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All newcomers were leaked along Little Mac, Pac Man and the Miis

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iam8bit

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Megaman is considered just as much of a Nintendo character as any to fans and everyone wants to see the rivalry of Sonic and Mario. Pac-Man doesn't have that kind of connection with Nintendo.
While I agree with this, you completely changed your argument.

The denial is strong on smash boards... if anything this rumor is probably TRUE given the simple fact that: No One Could Guess Wii Fit Trainer. I repeat, NO ONE.
Yeah, it's not like Wii Fit Trainer's game was one of the top-selling Nintendo games of last generation and pretty much a gaming phenomenon. :p
 

SmashChu

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Also, are we still debating Pac-Man's movesets potential? Ive seen so many possible movesets in the Pac-Man thread and most of them work really well. I think some of you should really visit it if you want to see a moveset list.
You can make a moveset for anything. People have made movesets for L Block.

The problem witgh Pac-Man is he doesn't have any moves that are distinctly Pac-man save for eating. With Sonic, Snake and Megaman you have a plethora of moves that fit the characters. With Pac-Man, you don't have this even in the slightest. There is no way to design his standard attacks. Sonic takes moves from his fighting games (and spins). Megaman uses his blaster and robot master powers. Snake uses CQC. Pac-Man doesn't have this. His claim to fame was him being a pie graph. The games where you can draw moves from were never very popular. The other three characters had games throughout that were more popular, sold better and were more recognizable. Pac-Man didn't have this and suffers from poor source matterial. The argument isn't that you can make a moveset. Its that you can't make one like Sonic Snake or Megaman.


The denial is strong on smash boards... if anything this rumor is probably TRUE given the simple fact that: No One Could Guess Wii Fit Trainer. I repeat, NO ONE.
First, Smash Board is the only place that gives two ****s about Pac-Man. He isn't liked on gameFAQs or 4chan and he isn't discussed in Japan at all. As for WFT, she was discussed before she was shown.


The only thing making it "false" is that nintendo held off revealing 3 out of 6 known characters... this in no way debunks this as some rumor, its clearly a fact that someone actually saw/heard nintendo at E3 (while the game is actually being set up to be showcased) saying "villager wii fit trainer and megaman" are in the game.
The rumor was that is was to be revealed at E3, so the rumor was contingent on it being true.

It's obviously fake. The guy post a roster the day before and some of it was right. He then goes off and says he had an inside source the whole time. Most leaks put their ass on the line and came up with more info. This was a good guess gone wrong. Anyone who isn't a fool can see that.
 

Mypantisgone

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It's not just about Wii Fit Trainer,it's also about guessing her name and the Villager.Especially since Sakurai originally said that Animal Crossing characters were too innocent.
 

SmashChu

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It's not just about Wii Fit Trainer,it's also about guessing her name and the Villager.Especially since Sakurai originally said that Animal Crossing characters were too innocent.
He actually got Villager's name wrong.

Old thread that talked about WFT called her "Wii Fit Trainer."
 

Jumpman84

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I was never stating it as fact. I post it so you can assume it my opinion. I'm not going to say "wow........so exciting, I say sarcastically as I signify my opinion of this game isn't high." I shouldn't have to spell it out for you. You should be smarter than this.
My apologies. People on the internet often make posts that they claim is 100% fact (like Brawl not being a good game). I assumed you were doing the same. I was wrong.

No, I mean the game is worth a rental at best. It's a waste of a purchase. 3/5. Get my drift.

Mario 3D World and Sonic Lost Worlds will be better 3D platformers and offer a better experience.
Ironic, considering that Sonic Lost World is also considered a mediocre game. :troll:

These characters requested because people like them and believe they are part of Nintendo's history. Megaman is considered just as much of a Nintendo character as any to fans and everyone wants to see the rivalry of Sonic and Mario. Pac-Man doesn't have that kind of connection with Nintendo.


A game made by Shigeru freakin' Miyamoto doesn't count as a connection to Nintendo? You must have some ridiculously high standards.

We also have three Mario Kart arcade titles featuring Pac-Man, one including his new design. Namco was one of the original five third party licensees for the NES (before Konami and Capcom became major names), and they even had a falling out that played out like an early version of Squaresoft.

By the way, in the Golden Age of Video Games, Donkey Kong was the second most popular arcade game. The most popular? Pac-Man. The connection between these companies has always been there...

In conclusion, there's only one thing to say...



 

SmashChu

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Ignoring the rest because this is the only part that has any merit and isn't arguing to be right. As an aside, I watched a review for the new Pac-Man game that gave the game a 2.5/5 calling it mediocre at best.


A game made by Shigeru freakin' Miyamoto doesn't count as a connection to Nintendo? You must have some ridiculously high standards.

We also have three Mario Kart arcade titles featuring Pac-Man, one including his new design. Namco was one of the original five third party licensees for the NES (before Konami and Capcom became major names), and they even had a falling out that played out like an early version of Squaresoft.

By the way, in the Golden Age of Video Games, Donkey Kong was the second most popular arcade game. The most popular? Pac-Man. The connection between these companies has always been there...

In conclusion, there's only one thing to say...
Iconic means jack crap. Being iconic didn't get Sonic and Megaman in. What got them in what the fan perception of them. Anyone with any sense will tell you that the primary reason that they got in is that everyone wanted them. It was clear as night and day. The fan perception is not the same for Pac-Man as people expect him but don't want him though this is fading with Sakurai's comment about Namco characters. To fans, Megaman and Sonic have identity and history with Nintendo. Sonic is seen as a rival and Megaman is seen as a cousin. Pac-Man doesn't share these qualities. Pac-Man was never specific to Nintendo and never had any relation to it. Pac-Man's peak was in the arcades and Mrs. Pac-Man and everything else has been him in the gutter.

A Pac-Man game made by Miyamoto and him being in Mario Kart games Namco makes mean nothing because none of these are deciding factors. Pac-Man Vs. did not do very well and is generally unknown while te Mario Kart games never left Japan. Furthermore, it has been shown more often than not that fan input is what drives third party characters and Sakurai has said he is not keen to adding a lot of third party characters. The argument against Pac-Man is the same: even if he excels in some areas he fails on where it counts.

Pac-Man fans are really the worst.
 

BKupa666

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Pac-Man and Mii would be quite possibly the dullest two newcomers imaginable, giving even WFT a run for her money. That said, anyone who believes it was anything less than a legitimate leak that WFT was guessed in advance, much less in combination with Mega Man and Villager despite being mentioned by just a single person in 2008 on GameFAQs as a joke (which, of course, gets misconstrued as "she was discussed") is completely in denial. At this point, it's just a matter of whether or not those three legitimate leaked characters were lumped in with three falsely leaked characters, or whether there's some nuance to those three that is as of now unknown.
 

SmashChu

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Pac-Man and Mii would be quite possibly the dullest two newcomers imaginable, giving even WFT a run for her money. That said, anyone who believes it was anything less than a legitimate leak that WFT was guessed in advance, much less in combination with Mega Man and Villager despite being mentioned by just a single person in 2008 on GameFAQs as a joke (which, of course, gets misconstrued as "she was discussed") is completely in denial. At this point, it's just a matter of whether or not those three legitimate leaked characters were lumped in with three falsely leaked characters, or whether there's some nuance to those three that is as of now unknown.
Guesses don't mean you know anything. Guy is 50/50 doesn't mean he knew anything. Remember, he didn't have a leak until had guessed right. Convenient, don't you think.

It's not denial. It's skepticism.
 

Jumpman84

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But I'm not a Pac-Man fan. :( I just think he's a neat character and it would be cool to play as him.

In a way, all the third parties we have seen are rivals from different eras. Sonic is clearly the 16 bit war. Snake represents the modern era rival, PlayStation. Mega Man was a rival to Mario back on the NES, as both of them had fantastic platforming games considered the greatest of all time. Pac-Man could fill the role as the rival of the arcade era. In any case, there's no way to know for sure until the game is released or Sakurai confirms him or another third party.

Out of curiosity, aren't you the guy who said there wouldn't be any 3rd party characters before E3? And then said Sonic wouldn't return because he was already a guest in Brawl and was a one time deal? Or am I thinking of someone else?
 

BKupa666

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Guesses don't mean you know anything. Guy is 50/50 doesn't mean he knew anything. Remember, he didn't have a leak until had guessed right. Convenient, don't you think.

It's not denial. It's skepticism.
It's quite plainly not convenient to simultaneously predict three characters no one to that point had lumped together because only one person had even brought up one of the three previously, and most had given up hope on another of the three, given that he was one of the few characters Sakurai himself seemingly deconfirmed. All that's really up for speculation is what happened with the other three characters: were they legitimate leaks that ended up rescheduled, erroneous/false information from the source, false additions from the poster, or some other option?

Skepticism might have been warranted had it been Little Mac, Pac-Man, and Mii revealed in lieu of the other three, given that plenty of people saw them coming, and Little Mac and Pac-Man were in many E3 reveal predictions. I don't see how it's anything but denial to claim "people talked WFT" once as a joke in 2008 on one board, thus it follows that a false leaker would guess her in his reveal prediction in 2013 on another board alongside one character Sakurai all but ruled out and another a vocal minority of users claimed would never get in because Sakurai would never put third parties in SSB4.
 

FlareHabanero

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the Mario Kart games never left Japan.
Actually Mario Kart Arcade GP and Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 did get global releases, albeit in limited quantities due to how arcades are a fairly niche market these days. I remember actually playing Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 on a Royal Caribbean cruise ship, and I can say that despite the Mario Kart title it does feel different to play.

However, Mario Kart Arcade GP DX is still exclusive to Japan at the moment.
 

Croco

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Actually Mario Kart Arcade GP and Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 did get global releases, albeit in limited quantities due to how arcades are a fairly niche market these days. I remember actually playing Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 on a Royal Caribbean cruise ship, and I can say that despite the Mario Kart title it does feel different to play.

However, Mario Kart Arcade GP DX is still exclusive to Japan at the moment.

Correct! I've even played them both at arcades where I live.
Heck.. even tamagachi was in it... hmmmmm? ;)


Anyway.. not sure why anyone is arguing over pacman getting in or even mii. If of happens it happens.
 

Croco

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Actually Mario Kart Arcade GP and Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 did get global releases, albeit in limited quantities due to how arcades are a fairly niche market these days. I remember actually playing Mario Kart Arcade GP 2 on a Royal Caribbean cruise ship, and I can say that despite the Mario Kart title it does feel different to play.

However, Mario Kart Arcade GP DX is still exclusive to Japan at the moment.

Correct! I've even played them both at arcades where I live.
Heck.. even tamagachi was in it... hmmmmm? ;)


Anyway.. not sure why anyone is arguing over pacman getting in or even mii. If of happens it happens.
 

Wario Bros.

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I've played Mario Kart Arcade GP at Disney World a long time ago and played GP 2 via an emulator. They're great and fun. FYI, GP 2 is nothing more than GP 1 with an expansion pack so if you played GP 2 then you've already played GP 1. I did suggest to the official Namco forum to bring GP DX to the eShop but heard nothing from them yet.
 

Fenrir VII

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You know, I just don't think the "leak" was as bold as most people say, for several reasons.
- The leak stated that all 6 chars would be revealed at E3, which they weren't...
- The leak did not say Villager, it said "guy from animal crossing".
- Megaman and Tom Nook were hugely popular in internet posts before Brawl, and then again before SSB4.
- The 3 non-confirmed characters are REALLY obvious choices, based on the number of internet posts about them.
- That leaves WFT, and the fact that the post got her name right, as the only real surprising thing in that entire post.


So taking that the leak was 50% correct, using 5 fairly obvious characters (based on the number of internet posts about each of them) and 1 oddball, that leads me to draw one of a couple conclusions.

Option 1, it was a complete guess, and he got lucky. This is a fairly low possibility, but you can't ignore that it is possible, given the fact that the post was only 50% correct and listed a wrong name for one of the 'correct' characters.

Option 2, the poster did have leaked info on the 3 revealed e3 characters, and filled it in with the other 3 for fun. This is probably the most likely scenario for having gotten the WFT guess right, but it doesn't really explain the wrong name for Villager. This would lead me to believe that it was info passed on from somebody who knew, rather than the poster having actually seen the video, etc.

Option 3, the leak was 100% correct, but Nintendo changed plans of revealing the other 3 for whatever reason. I don't see this as incredibly likely, because Nintendo really needed some hype coming out of this e3, so they could have used the extra Smash Bros help. I certainly don't think they would have changed plans because a handful of people on the internet knew about the leak...


Overall I'm inclined to believe Option 2, even if the other 3 characters are confirmed at a later date... but I'm definitely against people who say "because he got this part right, the rest has to be right"
 

| Kailex |

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Option 3 is what I feel for all rumors that were 'confirmed' fake, nintendo can always change plans, anyone can; maybe the guy is honest about everything but the stuff that he heard about were excluded/changed without his knowledge
 

BKupa666

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Side note, I don't understand what the bug up the skeptics' arses is about Villager not specifically being referred to as Villager when 'Animal Crossing Boy' is about as close a description of him as you can get, and when that's what he was called in his Brawl trophy. "He was called Villager in the trailer, which the leaker obviously would have seen"? We don't know for sure that the leaker saw the trailer specifically; he just as well could have seen screenshots, or even might have chosen to refer to the character by the title that had been made public to the 10 million people who bought Brawl for better clarity. The name (yet not identity) difference doesn't change the fact that very few people predicted him in the first place, much less so alongside Wii Fit Trainer and Mega Man. Let's not forget the two or three leakers pre-Brawl talking about how "Windwaker Link" would be in the game.

I'm quite curious, if any character but polarizing Pac-Man were listed in the leak, would skeptics still go so far as to claim "people were talking about WFT [and thus could have guessed her]" to poo-poo it?
 

MasterOfKnees

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Yeah, pointing fingers at the "Animal Crossing Boy" sentence is really grasping at straws, even when it didn't directly come from the leaker, but rather the guy who had gotten the information from the leaker. Furthermore, it doesn't really change anything in the big image. Same with the "Little Mac, Mii and Pac-Man weren't revealed at E3, so it's not true" argument, Nintendo has pulled things from E3 before, presumably DKC:TF was pulled from last year's E3 because it wasn't far enough in development, so it's definitely possible. Even then, the leaker could also have the info wrong and they were never supposed to be revealed at E3, since it's most definitely not a person directly associated with the development of the game.

The only way the leak isn't true as far as I'm concerned is if the leaker intentionally faked the other half of the list with other possible candidates, which could be a possibility, but as of right now I'm leaning towards it being true.

One thing is for certain, it wasn't just a guy who made a lucky guess, then further decided to make a big thing out of it (considering he wrote an article about it on his news site afterwards,) if you think that then you're really on a thin line.
 

BlitznBurst

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Yeah, it's not like Wii Fit Trainer's game was one of the top-selling Nintendo games of last generation and pretty much a gaming phenomenon. :p
No no no, what are you talking about, Sakurai chose her because he is a troll and WFT is a troll character and Sakurai hates Smash fans so he chose a character nobody requested to piss us off

I don't think you understand Smash Bros. at all
 

Jumpman84

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No no no, what are you talking about, Sakurai chose her because he is a troll and WFT is an unexpected character and Sakurai is a genius so he chose a character nobody requested to hype us up
Fixed. :)
 

Fenrir VII

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Side note, I don't understand what the bug up the skeptics' arses is about Villager not specifically being referred to as Villager when 'Animal Crossing Boy' is about as close a description of him as you can get, and when that's what he was called in his Brawl trophy. "He was called Villager in the trailer, which the leaker obviously would have seen"? We don't know for sure that the leaker saw the trailer specifically; he just as well could have seen screenshots, or even might have chosen to refer to the character by the title that had been made public to the 10 million people who bought Brawl for better clarity. The name (yet not identity) difference doesn't change the fact that very few people predicted him in the first place, much less so alongside Wii Fit Trainer and Mega Man. Let's not forget the two or three leakers pre-Brawl talking about how "Windwaker Link" would be in the game.

I'm quite curious, if any character but polarizing Pac-Man were listed in the leak, would skeptics still go so far as to claim "people were talking about WFT [and thus could have guessed her]" to poo-poo it?

First of all, it was listed as "Animal Crossing Guy", rather than "Boy"... which is a reasonably big difference, because as you posted, there was a trophy labeled "Boy". "Guy" could also have referred to Tom Nook, who had been WIDELY talked about and predicted, which breaks the "very few people predicted him" statement. I have personally seen a number of Tom Nook + Megaman requests and predictions all over Gamefaqs and such, so that's my reasoning there. WFT was the real oddball here, and I admit, that is an extremely lucky guess if it was...

Like, the guess of Megaman + "Animal Crossing guy" + list of other characters would not have been surprising or nearly as believable without WFT included.

Nintendo has pulled things from E3 before, presumably DKC:TF was pulled from last year's E3 because it wasn't far enough in development, so it's definitely possible. Even then, the leaker could also have the info wrong and they were never supposed to be revealed at E3, since it's most definitely not a person directly associated with the development of the game.

The only way the leak isn't true as far as I'm concerned is if the leaker intentionally faked the other half of the list with other possible candidates, which could be a possibility, but as of right now I'm leaning towards it being true.

One thing is for certain, it wasn't just a guy who made a lucky guess, then further decided to make a big thing out of it (considering he wrote an article about it on his news site afterwards,) if you think that then you're really on a thin line.

Thing is, nintendo really needed Smash to hit the hype train this year... I seriously doubt they would have pulled the intros if they were close to ready (seeing as how they showed the game anyway)... and they've had quite an opportunity to reveal them in the months since E3, but had nothing but crickets.

Also, somebody continuing to want attention after a lucky guess would not be all that uncommon on the internet.


Like I said, I'm leaning toward the option where the leaker actually knew the 3 reveals secondhand, and made up the others... mostly because I think Pac-man, Little Mac, and Mii are almost the safest/least-controversial bets anybody could make at this point in development (except maybe Chrom)..

I'm just saying the boards are still holding onto the idea that because the poster got <50%, including one real oddball, the rest is absolutely true, and that kind of breaks logic for me. Though I won't be surprised if those characters are in...
 

BKupa666

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First of all, it was listed as "Animal Crossing Guy", rather than "Boy"... which is a reasonably big difference, because as you posted, there was a trophy labeled "Boy". "Guy" could also have referred to Tom Nook, who had been WIDELY talked about and predicted, which breaks the "very few people predicted him" statement. I have personally seen a number of Tom Nook + Megaman requests and predictions all over Gamefaqs and such, so that's my reasoning there. WFT was the real oddball here, and I admit, that is an extremely lucky guess if it was...

Like, the guess of Megaman + "Animal Crossing guy" + list of other characters would not have been surprising or nearly as believable without WFT included.
Good catch, and you're right there, although I think it's a much greater stretch to interpret "Animal Crossing Guy" as Tom Nook than as the Villager, given that, since people actually brought up Tom Nook, calling him anything else would be misleading, whereas Villager was previously a bit of a blank sheet, other than the "Boy" trophy name. Tom Nook in combination with Mega Man would have caused me to raise an eyebrow, since his requests were always rather low-key, basically a handful of half-hearted attempts to maybe get in an Animal Crossing Rep without stumbling over the tripwire that was Sakurai's belief that its characters were too passive, though I wouldn't have considered it a likely leak at all. WFT, however, is an entirely different story.
 

Shorts

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"I don't like that Miis and Pac-Man could be playable"

all I'm hearin'.

Nothing is more boring that Wii Fit Trainer, and at least both of them aren't Toon Link.
 

Kapus

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I find Wii Fit Trainer to be more interesting than Pac Man, personally. Miis are a bit harder to determine, as they could be implemented in many different ways due to their naturally customizable origin.
 

Shorts

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lol. "Pac-Man is so boring!"

>doesn't say **** about LITTLE MAC THE MAN WHO CAN'T DO ANYTHING.

I call bull**** on Megaman being more connected to Nintendo than Pac-Man. Kind of super bull****.
 

BKupa666

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lol. "Pac-Man is so boring!"

>doesn't say **** about LITTLE MAC THE MAN WHO CAN'T DO ANYTHING.
Star Punch Mechanic, Heart Mechanic, Doc Louis, combo-oriented boxing playstyle >>>>> Chomp, Butt Bounce, Rev Roll, unknown playstyle

That being said, Wii Fit Trainer will never be dethroned as 'most boring.' Anything >>>>> a glorified Wireframe

 

Bowserlick

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It does seem like people that think Pacman would be boring rave about the man who only dodges and punches and the Lord who would be "the perfect blend of Marth and Ike."
 

BKupa666

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It does seem like people that think Pacman would be boring rave about the man who only dodges and punches and the Lord who would be "the perfect blend of Marth and Ike."
That's understandable for the most part because Pac-Man's playstyle is a massive question mark; not even his fans have talked about how he'd play, only which three or four moves he'd have, which most likely leads individuals to believe his playstyle would, like the character himself, be middle-of-the-road (generic, in other words). Little Mac's playstyle is anything but a question mark; at the very least, he'd be a fast, combo-oriented boxer whose speed offsets his limited range, potentially with a cool Star Punch mechanic or Doc in the mix as well. The hypocrisy you're trying to shine light on is much more evident with Chrom as the example, although there are still people out there who believe he'd use anything but a sword, or that he'd be coupled with Lucina or something (:chuckle:). Though ultimately, some might find it easier to be happy with the devil whose halves they know rather than the devil they don't.
 

iam8bit

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I think someone could've guessed those 3 right. It's definitely NOT impossible.

That said, didn't this "leaker" also got some E3 information out? I remember reading another post from him that accuretely predicted or revealed something not Smash related...

Oh, and what's this blog post from him someone mentioned?
 

mimgrim

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I call bull**** on Megaman being more connected to Nintendo than Pac-Man. Kind of super bull****.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mega_Man_video_games
50 games on Nintendo consoles. With only the newer stuff being on multiple consoles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Pac-Man_video_games

28 games on Nintendo consoles. Quite a few of those games aren't Pac-Man only either and are mixed with other games and most of the games are on a different system as well as a Nintendo system.

The one talking out of their a** here is you.
 

Jumpman84

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Shorts

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numbers.
The one talking out of their a** here is you.
Namco and Nintendo work together frequently, and they have a deep rooted history. Namco is making Smash Bros along side Nintendo. Pac-Man and Mario have already been in a game together. Cool, Megaman has game numbers. But that's because Megaman has 800000 games. BOTH Pac-Man and Megaman have strong ties to Nintendo, and trying to say one has more over the other is just silly because there is no real way to measure it. I'd still put my money on Pacs.

And this isn't coming from a PM fan. I'm a fan of neither characters.

And I don't care if you think I make an ass out of myself. This is a ****ing forum about a game that hasn't come out yet. Everyone here makes an ass out of themselves simply by logging on and jerking off over a bunch of bull****.
 

Jumpman84

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Namco and Nintendo work together frequently, and they have a deep rooted history. Namco is making Smash Bros along side Nintendo. Pac-Man and Mario have already been in a game together. Cool, Megaman has game numbers. But that's because Megaman has 800000 games. BOTH Pac-Man and Megaman have strong ties to Nintendo, and trying to say one has more over the other is just silly because there is no real way to measure it. I'd still put my money on Pacs.
I wanted to like your post, but couldn't due to your rudeness and vulgar language later on. so I just quoted the part I liked.

In other words...



 

No Control

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
151
Location
United Kingdom
It's true that the ONLY thing that makes that leak believable is WFT. 2 out of 5 of the others of course would've meant nothing if it wasn't for WFT, so that's the only part of the rumour worth concentrating on.

I really think it's a guess, guys. I know it's unlikely that someone would guess WFT, but a lot of people tried to guess and one guy happened to name WFT and be lucky. Even though normal Smash forums wouldn't have thought up the list he did, if you were to step back and have a look at which franchises/characters could sell Smash, Wii Fit would have been a viable option.

That said, I didn't think of it (I did guess an AC character), but then I wasn't very hyped until THAT E3 trailer (didn't even watch it until like a week after it came out if I remember, though I was very busy at the time).
 

cmbsfm

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 6, 2012
Messages
2,823
NNID
srmario
NOOOOOO please don't add miis. That would horrible. I'd rather have them as profile pictures. Assist trophies at best. Playable would suck.
 

Smashoperatingbuddy123

Smash Legend
Joined
Jul 16, 2013
Messages
10,909
NOOOOOO please don't add miis. That would horrible. I'd rather have them as profile pictures. Assist trophies at best. Playable would suck.
Your lucky (for now) the mii was not announced today the male wii fit trainer destoryed the chance of mii getting anounced today

Its still possible we will get the mii as playable
 
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