Air Dash Online - A competitive platform fighter

[Crispy4001]

How can you even compare this to Project M? Project M is still a mod a very well done mod but at its base it is still a mod built on a brawl engine. Also you must not support many kickstarters as I have put a lot of money on Kickstarter and from most of those games you get a lot of well tuned Ideas and even gameplay videos. Some more than others but the ones that have succeeded have already put months of work into the game and have shown a lot of promise which this does not at its current stage.

Me bringing up Project M was meant to say that it can't be compared to where that mod currently is. It took the PMBR years to 'smooth out the movement' according to their own goals and to meet the expectations of the Smash community at large. ADO, by comparison, has been developed from scratch in months. Project M got trashed on unreasonably in the early goings for precisely that... being early. It's a lesson to show that these sort of complaints lack perspective. They judge where it's at, rather than where it's going. With what I've played of the web build, I can't say I agree with your takeaway.

... If you never saw potential in this game and still are unimpressed by the prototype, don't back it, and don't pretend like it'd reach a state where you would. You know as well as me that a "few [more] years" of development is an unreasonable demand. For where the game is and what they've promised, it's asking for a finished product, all absent the funding they apparently need to make that possible. Sure, it's ok to say that you'd have to play it at that stage (or close to it) to be convinced. But if you take that angle, you aren't saying that you'd be in it someday to crowdfund. You'd be in it for a post-release demo, most likely.

Last and most importantly, this is a fighting game Kickstarter. I can't think of another genre besides RTS that would be as difficult to produce a polished vertical slice of. Asking for something "well-tuned" when the game is maybe 1/5th complete is silly. Unlike most other genres, they can't simply build a core foundation and expand on it mostly with new content and assets. The problem is that the foundation has to be malleable, play-tested, and revised in nitpicky fashion throughout development. It's the heart and soul of the game.

Perhaps this is in part why so few fighting game Kickstarters exist. It's pretty much impossible to meet those vertical slice expectations. I think the only way a game like this could succeed is if it were judged on different terms.

Project M uses mostly premade assets, they -basically- just change number values within Brawl with a few added code snippets.

I think this discredits the large amount of animation work they've put into it (not to mention the hacking to make those edits possible). Even characters like Marth that appear to be untouched at first glance had to have their animations adjusted to match Melee hurtboxes.

 

[dkuo]

@Yamer, how many of the kickstarters with purely concept artwork have made 300k+? and of the ones that did, how many aren't operating under a very famous developer or company?

unfortunately most people dont really see potential in fighting game engines (unless theyre somewhat involved in fg's like us or other fgc people), these people are mostly just interested in characters/art/animation/story/etc stuff like that is what they define as "potential," they dont really differentiate between game engines (ie smash-based engines mean the same as any other engine to them, or alternatively they understand its implications but simply dont care)

i dont mean to rain on ado's parade but unless you guys pull some amazing strings in the next week i dont see the kickstarter really making the cut. its not the end of the world though since you can relaunch failed kickstarters and all that, where you can sort of regroup and replan the kickstarter. and with your team im pretty confident that you guys can pull through the 2nd time if the 1st doesnt make it...hopefully this isnt the case though and you guys have a bomb to drop in the coming days

 

[Yamer]

Yea, kickstarter is a fickle beast. After seeing the lack of response from the smash community, I don't think we can save it. We just have to scale back our goals for the next year and move forward accordingly.

I think this discredits the large amount of animation work they've put into it (not to mention the hacking to make those edits possible). Even characters like Marth that appear to be untouched at first glance had to have their animations adjusted to match Melee hurtboxes.

I didn't mean to discredit the hard work put in by countless smashers. I was just trying to illustrate the point(though exaggeration) that a mod shouldn't be directly compared to a new game(prototype), especially the aesthetics.

 

[nat pagle]

1. I'm not supporting a 300k kickstarter for an online game that doesn't even look that interesting.

2. We only got 90k for EVO, most hyped thing in years.

3. How do we know if it's any good?

 

[spacer`1]

1. I'm not supporting a 300k kickstarter for an online game that doesn't even look that interesting.

2. We only got 90k for EVO, most hyped thing in years.

3. How do we know if it's any good?

May I ask why you think it doesn't look interesting? I think it looks pretty good so far, and most of animations that they have shown us as of yet have been rough and unfinished. As a result, things don't look as nice or as polished as Smash or other 3d fighters. Is that why you don't think it looks intereting?

 

[KrIsP!]

1. I'm not supporting a 300k kickstarter for an online game that doesn't even look that interesting.

2. We only got 90k for EVO, most hyped thing in years.

3. How do we know if it's any good?

I'm interested, and your not expected to pay 350k, if you like the game you can pre purchase it while helping with its development. If your not interested why bother posting?

 

[Delta-cod]

You're never allowed to post about being disinterested in something everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

[Yamer]

3. How do we know if it's any good?

You could play the prototype?

 

[nat pagle]

I'm interested, and your not expected to pay 350k, if you like the game you can pre purchase it while helping with its development. If your not interested why bother posting?

Because I like letting people know when something won't work out.

Ain't nothing wrong with that.

 

[Crispy4001]

Because I like letting people know when something won't work out.

Judging by his posts above yours, I don't think Yamer needed to be told that.

Blanket 'not interested' statements don't really contribute either. spacer asked you some good questions - why not answer those to elaborate? Likewise, giving the prototype a shot and dropping some impressions (good or bad) would leave all of us, and you, more informed.

 

[Cellsai]

At this stage I think it might actually be best to cancel the KS before it ends. There's basically zero chance that it's going to make it's goal at this stage and a lot of that blame can be laid on a complete lack of interaction on the part of the devs. You can't just hang these campaigns out on Kickstarter and then leave them flapping in the wind assuming places like the Smash Community will carry them for you.

Regardless of what the situation actually is I think posting a message like "Sorry guys, something came up and we weren't able to give the KS the attention it needed. We're going to pull it for now and do a better one in the future. Thanks for the support!" would save ADO a lot of face instead of being known as 'That Smash clone that asked for 355k and only got 7'.

 

[spacer`1]

At this stage I think it might actually be best to cancel the KS before it ends. There's basically zero chance that it's going to make it's goal at this stage and a lot of that blame can be laid on a complete lack of interaction on the part of the devs. You can't just hang these campaigns out on Kickstarter and then leave them flapping in the wind assuming places like the Smash Community will carry them for you.

Regardless of what the situation actually is I think posting a message like "Sorry guys, something came up and we weren't able to give the KS the attention it needed. We're going to pull it for now and do a better one in the future. Thanks for the support!" would save ADO a lot of face instead of being known as 'That Smash clone that asked for 355k and only got 7'.

Good plan. A little bit of PR goes a long way. That said, you could definitely help yourselves out by distributing packages of the most complete version to the backers, just to give them a taste.

 

[JV5Chris]

I had a number of my own thoughts leading into the Kickstarter, but have made an effort to keep them to myself and the team during the campaign. When things go live, part of being a team player is setting opinions aside to be supportive. I do agree with plenty of what's been said, but it's best left to the project lead to advance this conversation and lay out his plans.

There are a few things I would like to say at this moment though. First, I want to acknowledge everyone that has supported us, the team that has worked hard to get to this point, and the smash community at large. Second, despite setbacks, I do maintain a positive view of my contributions, our developer streams, and input gathered at EVO. It wasn't nearly enough outreach, but I can't feel bad about those steps we took.

I also want to just briefly comment on the KS monetary goal. There are two often conflicting ideas of what success is. In the limited context of Kickstarter, it's reaching the funded status. In the context of developing a game, it's raising the funds necessary to cover the realistic costs. When a campaign knowingly undercuts their costs to reach short term gratification on KS, it's not fair to all parties involved, demonstrates a lack of responsibility, and shows poor ethics. This might not be the easiest thing to understand but having a failed Kickstarter is far more ideal than having a greenlit one with insufficient funds to deliver.

Without say a publisher or angel investor on board to help offset costs, the game will need to be scaled back to lower that total. I hope people understand it was never the intent to have dedicated members of this community bare the lion's share of the funding. Due to oversights leading up to the KS, it unfortunately came across that way. I want to apologize to anyone under that impression.

 

[Deleted member]

I think the project has potential, but it's too focused on being like Melee.

I dislike how some of the characters have moves that are identical to that of fighters in Super Smash Bros. Melee, the knee and the Falco Dair... It gave me the impression that the game is simply trying to be what Smash Melee can't when instead, I feel it should try to head in its own direction and be its own creative work. Find its own identity, much like I said ITT way earlier. I'll support the project once its finished, since I see the potential, but atm, I don't see much that's exciting in this.

Right now, ADO feels like Smash Melee, with original characters, Air Dashing, and a few mechanics from Guilty Gear tossed in.

I think the idea of a competitive platform fighter is a great one, and I hope that this project succeeds so that future endeavors may take place, but like I said, I think that if you wanna get people excited, the project needs to find its own identity and head in a new direction. Don't be afraid to redo concepts if you need to. Also, now would be a good time to start thinking of a better name than something that sounds a lot like a mediocre anime from 2013.


Just my two cents is all.

 

[Bakuryu]

Yea, kickstarter is a fickle beast. After seeing the lack of response from the smash community, I don't think we can save it. We just have to scale back our goals for the next year and move forward accordingly.``

The reason the smash community didn't "respond" was probably because most of them didn't even know about it. Someone pointed out that with wide spread PR we raised $94k dollars. Warranted it was a donation drive and for the glory of being at EVO, but smashers put money where their mouth is. I forget which big smash tournament was going on when you guy first started your kick starter and all I saw on the stream was your logo. Their should have been massive shout outs, gameplay demos, developer interviews, the works and not just for that tournament every one since then.

I also want to just briefly comment on the KS monetary goal. There are two often conflicting ideas of what success is. In the limited context of Kickstarter, it's reaching the funded status. In the context of developing a game, it's raising the funds necessary to cover the realistic costs. When a campaign knowingly undercuts their costs to reach short term gratification on KS, it's not fair to all parties involved, demonstrates a lack of responsibility, and shows poor ethics. This might not be the easiest thing to understand but having a failed Kickstarter is far more ideal than having a greenlit one with insufficient funds to deliver.

I think most sane and logical people understand this, but alot just look at a number at first glace and say screw that noise. Even though it wasn't for the game itself since they had a publisher to help them; Skullgirls was able to justify their high price for just a character by thoroughly breaking it down and then having know people in the industry back them up. This all comes back to PR. Someone has to know someone working at these website and get this info on there.

I dislike how some of the characters have moves that are identical to that of fighters in Super Smash Bros. Melee, the knee and the Falco Dair... It gave me the impression that the game is simply trying to be what Smash Melee can't when instead, I feel it should try to head in its own direction and be its own creative work. Find its own identity, much like I said ITT way earlier. I'll support the project once its finished, since I see the potential, but atm, I don't see much that's exciting in this.

I really don't see the problem with having a couple moves from a game who's genre it is they are trying to mimic. Take Skullgirls for example; there are quite a few moves, taunts, and other things in the game that are clearly a homage to other fighting games. Especially when it has some elements of two different characters at once. Ever wonder how Falco and Falcon would play if they were meshed together? Now you can.

Right now, ADO feels like Smash Melee, with original characters, Air Dashing, and a few mechanics from Guilty Gear tossed in.

Upon reading the game description I actually think this is genuinely what they are going for and in my opinion isn't a bad idea. Trying to make a completely original fighter is almost impossible especially if you still trying to keep the feel of a smash brothers game. I think the idea is to take the smash brother gameplay that we all know and love (mainly melee's) and evolve it further and cater its gameplay to that crowd. I can't think of a single thing this community should be supporting more then this honestly.

 

[Cellsai]

Yea, kickstarter is a fickle beast. After seeing the lack of response from the smash community, I don't think we can save it. We just have to scale back our goals for the next year and move forward accordingly.

The reason the smash community didn't "respond" was probably because most of them didn't even know about it. Someone pointed out that with wide spread PR we raised $94k dollars. Warranted it was a donation drive and for the glory of being at EVO, but smashers put money where their mouth is. I forget which big smash tournament was going on when you guy first started your kick starter and all I saw on the stream was your logo. Their should have been massive shout outs, gameplay demos, developer interviews, the works and not just for that tournament every one since then.

I can't stress this enough. It's honestly kind of insulting to blame the lack of success on the Smash Community's lack of response when there was virtually nothing to respond to.

 

[Giygacoal]

Good luck with that production reboot described in the Kickstarter page. You will have my sword when the time comes. My only problem with the visuals is that 4 of the 5 characters have primarily blue outfits.

 

[Chronodiver Lokii]

For the price point
If you are paying your team correctly...
than a 350k price point is super cheap

money in games goes towards:

1. software licenses (Autodesk modeling programs usually cost about 3k a program....zbrush is 700$....you have to license the engine...texturing stuff if you choose to go that route needs licensing....etc etc etc......)
2. paying your staff
- artists: 3D, concept, animators, tech artists, environment artists, etc
- designers
- programmers
- non artist/programmer staff
- etc etc etc
3. various other legal things

but
primarily
dat team

salaries for beginners in industry is an upwards of 35-45k in 2007 studies.
( cant say for certain, but members of this project have seen industry work and they can probably explain this better)

I believe the price point is fair, especially for the quality bar they are trying to set.

 

[dkuo]

i agree that a 350k is very cheap for the project overall, but for a kickstarter thats still hella steep especially relative to other kickstarters
so it makes sense why people are put off by it on first impression

if the team is thinking about lowering the goal$, there are other avenues of $ possible after the game release. but i can understand if thats not what the team is going for


hope the reboot succeeds, i really really really want this game to be made lol

 

[KrIsP!]

I still believe, best of luck to you guys.

 

[JV5Chris]

The reason the smash community didn't "respond" was probably because most of them didn't even know about it.

I wouldn't say that was entirely the case. A fair number did know about the game, especially after we helped fund Ice's trip to EVO. It was a lot of good exposure at the time, but that momentum was not sustainable. There were certainly other attempts to work with the scene to raise awareness, but between trying to gain the support for it and coordinating the effort, many opportunities were lost. Not all, Clash Tournaments were really amazing partners throughout, but ultimately more needed to happen. That onus of course is ultimately on us.

I can't stress this enough. It's honestly kind of insulting to blame the lack of success on the Smash Community's lack of response when there was virtually nothing to respond to.

I believe Yamer was speaking more to the apparent challenges rather than passing blame. With Melee's recent achievements and Smash 4 around the corner, the community is understandably honed in on building up the Smash competitive brand and, to some extent, hoping to make an impact on Nintendo. Unfortunately, as a new game outside of the core franchise, we don't quite fit into the current narrative.

That leads into one of the big questions moving forward, what can be done differently to bring a Melee-inspired indie fighter into the collective interests of the community? Or perhaps that is a goal that needs to be revisited at a later date when the timing is better.

salaries for beginners in industry is an upwards of 35-45k in 2007 studies.
( cant say for certain, but members of this project have seen industry work and they can probably explain this better)

It depends heavily on position, the cost of living, and status as a contract or staff employee. That said, these are starting estimates, experienced help in the industry expects more.

 

[Chronodiver Lokii]

Thanks for the clarification; our school hasnt been diligent on getting numbers (even if we ask), so i have to fumble around with the old estimates for starting salaries

but yeah Chris speaks the truth
moneys yo

 

[JV5Chris]

Thanks for the clarification; our school hasnt been diligent on getting numbers (even if we ask), so i have to fumble around with the old estimates for starting salaries

I know what that's like. Feel free to ask me any questions on the subject, I might be able to tell you a few things about the industry schools typically leave out.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Well I can tell you from my own experience that basically nobody I know knew about this.

 

[JV5Chris]

Well I can tell you from my own experience that basically nobody I know knew about this.

Well, we certainly didn't reach as much of the scene as we had hoped to. I'm not suggesting our efforts were overall successful, only that there was some awareness.

 

[greenluigiman2]

One of the most overlooked things about the Smash Bros. series by competitive players is that the general audience plays the games because of the characters.
Not because of how the characters play, but the characters in general. People love these characters. They love them outside of Smash... Hell, they even love these characters outside their own games. This is one aspect you guys need to work on before re-doing the Kickstarter. Make the characters more interesting beyond just their name, appearance and playstyle. How can you achieve this? Here's how:

• Unique attacks/animations - I know it's early on in the process, which means that animation is limited, but the animations & attacks that you do have should be as distinguishable as possible, they should define the character. Giving the characters attacks that existing characters already have is cute, but people like seeing new things.

• Voice acting - Voice acting is sooo underrated. It helps liven characters so much, and helps people understand what a character is about. One of the things I love about MvC3 and Punch-Out is the voice acting, as well as the quotes that go along with it. I go on Youtube sometimes just to hear character quotes.

• Backstory/Role - In a game that's not telling a story, backstories are very effective. I'm pretty sure at least some of the characters were already given backstories, and that's cool. If your game is telling a story however, you don't necessarily need backstories, as long as the characters' roles in the story that the game is telling are clear.

 

[Chronodiver Lokii]

Thanks Chris! Means a lot!!
Expect questions : P

 

[Z'zgashi]

Giving the characters attacks that existing characters already have is cute, but people like seeing new things.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This.

It's one thing to base a character's playstyle off another, but when you blatantly copy moves, it just feels lazy and unoriginal. That was by far my biggest gripe with the game.

That and the fact that you brought back Falco's dair.

 

[JV5Chris]

One of the most overlooked things about the Smash Bros. series by competitive players is that the general audience plays the games because of the characters.

With regards to the competitive scene I have to disagree, there is absolutely recognition of character importance. It's just expressed in different ways that often relate closer to each character's persona within the Smash franchise and the community's culture. (for example, Captain Falcon)

We intentionally chose to tackle characters first that could represent existing play-styles for three major reasons. First, basing our initial work on existing references helped tremendously with building and tuning up the foundation. Second, we did feel it was important for there to be some familiarity with the cast and, at the beginning, stay close to our roots. Most articulated requests we received did in fact echo that sentiment. Third, with coding, rigging, animation, and other technical needs in mind, it made far more sense to build up to more varied/complex character designs and move-set challenges. Also revisit, refine, and differentiate moves as more of the cast is added and more tech is in place. It's pretty frequent in game development that what is practical for production at the time does not coincide with the ambitions. You just have to take it one step at a time with recognition that making games is a process.

As for the art aesthetics, there's no denying we all enjoy the Nintendo characters we've grown up with, but inviting the "mascot quality" comparisons was not in our best interest, hence the different direction. I do certainly agree though that more could have been done to highlight the character bios, voices, and world building. Absolutely taking note of that.

 

[nat pagle]

Dear Lord, only $7k in the Kickstarter with a goal of $355k?

I guess I'm right when I say this doesn't have much chance.

 

[Yamer]

Dear Lord, only $7k in the Kickstarter with a goal of $355k?

I guess I'm right when I say this doesn't have much chance.

Oh yes, you are very perceptive. You deserve a cookie as a reward.

 

[nat pagle]

Oh yes, you are very perceptive. You deserve a cookie as a reward.

You can give the burnt ones to anyone actually believing there was a chance for this game to as big is was touted to be. This is a few thousand dollar indie game, not a $355k production.

 

[greenluigiman2]

With regards to the competitive scene I have to disagree, there is absolutely recognition of character importance. It's just expressed in different ways that often relate closer to each character's persona within the Smash franchise and the community's culture. (for example, Captain Falcon)

The example I had in mind when I said what I said is Project M's dismantling of Pokemon Trainer. Taking one of the most unique characters in the game and turning him (and I use that word ironically considering he doesn't exist in Project M) into three separate, somewhat generic characters with no longer any relation to each other for the sake of making the game more competitive shows a certain amount of disregard for the character. To the general audience Pokemon Trainer is perfect the way he is. He represents Pokemon better than any other Pokemon character in the history of Smash.

 

[Z'zgashi]

The problem with PT is fatigue and force switch. If they took those out (or at the VERY LEAST fatigue, that sh*t is gay), then Id agree, but really, PT is just a failed gimmick due to those problems, so instead of P:M trying to expand on and fix the gimmick, they just normalized it, which has both its ups and downs. One thing though, is that in fighting games, most people generally pick one or two characters, and get really good with those characters, only using other characters for fun or friendlies. In fighting games, single characters are what make and break games for people. For example, say theres someone who likes Squirtle and wants to just play him. Due to how PT works, even if he only wants to use this one character, he is now forced into using the other 2 at points in the match, even if he doesnt like the other two, and if he doesnt switch, he starts to lose damage output and knockback just for staying Squirtle. Forcing multiple characters on someone, especially in a game where you only pick one character per match, is a VERY bold thing to do in this type of genre, and the reason P:M didnt want to keep it as is is the exact reason I just mentioned. Now sure, they couldve allowed PT to still be able to use down b to switch and kept them all together while removing force switch/fatigue, but you have to realize, P:M was made specifically for the COMPETITIVE spectrum of the Smash fan base, and in that scene, the VAST majority of people would prefer to use just one Pokemon and have another move at their disposal, which is why they changed it like that.

 

[JV5Chris]

Well this really isn't a Project M thread, but as someone with an early Wii model, PT in vanilla Brawl frustrates me to no end thanks to the disc loading times while switching. Splitting them up was a very pragmatic change. Like what they've done with them too, but that's a discussion for another thread.

This is a few thousand dollar indie game

In the real world, a few thousand dollars is no game budget.

 

[nat pagle]

In the real world, a few thousand dollars is no game budget.

In the real world, the game needs to have a foundation before it can throw out numbers like $355k.

 

[Cellsai]

Hey guys, thanks to all of our backers so far! We seriously love you guys. We are working on something new, stay tuned.

So is this something new still happening, or was that the cancelling of the KS?

 

[Deleted member]

One of the most overlooked things about the Smash Bros. series by competitive players is that the general audience plays the games because of the characters.
Not because of how the characters play, but the characters in general. People love these characters. They love them outside of Smash... Hell, they even love these characters outside their own games. This is one aspect you guys need to work on before re-doing the Kickstarter. Make the characters more interesting beyond just their name, appearance and playstyle. How can you achieve this? Here's how:

• Unique attacks/animations - I know it's early on in the process, which means that animation is limited, but the animations & attacks that you do have should be as distinguishable as possible, they should define the character. Giving the characters attacks that existing characters already have is cute, but people like seeing new things.

• Voice acting - Voice acting is sooo underrated. It helps liven characters so much, and helps people understand what a character is about. One of the things I love about MvC3 and Punch-Out is the voice acting, as well as the quotes that go along with it. I go on Youtube sometimes just to hear character quotes.

• Backstory/Role - In a game that's not telling a story, backstories are very effective. I'm pretty sure at least some of the characters were already given backstories, and that's cool. If your game is telling a story however, you don't necessarily need backstories, as long as the characters' roles in the story that the game is telling are clear.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This.

It's one thing to base a character's playstyle off another, but when you blatantly copy moves, it just feels lazy and unoriginal. That was by far my biggest gripe with the game.

That and the fact that you brought back Falco's dair.

I agree so much.

Take a look at the Guilty Gear and Blazblue casts. Each and every one of those characters is memorable and recognizable. Noel Vermillion? Cute shy girl who uses Gun Kata, Sol Badguy? Burly badass who carries a lighter for a weapon. Baiken? One armed ronin chick with a Katana. Jin Kisaragi? Yandere brother with a sword that's posessing him. Hazama? Main villain, with references drawn from MJ and the Joker. All of the characters have personalities and backstories that people can relate to, and their designs and fighting styles represent those stories. It's all built in tandem, not once the fighting is finalized.

Forget about the iconic Nintendo cast, look at other fighters and note how their cast kinda has a certain feel to it. Out of the cast right now, nothing really stands out in terms of personality, sure... some characters may mirror moves and playstyles from Melee, and GG, but none really stand out, and because of that, it's honestly kinda unexciting... So we got a bunny chick with a staff... why does she have a staff, where is she from, what does she do? A punk guy who shoots lightning? A demon dude... Ok, those are cool ideas, but it'd be better to see them more fleshed out... Why are they fighting? What sort of world do they live in? What are their backstories? Without all that, the characters can feel one-dimensional and generic, I also agree that the characters all have too much blue.

You can get away with copying moves from other games, and using inspiration from other games, but only if the game has it's own identity, otherwise, like Zgashi said, it makes the game feel lazy and unoriginal.

 

[JV5Chris]

In the real world, the game needs to have a foundation before it can throw out numbers like $355k.

What we've built is a foundation, an underlying platform fighting game engine capable of scaling up to the final production with continued development. Now what the game would need to progress into something more is a realistic budget moving forward. A few thousand dollars simply won't cut it. You don't have to take my word for it, read over what others have said on this last page.

Your own perceived value here unfortunately doesn't match to the actual costs of game development. Believe be, I'd be beyond ecstatic if it did, probably would avoid Kickstarter all together, but needless to say that's not the case.

 

[JV5Chris]

ManlySpirit, I do agree with your critique. The characters would have benefited from being further flushed out and iterated upon. Certainly easier said than done with a finite allocation for concept art and with other development considerations at play, but perhaps we needed to re-prioritize and delay other aspects of pre-production to nail the characters down.