Q&A Ambitions as a Plumber; A Mario FAQ

[condemned_soul]

Dairs help me out some much in that match up which can lead to a grab or a Utilt. even though he has way more projectiles then you, still shoot a few fireballs to throw off/ cancel his items because once link/Ylink get on a role with their items, bad news.

um depends.....ill say falco/Ganon because falco lasers and if the ganon know his range very well, mario can get outrange and can get killed quick for it.

 

[voorhese]

ganons my favorite matchup, and i like vs falco to lol...but i dont play super experienced player with my mario so...

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I actually switched my secondary to ganon because of that. not only is he bad news for Mario, but he has the range mario lacks. I also second Marth....I"m not big on techskill as you can see lol

falco seems like an uphill battle for most/all of the melee cast
armada once said those lasers are overrated
they're not
srsly

 

[condemned_soul]

I love the combos I can pull off against ganon, its just that his freaking Uair and Fair are very annoying when ganon know the mario MU. I shouldnt have to add Dair because everyone should knoe how evil and manly that move is.

Falco.....those **** lasers are so hard to escape. people can say well avoid them but if that were true, he wouldnt be our hardest match up. Once again I shouldnt have to explain to you how gay his Dair is because if i have to you dont play falcos then.

M@1 go revive the mariotality thread for me so i dont double post pls

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I went to Apex
that was all the falco experience I needed lol
swear to god everybody there had a falco secondary
it was ridiculous
and also I read on the ganon boards that they don't really approach
they just wait for people to run into their fair/nair
so maybe, you can wavedash under it/go above it with a dair and get into those nasty combos that you can pull off on a big boy like ganon

 

[condemned_soul]

my favorite move to do to ganon is to wavedash shffl Nair. OMG that move has save me so many times. It helps me out speed ganon because for me to do this move, I have to be pretty close since i know that ganon is going to shffl Fair DI'ing backwards

 

[M@1funk$hun]

thats true. they do like to retreat with a fair
never see retreating nair
retreating uair would probably be a better option but it isn't used in favor of the fair
the main thing I do with ganon is perfect waveland to jab
god that covers so much

 

[condemned_soul]

I dont think a retreating nair would do so good against mario. even if it does, the fair would be a better option.

 

[Lordydennek]

wait for the ganon to do a move. then move forward then he will
a)shield
b)jump to do a move
c)jab
d)move backwards

if he sheilds-no biggy here either wd to grab or fh a ball then ff it into whatever. mind game with spacing and wait for him to move oos then punish
if he jumps-yay! just what I would want. uair him...combo city. nuff said
if he jabs-run back and ball. its best to play campy cuz theres not much speed in ganon and you can rack up LOTS of damage from balls
if he moves backwards-still not a bad option you get to either predict his backwards move and follow up with a fair or uair or nair or wd dsmash or grab or well you get the picture. just watch out for a jab or ftilt. if he starts punishing you with those, go back to the campfire. make him come to you then punish his bad spacing.

 

[condemned_soul]

thats true. they do like to retreat with a fair
never see retreating nair
retreating uair would probably be a better option but it isn't used in favor of the fair
the main thing I do with ganon is perfect waveland to jab
god that covers so much

I dont like their Bairs either

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I dont like their Bairs either

yeah bairs are usually troublesome for me too
but luckily they live in the woods and usually don't bother people

 

[condemned_soul]

can ganon combo anyone into a warlock punch?

 

[M@1funk$hun]

No.
his dair is too strong to do that
and I think his pawnch is a little longer than C. Falc's

 

[Lordydennek]

of course he cant...

 

[A2ZOMG]

On Yoshis, Ganon can combo fastfallers into Warlock Punch at a certain percent range. He has to spike Fox/Falco from above a platform for it to work, but it definitely can combo.

Ganon vs Mario is a really really dumb matchup though. You can combo Ganon a lot, but he just never dies unless you F-smash him, which unfortunately is hard to combo on him. His recovery isn't nearly as gimpable as Falcon's, so every KO against Ganon requires a ****load of work. While on the other hand, Ganon just kills you by landing like 6 well-spaced aerials which have MORE RANGE than your F-smash. Plus his AMAZING F-tilt can easily wall most of your approaches and pretty much every hit Ganon lands is almost guaranteed to get you offstage, which is just a horrible position to be in.

I would consider Ganon to be like Mario's 2nd or 3rd worst matchup or something like that. He's just really stupidly bad for Mario. He outspaces you and refuses to die and kills you really easily. I mean hell, I actually use Ganon and use him to counterpick against other people who use Mario against me since I personally feel it doesn't take much work for Ganon to beat Mario.

 

[Lordydennek]

I disagree. playing smart against a ganon prevents you from being outspaced. its easy to gimp him honestly. edgeguards and cape and dsmash. this is 4000 times easier than cfalcon and a great mu for mario overall.

its all about being patient then taking advantage of his sloooow move speed. nairs in his face destroy him. and uairs combo him real easy. remember mario is really fast. get in there and tear him up everytime he spaces poorly or does a laggy move. lure him into bad situations

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I agree that it's easy to gimp him
that's it
I agree with A2 with everything else
if you're playing a good ganon, they will space things, and they will not give you much chance to take advantage of the movement speed

 

[Lordydennek]

sit back and ball him for a bit. if you have room, better to play him on stages like fd or poke. fod might be the best option. dl is ok too. but if ur gonna take him to ys be careful. a fair or two will end you there. depends on your play style.

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I try to NOT take anyone with a range longer than mario's fsmash to yoshi's story. just a rule of thumb

 

[Lordydennek]

not a bad rule. altho i do like fighting peach there. despite the dsmash

 

[j3ly]

mario can navigate ys almost as well as FoD. fox and marth **** us here, and they all know it. falco can shine -> shine kill us off the top. falcon will kill you at 40% if he catches you there with a dair -> knee

all this being said, the walljump facilitates all kinds of edgeguards, and makes dropzone nair useful. upB walljump is meh. we can be so fast on this stage, so if it gets CP'd then all is not lost.

also, chars with insane DI against our fsmash (falcon, fox, falco) cant (A)SDI directly upwars and survive to stupid %'s

 

[M@1funk$hun]

come to think of it, taking peach there is a good idea
less room for her to space/navigate/float
good job not trolling for once lorddynnek =P

 

[j3ly]

Fd is the best vs peach imo because we can fireball camp like no other. on yoshis, her fair and dsmash take up a large % of the available stage area so thats no good. it comes down to personal preference because we can kill her much, much easier here, but its alot harder to camp her, and escape.

usmash oos is important vs peach. all peaches dash attack the shield. i see vanz, armada and our uk peach do it all the time. normally after somebody techs dsmash on the spot, and shields instantly, at low %'s.

FoD messes with her floats alot. and we can move super fast, survive to ok percents where she dies pretty early from fsmash. its personal preference, and i prefer to camp as hard as possible on FD. (obviously) stray away from DL, as our usmash oos will not be anywhere near as effective.

 

[Lordydennek]

come to think of it, taking peach there is a good idea
less room for her to space/navigate/float
good job not trolling for once lorddynnek =P

oh thanks bud. and you had a bit of a spelling fail with my name there.

also Jely
I really dont think Fod is a good idea. bcuz.
1) Peach's actually like that stage.
2) the platforms dont mess with her floats they actually provide her with places to instantly dsmash you. and its hard to get awy from her dsmash here. altho she dies earlier here its not worth it. her stage control is crazy here.
3) if you dthrow her she has a chance to tech out on the platforms into a dsmash. scary.

overall I'd say to stick with a safer stage than fod.

 

[M@1funk$hun]

I swear I read your name differently everytime you post lol

 

[Lordydennek]

you want to know the mystery to it?

Lord ydennek
Lord Kennedy
lol it's my last name backwards

 

[M@1funk$hun]

huh
look at that.
where do you live/smash?

 

[condemned_soul]

when i play peach on FoD, i usely get the kill when a stand under a platform>jump> wd off the platform in peach's direction> jump back> wd backwards on the platform to platform cancel again>An upward tilted Fsmash. that is my famed way of killing peach.

 

[Lordydennek]

huh
look at that.
where do you live/smash?

Columbia Mo.

also Csoul-
isnt that a bit risky? I have the best midwest peach coming to my house this weekend. Ill try some stuff out and then get back to you guys. I usually get the kill from wd back fsmash or clever bair gimps(which is hard to do...)

 

[condemned_soul]

I redid the post the right way

whats the name of the peach main?

 

[Lordydennek]

Darkatma. and another good one may come too- Hondafoo

 

[A2ZOMG]

Ugh Peach is super tedious. One mindgame I like at low percents is 3 Jabs -> F-smash. I swear a lot of people will get hit by it. And it's super safe to do since of course they're not going to punish it on block. I like it against Peach since her good CC options don't have quite as much range as others (D-smash mainly).

 

[Lordydennek]

that fsmash messes em up bad. balls. lotsa balls in this mu.

 

[n0ne]

i love ****** peach with plumber in yoshis or battlefield. gotta take caution in jumping to platforms while she is above one tho.

Against peach, i always overlook usmash and never use it , idk why. it ***** her if u like trading.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Generally the way I kill Peach is I run at her and do random Up-smashes. Tends to work really well when my reaction game is spot on.

 

[-PM-]

The best way to beat peach is just to pick yoshi's. I approve of the random Usmash. I normally klil with Fsmashes or high % Dsmashes.

One good thing is wait for the peach to nair you at a low percent CC it then usmash.


Been awhile since i've been here.

 

[condemned_soul]

oh yeah PM in da house!!!!

Becareful because CC + Peach= Dsmash from hell

 

[-PM-]

Thats what SDI is for ;D

 

[Lordydennek]

if she is float cancelling there wont be time between the nair and the dsmash. youll just die.

 

[Kanelol]

why is it that D-throw > d-air > u-air combos at 40% on Marth, but at 43%-47%, Marth drops too low to combo into u-air, but at 48% and above Marth gets too high from the d-air to combo into u-air

wtf