Apex Legends Mafia: Boosted GAME OVER Who won?

[LaserGuy]

Maven89 , I would like an answer to this:

So which games in particular were you thinking of when you said you thought that my play here did not look like my previous games?

And also, can you explain what you found memorable about those games?

 

[LaserGuy]

Spoiler

Votes:
Mala -> Mala (1)
Ryker -> Xivii (1)
Laser -> Bessie (1)
Xivii -> Vicarin (1)
Ryker -> Vicarin (2)
Wam -> Sabrar (1)
Eido - > Bessie (2)
Mala -> Vicarin (3)
Frozen -> Red Ryu (1)
Red Ryu -> Vicarin (4)
Eido -> Unvote
Wam -> fonti (1)
Eido -> Xivii (1)
Xivii -> Wam (1)
Eido -> Sabrar (1)
Mala -> Unvote Vicarin (2)
Bessie -> Ryker (1)
Xivii -> Sabrar (2)
fonti -> Sabrar (3)
fonti -> Wam (1)
Sabrar -> Xivii (1)
Laser -> Wam (2)
Wam -> Xivii (2)
Ryker -> Sabrar (3)
Xivii -> Unvote UP (2)
Frozen -> UP (3)
UP -> Unvote Xivii (1)
Ryker -> Wam (3)
Red Ryu -> Bessie (1)
Xivii -> UP (3)
UP -> Wam (4)
Xivii -> Laser (1)
UP -> Maven (1)
Somi -> UP (2)
fonti -> Laser (2)
Bessie -> Laser (3)
Maven -> Laser (4)
Laser -> Maven (2)
Wam -> Maven (3)
UP -> Wam (2)
Frozen -> Wam (3)
Wam -> fonti (1)
Laser -> Xivii (1)
Somi -> Unvote UP (0)
Maven -> Unvote Laser (3)
Maven -> Mala (1)
Maven -> Unvote Mala (0)
Eido -> Wam (4)

If I'm missing something, let me know.

LaserGuy kind of weird that you called Wam town for his vote not following people, when his vote followed you.

Are you suggesting that wam and I are scum together because we both happen to post at the same time of day? Or am I missing something here?

If you are town, you have the ability to convince me. It is something I'm considering or I wouldn't bother talking to you, I'd just telling Xivii and Ryker to yeet you now.

I do not believe I am interpreting Wam or you in bad faith, and I will need specific example of where you believe my interpretation is wrong (for either him or you, whatever you prefer to talk about).

I'm going to come back to this a bit later. I'm not ignoring you, just this may take awhile to explain and my spider sense is tingling about something else that I feel may be more important. Remind me if I forget.

 

[LaserGuy]

Xivii , can you point me to where you responded to Sabrar's #345? This post:

I feel Xivii is getting desperate if he wants wam's help to yeet me while he himself is voting wam. He's not even reacting to the points I made.

• he wants flavor claim with an argument that makes no sense and for which there is no town-motivation
• he lives in the moment and doesn't have progression from his past self. This is shown a) by him discarding entirely his page 1 read on bessie in favor of a 'not voting' sus (which he should know from Sumthing - that he likes to bring up - is not relevant) and b) by not remembering what his earlier stance on the claiming was.
• he misrepresents my attack on him by wanting to get favors with Eido (wrong because timeline). Also Malak independently had the same suspicion as me and because of that this should be taken as a legit read. However he's not acknowledging that, he treats Malak gently because he's confirmed but he's attributing malice to me.

I am also interested in hearing your explanation for your Maven read in #326. Why didn't you respond to Sabrar when he asked you about this in #327?

 

[Xivii]

I don't know what more you want from me, it's a silly argument.

I responded to it here LaserGuy

 

[bessie]

The thing is, I knew you were going to vote Ryker as soon as it was the second page and he had ignored your question. So I was surprised that you didn't vote when you came back. Also, you keep framing this as if there was RVS, but it was over halfway into the first page which has been fairly common, and you already had something you were suspicious of so it wouldn't have been random.

Correct I don’t do RVS so my vote would have been serious. I wait on my vote a little while so that others can do RVS if they want. I’m still stuck in the mind set that once someone places a serious vote, RVS is over and players are expected to remove or justify their RVS vote. You know this because you played there. I've explained that here before too.

This is the one I'm referring to:
What was your intention?

Original post:

Bessie - I'm going back and forth on bessie. I'd like to wait until she responds to my meta question before going into this. I remember bessie trying to challenge someone's town read and that was suspicious. Actually, now that I think about it, really suspicious. Because it was on UP, someone she hadn't really been commenting on before. So as I'm writing this, I'm edging closer to the side of scum bessie.

The quote you're referring to is #749. My intent was point out that UP was buddying fonti. Re the underlined, I had commented on this before:
#620

Malakandara is mod confirmed town. Who is “everyone” on your list? At the time you made this post, I was voting for Ryker. Just going back one page to Page 13, Vicarin’s list Post #494 does not agree, he has Xivii and Maven near the bottom. So your “everyone” seems to be a select group of people. Or perhaps by everyone you actually mean fonti?

#739

I went back one page to see where you were getting the idea that everyone agreed with you, and easily found an example that didn’t. I think your posts #549 and #552 were more about trying to reinforce the idea in everyone’s mind that your views are the town consensus ( implying you are town and those that don’t agree aren’t town) and also about buddying fonti.

#749

Or your reads align with fonti’s, not fonti's align with yours.

Like really? He’s not pushing very hard, he’s pushing very carefully. But perhaps he will push harder now, now that he sees it meets with your approval.

And no I hadn't commented on Sabrar because I was still formulating my read when UP replaced.

I'm not sure what you mean with regard to my responses.

Ok.

 

[LaserGuy]

Why did you switch your vote from Xivii to Sabrar at this point?

Xivii Xivii I'm being mentored by Osie. I don't know how much that influences your thoughts about my behaviour. We talk about general Mafia things only.

Any particular reason you didn't mention this sooner?

Yeah will do ^ Going back to this:

Spoiler: Testing 1, 2, 3

Ryker / Fontisian / Xivii / Sabrar

^ They have set the stage. In Sabrar's case, I've been voting him, but he did put forward a discussion on Xivii that others have used as a talking point.

Red Ryu / Wam / Bessie

^ Feels in their own lane. Their points don't feel part of the wider group chat to me. I think Mafia could fake it here.

Frozenflame / Somitomi / Vicarin / LaserGuy / Maven

^ These are players who haven't advanced the group chat with anything new, or they come across as reacting more to the events around them / catching up. I think Mafia could fake it here.

The red is the player pool I would support with a vote right now.

Did Osie suggest you format your reads in this manner? I would still like to see a top-to-bottom ordered list from you.

Could you also tell me what you don't like about both Red Ryu and Maven?

 

[LaserGuy]

pedit The top question the above post should also be Eido

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Any particular reason you didn't mention this sooner?

Didn't remember who, but I do remember Chaco finding him an IC in the sign-up thread. Are you implying that it's scum behaviour?

 

[LaserGuy]

Didn't remember who, but I do remember Chaco finding him an IC in the sign-up thread. Are you implying that it's scum behaviour?

It's piqued my interest. But I'd rather let Eido give his comments before I commit to anything.

 

[Wam]

Quick post.

Bessie is scum. I have called bessie scum twice on what I am going to admit is a weak meta basis. She hasnt responded to either. Town bessie gets very aggressive when you call her scum and wouldnt ignore it. This is scum bessie.

Vote bessie

 

[Xivii]

Correct I don’t do RVS so my vote would have been serious. I wait on my vote a little while so that others can do RVS if they want. I’m still stuck in the mind set that once someone places a serious vote, RVS is over and players are expected to remove or justify their RVS vote. You know this because you played there. I've explained that here before too.

NOBODY READ THIS IT'S A RAMBLING STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS

The goal is always to move out of RVS as soon as possible. Anyway, as I said, we had left RVS before the end of page 1. You made this post here on page 4 and hadn't voted. That's what caught my eye. From experience, I do think you genuinely believe that you are being normal bessie and that I am catching you for the wrong reasons, but there are subtle differences in how you behave as scum that you may not be consciously aware of. It's the same way Sabrar caught you with the joker picture. There's a certain carefulness that comes from scum!bessie and that's what I was trying to get at page 1 but was premature. I do believe that town!bessie would have reacted to the joker but that scum!bessie believes that she wouldn't have because she's coming from a place of being informed. She knows Sabrar is town, so she doesn't want to bring attention to the joker picture in case it's a crumb. Town!bessie wouldn't know Sabrar is town though and so wouldn't be weighted toward the view that it's a crumb and ask about it. Similarly, town!bessie would have gotten on Ryker right away from the 'clear' statement and ignoring her. But scum!bessie knows Ryker is town and so doesn't react to it as she would as a town bloodhound. To her, she's being normal because she's clouded by her scum perspective.

Town bessie reacts to everything. She would have reacted to Sabrar's opening. She would have reacted to Laser claiming she missed a handshake. She would have reacted to me pointing out the MAS spelling by her and Ryker. None of this is occurring. Ninja-edit: and we add on top of that, what wam posted above. It doesn't feel like you're trying to drive the game forward, similar to LaserGuy. It's more like you're just reacting. And I don't really think the pacing is an excuse. There have been times the game was speedy, but for the most part it's been at a fairly balanced pace.

Ok.

What did you mean?

 

[Xivii]

The quote you're referring to is #749. My intent was point out that UP was buddying fonti. Re the underlined, I had commented on this before:
#620

Thank you, I see your flow of thought now. The response to Fonti is still scum indicative, however. You were trying to pick at her read.


This is indeed looks like scumbessie, I think. What does this mean for wam. What does this mean for Red Ryu. What does this mean for LaserGuy. Hmm. Hmmmmmm.

LaserGuy is still scum.
I'm not so certain on wam, but Fonti said he likes to bus, so he can still be scum. Not the lynch though given how many people want him to be.
Does Red Ryu have a genuine scum read of bessie and town read Laser because of sharing that read. Or is he informed. I'll have to look again.

 

[Xivii]

You know, I think we might just be dealing with TownRuy and scum Frozen here. I think Ruy just caught onto scum bessie early and took Laser's push as town indicative.

This looks bad from Frozen upon scum bessie:

bessie comes off townier given her reaction to me blowing off her deflective answer to me calling her post the fluffiest in the game. I don't think scum!bessie says "wow look at FF trying to dodge opining on maven" as if I should have known that in her eyes, maven could be attacked on the same grounds. very strange narrowing of the possible rebuttal against my slot if she's scum. She could just have easily said "wow look at FF ignoring me because his attack was bad and he knows it" when instead she jumped to the conclusion that I was trying to avoid addressing maven's slot which feels like town!bessie projecting her own comparison of herself against other slots onto my thought process without realizing it and getting a mistaken but understandable scum ping from it as a result

And this:

I don't think scum!UP has any problem pushing against town consensus when his slot is a real play consideration for a few slots. from my limited experience with scum!UP, he doesn't play aggro scum unless thunderdome'd or setting up a thunderdome is a necessary path to endgame. I'd expect to see more subtle FUD tactics coming from scum!UP in earlygame and I think his current play is consistent with that. UP's scum game I think revolves around subtle suggestion, getting people to doubt themselves without realizing its UP's commentary doing it. I think you're underestimating scum!UP having such early confidence that he's expressing genuine feelings here because to me, UP comes off as having an intentionally disarming approach which tracks with scum!UP imo

Both bessie and Frozen tried to discredit Fonti's UP town read. They are both trying to keep him as a play.

ultimately upon re-read the slot is less towny than I originally thought and am not opposed to a lynch here but given how Laser has been playing I think he will become easier to read as time goes on whereas I don't see that being the case for Wam at all

And I don't know how you spend an entire post showing how someone is scum just to say he's going to improve over time.

 

[Xivii]

This is literally something that I propose every game that is a closed setup, but if I guess it every game I'll have to be right some time right: multiball - Laser & Wam, Bessie & Frozen? I think that makes Masons make sense.

not really opposed to mass claim, I don't think Chaco would lie about randomizing the alignments and my role could just as easily be a scum role as it would still have utility in that capacity so from my limited POV randomization checks out

This still makes no sense.

 

[Vicarin]

You think that 2 pairs of scum would mean Masons would be more balanced with Malakandra in game? Thought 2 scum teams of 2 would be typically easier to deal with as town than one team of 4 or even 3 given the chance of cross kills.

 

[Vicarin]

Xivii I know you love coming up with more theories, but if you had to settle on a town-scum list for right now, what would it be? I know you gave a reads list earlier today, but you're changing around people on it rather often apparently.

 

[Chaco]

“I try until it hertz- get it?”


Vote Count 1.:
Wam(4): Ryker, UtopianPoyzin, FrozenFlame, Eido
Xivii(2): LaserGuy
Bessie(2): RedRyu, Wam
LaserGuy(3): Xivii, Bessie, Fontisian


Not Voting(4):
Vicarin, Malakandra, Somitomi, Maven89

Two and a half days until deadline, roughly.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Xivii's right in that everything he said had a backdoor built into it. Most recently, he's just largely been more focused on continuing arguments (Bessie color shenanigans and defending himself against Xivii) than actually progressing toward something. Off the top of my head, I can recall him asking Eido for a read list and asking Wam a mechanical question.

I'm reading his reasoning and defense but I do not see this.

I think he is trying to flesh out his reads and get something going, more so he does not like Xivii play this game. Only major issue I got with Xivii myself is the speculation on character claims which is weak sauce.

I get the color thing being weak, I didn't agree with that either. But I think his push was legit thinking he caught a potential slip. Even Xivii pushed Bessie a bit on that earlier. Has he been pushing that as a main talking point still? I don't think he has. More so his posts imply his main pushing point is Bessie fits a scum meta with not much for content despite walls of posts.

I do not think Bessie has been considering your play in mind when trying to analyze you. Rather posturing at the time.

The other stuff I did not read deep into but I do think laserguy is trying to develop reads and find scum this game.

 

[Malakandra]

FYI I will be gone this weekend starting on Friday at 3 P.M. EST. So rather than having your IC be away for the final day, I propose we make the deadline Thursday at 6 P.M. EST artificially. Then just hammer who ever has plurality at that time. Thoughts?

I will also be working on compiling all my notes and thoughts so far into a somewhat concise list that I will post tomorrow.

 

[Vicarin]

Perfectly fine by me.

 

[fontisian]

I'm reading his reasoning and defense but I do not see this.

I think he is trying to flesh out his reads and get something going, more so he does not like Xivii play this game. Only major issue I got with Xivii myself is the speculation on character claims which is weak sauce.

I get the color thing being weak, I didn't agree with that either. But I think his push was legit thinking he caught a potential slip. Even Xivii pushed Bessie a bit on that earlier. Has he been pushing that as a main talking point still? I don't think he has. More so his posts imply his main pushing point is Bessie fits a scum meta with not much for content despite walls of posts.

I do not think Bessie has been considering your play in mind when trying to analyze you. Rather posturing at the time.

The other stuff I did not read deep into but I do think laserguy is trying to develop reads and find scum this game.

Without looking back through the thread, tell me who Laser wants to yeet and why.

 

[Wam]

I'm fine with a fake deadline but I'm GMT so may not be around at deadline. Although currently its 1 hour less difference than normal which helps.

 

[Maven89]

Laser, the game was the crossover game we had on your site. I got night killed N1 in it. But either way, it’s irrelevant, because my read on you is not based on meta, as I’ve already declared.

I still need Ryker to answer Malakakaksk question

 

[LaserGuy]

Laser, the game was the crossover game we had on your site. I got night killed N1 in it. But either way, it’s irrelevant, because my read on you is not based on meta, as I’ve already declared.

Oh, I had forgotten you were in that game. Did you follow along closely after you died?

 

[LaserGuy]

Xivii , can you answer this part?

I am also interested in hearing your explanation for your Maven read in #326. Why didn't you respond to Sabrar when he asked you about this in #327?

 

[Maven89]

Oh, I had forgotten you were in that game. Did you follow along closely after you died?

Why do you keep harping on this when it’s irrelevant?

 

[LaserGuy]

Why do you keep harping on this when it’s irrelevant?

I'm trying to figure out whether or not you scumslipped.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Without looking back through the thread, tell me who Laser wants to yeet and why.

bessie, scummy behavior fluffy posts that lead nowhere.

xivii for odd behavior and reads he found questionable.

wam because survival and not town in his eyes.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

FYI I will be gone this weekend starting on Friday at 3 P.M. EST. So rather than having your IC be away for the final day, I propose we make the deadline Thursday at 6 P.M. EST artificially. Then just hammer who ever has plurality at that time. Thoughts?

I will also be working on compiling all my notes and thoughts so far into a somewhat concise list that I will post tomorrow.

I can try no promises I will be here at this time, I will be voting + maybe disc golf with furries.

 

[Malakandra]

Thats fine, this doesn't need to be a strict deadline. Just a hey try to get your votes in by around this time.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm getting real bored while waiting for new stimuli. Probably going to try and ISO another player tonight or tomorrow, but damn am I tired of the waiting period before deadline gets close enough for people to be realistic with their votes.

Maybe we artificially deadline tomorrow as proposed, if so we work on the yeeting and pushing.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Yeah and then I lied to Sabrar about the cop result on Xivii he sent me only for Xiv to die and flip scum right after. That was fun...

Ok, so you're saying the mason chat might involve people who don't know each other's alignment? Can some DGames regular tell me if that's considered normal (or possible) around here? Assuming it is, what do you think of Ryker's alignment then? Is town-Ryker vouching for the alignment of the penpal for some reason? Or is scum-Ryker hoping town-penpal dies first, giving them conftown status?

We're gonna have a scramble anyway, just embrace the chaos.
On a serious note, Wam yes, some of his posts (particularly their take on Ryker's claim) pinged me, Laserguy probably not.

I did question the mason claim, but came to the conclusion that it's likely true given Ryker's offer to claim in their very first post and their behavior.

Yeah, I've been generally somewhat demotivated lately and it's not helping me play mafia (or do any of the other things I want to or should).

if you need time for yourself I recommend you might consider replacing out. I’ve been in that spot the past few weeks. It’s just mafia if you don’t feel that fire. Don’t force it if you do not feel the urge.

Otherwise of you feel the urge with a bit of rest, give it a go. But like with what Ryker said, do make sure to care for yourself and never forget to do that.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Laser, the game was the crossover game we had on your site. I got night killed N1 in it. But either way, it’s irrelevant, because my read on you is not based on meta, as I’ve already declared.

I still need Ryker to answer Malakakaksk question

I still need Fonti to answer because that's what I was asked to do.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

vote bessie

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I'll give a full updated read list after Fonti gives her answer.

 

[Xivii]

Xivii , can you answer this part?

I'm sorry dude, but no. Why does this matter? You didn't even follow up on the last question, which I intentionally brushed off to see if you would. You're just asking questions for the sake of looking busy.

 

[fontisian]

Alright, alright, jeez.

They're both town. Xivii's doing his paranoid explore all worlds thing and fluidly moving through his suspicions as they do scummy or towny things.

Ryker's in the same place as me a lot, his response to me asking him to stop disrespecting Sabrar was to be paranoid that I was scum trying to manipulate his process, and the mason claim means he's locked into a corner if he gets to late game anyway.

 

[fontisian]

I'm sorry dude, but no. Why does this matter? You didn't even follow up on the last question, which I intentionally brushed off to see if you would. You're just asking questions for the sake of looking busy.

How sure are you about the Bessie thing? You don't have to answer right now, but I think there's some stuff pointing against Bessie/Laser and I want to get into that before eod if you think both are scum.

 

[fontisian]

I will say that I experienced some doubts on Xivii earlier today, because his language felt kind of wooden, but I think they're representative of me being in a weird headspace than Xivii actually not being town.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Ok, so first the answer to the previous question:

Xivii - While I can always be wrong, I like him. He's obviously searching. Even if he were to be scum, he's acting in a protown manner at the moment by stirring the pot moreso than anyone else at this point in the game. He's reads snap back and forth constantly, but that's standard fare from what I remember and further indicative that he's trying to find scum and inform his world view rather than trying to frame the game the way he wants.

Font - Font's probably town. She generally lines up with my way of thinking and is, much like Xivii, looking around trying to find scum. I would need for her to be very wrong on her push into Laser/Wam and see how that was handled and where she goes next before I would reconsider. THAT BEING SAID, I did tell my mason partner to bring up another look at this slot should I die before I could do it. FF got pinged by the exact same thing and I'm not altogether comfortable with her inserting herself into a proposed townblock. Between that and her "Laser" focus at this stage, check the slot later, but like, way later. Would need more to come to light before I would be willing to come after Font.