AT / Mechanics Compilation

[Overswarm]

Does it do it with all characters or just Marth?

Does the way you're facing matter, or just the direction you are trumped?

This obviously isn't permanent after being trumped -- how long of a delay is it (generally speaking)

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Does it do it with all characters or just Marth?

Does the way you're facing matter, or just the direction you are trumped?

This obviously isn't permanent after being trumped -- how long of a delay is it (generally speaking)

Same thing happens to Lucina.

It needs to be done during a pretty short window of time after being trumped it seems, and when you are trumped you are always facing the stage by default. It would seem it's based off of your trump direction.

 

[Shaya]

I'm going to guess this is equivalent to what we're seeing with Wario flying around.
Reverse bucket breaking / some sort of momentum throwbacks occurring when you do an action that is meant to apply a force in a certain direction while another force is still moving you.

This happened in Brawl for Marth with dancing blade in certain scenarios, the common one being Pokemon Stadium 2's treadmills + ledges.
Both counter and dancing blade used to give you momentum in a certain direction; in counter this was just this jaged "down angle" shift, dancing blade was vertically upwards.

I'm thinking that applying a force during momentum is dangerous. Momentum cancelling in brawl into a special would actually "return" your momentum if it didn't stall you mid air, usually killing you. Something something vectoring involved using initial knockback something?

 

[Zigsta]

After some extensive testing this morning I can say that these experiences are either way off the anecdotal chart or just vague claims...I couldn't get anything to push me off the ledge, even Bowser smashes.

Interesting...sounds like this changed from the E3/SDCC demo. I'll definitely try this out with Bowser once the game releases in the US.

As for countering, does this happen with Ike, Little Mac, Lucario, and Greninja too?

 

[Neo Zero]

@ Dabuz and I did some more testing concerning being pushed off the ledge. While trying to shuffle didn't seem to produce any results, when I "jumped" it seemed to work as we've been seeing it. In the case of our experiments, if I jumped after being pushed off the ledge I would double jump. Perhaps its as simple as buffering an action while being slid back by the momentum of the shield push, to thus cause you to slide off the ledge. At the very least, rolling doesn't appear to work but jumping does.

 

[Shaya]

when you say double jump do you mean it would do two (or one) hops, or that you wouldn't have a second jump afterwards?

And are you in the air 'off stage' or are you just above it? (Like how is it different to jumping oos?)

 

[Neo Zero]

The momentum from the slide made it so when I jumped, I was to the side of the stage (using a double jump). Pressing jump once, it seemed to have just slid me off normally.

Basically, the slide doing this used my first jump, while I still had my second air jump to use.

 

[Dabuz]

Can confirm all the stuff Shirui said.

 

[Overswarm]

http://www.twitch.tv/shi_gaming/b/571271653

(after geninja matches in beginning)

DHD can glitch. Rosalina uses her item swirly thing and make it disappear OR can apparently take the smoking can and have it freeze in midair. It deals no damage to anyone but becomes a tangible object for Rosalina's opponent (DHD), so DHD's attacks hit the can. Unsure of its other effects.

 

[Overswarm]

Is there a limit to how long Pac-Man can hold his key item (or any other item) before it disappears, or is it permanent?

 

[Neo Zero]

@ Dabuz and I did more testing on the Shield slide ledge mechanic earlier

As mentioned, strong attacks with enough momentum (not sure how much is needed) can cause you to slide off the ledge. Buffering a jump will send you down off the ledge. Additionally, I was able to get it to work by pressing down, but it's far less consistent. It was more consistent when buffering a Down Aerial/Tilt though. Doing this you're able to send out an aerial while falling off (good for fast Fairs with good range). Additionally, you can double jump out of it, or tether the ledge almost immediately.

Also we were able to get the reverse to be true as well. Ike Fsmash while on the ledge shielded gave Ike enough momentum to fall off the ledge in a similar manner. Seems much harder to do though, and could only get it to work once.

Finally, something minor we noticed is you're invincible during the time you're falling down from a Shield Break. Doesn't mean much but it's something.

 

[Shaya]

The invincibility while falling down was a thing in Brawl too IIRC.

 

[Overswarm]

Size directly correlates to the auto-snap your character can receive. Tested with tiny mario on battlefield, the forgiveness for missing with his up+b seems to be much less. Won't mean much except for the Miis though, but this indicates that larger ones will likely have an easier time grabbing the ledge depending on their up+b.

 

[Overswarm]

Mario appears to have invincibility frames on his up+B?

 

[KuroganeHammer]

he had it in 64, and melee, and brawl so i dont see why not

 

[Overswarm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fllS4Ke2IN8

Apparently certain aerials spike with their early hits -- we knew this already with megaman's bair, but apparently heavier characters don't fall over from this spike while lighter ones do.

 

[Neo Zero]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fllS4Ke2IN8

Apparently certain aerials spike with their early hits -- we knew this already with megaman's bair, but apparently heavier characters don't fall over from this spike while lighter ones do.

The 2nd last hit of Greninja's Uair does something similar in that it spikes down.

Also, I get the spike effect from both Pit's and DP's Fair and Uair. However, only MK can knock down like that out of everyone I've tried so far, but this seems to be a mechanic of multi-hit aerials in general.

MK's Bair actually can do this, but it causes a ground bounce, rather than the straight on the floor feature his Fair does.

 

[Shaya]

I think that's been a Kirby character feature for a long time, but wasn't really pronounced outside of 64 (multi hit moves that alternated light hitboxes of sending you down and upwards).
Dedede's dair in Brawl could do the same thing, I think MK's back air did do "that" as well, but not exactly at this effectiveness.

 

[Overswarm]

Custom moves guaranteed on roulette:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKby5OKOE1U&app=desktop

Is there an "unlock guide" for the 3DS version? We might want to get one of those.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

So Greninja's uair can kill downwards at 8% off stage.

 

[Overswarm]

So Greninja's uair can kill downwards at 8% off stage.

Can you SDI out of it? From what I saw it took forever for it to occur. I've been able to get out of megaman's dash attack, mario's dair, and pikachu's d-smash / fair pretty easily in the demo but haven't been able to test other stuff on a japanese 3DS.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Can you SDI out of it? From what I saw it took forever for it to occur. I've been able to get out of megaman's dash attack, mario's dair, and pikachu's d-smash / fair pretty easily in the demo but haven't been able to test other stuff on a japanese 3DS.

I haven't seen anyone DI out from what they have posted, but I do think that would be an immediate thing to check if I had a 3DS copy on me :<.

 

[Overswarm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdpmXxQ5TIk#t=27

Wario's momentum glitch (according to a japanese video) appears to be simply holding up until the glitch occurs, then holding the direction you want to go. Wario CAN kill himself in this manner and it does not require massive knockback for this to occur.

 

[Overswarm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnLXfZlj2LA&feature=youtu.be&t=55s

You can lag cancel by throwing an item.

Edit:

This can only be done by pressing the "spawn item" input, not the throw command (so down+b with Link). Doesn't work with characters who do not throw with that kind of input. So far only the links and peach I think.

 

[Krynxe]

I'm sure this has been known already, but in case some people don't or it hasn't been stated yet: Dashdancing is very much possible. You just need to be very quick.

Some characters might not be able to do it, but every character I've tested thus far has been able to do it.

it's a good technique for occasional mindgames, showing off your swagger, and breaking your circle pad. I haven't found very many other applications for it yet

 

[Krynxe]

And again, for documenting purposes, DACUS is possible in Smash for 3ds

 

[Overswarm]

I'm sure this has been known already, but in case some people don't or it hasn't been stated yet: Dashdancing is very much possible. You just need to be very quick.

Some characters might not be able to do it, but every character I've tested thus far has been able to do it.

it's a good technique for occasional mindgames, showing off your swagger, and breaking your circle pad. I haven't found very many other applications for it yet

You mean the Brawl version of moving back and forth in one spot?

Dash dancing is dashing the full length of your initial dash animation back and forth, with the possibility of canceling it into the opposite direction at any point within that full initial dash. This allows you to constantly alter the space you occupy, dodging attacks that enter your initial dash range and easily countering their whiff.

The Brawl spasming back and forth was more of a quick movement that hopefully made your opponent shield so you could grab them.

 

[Overswarm]

Lil Mac's OHKO can do some crazy freaking stuff with momentum. I got grabbed by Kel's Marth as I was doing it and it just launched him over a stage length away, it looked a lot like the counter glitch Marth has.

 

[Shaya]

http://smashboards.com/threads/fox-trot-based-ats.371108/

 

[Deleted member 245254]

I recently made this and posted it to the Sonic forum. It seems Sonic's new spike to his dair has a pretty strict activation window. Maybe and ~ the first half of the animation after the input.

 

[Overswarm]

So I can cancel my aerial momentum with Greninja and Mii Sword Fighter by using a forward air near the ledge. It's seemingly lagless -- I was grabbing the ledge with Greninja, dropping down, jumping towards the stage, and forward airing but it would "pop" me up on the stage and I could immediately grab. It was pretty fast.

I did it on both Battlefield and Arena Ferox (non FD for both) and was able to semi consistently get it.

Brief video I just made, potato cam:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BeS_3NeiwhM&feature=youtu.be

 

[Overswarm]

Already known, but now video proof:

http://www.gfycat.com/MiniatureWhimsicalBarnowl

G&W can get two 9's in a row

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Sheik might have a chaingrab or at leasta pseudo one. You can use up air spike to ground opponents and grab them before they can do anything at low percents. At certain point that they can buffer a roll or a jab depending on the character

Gonna try to test it with someone tomorrow with Di/vectoring into account

 

[Overswarm]

can confirm, she can do that.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

The pseudo dash dancing is gonna be a lot easier on a gamecube.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

can confirm, she can do that.

Yea. I just don't know how vectoring factors in. You can go coast to Coast on FD on pika, charizard, greninja and lucario starting at 0. Stops working around 75

 

[Neo Zero]

Yea. I just don't know how vectoring factors in. You can go coast to Coast on FD on pika, charizard, greninja and lucario starting at 0. Stops working around 75

Does it actually work as you think it does? I thought I had one with Palutena a while back, using the spike off her Uair/Nair to regrab, but she's actually at a frame disadvantage when this is done. Is Sheik at frame advantage where you can get the grab no matter what?

I did some testing just now, and I noticed that my opponent (in this case, Ganondorf) could begin the start up frames of attacks, Shield and even roll out of this.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

That's what I'm about to test right now

 

[Neo Zero]

That's what I'm about to test right now

For what it's worth, I tested a variety of characters to see if they could CG like this or even just combo off the Multi Hit spike. Besides MK, the only one I got to combo (and thus, I believe is at frame advantage) is Zelda, who I'm able to combo the multi hit spike of her Nair into her Dtilt. I tested the Pits, DDD, Doc (Doc can actually set up a Dair spike at low percents to spike them down off a D throw by the ledge it would seem, but I didn't test it on that many characters), Zelda, Palutena, Jr, Greninja, Kirby, Mii Brawler, and Zero Suit Samus (maybe some others? Can't remember them all the moment though).

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Lucario can still do his aerial frame 1 force palm from the air I believe.

Pretty sure this means Link and Toon Link can still quick draw arrows.