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An index of "leaks" and status: forbrawlbattle's "second post" and Brawl360 removed

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RedrappeR

RedrappeR

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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294
Aeris said:
Hmm, I wonder to whom you might be preaching...could it be moi? Well, in that case:

1) Hyperbole has its place; don't forget it. Words like "abomination," "horrendous," and the like are used for effect (or at least when I've seen them). Granted, they still betray a disappointment with choices made about this roster, but I think you're overanalyzing the word choice of many of us malcontents.

2) I don't agree with the people that simply say how awful the roster is sans explanation. Some, however, bring up valid concerns and problems with what has been (allegedly) revealed. (I will touch more upon this in the next section.)

3) Oh, what a difference 10 characters make, though! You're comparing two radically different times: think of it as the world pre- and post-World War II. A major event (allegedly true roster reveal) that turned the world upside down. (Again, hyperbole--learn to understand it. But there is absolutely no denying that the Smash community isn't generally up in arms about all of this.) When it was simply the 25 characters revealed by the DOJO, the roster seemed perfect. Sakurai was really taking directly from the famed "journal," and it seemed like this game was all about fanservice. We had so many newcomers, and it seemed unlikely that we could possibly have seen most of them...there had to be plenty more hidden newcomers, too...right? Until this alleged leak came to pass, I was convinced that this roster would be truly perfect. Delusional? Perhaps. But few of us had any reason to doubt that Sakurai was doing everything possible to please as many fans as possible: plenty of characters, and good ones at that.

Since you are most likely addressing my disdainful remark about the "ridiculously small" roster, that was more in reference to a point brought up by FlipTroopa. I could live with a 35-character roster, don't get me wrong; but my sardonic comment was more criticismic of the way in which Nintendo's own hype and information have shaped our collective expectations for the game. Sakurai has hinted that this would be his last game, or at least the last Smash game. The DOJO frequently makes note of things being as good as they possibly can be, saying that "they really have thought of everything!" Our expectations are high for a good reason.

Your figures aren't necessary in this case; I know that 35 is a big number for a character roster in a fighting game, and I'm sure most of the community here does as well. The only games that come to mind with higher numbers are MvC, and that's a different beast altogether. (Although Smash-X was kind enough to post roster numbers that were actually higher than 35, just for reference.) As you might have noticed (in perusing the thread's previous pages), members like ChronoBound and myself are disappointed with the quality, NOT quantity of the roster.

And in that same vein, the reason many of us are disappointed is not because there are only 10 characters left; we are disappointed because of who is left. Most of these "last surprises" are highly unsurprising: 6.5 veterans, 3.5 newcomers. (I use halves because Toon Link is essentially Young Link--a veteran--with a graphical overhaul, making him technically a newcomer.) Among those newcomers, two are HIGHLY questionable (Wolf and R.O.B.), and one is questionable in the sense of who it replaced (Lucario replacing Mewtwo). The fact that StarFox gets three representatives, at least one of whom will likely be a Fox clone, seems odd when a franchise like Metroid is still left with Samus by her lonesome--not to mention the fact that Wolf hadn't NEARLY the amount of fan support that Krystal had.

Also lacking is the element of surprise. These characters, these faces that we've all seen before--THESE are the hidden characters?! We expect something unexpected and exciting; to leave rehashed characters as "secret" seems anticlimactic. This is what posters like FlipTroopa and myself mean when we say that our hype for the game has died. There isn't anything terribly exciting about the characters left to be revealed. Three-fourths of the remaining combatants have all been seen before, and the other quarter of them are questionable choices. To unlock Ridley, for example, would be far more surprising and enjoyable than unlocking, for example, Wolf.

4) Ah, the personal reference. Since you are so interested in figures--including my high post count--might I suggest that you take a peek at when I joined these boards? ...August 2001, you say? Ah, I see. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but Brawl was first officially announced at E3 '05--May 2005, am I right? And, well, barring some strange rift in the time-space continuum, I find it to be a physical impossibility for me to have "HONESTLY" become so enthralled with this game "SOLELY FOR THE PURPOSE" (i.e. "JUST BECAUSE") of expecting an unconfirmed character whose chances aren't guaranteed.

Yes, 'tis true: I joined in anticipation of Melee way back when. And I never got involved with the Smash series because I was truly hoping that X character would be playable--that's foolish. I became enthralled with the series because Nintendo has been a huge part of my life since age 3. To me, the Smash series encapsulates so much (if not all) of what Nintendo is. I love the Smash series for its style, its gameplay, and its celebration of Nintendo's history.

That being said, despite my love of Smash stemming from its overarching features, the specifics DO matter, and no specific aspect is more important than the roster itself. One excluded character does not a bad roster make (again, hyperbole is our friend sometimes!), but a slew of them missing does tend to fuel discontent with the final product. It isn't as though I will boycott the game and curse the name of Nintendo. Of course I'll buy the game on release day, probably as early as possible so I can play it as much as possible on the day of release. It just won't be nearly as exciting as it could have been--wasted potential, to be frank.

So, in short, I think that there are overreactions throughout the thread, but I wouldn't call them a majority by any means. MANY of us are legitimately dissatisfied with the roster for realistic reasons--very few people were expecting 75 characters with 4 reps per franchise or something exorbitant. I think you're either misconstruing some of what has been said by a good number of us, or simply overemphasizing those who do not rationalize their complaints.

And, since you chose to go toe-to-toe (;)): who are you to complain about this thread and those who post in it? Come down off that high horse for a second; no one asked you to come preach to the disgruntled masses, and I honestly don't think your admonitions are as necessary as you have deluded yourself into believing. If you are so aggravated with this thread every time you come back, there's a simple solution: don't.

Much as your misguided, pseudo-altruism has driven you preach to us, I must likewise stress a point to you:

Many members of the Smash community were highly disappointed with Melee's final roster. Many members of the Smash community will be similarly disappointed with Brawl's final roster. There will be plenty of complaining; frankly, I think this thread is just the tip of the iceberg. Granted, it will die down after a good while, but it won't be immediate.

And, again, if you are so aggravated by the general dissatisfaction with this roster, just think: wouldn't you rather people complain now instead of later? I, for one, would much prefer to get it all over with now.

I look forward to reading your original message once again. And, say, if you really want to garner some attention, don't just go bold--underline and italicize, pump the text up to size 7 (at least!), and put it all in red! I'm sure that will get the message across.
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For future reference, I wasn't addressing you specifically, I was using you as an example to illustrate a point.

And I will apologize for labeling you, because you actually brought up some valid points in that previous post. But that's the thing..

1. I'm not on a high horse. I'm being honest. I don't think I'm better than you guys, I'm thinking a lot of the people on this board are better than they're acting. That's my point.
2. Hyperbole does have it's place, but when you read "it's a bad roster" compared to "this roster is an ABOMINATION", there's a difference.
3. I'm a writer. Most of the time when you write dialogue you capitalize certain parts of the sentence for emphasis. Maybe that leaked through.

So yes, my misunderstanding on that. But shorter versions of the post you just did is what I'm not seeing. It's like the past two times I've come in here, it IS overreaction.

but I still standby the fact that this ISN'T the worst roster ever created.
 
LavisFiend

LavisFiend

Smash Lord
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Apparently, you guys missed my post the first time around. I'll just edit it in here.

Assuming smashboards doesn't lock me out with it's ****ty server.

EDIT*

Food for thought:

Had they revealed this information prematurely, Nintendo can (and will) background check for breaking the NDA act.

They would be fired from their jobs; possible even threatened with fines....

NOBODY is going to risk their life over a video game roster.

They are throwing you for a loop because if they told you the ACTUAL ROSTER THEY WOULD HAVE NINTENDO BREATHING DOWN THEIR NECKS!

They released an incomplete roster.

Now everyone; shut up.
 
Tree Gelbman

Tree Gelbman

100 Percent Done
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Most games have a rating on the disc. I even checked. Sorry, I think this might be fake. Who did you say posted this?
 
Masque

Masque

Keeper of the Keys
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RedrappeR said:
For future reference, I wasn't addressing you specifically, I was using you as an example to illustrate a point.

And I will apologize for labeling you, because you actually brought up some valid points in that previous post. But that's the thing..

1. I'm not on a high horse. I'm being honest. I don't think I'm better than you guys, I'm thinking a lot of the people on this board are better than they're acting. That's my point.
2. Hyperbole does have it's place, but when you read "it's a bad roster" compared to "this roster is an ABOMINATION", there's a difference.
3. I'm a writer. Most of the time when you write dialogue you capitalize certain parts of the sentence for emphasis. Maybe that leaked through.

So yes, my misunderstanding on that. But shorter versions of the post you just did is what I'm not seeing. It's like the past two times I've come in here, it IS overreaction.

but I still standby the fact that this ISN'T the worst roster ever created.
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No problem, and I hope I didn't sound too argumentative. I'm a fan of writing as well, so it's nice to see someone with a similar appreciate for the power of the written word. Sometimes, however, my emphases will go unnoticed because of both the subtlety I try to convey from time to time (gotta make people think!) and the "that's a given" understanding of what I am saying that is already present in my mind.

I will concede that it isn't the worst roster created, and that, too, is an understatement. But I certainly am not satisfied with this roster for reasons that I think we might both agree are at least understandable.

So how about it: agree to disagree? ;)
 
F

FlipTroopa

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Well... that pic confirms it. Somebody wake me when anything remotely interesting appears in this game. I have a life to go back to.
 
Darkraid

Darkraid

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Nonono the pic is real but the roster that was given was fake. Why would the leaker not post a pic of the final roster, but the starters?
 
Tree Gelbman

Tree Gelbman

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No not over....we still have too many loop holes. Krystal voice leak. Animal Crossing rep. Balloon Fighter fish pointed out. Ridley hints. It just all doesn't add up yet.

I'm so confused about this game right now.
 
S

Shuma

Smash Hero
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Messages
5,407
Shut up, we have no proof that it's real, it's very possible it's real however, so everyone should brace for impact.
 
B

Black/Light

Smash Master
Joined
May 23, 2006
Messages
3,207
JustABill said:
No not over....we still have too many loop holes. Krystal voice leak. Animal Crossing rep. Balloon Fighter fish pointed out. Ridley hints. It just all doesn't add up yet.

I'm so confused about this game right now.
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Krystal VA. . .NPC like Slappy.
AC character. . .doesn't need a rep to have a icon/ That sticker doesn't have to be FOR a AC character.
BF. . . .being repped by that fish on that stage.
Ridley. . .I have no idea what hints to him.
 
K

KirbySSB

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Shuma said:
Shut up, we have no proof that it's real, it's very possible it's real however, so everyone should brace for impact.
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This MOCKUP was posted a long time ago of how the character selection screen looks once its filled up



NOW, hours later, we received a leaked image of the STARTING ROSTER which PERFECTLY MATCHES THE LEAKED ROSTER if you take away the secret characters.

Not to mention how four separate people all came up with the same 35 character roster.

35 characters for brawl.
 
S

Shuma

Smash Hero
Joined
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Messages
5,407
Look, i know this roster is probably the real deal and i like it, however, we don't really have any concrete proof, the "rows" where like that in Whoby(probably) so anyone that played the demo, could "predict" that. Secondly, the internet is full of *******s, this guys know each other and could very well be toying with us, most of the "vetarans" in the forum where the 35 Char roster was leaked didn't take it too seriously.
 
Tree Gelbman

Tree Gelbman

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Really? I can't believe you guys would think they'd leave out Luigi, deliberately hint at characters, and pick ****ing R.O.B. for Sakurai's potentially final Smash Bros game. This whole situation is fishy.
 
iluvnintendo1983

iluvnintendo1983

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
217
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If the 35 character roster is real, and the leaked picture of the starting roster is real...then that means that out of all the unlockables, only 5 are new characters - ROB, Wolf, Lucario, Sonic, and Snake. Also, cartoon Link...but I just consider him to be a different variation of "Young Link" myself.



Pure suckage. :urg:
 
0

0ranger

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Joined
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Messages
64
Location
Buffalo, NY
Has anyone mentioned that the 35 roster will produce 4 rows of exactly 9 chars? ZSS eventually gets her own icon, if I remember right. 36/4 = 9
 
K

k4polo

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
205
Location
Conyers, Georgia
hmm I believe the list about two weeks ago since the prophets looked to be in common with this list.. Plus you add the many correct prophets up. MarkMan(Hes a cool dude).

I had to toss aside my preferences though. But hey have fun man with this game
 
Elysium

Elysium

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
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Zek said:
"GoateBoate
Posted 1/19/2008 10:06:43 PM
message detail I will admit. I have no credibility whatsover on my own part because I will not reveal my source. However, I will tell you what I know to be correct. The "rows" indicate each row in the character select screen. The characters go from left to right on each row.

Row 1

Mario
DK
Link
Samus
Kirby
Fox
Pikachu
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch

Row 2

Luigi
Diddy Kong
Zelda
Pit
Meta Knight
Falco
Pokemon Trainer
Ike
Snake

Row 3

Peach
Yoshi
Ganondorf
Ice Climbers
King Dedede
Lucario
Ness
Sonic
Bowser

Row 4

Wario
Toon Link
R.O.B. (star fox)
Captain Olimar
Captain Falcon
Lucas
Wolf
Jigglypuff"
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KirbySSB said:
This MOCKUP was posted a long time ago of how the character selection screen looks once its filled up



NOW, hours later, we received a leaked image of the STARTING ROSTER which PERFECTLY MATCHES THE LEAKED ROSTER if you take away the secret characters.

Not to mention how four separate people all came up with the same 35 character roster.

35 characters for brawl.
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Look at the times. According to this, that picture has been out for awhile and that person called this "roster" on the 19th.
So someone took a look at this picture and disguised it as a leak.

This roster sucks.
 
Boofer

Boofer

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 25, 2007
Messages
755
iluvnintendo1983 said:
If the 35 character roster is real, and the leaked picture of the starting roster is real...then that means that out of all the unlockables, only 5 are new characters - ROB, Wolf, Lucario, Sonic, and Snake. Also, cartoon Link...but I just consider him to be a different variation of "Young Link" myself.



Pure suckage. :urg:
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Yes, I agree. I've been saying this for the longest. Truthfully, we should at least have just as many secret newcomers as secret vets. It just doesn't make sense for most of the SECRET characters to be characters that we've already played as.

0ranger said:
Has anyone mentioned that the 35 roster will produce 4 rows of exactly 9 chars? ZSS eventually gets her own icon, if I remember right. 36/4 = 9
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Uhh...Did you not see that random button? And what are talking about "if I remember right?"
 
Chepe

Chepe

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Messages
1,146
So, does anyone know WHEN exactly that mockup was made? And... a lot of people are going to think R.O.B. is a Star Fox character with that setup...
 
0

0ranger

Smash Cadet
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Messages
64
Location
Buffalo, NY
Boofer said:
Yes, I agree. I've been saying this for the longest. Truthfully, we should at least have just as many secret newcomers as secret vets. It just doesn't make sense for most of the SECRET characters to be characters that we've already played as.



Uhh...Did you not see that random button? And what are talking about "if I remember right?"
Click to expand...
I forgot about the random button, but didn't the demos give ZSS her own icon? Maybe it was a demo specific thing.
 
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