we rush into any conclusions, it's kinda common since characters like Palutena, K. Rool and Lucas do this too.

Floor attacks (front, back, trip): Passing on this one too. Swinging back-and-forth's pretty damn common when rising up.

Edge attack: Joker's reminds me of Cloud's, being a slash, while Sword stabs akin to Link.

Specials: Hoo boy now we're getting complicated, since the Mii's have three different choices for their Specials:

B: Joker's Gun seems like the lovechild of Falco's and Bayonetta's. Falco's due to the animation while normally shooting, Bayo's because Joker can pull off similar gun stunts. Sword has the tornado, the shuriken or multi-hit stabs as choices here.
Side B: Joker's Eiha is a variant of Robin's Arc Fire in how it travels, with extra poison. Sword has the spinning charge, charged multi-stab and the chakram.
Up B: Joker's Grappling hook is a tether and upward version of Isabelle's rod. Sword has a sword version of Brawler's "Rise up, crash down", a series of sword strikes dashing in a straight line (which can be angled), and Link's Spin as choices.
Down B: Joker's Rebel's Guard reminds me of Incineroar's Revenge, only combined an expanded version of Cloud's limit mechanic. Here I'll make the exception since Arsene gives Joker a version of Palutena's counter - reflecting both melee and ranged attacks. Sword has a counter here too, true, but it works more like Marth's. The other Down Bs are a slash working like Mario's Cape and a dash forward similar to Falcon's / Ganon's but with a sword.

TL:DR:

I could see similarities in 4 or so moves between Joker and Sword - the thing is, the eyetest doesn't really work when a lot of the similar attacks are common with the cast (corkscrewing Nairs and one handed grabs). Given that disclaimer, other characters Joker appears to have borrowed from are Marth, Zero Suit and surprisingly enough Falco. Meanwhile, Sword shares some stuff with Link, and looks decently similar to Toon Link.

 

[Voe]

Side note: Let go of Doom Slayer and MK characters, and I'm saying this as a die hard fan of both franchises, it simply isn't happening. Take an honest step back and assess it.

Really dude? They'll have faithful moveset whilst ignoring the biggest thing about the game/characters? Are you serious?

They changed the blood to stars with Joker, excessively voilent video game characters will NEVER be in Smash.

I probably shouldn't have used the word faithful, seeing how people at times can't look past the blood and gore when it comes to Doomguy and an MK character for Smash. The point I wanted to make was that you can make a reasonably and creative play style and move set for these characters without the gore and brutal violence. I'll leave some examples as Spoilers in this post.

Spoiler: MK Rep case

If blood was that big of an necessity for an MK rep's move set then Sakurai could just make the sweating effect from the SNES version of MK1 as a neat attention to detail, or reference to when MK was originally censored.

The safest way you could go on about making a move set, as well as setting the tone for an MK rep in a game like Smash Bros would be to based them on MK games 1-UMK3. The older games don't look as brutal as the 3D MK era and the reboot timeline games. Imo UMK3 could bring the most out of a classic era Scorpion. He can have the Aggressor meter/gauge, which would be if the brawler characters in Smash had Cloud's LIMIT meter but for his all of his attacks minus his specials and grabs. His moves would majority look like how they did from the classic era but in 3D. He wouldn't be performing X-Rays and dismembering Pikachu. If majority of Scorpion's moves are based from his old game sprites you can see how simple his moves can be translated without the modern violence of MK9-MK11 games. And his Final Smash can be a flashier version of this Fatality, after he covers the enemy with flames you'll be insta killed similar to when you explode after dying by Mimikyu at high percents.

Spoiler: Doomguy's case

For Doomguy I've seen an example from the Doomguy Support thread where his whole gimmick would be collecting ammo and small health drops whenever you deal damage to your opponent (have this fly out of characters instead of blood). For Doomguy's guns he would have an ammo meter. For his health I'm sure there's a good way to balance out the amount of health drops you could get out of hitting your opponent but the healing would have to be minimal like the 2D food items, and come out much lesser than his ammo drops for the sake of balance.

For a visual reference I'd like to point out how Rivals of Aether handled this type of mechanic for a character. In RoA part of Shovel Knight's mechanic is that he can collect treasure that flies out of his opponents whenever he attacks them. For Doomguy's case the ammo and health flying out of enemies would look similar to this:

Doomguy wouldn't have a special where can call the ammo and health to him like a magnet so you would have to go pick them up himself. The health can also be used by your opponent, and depending on where the ammo and health falls your oppenent can use that as an advantage to keep you away from reloading your weapons when they're low. But his weapons wouldn't be his only attacks so Doomguy can go in and fight as a brawler for some of his attacks, as well as having strong, but short range grabs based from the new Doom games' Glory Kills. He just won't literally Rip and Tear people but instead send the opponent flying. Originally I thought if Doomguy did a Glory kill at higher percents he would just insta kill the opponent, but that might end up being too broken.

I'm not expecting an MK rep or Doomguy to show up in the Fighters Pass to be honest because I doubt Nintendo would go out of their way for a character from these franchises, regardless if MK11 for the Switch is around the corner and soon we'll have two Doom games on the Switch. But like I've said in this thread in the past, never say never.

And you do know that MK is banned in Japan for the massive amount of gore right? So why would that hack Sakurai add in a character from a franchise that's banned in Japan?

If this is the case and CERO won't allow MK in Sakurai's game then well, RIP Mortal Kombat for Smash. Unless of course there's a loop hole to all of this and Mortal Kombat could make it into a Japanese developed game like Ultimate, as long as the MK content doesn't go against Ultimate's rating. I'm not too familiar with Japan's rating system so I wouldn't know if such loop hole would be possible. With that said these characters fit Sakurai's criteria and also had a big impact on gaming throughout the years.

 

[SpectreJordan]

It's that kind of charm that really sold Jokers inclusion. Now that we have actually seen how the pack is structured I can confidently claim that Banjo-kazooie really has what it takes. This pack really was stuffed with content, but it seems that a candidate needs more than the base 3 requirements to work. Considering how you need Spirits, the franchise in question has to have characters to fill it in. Plus it is worth noting that the Mii costumes revealed were both from the pack franchise and the company that associated with it, Sega in this case.

If we get MS Mii costumes, I hope it’s just for Minecraft & Rare franchises. I don’t want to see Halo relegated to Mii costumes, I feel it’s too big for that lol

So we most likely aren't getting any news for the next fighter till E3. I have a prediction/hope myself. The Xbox event is the day before the Nintendo one. What if during it they reveal what looks like a new Banjo and Kazooie game, but it turns out to actually be the smash reveal trailer for them?

Then during nintendos direct, they go over banjo and kazooie, then say they are releasing later that day, and also announce a Banjo and Kazooie game coming for switch? Then maybe also show a trailer for the next character, coming sometime in Augest or September

It’d probably be the other way around. Microsoft announces a new Banjo game, then Nintendo announces the two in Smash the next game alongside a Switch port. There’s no way MS would let Banjo be exclusive to Switch.

 

[Lycan Rex]

Because that means Joker is using Mii Swordfighter as his base, which would mean the theory about Duck Hunt and Mii Sword crashing the game due to them being DLC bases is true

And ergo, Duck Hunt = Banjo Kazooie's base character

Thanks. There's so my theories and leaks going around it's hard to keep track of them all.

On another note, for any chrom fans out there, they changed his victory theme to match lucy and robin

 

[Mr. Stagg]

If we get MS Mii costumes, I hope it’s just for Minecraft & Rare franchises. I don’t want to see Halo relegated to Mii costumes, I feel it’s too big for that lol

Looking at the costumes we got from this pack I feel that the majority of them will be from Rare. Considering Chief was deconfirmed I dont think Chief will get Costumed due to Frank's tweet.

 

[weallfloatdownhere7]

Hey guys, just want to talk about this theory that I've been thinking about but it's about the Mii costumes returning as DLC because we just got the Tails & Knuckles Mii costumes back. So I went back to the old Wii U & 3DS smash bros and looked at the list of DLC Third party Mii costumes that was removed from Ultimate and it got me thinking what if Nintendo chose Characters from Sega (Joker who is made by Atlus but is owned by Sega), A Bandai Namco character which they can also sell the Bandai Namco Mii costumes, A Capcom character to sell the Capcom Mii costumes, & last Square-Enix character (Maybe Erdrick) to sell the Square-Enix Mii costumes again. I believe if they are doing this practice we could be looking at characters from Bandai Namco, Capcom, Square-Enix in the rest of the DLC line-up but honestly I don't know I just wanted put this theory out there.

I dunno if they’d choose characters from those companies just for the sake of selling Mii Costumes

 

[MissingGlitch]

I dunno if they’d choose characters from those companies just for the sake of selling Mii Costumes

It depends how cynical we want to be. Like I'm still thinking Nintendo is only going to add characters that have upcoming game releases so they can be used for advertising.

Then they can just double wammy on us by selling Mii costumes of said upcoming game/series. So it seems in the realm of possibility.

 

[Nazyrus]

I think it's a 50/50 situation, it migiht as well be in the cases of some characters that some of those miis will come back. If anything I think the one company i'm certain we will get a new rep from is Namco and have Lloyd mii back at least. Everyone else could be different companies and have nothing to do with it, having the remaining mii costumes just be randomly placed in the next dlcs. A pattern really isn'tt a pattern with only one ocassion, we have to see how and which miis are coming in 2nd pack before we consider this theory possible as a pattern, and even then Sakurai doesn't stick with patterns for long, hence why every year we fail to predict what he does. I do strongly believe Namco has to have someone coming tho, personally I think a Tales of rep is a must, it's like their FF and we don't even have spirits from that franchise, AT ALL. Anyways. this is derailing from Banjo, lol.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

The only thing is, Heihachi's VA died after his Incineroar role for Smash, so I don't think they'd feel ready to use him yet, out of respect for mr. Ishizuka.

We did get Akira upgraded as a assist trophy so there's Virtua Fighter in smash.

Yup. Jacky's toast, but polygon man lives on. With any luck, he may get enough supporters by the next game, so that's something.

 

[ColtonS25]

If we're talking about DLC only being characters with upcoming games, then I could definitely see the final lineup being something like:

Joker (Persona 5 Switch Port)
Erdrick (DQ11 Switch Port)
Banjo and Kazooie (Rare Replay Switch Port)
Phoenix Wright (New Ace Attorney game sometime??)
Some Wildcard Pick (I have no idea, only that it might be a 3rd party)

It makes sense from a marketing standpoint, and as long as the characters are cool, I don't have a problem with advertising. Unless it's Corrin. Heck FE Fates. I finished all 3 routes and really dislike Corrin. I really don't think that they deserve the roster slot tbh.

Anyways, since I haven't had the opportunity, I'll go ahead and give my most wanted for DLC!

Elma
Banjo and Kazooie
Geno
Phoenix Wright

Really hoping that the Joker being based on Mii Swordfighter theory holds up. That would give a huge boost to the bear and bird's chances. Otherwise, I could see Erdrick using Mii Swordfighter as a base and the theory still working. So, any updates on datamines? I haven't heard anything yet, but I haven't really been looking too hard.

 

[MissingGlitch]

Elma
Banjo and Kazooie
Geno
Phoenix Wright

I see you are a person of culture as well.

 

[Mr. Trumo]

Because that means Joker is using Mii Swordfighter as his base, which would mean the theory about Duck Hunt and Mii Sword crashing the game due to them being DLC bases is true

And ergo, Duck Hunt = Banjo Kazooie's base character

I thought the theory was that Mii Swordfighter was the base for Brave? (Given its Erdrick)

 

[MissingGlitch]

I thought the theory was that Mii Swordfighter was the base for Brave? (Given its Erdrick)

Nah we've been going with Duck Hunt behind brave. Duck Hunt is close to the same exact height brave is on his hind legs.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Nah we've been going with Duck Hunt behind brave. Duck Hunt is close to the same exact height brave is on his hind legs.

I've kind of wondered if Duck Hunt even fits that well as a base for Banjo Kazooie other than them having similar duo mechanics with just how Duck Hunt moves around, relies on projectiles for so much of the moveset, and also seems really light. I guess I always envisioned Banjo to have a little more weight behind him when he hits. And I also just don't want to see him end up looking too small...

 

[pupNapoleon]

If we get MS Mii costumes, I hope it’s just for Minecraft & Rare franchises. I don’t want to see Halo relegated to Mii costumes, I feel it’s too big for that lol

...but Minecraft is immensely 'bigger' than Halo in just about every way the phrase can be said...

 

[SpectreJordan]

...but Minecraft is immensely 'bigger' than Halo in just about every way the phrase can be said...

I love Minecraft, it’s one of my favorite games of all-time. But I feel most people would be fine with some Mii costumes & a stage.

Halo deserves a bit more than that. Halo getting into Smash but only as a Mii costume, would just be like “Why?”

To stay on topic, I feel the same way about Banjo potentially being a Mii costume.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I love Minecraft, it’s one of my favorite games of all-time. But I feel most people would be fine with some Mii costumes & a stage.

Halo deserves a bit more than that. Halo getting into Smash but only as a Mii costume, would just be like “Why?”

To stay on topic, I feel the same way about Banjo potentially being a Mii costume.

What exactly does a costume from Minecraft even looklike?
Is this a blocky skin? Or is it a mii in a colored shirt and pants?
Doesn't make much sense at all.

And what about Banjo would you want as a mii costume?

 

[MissingGlitch]

I've kind of wondered if Duck Hunt even fits that well as a base for Banjo Kazooie other than them having similar duo mechanics with just how Duck Hunt moves around, relies on projectiles for so much of the moveset, and also seems really light. I guess I always envisioned Banjo to have a little more weight behind him when he hits. And I also just don't want to see him end up looking too small...

It's more about how his model is set up to already have two models and how similar they would look to Banjo and Kazooie. It would just allow for better visualization.

 

[UnknownJ25]

I love Minecraft, it’s one of my favorite games of all-time. But I feel most people would be fine with some Mii costumes & a stage.

Halo deserves a bit more than that. Halo getting into Smash but only as a Mii costume, would just be like “Why?”

To stay on topic, I feel the same way about Banjo potentially being a Mii costume.

If Chief was a mii costume, I would actually be a bit angry. For a character as loved as chief that would be a slap in the face

 

[weallfloatdownhere7]

What exactly does a costume from Minecraft even looklike?
Is this a blocky skin? Or is it a mii in a colored shirt and pants?
Doesn't make much sense at all.

And what about Banjo would you want as a mii costume?

Makes more sense than an awkward blocky Steve trying to run around the stage

 

[ivanlerma]

i'd be fine with Master Chief as a Mii Costume, though now i'm seeing you guys believing it would be a shame to his franchises fame.

 

[SchAlternate]

Having Halo content in Smash in any capacity would be absolutely wild, no matter what the content actually is.

Best case scenario would be having the Chief himself as a playable character, but I think he was already deconfirmed.

 

[JonSmash]

yeah if chief got a mii costume it would open the door for future DLC CHaracter pack 2 or the next smash

think about it people would have to BUY his mii outfit so if it sells well they might want to add him as a character same for steve since those 2 are deconfermed at this point by people in the indestry

 

[KingMinjo91]

I've kind of wondered if Duck Hunt even fits that well as a base for Banjo Kazooie other than them having similar duo mechanics with just how Duck Hunt moves around, relies on projectiles for so much of the moveset, and also seems really light. I guess I always envisioned Banjo to have a little more weight behind him when he hits. And I also just don't want to see him end up looking too small...

From what I understand, Duck Hunt would be used as a base if true. Doesnt mean that all the stats or moves are the same or anything like that. Ike was used as a base for Cloud, for example (at least thats what ive read). Like someone previously said, it probably has more to do with the two models/fighting together thing they have going on.

As for how tall Banjo is, it would actually be pretty accurate when compared to his size in his games and artwork. Compare him to characters like Boggy and Bottles. Hes also in some japanese-only mario paint game, depicted as taking up slightly less space than Yoshi. Banjo was never really big or tall when you think about it.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I think Duck Hunt's Skeleton is far too different for Banjo to even come close to taking a base from them.

No, Banjo-Kazooie is far more likely to take a skeleton from someone like Fox, Falco, Wolf. Mario, or even Lucario before Duck Hunt. Their design philosophies just do NOT match in the slightest unlike Ike and Cloud or Bayonetta and Zero Suit Samus.

 

[Brothanigus]

I think Duck Hunt's Skeleton is far too different for Banjo to even come close to taking a base from them.

No, Banjo-Kazooie is far more likely to take a skeleton from someone like Fox, Falco, Wolf. Mario, or even Lucario before Duck Hunt. Their design philosophies just do NOT match in the slightest unlike Ike and Cloud or Bayonetta and Zero Suit Samus.

You wouldn't be saying this if you know how all this worked. And a skeleton is just a base, they can be modified in almost every way. Duck Hunt is perfect for B&K and no one else on the roster works. Kazooie, even in the bag, will have a skeleton.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

You wouldn't be saying this if you know how all this worked. And a skeleton is just a base, they can be modified in almost every way. Duck Hunt is perfect for B&K and no one else on the roster works. Kazooie, even in the bag, will have a skeleton.

Honestly, I do know how they work. The sleep deprivation must've taken over.

Either way, using Duck Hunt as a base is speculative because, unlike Smash for, there's no real reason to believe that these characters aren't built from the ground up, as t least as far as I'm aware. Was there anything that suggested Joker was built off of someone else?