Am I the only one who doesn't want a new Pokemon rep?

[YoshiandToad]

I do find myself struggling to care about new Pokémon characters now Trainer is back and IMO is the perfect Pokémon representative more than any single Pokemon could manage.

With the deconfirmation of Meowth and Eevee, there's few other Pokémon I'd consider a big enough deal on their own to get excited about; Snorlax, Gengar, Gardevoir, Blaziken, arguably Garchomp are some of the ones that stand out. Alakazam and Machamp are also Pokemon I'd love to see on a personal level, but I understand both are more B list Pokemon stars than A list like Gardevoir, Gengar, Meowth, Eevee, etc

Admittedly I'm not super familiar with Sun and Moon as I stopped after XY, but that there's no clear mascot of the gen with Decidueye, Inciniroar, Lycanroc, Buzzswole and Tapu Koko being labelled as the possible Pokémon frontrunner. Mimikyu was also arguably a pretty iconic Gen 7 Pokemon, but it and Bewear are now out of the running.

Really I just want a Pokemon newcomer that has proven long lasting popularity rather than feeling like some inevitable promotion. Whether that's from Gen 1, Gen 3 or one of the other gens with less obvious popularity is up for debate, but I feel like it's such a waste that Pokemon who miss their tiny window of opportunity will never get a chance again.

That said; TEAM ROCKET FOR SMASH. Villain teams are popular in the Pokemon fandom, they're reoccurring, Jessie, James and Meowth are now not only some of the most iconic antagonists Nintendo has ever had, but they're also canon more than ever to the games now Let's Go has featured them again.

GIVE US MEOWTH AND WOBBUFFET, DAMMIT.

 

[Yuya-Noboru]

I get you , but I rather there be a balance between both. part of the reason I like nintendo is there games are not a serious or realistic like other game company's. I mean you can have a fun game and tell a good story without being another guy with a gun killing things. They still have those mascot type characters when it seems like everyone else is going the realistic route.

I prob did not describe this well I am having a hard time putting it into words but hopefully you can catch what I am meaning.

disclaimeer: not saying I dislike serious games they can be good, heck my favorite game is bioshock

Yeah I understand. I didn't meant that I don't want any pokemon in the game though, it's more about newcomers rather than already existing character. I don't want the game to be too serious, just more serious haha.

I think she is. She wasn't even on the list of Japan's 100 most popular Pokémon. I don't think being a veteran is what should warrant a character's placement. Relevance makes more sense.

You're right, she wasn't on the top 100.

 

[Crystanium]

Melee I can understand, but why be disappointed in Pichu being apart of Smash Ultimate (where it’s main thing is how everyone is here)

Because of SSBM.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Because of SSBM.

Just Melee? No petty bias or anything

 

[Crystanium]

Just Melee? No petty bias or anything

I like Raichu more than both Pichu and Pikachu. That's all there is too it, really. And besides, with the Alolan Raichu (of which there are neither Alolan Pichus or Pikachus), I think it's time for Raichu to shine.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I like Raichu more than both Pichu and Pikachu. That's all there is too it, really. And besides, with the Alolan Raichu (of which there are neither Alolan Pichus or Pikachus), I think it's time for Raichu to shine.

If he was as popular as Pikachu or cute(ish) like Pichu, then he probably would’ve had a chance years ago (but now we got two of them, so a 3rd and not as popular/cute/bad*** as Pikachu nor unique of a clone or echo like Pichu wouldn’t help Raichu much)

 

[Putuk]

The way I see it, just have Pokémon Trainer with a new set of Pokémon to cater to each new generation. Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard, for example, could be replaced with Popplio, Dartrix, and Incineroar. Of course, this doesn't have to be set up like this in the manner of first, second, and third forms. Decidueye is a very popular Pokémon, and while I'm always choosing water types for my starter Pokémon, my son likes owls. It'd be the first time I didn't start off with a water type. Besides, the idea of a grass and flying type, as well as a grass and ghost type just seemed pretty unique. I think Mewtwo could remain as the villain..

I think a lot of people would prefer Rowlet>Brionne>Incineroar. Mostly because Rowlet is insanely popular, I believe it topped a japanese poll for most popular Gen VII addition.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

Pokemon is fine rn. I really hope we don't get another rep, I agree with you that 9 is a lot. And I don't like the way the roster is organised, seeing as a lot of pokemon pull moves from other fighters. If you ask me, I'd remove Greninja first and replace him with Decidueye if we were to get another rep. Also pichu deserves to be an echo of Pikachu, I don't care. And Jigs is boring if you ask me, I'd replace her with lycanroc. And take all possible replacements with a grain of salt, I'd be more than happy to switch them out for a non-pokemon rep too.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Also pichu deserves to be an echo of Pikachu, I don't care. And Jigs is boring if you ask me, I'd replace her with lycanroc

- smaller, takes more damage from its own moves, new unique animations for fighting moves...no echo possibility
- Original 12 member of Smash...not getting cut ever

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

i also have no interest in a new pokemon

 

[soviet prince]

Pokemon is fine rn. I really hope we don't get another rep, I agree with you that 9 is a lot. And I don't like the way the roster is organised, seeing as a lot of pokemon pull moves from other fighters. If you ask me, I'd remove Greninja first and replace him with Decidueye if we were to get another rep. Also pichu deserves to be an echo of Pikachu, I don't care. And Jigs is boring if you ask me, I'd replace her with lycanroc. And take all possible replacements with a grain of salt, I'd be more than happy to switch them out for a non-pokemon rep too.

stay away from my ninja frog

 

[Crystanium]

If he was as popular as Pikachu or cute(ish) like Pichu, then he probably would’ve had a chance years ago (but now we got two of them, so a 3rd and not as popular/cute/bad*** as Pikachu nor unique of a clone or echo like Pichu wouldn’t help Raichu much)

Raichu is definitely a cute Pokémon.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Raichu is definitely a cute Pokémon.

Has nothing on Pikachu though (Pichu maybe)

 

[Michael the Spikester]

As much as we already have many reps. Let's face it we're definitely getting another one. If leaks are to be true it'll likely be Incineroar since they say no Decidueye or such.

 

[Crystanium]

Has nothing on Pikachu though (Pichu maybe)

We clearly disagree with each other, which is fine.

 

[SmashShadow]

It feels like every game there was a pretty clear choice for who I wanted but not so much this game. There isn't really much of a flagship character for new age Pokemon so it makes picking any single one feel like you're picking them for the bare minimum. Honestly, at this point I want Sceptile more than any new Pokemon but at this point I feel we're almost resigned to getting Incineroar or Decidueye.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

We clearly disagree with each other, which is fine.

Everything is fine

 

[Koopaul]

I am completely neutral on this. I don't care what happens. If we get a newcomer, that's okay. If we don't, that's also okay. If the newcomer is a Gen 7 Pokemon, sure why not? If the newcomer isn't a Gen 7 Pokemon, that's fine too.

At this point I can't seem to bring myself to care. And this is the only series I feel this way about.

 

[Handy Man]

I feel that no Gen 7 Pokémon has lived up to Greninja's popularity. The fact that people can't decide between choices like Decidueye, Incineroar, Tapu Koko, or others says a lot to me. When X and Y came out, Greninja was undoubtly the favorite design of the three starters, plus Ash only got a Froakie in the anime. Sakurai must have forseen this as he looked at Greninja's concept art, and Greninja still remains to be the most popular Gen 6 Pokémon to this day.

I rather there be no newcomers for Pokémon in the base game of Ultimate, and rather have a Gen 8 Pokémon as DLC next year. Sun & Moon are approaching their second anniversary, and no one can seemto agree on who the most popular Pokémon is for the current generation. That's not the best sign in my opinion, and I feel like people would be happier if a "new Lucario or Greninja" was announced in Gen 8 and earned a similar support base, one big enough to make a Smash inclusion warranted. This is just my opinion though.

Overall, I do want a new Pokémon rep, but not from Sun & Moon, from next year's Pokémon game instead. It just makes a lot of sense to me.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I think that the issue with Pokemon is that we mostly just get character versions of the monster: its fun, but for the most part we get real concept of what makes the games so special. Their unique traits.
This is why I really wanted Pokemon Trainer to return, but completely separate from having three summonable Pokemon: I wanted Trainer to use the Pokeball as a hunt/trap weapon, and play first hand.

That said, at least we have our single Transformation character in Smash, to highlight the switchout mechanic of Pokemon (though really, that's most RPGs). Alas.... I still think we need more unique Pokemon. Ideally an Eevee that can become any of its evolutions (only once per life is what I say, but who knows). And Team Rocket as a trap style character!

it pisses me off how fire emblem is viewed so negatively by the smash community while pokemon is flooded with new reps and nobody bats an eye
yeah, pokemon is an incredibly successful franchise and it makes sense
but so is fire emblem, but just with a more niche audience

Fire Emblem was such a failure before Awakening that it was going to be cancelled.
I know that is an oversimplification, but Pokemon never went through this.

In fact, there is no gaming franchise comparable to Pokemon, which is studied in sociology, and dozens of other marketplaces, due to being classified as a "phenomenon." There's no comparing Pokemon to any franchise, but especially not Fire Emblem: Pokemon makes 1.5 billion dollars a year as a franchise (and encompasses far more media).

Pokemon is just viewed and treated differently than all the other franchises on the roster, even from the fans.
That said, I see it as being more negative. Squirtle and Ivysaur were two original characters in Brawl, that went so unnoticed in absence that they were mentioned less than any other cut veteran, often without the writer even knowing they forgot to include them.
And thats Squirtle and Ivysaur, the former is easily a more popular character than half of the Smash Roster!

I feel that no Gen 7 Pokémon has lived up to Greninja's popularity. The fact that people can't decide between choices like Decidueye, Incineroar, Tapu Koko, or others says a lot to me. When X and Y came out, Greninja was undoubtly the favorite design of the three starters, plus Ash only got a Froakie in the anime. Sakurai must have forseen this as he looked at Greninja's concept art, and Greninja still remains to be the most popular Gen 6 Pokémon to this day.

I rather there be no newcomers for Pokémon in the base game of Ultimate, and rather have a Gen 8 Pokémon as DLC next year. Sun & Moon are approaching their second anniversary, and no one can seemto agree on who the most popular Pokémon is for the current generation. That's not the best sign in my opinion, and I feel like people would be happier if a "new Lucario or Greninja" was announced in Gen 8 and earned a similar support base, one big enough to make a Smash inclusion warranted. This is just my opinion though.

Overall, I do want a new Pokémon rep, but not from Sun & Moon, from next year's Pokémon game instead. It just makes a lot of sense to me.

There has never been a Smash game where the Pokemon newcomers were easily foreseen.
In 64- Jigglypuff still doesnt seem right.
Melee- Pichu can be justified, but even judging today, Togepi would have made more sense for promotional purposes
Brawl- Pokemon Trainer was a huge wildcard. And even Lucario, who was popular, was not a given.
Sm4sh- Greninja, the placeholder. And not a 'given' before he was announced. In fact, he was quite shocking to a large number, especially as the reveal made him appear to be Mewtwo.

If we get a Pokemon Newcomer, I stand by the most sensible option being Team Rocket. Not only are they always relevant because of the anime, and not only are they legacy characters (true All-Stars known outside of just gaming), and not only would they encompass several Pokemon with a likely unique aspect by not having the Pokemon fight Traditionally... but Team Rocket is also a "rep" for both gen 7 and gen 8. The gen 7 sequels, Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon, made a big deal about bringing back all the rival teams. The emphasis was of course Team Rainbow Rocket. We have Pokemon Yellow being remade, which is a lot of Team Rocket, and we have good reason to think gen 8 will continue with the references back to Kanto.

The issue here is that it makes so much sense it is almost blind. Again I'll state, Pokemon is different than every other series in Smash- in terms of character addition, in terms of franchise legacy/impact, and in terms of player interpretation.

That said, the OP is funny in that it even compares Pokemon to Fire Emblem, since its inclusion, Fire Emblem has gotten at least one new character per series. And usually that new character is a clone.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Fire Emblem was such a failure before Awakening that it was going to be cancelled.
I know that is an oversimplification, but Pokemon never went through this.

Not simple enough tbh

There has never been a Smash game where the Pokemon newcomers were easily foreseen.
In 64- Jigglypuff still doesnt seem right.
Melee- Pichu can be justified, but even judging today, Togepi would have made more sense for promotional purposes
Brawl- Pokemon Trainer was a huge wildcard. And even Lucario, who was popular, was not a given.
Sm4sh- Greninja, the placeholder. And not a 'given' before he was announced. In fact, he was quite shocking to a large number, especially as the reveal made him appear to be Mewtwo.

The game Pokémon doesn’t get a new rep will be the game Captain Falcon is no longer a solo rep for his series

The issue here is that it makes so much sense it is almost blind. Again I'll state, Pokemon is different than every other series in Smash- in terms of character addition, in terms of franchise legacy/impact, and in terms of player interpretation.

The only franchise that matches up with Pokémon is Mario (the series overall and not just the main Mario series)

That said, the OP is funny in that it even compares Pokemon to Fire Emblem, since its inclusion, Fire Emblem has gotten at least one new character per series. And usually that new character is a clone.

(Unique)(Clone)
(Unique)
(Alt to Clone and now Co-Founder of the Echo Fighters)(Unique)(Unique)
(Echo)

Seems about right

 

[nirvanafan]

No, i also do not want another pokemon rep but that is mainly because I never really got into the franchise, although I do think they probably should get one since they have such a large fanbase that may be disappointed if they get nothing new.

 

[Swaggy-G]

I really want another pokemon rep, but please, no more gen 1. I think it's ridiculous that despite the rich history of the franchise and all the iconic pokemon through the years, only three of the pokemon fighters do not come from the first game (and Pichu is a honorary gen 1 pokemon anyway).

 

[Arcadenik]

I do find myself struggling to care about new Pokémon characters now Trainer is back and IMO is the perfect Pokémon representative more than any single Pokemon could manage.

With the deconfirmation of Meowth and Eevee, there's few other Pokémon I'd consider a big enough deal on their own to get excited about; Snorlax, Gengar, Gardevoir, Blaziken, arguably Garchomp are some of the ones that stand out. Alakazam and Machamp are also Pokemon I'd love to see on a personal level, but I understand both are more B list Pokemon stars than A list like Gardevoir, Gengar, Meowth, Eevee, etc

Admittedly I'm not super familiar with Sun and Moon as I stopped after XY, but that there's no clear mascot of the gen with Decidueye, Inciniroar, Lycanroc, Buzzswole and Tapu Koko being labelled as the possible Pokémon frontrunner. Mimikyu was also arguably a pretty iconic Gen 7 Pokemon, but it and Bewear are now out of the running.

Really I just want a Pokemon newcomer that has proven long lasting popularity rather than feeling like some inevitable promotion. Whether that's from Gen 1, Gen 3 or one of the other gens with less obvious popularity is up for debate, but I feel like it's such a waste that Pokemon who miss their tiny window of opportunity will never get a chance again.

That said; TEAM ROCKET FOR SMASH. Villain teams are popular in the Pokemon fandom, they're reoccurring, Jessie, James and Meowth are now not only some of the most iconic antagonists Nintendo has ever had, but they're also canon more than ever to the games now Let's Go has featured them again.

GIVE US MEOWTH AND WOBBUFFET, DAMMIT.

This!

Team Rocket from the anime are finally back in the games... but for how long? I don't know but I am not letting this golden opportunity pass. I am letting Nintendo and Pokémon Company know that I want Jessie, James, and Meowth in more games after Pokémon Let's Go. I want them to be relevant in the games in addition to the anime. You know how people say the anime doesn't count... so that's why I want them in the games.

It's upsetting that everyone are sleeping on Meowth and Team Rocket for Smash and they are letting this golden opportunity pass so I have to be more loud to compensate for the deafening silence.

 

[pupNapoleon]

You know how people say the anime doesn't count... so that's why I want them in the games.

When it comes to Pokemon, *only* the anime matters. (Slight hyperbole, but majority of the decisions do come from the anime/ flat out being made up, not from the games).

I really want another pokemon rep, but please, no more gen 1. I think it's ridiculous that despite the rich history of the franchise and all the iconic pokemon through the years, only three of the pokemon fighters do not come from the first game (and Pichu is a honorary gen 1 pokemon anyway).

We get a lot of Pokemon that were conceived during the first generation, because Pokemon don't represent a generation (the closest we have to this being untrue is with Greninja, who was technically a Gen 6, but at a greater scope, could just be seen as the 'new' pokemon versus one already known. In other words- there are only 'new' Pokemon and 'old' Pokemon, and once they are not the current generation, they are 'old.')
The original Starter Pokemon, for example, are available as *starter* pokemon in I believe 5 out of seven generations. Kanto is a playable region in four of the generations. Pokemon are born in a generation, but the generation does not contain and hold the Pokemon captive.
In fact, moreso than other franchises, the characters continue. We don't see many Fire Emblem characters make it in from game to game, as a comparison.

TL; DR: There is no such thing as Pokemon representing a generation. This is a misnomer in the Smash community and only stifles the believer.

 

[Tollhouse]

Uggghhh the franchise representation argument never stops coming up. Saying no to a character because their franchise already has a lot of characters in the game is ludicrous. If a character can add something to the game, add them in I say. Adding a newcomer to smash just because their franchise has very few reps or dismissing a character because their franchise has so many reps already, cuts out better candidates and thus hurts a game's potential to be the best it can be.

 

[TaichiYaegashi]

I could take it or leave it. If another gets in, cool. If another doesn't, that's completely fine as well.

 

[Swaggy-G]

When it comes to Pokemon, *only* the anime matters. (Slight hyperbole, but majority of the decisions do come from the anime/ flat out being made up, not from the games).



We get a lot of Pokemon that were conceived during the first generation, because Pokemon don't represent a generation (the closest we have to this being untrue is with Greninja, who was technically a Gen 6, but at a greater scope, could just be seen as the 'new' pokemon versus one already known. In other words- there are only 'new' Pokemon and 'old' Pokemon, and once they are not the current generation, they are 'old.')
The original Starter Pokemon, for example, are available as *starter* pokemon in I believe 5 out of seven generations. Kanto is a playable region in four of the generations. Pokemon are born in a generation, but the generation does not contain and hold the Pokemon captive.
In fact, moreso than other franchises, the characters continue. We don't see many Fire Emblem characters make it in from game to game, as a comparison.

TL; DR: There is no such thing as Pokemon representing a generation. This is a misnomer in the Smash community and only stifles the believer.

Okay? My point was that I'd still prefer Pokemon from newer games.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Okay? My point was that I'd still prefer Pokemon from newer games.

It is not my intention to say that you cannot desire a Pokemon that was born in a region that came later than Kanto... but your argument was stating that Pokemon of the first 151 numerical value are somehow outside of the other options, grouping them and casting them as an independent group that has received unfair bias. I am and was merely attempting to disprove that belittling of characters associated with Kanto.

 

[UserKev]

I'm off ship, to. I only wanted a Pokémon newcomer because of Mimikyu. I'm so agitated by the humanoid Pokémon trend now, I lost the hype for Incineroar I considered my only other exception.

 

[Barbasol]

I actually find that Pokemon reps add a lot to Smash - they tend to be visually diverse and offer something beyond a bipedal human. Even amongst the current roster we have a big mouse, little mouse, dragon, quadraped lizard, turtle, bendy 'alien', ninja frog, and singing ball. Thats pretty solid overall. If we get archer owl or something thats a win in my books - franchise be damned.

 

[Arcadenik]

Okay? My point was that I'd still prefer Pokemon from newer games.

“Newer games”

Pokémon Let’s Go Pikachu/Eevee are “newer games”.

Meowth/Team Rocket are in those “newer games”.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I'm not a fan of alternative Trainers (at all), as the one character would not be called "Pokemon Trainer" if there is an "Alolan Pokemon Trainer."
That said, Greninja screwing up the CSS and in general how forgotten the characters are, I wish Pokemon Trainer worked this way:
All 9 Pokemon are regular Pokemon in the CSS, full movesets and all.
Pokemon Trainer is another character on the screen- if you select him, you choose three other Pokemon to take into battle. They each lose their down special to transform.

It would require some fine tuning, but it would make more sense as a series, this way.

If he was as popular as Pikachu or cute(ish) like Pichu, then he probably would’ve had a chance years ago (but now we got two of them, so a 3rd and not as popular/cute/bad*** as Pikachu nor unique of a clone or echo like Pichu wouldn’t help Raichu much)

I am gonna go on record to say that I think Raichu is the only cute 'chu.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

“Newer games”

Pokémon Let’s Go Pikachu/Eevee are “newer games”.

Meowth/Team Rocket are in those “newer games”.

As a man who doesn’t play Pokémon, isn’t every Pokémon in every new main game?

I am gonna go on record to say that I think Raichu is the only cute 'chu.

Detective Pikachu with the voice of Danny DeVito and the attitude of Deadpool is cuter

 

[Arcadenik]

As a man who doesn’t play Pokémon, isn’t every Pokémon in every new main game?

Yes and no. Yes because it's possible to have every Pokémon in every new main game via trading. No because some of them aren't available in the new main games without trading from old main games.

For example, the Kanto starters... let me see if I got this right.

You can't get them in 2nd gen games. You have to trade them from 1st gen games.

You can't get them in 3rd gen games. You have to trade them from 1st gen remakes.

You can't get them in 4th gen games. You have to trade them from 2nd gen remakes (defeat Red to get one).

You can't get them in 5th gen games. You have to trade them from 2nd gen remakes.

You can get them in 6th gen games. You can't get them in 3rd gen remakes. You have to trade them from 6th gen games.

You can't get them in 7th gen games but you can get them in 7th gen Ultra games (use Island Scan).

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Yes and no. Yes because it's possible to have every Pokémon in every new main game via trading. No because some of them aren't available in the new main games without trading from old main games.

For example, the Kanto starters... let me see if I got this right.

You can't get them in 2nd gen games. You have to trade them from 1st gen games.

You can't get them in 3rd gen games. You have to trade them from 1st gen remakes.

You can't get them in 4th gen games. You have to trade them from 2nd gen remakes (defeat Red to get one).

You can't get them in 5th gen games. You have to trade them from 2nd gen remakes.

You can get them in 6th gen games. You can't get them in 3rd gen remakes. You have to trade them from 6th gen games.

You can't get them in 7th gen games but you can get them in 7th gen Ultra games (use Island Scan).

Seems like there’s a ****load of trading for those who want everyone

 

[Arcadenik]

I think she is. She wasn't even on the list of Japan's 100 most popular Pokémon. I don't think being a veteran is what should warrant a character's placement. Relevance makes more sense.

Yes she was.

Serebii Note: The Top 100 Pokémon in the Pokémon Elections in Japan https://t.co/oV6DIIA7Ub pic.twitter.com/q6ErjUkfr1

— Serebii.net (@SerebiiNet) June 7, 2016

 

[Pippin (Peregrin Took)]

I’m cool with whatever at this point. At first I thought it would be awkward to have Greninja and Squirtle together in-game, but then I realized the three “edgy” Pokémon actually complete their own triangle (fighting-psychic-dark).

I wouldn’t mind maybe another Fire Pokemon though since it was cool having solo Charizard and Greninja contrast each other. Incineroar would be okay, but personally I’d rather have Salazzle. How popular is she?

EDIT: Can’t forget about Jessie and James Team Rocket. Had an idea for them in Brawl where they were in a mech with explosives and followed Snake around in the Subspace Emissary. Basically a Tron Bonne clone but secretly I’d like them to shoot Puzzle League blocks too. It’d be a fun shout out to the one Pokémon game that never saw a release in Japan.

 

[soviet prince]

a ghost or ice pokemon would be different

 

[Matoi]

Incineroar is getting in and no one can stop it